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13:46:10 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2023/09/21-i18n-irc
13:46:19 <addison> Meeting: Internationalization Working Group Teleconference
13:46:25 <addison> Chair: Addison Phillips
13:46:32 <agendabot> agenda: https://www.w3.org/events/meetings/c5b143d1-0a5b-4adb-8d60-0f5f9bfe5a41/20230921T150000/
13:46:32 <agendabot> clear agenda
13:46:32 <agendabot> agenda+ Agenda Review
13:46:32 <agendabot> agenda+ Action Items
13:46:34 <agendabot> agenda+ Info Share
13:46:36 <agendabot> agenda+ RADAR Review
13:46:38 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/09/21-i18n-minutes.html addison
13:46:40 <agendabot> agenda+ Pending Issue Review
13:46:41 <agendabot> agenda+ TPAC Fallout
13:46:43 <agendabot> agenda+ -> w3c/adapt#240 https://github.com/w3c/adapt/issues/240
13:46:44 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/adapt/issues/240 -> Issue 240 Could we build symbolic annotations with existing Web standards? (by DuncanMacWeb) [i18n-tracker]
13:46:46 <agendabot> agenda+ WCAG 2.2 PR# 3347: another look
13:46:48 <agendabot> agenda+ AOB?
13:52:58 <xfq> xfq has joined #i18n
13:54:25 <addison> agenda+ definition of string (w3c/bp-i18n-specdev#117)
13:54:26 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/bp-i18n-specdev/issues/117 -> Pull Request 117 Add additional definitions of 'string' (w3c/i18n-actions#41) (by aphillips)
13:55:42 <addison> present+ Addison, Fuqiao
13:56:38 <JcK> JcK has joined #i18n
14:01:36 <addison> agenda+ string-meta progress
14:01:46 <addison> present+ Atsushi
14:04:05 <addison> present+ Richard
14:04:59 <addison> zakim, take up agendum 1
14:04:59 <Zakim> agendum 1 -- Agenda Review -- taken up [from agendabot]
14:05:01 <addison> agenda?
14:05:05 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/adapt/issues/240 -> Issue 240 Could we build symbolic annotations with existing Web standards? (by DuncanMacWeb) [i18n-tracker]
14:05:06 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/bp-i18n-specdev/issues/117 -> Pull Request 117 Add additional definitions of 'string' (w3c/i18n-actions#41) (by aphillips)
14:05:44 <atsushi> scribe+
14:06:10 <atsushi_> atsushi_ has joined #i18n
14:06:46 <atsushi_> scribe+
14:06:47 <addison> agenda+ tr-design changes
14:06:48 <atsushi_> xfq: one item, PR against code point character, for /TR/ design
14:07:01 <addison> zakim, take up agendum 2
14:07:01 <Zakim> agendum 2 -- Action Items -- taken up [from agendabot]
14:07:15 <xfq> s/code point character/code point styling/
14:07:15 <gb> Found actions in w3c/i18n-actions: #44, #43, #42, #41, #39, #36, #35, #33, #32, #18, #16, #15, #13, #12, #11, #10, #9, #8, #7, #5, #4
14:07:26 <addison> #44
14:07:27 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-actions/issues/44 -> Action 44 follow up on the bidi thread of rdf-star (on r12a) due 2023-09-19
14:07:58 <atsushi_> addison: we had traffic on rdf-star issue
14:08:00 <addison> #43
14:08:00 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-actions/issues/43 -> Action 43  pull together the list of win/mac/etc apis for setting base direction and/or language (on aphillips) due 2023-09-18
14:08:30 <addison> #42
14:08:31 <atsushi_> addison: started making a list, and will insert into explainer later
14:08:31 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-actions/issues/42 -> Action 42  work on tc39 proposal (meet with addison and eemeli to start) (on xfq) due 2023-09-18
14:09:01 <atsushi_> xfq: haven't chance to talk with them yet
14:09:08 <r12a> q+
14:09:27 <addison> ack r12a
14:10:13 <atsushi_> r12a: relevant to that, in breakout, director general of ECMA said that W3C colleagues could jump into talk with them more
14:10:42 <atsushi_> ... she contacted by email to me
14:11:43 <atsushi_> ... I've mentioned that individual contributor are working within us
14:11:43 <addison> #41?
