IRC log of coga on 2023-05-03

Timestamps are in UTC.

18:04:43 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #coga
18:04:47 [RRSAgent]
logging to https://www.w3.org/2023/05/03-coga-irc
18:04:47 [Zakim]
RRSAgent, make logs Public
18:04:48 [Zakim]
Meeting: Cognitive and Learning Disabilities Accessibility Task Force Teleconference
18:04:48 [Katy]
present+
18:04:52 [JohnRochford]
present+
18:04:53 [julierawe]
present+
18:05:02 [abbey]
present+
18:05:05 [kirkwood]
present+
18:05:06 [julierawe]
chair: julie
18:05:07 [jeanne]
present+
18:05:25 [julierawe]
meeting: Clear language subgroup meeting
18:05:40 [julierawe]
date: 05 03 2023
18:06:17 [jeanne]
scribe+ jeanne
18:06:19 [julierawe]
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1JKJ32DK_A82ahsQ_k0RVPc-ZYpX5uuKtuGOLdo2OqyY/edit#heading=h.ho88uer4k9cv
18:09:04 [jeanne]
Julie: What is the latest update with the AGWG chairs and what should be included?
18:09:39 [jeanne]
... we are aiming for 20 outcomes and one outcome built out with a Method and Test
18:10:06 [jeanne]
Jeanne: We have a meeting later this week. The latest I heard was that we were only going to do Outcomes
18:11:03 [jeanne]
Julie: We are going to keep #11 for now and keep a note for now about possibly removing it.
18:11:39 [jeanne]
JohnK: Facial Expression isn't really
18:11:48 [jeanne]
... "implied meaning"
18:12:03 [jeanne]
Julie: Is it "non-verbal meaning"?
18:12:30 [jeanne]
JohnR: "Non verbal Cue" is the correct label
18:12:55 [jeanne]
... I like the label better but I think it should go.
18:13:06 [jeanne]
Julie: Item 12
18:13:57 [jeanne]
... Paragraph length, with conditional tests that give flexibility for bronze Silver gold levels
18:14:22 [jeanne]
JohnK: I don't like "divide long text". Break up long paragraphs into shorter ones.
18:14:51 [jeanne]
... one idea per paragraph is what is generally
18:15:04 [jeanne]
Becca: We should also think about sentences per paragraph
18:15:24 [jeanne]
JohnR: And words per sentences
18:16:34 [jeanne]
Proposed: Break long text into short paragraphs that focus on one idea. Weighting process TBD that rewards content creators for having fewer sentences per paragraph and fewers words per sentence: X for Bronze, Y for Silver, etc.
18:17:42 [jeanne]
Jeanne: I recommend not going into detail about Bronze and Silver in case the group decides not to do bronze, silver,gold.
18:18:24 [jeanne]
Julie:Item 13 Ssection Length and Headers
18:18:39 [jeanne]
... should we split them up?
18:18:56 [jeanne]
Jeanne: there are two different tests. I think we should split them.
18:21:12 [jeanne]
JohnK: What does it even mean in this context? It's not part of grammar
18:23:05 [jeanne]
JohnR: HTML is a good example to illustrate what we are talking about.
18:23:31 [jeanne]
Proposed: Section length: Chunk content into short sections, with a small number of paragraphs, to make the information easier to read and understand and to avoid overwhelming users.
18:25:34 [jeanne]
Becca: I think we need more definition of a section -- is a horizontal rule a section?
18:26:53 [JohnRochford]
JohnRochford has joined #coga
18:27:16 [jeanne]
Jeanne: from WCAG22 https://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG22/#dfn-section
18:27:53 [jeanne]
a self-contained portion of written content that deals with one or more related topics or thoughts
18:30:59 [jeanne]
Julie: Adding a new Outcome: Purpose of Blocks of Text.
18:31:16 [jeanne]
JohnR: COntent Usable says to try to put the purpose of each block of text first
18:36:14 [jeanne]
Proposed: Purpose of each paragraph: Put the aim or purpose at the beginning of each paragraph. This is especially important in sections with more than one paragraph.
18:39:10 [jeanne]
Julie: Item 16: Lists
18:39:40 [jeanne]
Katy: What is it breaking up -- bulleted or numbered?
18:39:52 [jeanne]
JohnK: It breaks up walls of text.
18:41:50 [jeanne]
Jan: It helps users focus on scannable information
18:42:32 [jeanne]
JohnR: Bold text, italic text, colored text all help users focus on information.
18:44:22 [jeanne]
Jan: Historically screen readers don't announce semantics of text.
18:45:59 [jeanne]
JohnK: in basic HTML, <strong> is bold and <em> is italic
18:48:09 [jeanne]
New item: Bold text, italic text, and colored text: Use text formatting such as <strong> for bold, sparingly to help users focus on information.
18:48:44 [Becca_Monteleone]
+1 to Jan's point on cognitive load
18:49:40 [jeanne]
Jan: we need to take into consideration that some people will not have the ability or knowledge to customize their assistive technology and it will be a barrier for them. It should work for the default settings of assistive technologies.
18:53:02 [jeanne]
Jeanne: I'm concerned to make sure that we can find research on using bold text sparingly.
18:53:47 [jeanne]
Julie: Colored text and links can be very distracting.
18:54:42 [jeanne]
Jan: We have to think carefully about how that might be interpreted that we don't want designers not to underline links or use custom colors for links.
18:55:26 [jeanne]
Jan: Maybe don't duplicate links on a page, that repeats of links are used sparingly because it creates duplication in the link list.
18:56:29 [jeanne]
JohnK will look for research on this new Outcome.
18:56:59 [jeanne]
Julie: Next meeting is the 11th to finish 17 to 23.
18:57:36 [julierawe]
rrsagent, make minutes
18:57:38 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/05/03-coga-minutes.html julierawe
18:58:16 [jeanne]
Jan: This is my last meeting until mid-November. Thanks for the leadership that Julie has brought to this group.
18:58:29 [jeanne]
rrsagent, make minutes
18:58:30 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/05/03-coga-minutes.html jeanne
19:24:58 [jeanne]
jeanne has joined #coga
19:51:54 [kirkwood]
kirkwood has joined #COGA
20:02:05 [kirkwood]
kirkwood has joined #COGA
20:06:32 [Zakim]
Zakim has left #coga
20:20:31 [kirkwood]
kirkwood has joined #COGA
22:10:29 [kirkwood]
kirkwood has joined #COGA
22:28:37 [kirkwood]
kirkwood has joined #COGA
22:40:01 [kirkwood]
kirkwood has joined #COGA