14:11:43 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-actions/issues/41 -> Action 41 propose new specdev text on strings for xml (on aphillips) due 2023-09-07
14:12:02 <atsushi_> addison: PR is filed and in agenda later
14:12:04 <addison> #39
14:12:04 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-actions/issues/39 -> Action 39 develop best practice guidelines for name-like fields (on aphillips) due 2023-08-31
14:12:20 <addison> #36
14:12:20 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-actions/issues/36 -> Action 36 follow up with murata-san about wcag status (on aphillips) due 2023-08-31
14:12:36 <r12a> Samina Husain is Director General at ECMA
14:12:37 <addison> close #36
14:12:38 <atsushi_> addison: close that
14:12:42 <gb> Closed -> action #36 https://github.com/w3c/i18n-actions/issues/36
14:12:45 <addison> #35
14:12:45 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-actions/issues/35 -> Action 35 make the edits of CSS #5478 (on fantasai) due 2023-08-30
14:12:56 <addison> #33
14:12:57 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-actions/issues/33 -> Action 33 Close issues marked `close?` or bring to WG for further review (on aphillips)
14:13:21 <atsushi_> addison: made more progress on this yesterday, and closed many
14:13:21 <r12a> agenda?
14:13:24 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/bp-i18n-specdev/issues/117 -> Pull Request 117 Add additional definitions of 'string' (w3c/i18n-actions#41) (by aphillips)
14:13:24 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/adapt/issues/240 -> Issue 240 Could we build symbolic annotations with existing Web standards? (by DuncanMacWeb) [i18n-tracker]
14:13:38 <atsushi_> ... will talk a bit later
14:13:47 <addison> #32
14:13:48 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-actions/issues/32 -> Action 32 Approve the character markup PR (on fantasai) due 2023-08-17
14:14:06 <atsushi_> addison: close this
14:14:19 <atsushi_> r12a: better to keep?
14:14:34 <gb> Found actions in w3c/i18n-actions: #44, #43, #42, #41, #39, #35, #33, #32, #18, #16, #15, #13, #12, #11, #10, #9, #8, #7, #5, #4
14:14:43 <addison> #18
14:14:44 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-actions/issues/18 -> Action 18 Have informal explanation sessions about counter style translations with csswg members (on frivoal, fantasai)
14:15:07 <addison> #16
14:15:07 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-actions/issues/16 -> Action 16 Keep track of line-breaking in Korean for i18n-discuss#11 (on aphillips)
14:15:17 <addison> #15
14:15:18 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-actions/issues/15 -> Action 15 Get character styling into w3c stylesheet (on aphillips)
14:15:32 <addison> #13
14:15:32 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-actions/issues/13 -> Action 13 Make sure generics are comfortable to read in the content language (on frivoal)
14:15:37 <atsushi_> addison: keep #15 for discussion
14:15:49 <atsushi_> r12a: styling had been done?
14:16:04 <addison> close #15
14:16:06 <gb> Closed -> action #15 https://github.com/w3c/i18n-actions/issues/15
14:16:12 <atsushi_> addison: fantassai took image thing, so could close this one
14:16:28 <addison> #12
14:16:29 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-actions/issues/12 -> Action 12 Upgrade/edit the explainer to address issues raised by google (on aphillips)
14:16:29 <atsushi_> addison: can close #13, CSS one has closed
14:16:36 <atsushi_> s/closed/closed?
14:16:41 <addison> #11
14:16:41 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-actions/issues/11 -> Action 11 Triage all css properties to determine which are logical, physical, or na by default (on frivoal)
14:16:49 <atsushi_> addison: worked for explainer, for #12
14:16:50 <addison> #10
14:16:51 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-actions/issues/10 -> Action 10 With florian triage richard's article into a list of potential generics (on frivoal, fantasai)
14:17:06 <addison> #9
14:17:06 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-actions/issues/9 -> Action 9 Follow up with ecma-402 on next steps and start tc39 discussion (on aphillips)
14:17:26 <addison> #8
14:17:27 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-actions/issues/8 -> Action 8 Create pr against canvas formatted text (on aphillips)
14:17:32 <addison> #7
14:17:33 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-actions/issues/7 -> Action 7 Remind shepherds to tend to their awaiting comment resolutions (Evergreen) (on aphillips, xfq, himorin, r12a, bert-github)
14:17:46 <addison> #5
14:17:49 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-actions/issues/5 -> Action 5 Check into how to list questions at the top of a digest and/or improve lang enablement communications (on r12a)
14:18:02 <addison> #4
14:18:02 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-actions/issues/4 -> Action 4 Work with respec and bikeshed to provide the character markup template as easy-to-use markup (on r12a)
14:18:19 <addison> zakim, take up agendum 3
14:18:19 <Zakim> agendum 3 -- Info Share -- taken up [from agendabot]
14:18:30 <addison> agenda?
14:18:32 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/adapt/issues/240 -> Issue 240 Could we build symbolic annotations with existing Web standards? (by DuncanMacWeb) [i18n-tracker]
14:18:32 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/bp-i18n-specdev/issues/117 -> Pull Request 117 Add additional definitions of 'string' (w3c/i18n-actions#41) (by aphillips)
14:18:50 <atsushi_> addison: had long chat with PLH about process
14:19:24 <atsushi_> ... chatted about WCAG, but found also similar on several other specs
14:20:23 <atsushi_> ... PR filed against Guide, following discussion
14:20:43 <atsushi_> ... pushing on AC reps and/or several big companies for participation
14:21:01 <atsushi_> ... on joining to activities
14:21:28 <addison> zakim, take up agendum 4
14:21:29 <Zakim> agendum 4 -- RADAR Review -- taken up [from agendabot]
14:21:38 <addison> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-request/projects/1
14:21:52 <atsushi_> addison: two new requests
14:23:28 <atsushi_> xfq: I can take DAPT
14:24:09 <atsushi_> addison: vc-jose-cose has internationalization consideration section
14:24:30 <atsushi_> bert: interested but quick review is required
14:25:08 <atsushi_> ... in october is desired
14:26:07 <atsushi_> addison: assigned Bert, with one month
14:26:16 <addison> zakim, take up agendum 4
14:26:16 <Zakim> agendum 4 -- RADAR Review -- taken up [from agendabot]
14:26:31 <addison> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/issues
14:26:45 <atsushi_> addison: couple of incoming issues
14:27:11 <atsushi_> addison: adequacy of base direction, and punycode reference
14:28:10 <addison> w3c/i18n-activity#1758
14:28:11 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/issues/1758 -> Issue 1758 Reference for punycode-encoding of IDN (by w3cbot) [pending] [tracker] [needs-attention] [s:rdf-concepts]
14:28:31 <JcK> present+ JcK
14:28:33 <addison> https://github.com/w3c/rdf-concepts/issues/63
14:28:47 <atsushi_> addison: RDF colleagues are happy to accept comment on issue
14:30:16 <addison> zakim, take up agendum 6
14:30:16 <Zakim> agendum 6 -- TPAC Fallout -- taken up [from agendabot]
14:30:27 <atsushi_> addison: anything to bring up here?
14:30:49 <addison> zakim, take up agendum 7
14:30:49 <Zakim> agendum 7 -- -> w3c/adapt#240 https://github.com/w3c/adapt/issues/240 -- taken up [from agendabot]
14:30:49 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/adapt/issues/240 -> Issue 240 Could we build symbolic annotations with existing Web standards? (by DuncanMacWeb) [i18n-tracker]
14:31:21 <atsushi_> addison: asking about existing standards
14:31:31 <atsushi_> ... could be related to COGA etc.
14:32:08 <atsushi_> r12a: add comment on this
14:32:42 <atsushi_> addison: we are interesting if they would want to go to Unicode
14:33:16 <atsushi_> ... characters something like emoji
14:34:04 <atsushi_> r12a: a bit difficult to me, looking at Unicode block it is quite well tighten to image for emoji
14:35:59 <atsushi_> [situation around bliss symbols]
14:36:22 <atsushi_> r12a: writing some to Unicode could be great
14:36:33 <addison> action: addison to connect unicode sah to the adapt 240 thread
14:36:41 <gb> Created -> action #45 https://github.com/w3c/i18n-actions/issues/45
14:36:52 <addison> agenda?
14:36:55 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/adapt/issues/240 -> Issue 240 Could we build symbolic annotations with existing Web standards? (by DuncanMacWeb) [i18n-tracker]
14:36:55 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/bp-i18n-specdev/issues/117 -> Pull Request 117 Add additional definitions of 'string' (w3c/i18n-actions#41) (by aphillips)
14:37:04 <addison> zakim, take up agendum 8
14:37:04 <Zakim> agendum 8 -- WCAG 2.2 PR# 3347: another look -- taken up [from agendabot]
14:37:13 <addison> w3c/wcag#3347
14:37:14 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/wcag/issues/3347 -> Pull Request 3347 Text-spacing note for I18n (by alastc)
14:37:51 <atsushi_> addison: during TPAC, edited this suggestion
14:38:46 <atsushi_> ... I don't care how long it is compaired to the SC text
14:39:13 <atsushi_> xfq: I'm kind of afraid that if we hide this text into understanding document, this will be missed
14:39:51 <atsushi_> addison: asking to move exception paragraph to first, and remove the last?
14:40:44 <atsushi_> addison: we want second paragraph for our purpose
14:40:55 <atsushi_> r12a: yes
14:41:28 <atsushi_> addison: so, could agree to remove some text, but keep second sentence
14:41:58 <addison>  <p>Exception: Human languages and scripts that do not make use of one or more of these text style properties in written text can conform using only the properties that exist for that combination of language and script.</p>
14:42:14 <xfq> https://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG21/#text-spacing
14:43:11 <atsushi_> r12a: suppose they would keep? but exception should be there
14:44:01 <atsushi_> addison: our sentence is to clarify explicit who to apply
14:45:01 <atsushi_> xfq: last sentence says effectively the same as exception
14:45:28 <addison> zakim, take up agendum 10
14:45:28 <Zakim> agendum 10 -- definition of string (w3c/bp-i18n-specdev#117) -- taken up [from addison]
14:45:28 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/bp-i18n-specdev/issues/117 -> Pull Request 117 Add additional definitions of 'string' (w3c/i18n-actions#41) (by aphillips)
14:45:58 <atsushi_> addison: actioin item to update our string desfinition
14:46:13 <atsushi_> ... current text only deals with web world
14:46:36 <atsushi_> ... and RDF-star is coming with XML world
14:46:48 <atsushi_> ... trying to incoorporate them into spec-dev
14:47:00 <addison> https://deploy-preview-117--bp-i18n-specdev.netlify.app/#char_string
14:47:02 <xfq> s/actioin/action
14:47:16 <atsushi_> addison: see above PR preview
14:47:39 <atsushi_> ... provide definition of string, and provide useful links for USVString/DOMString
14:50:27 <atsushi_> xfq: no definition in glossary yet
14:51:17 <atsushi_> addison: is good direction, but need some more text
14:51:27 <atsushi_> ... need to find definition of web platform
14:51:33 <atsushi_> ... html and JavaScript API
14:51:56 <atsushi_> ... not sure RDF colleagues are willing to be a part of web platform
14:52:28 <atsushi_> xfq: mentioned about XML based one, but SVG is based on XML but in the Web
14:52:45 <atsushi_> ... or implemented in the browsers
14:53:11 <r12a> Wikipedia says: The Web platform includes technologies—computer languages and APIs—that were originally created in relation to the publication of Web pages. This includes HTML,[4] CSS, SVG, MathML,[5] WAI-ARIA, ECMAScript, WebGL, Web Storage, Indexed Database API, Web Components, WebAssembly, WebGPU, Web Workers, WebSocket, Geolocation API, Server-Sent Events, DOM Events, Media Fragments, XMLHttpRequest, Cross-Origin Resource Sharing, File
14:53:12 <r12a>  API, RDFa, WOFF, HTTP, TLS 1.2, and IRI.
14:53:39 <atsushi_> addison: TAG document did not define the Web Platform
14:54:41 <atsushi_> https://www.w3.org/TR/ethical-web-principles/#intro
14:54:57 <atsushi_> The web is made up of a number of technologies and technical standards. HTML, CSS and JavaScript are often thought of as the web's core set of technologies but there are a raft of other technologies, standards, languages and APIs that come together to form the "web platform."
14:55:40 <atsushi_> r12a: DOM based technology?
14:56:57 <atsushi_> addison: will take these to write some text here
14:57:12 <atsushi_> ... we could go to TAG and say you should say something here
14:58:39 <addison> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-discuss/blob/gh-pages/explainers/string-meta-explainer-updated.md
14:59:04 <atsushi_> addison: xfq worked for explainer above
14:59:08 <addison> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-discuss/blob/gh-pages/explainers/string-meta-explainer-updated.md#is-there-a-better-approach
15:03:29 <atsushi_> addison: worth giving time on this or not?
15:07:57 <addison> action: xfq, r12a, and others to read the string-meta explainer and consider the new approach addison proposed
15:07:58 <gb> Cannot create action. Validation failed. Maybe one of the names is not a valid user for w3c/i18n-actions?
15:08:38 <addison> action: xfq, r12a: read the string-meta explainer and consider the new approach addison proposes
15:08:40 <gb> Created -> action #46 https://github.com/w3c/i18n-actions/issues/46
15:11:57 <addison> zakim, take up agendum 9
15:11:57 <Zakim> agendum 9 -- AOB? -- taken up [from agendabot]
15:12:30 <atsushi_> bert: regret for next week
15:13:29 <xfq> rrsagent, make minutes
15:13:31 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/09/21-i18n-minutes.html xfq
15:13:47 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/09/21-i18n-minutes.html addison
15:14:14 <addison> present+ JcK, Bert
15:14:19 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/09/21-i18n-minutes.html addison
15:21:33 <xfq> xfq has joined #i18n
15:47:17 <addison> zakim, bye
15:47:17 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees have been Addison, Fuqiao, Atsushi, Richard, JcK, Bert
15:47:17 <Zakim> Zakim has left #i18n