18:06:47 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #a11yedge
18:06:51 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2023/02/13-a11yedge-irc
18:06:51 <Zakim> RRSAgent, make logs Public
18:06:52 <Zakim> please title this meeting ("meeting: ..."), janina
18:07:27 <janina> rrsagent, make minutes
18:07:28 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/02/13-a11yedge-minutes.html janina
18:08:46 <Lionel_Wolberger> scribe+
18:08:51 <Lionel_Wolberger> Minutes from last time, https://www.w3.org/2023/02/06-a11yedge-minutes.html
18:09:13 <janina> present+
18:09:18 <janina> scribe+
18:09:23 <Lionel_Wolberger> present+
18:09:58 <janina> https://www.w3.org/2023/02/06-a11yedge-minutes.html
18:10:48 <janina> zakim, intros and announcements
18:10:48 <Zakim> I don't understand 'intros and announcements', janina
18:11:05 <janina> Derek and Bev introducing themselves to each other ...
18:11:11 <Lionel_Wolberger> agenda+ Introductions
18:11:14 <Lionel_Wolberger> agenda+ Progress updates
18:11:16 <janina> Meeting: A11y Edge Teleconference
18:11:20 <janina> Chair: Janina
18:11:33 <janina> date: 13 feb 2023
18:11:33 <Lionel_Wolberger> agenda+ Welcome & Announcements (CEPC and IRC) to newcomers
18:11:43 <Lionel_Wolberger> agenda+ Continuing progress on inventory of overlay capabilities,  capabilities.html
18:11:52 <Lionel_Wolberger> zakim, next item
18:11:52 <Zakim> agendum 1 -- Introductions -- taken up [from Lionel_Wolberger]
18:14:25 <Lionel_Wolberger> zakim, next item
18:14:25 <Zakim> agendum 2 -- Progress updates -- taken up [from Lionel_Wolberger]
18:16:27 <janina> zakim, next item
18:16:27 <Zakim> agendum 3 -- Welcome & Announcements (CEPC and IRC) to newcomers -- taken up [from Lionel_Wolberger]
18:16:33 <janina> q?
18:16:38 <janina> zakim, next item
18:16:38 <Zakim> agendum 3 was just opened, janina
18:17:03 <janina> agenda?
18:17:31 <janina> See above -- we're now tracking from here, though!
18:17:36 <janina> zakim, next item
18:17:36 <Zakim> agendum 4 -- Continuing progress on inventory of overlay capabilities,  capabilities.html -- taken up [from Lionel_Wolberger]
18:26:40 <Lionel_Wolberger> We viewed the ability in iOS to label a button by the end user, at the edge
18:29:49 <Lionel_Wolberger> Derek: cant expect people on the edge to label things, that is against what we stand for
18:30:04 <janina> q+
18:30:08 <janina> q-
18:30:12 <Lionel_Wolberger> ... but if it was a shared device, like a tablet, the ability to label on the advice would be very useful
18:30:30 <janina> q+ to explain how we use W3C process to discuss native implementations like the IOS example
18:30:48 <Lionel_Wolberger> ... it is hard to tell people everything that inclusive design can bring, but if you use this strategy, you can achieve these things
18:32:27 <derek> derek has joined #a11yedge
18:33:10 <Lionel_Wolberger> janina: W3C can ask operating systems to do things.
18:33:45 <Lionel_Wolberger> ... and WCAG has requirements regarding flashing. This should not be a guidance, it should be a requirement.
18:34:18 <Lionel_Wolberger> ... this could be moved to the user-agent to prevent this blinking
18:34:27 <Lionel_Wolberger> Derek: Like Google Chrome enabled auto mute
18:35:26 <janina> zakim, who's here?
18:35:26 <Zakim> Present: janina, Lionel_Wolberger
18:35:28 <Zakim> On IRC I see derek, RRSAgent, Zakim, janina, Lionel_Wolberger, Jem, jamesn, Travis, jcraig
18:35:37 <janina> present+
18:35:37 <derek> present+
18:36:25 <Lionel_Wolberger> derek:  We have a list of capabilities that overlays can do
18:37:05 <Lionel_Wolberger> ... what if we have a list of functionalities that the OS should never take away or block?
18:37:23 <Lionel_Wolberger> janina: Like some website disable the back button of the browser, so you cannot go back
18:37:57 <Lionel_Wolberger> ... taking away 'alt-left'arrow' forces me to type out a URL
18:39:42 <Lionel_Wolberger> derek: At what level are we working? We seem to be zooming in and out, from technical details to high level 'in the clouds'
18:40:49 <Lionel_Wolberger> janina: We dont want advertising to be able to introduce a keyboard block.
18:41:13 <Lionel_Wolberger> ... advertising is always an edge technology by definition, as the ad is served to the end-user's browser or app
18:41:19 <Lionel_Wolberger> rrsagent, make minutes
18:41:20 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/02/13-a11yedge-minutes.html Lionel_Wolberger
18:42:13 <Lionel_Wolberger> s/overlay capabilities,/overlay facts,
18:42:19 <Lionel_Wolberger> rrsagent, make minutes
18:42:21 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/02/13-a11yedge-minutes.html Lionel_Wolberger
18:43:16 <Lionel_Wolberger> Bev: I agree with the performance issues, and the general trend for more and more happening on the client side
18:43:27 <Lionel_Wolberger> ... I am for end users having as much control as possible
18:44:03 <Lionel_Wolberger> janina: TO recap, if a user is worried about keyboard traps, or some kind of personal setting,
18:44:09 <Lionel_Wolberger> ... set that concern in some technical way
18:44:19 <Lionel_Wolberger> ... and tries to load a page with some kind of conformance level
18:44:40 <Lionel_Wolberger> ... and an advertiser tries to push an advertisement that does not conform with the minimum conformance of the page
18:44:52 <Lionel_Wolberger> ... the real time bid would be turned down
18:45:11 <Lionel_Wolberger> Bev: Exactly, if the end user can set their preferences in some way according to their needs or disability
18:45:40 <Lionel_Wolberger> derek: Do we want a role for 'ad's?
18:46:40 <janina> scribe+
18:46:50 <janina> Lionel_Wolberger: will add advertising into capabilities
18:47:16 <janina> bev: wonders about warnings to users? should that be part of the path?
18:47:35 <janina> bev: sometimes we see those, but there's no reliability in the chain
18:47:55 <janina> Lionel_Wolberger: notes certificate errors on no https
18:48:10 <Lionel_Wolberger> Bev: The edge can provide warnings to users that there are flashing lights on the page
18:48:15 <janina> bev: thinking of warnings on flash
18:48:30 <janina> derek: text resizing, etc., picsels changing on screen
18:48:37 <janina> derek: could be just a few ms to evaluate
18:48:51 <janina> derek: notes google translate no longer in the header
18:49:26 <Lionel_Wolberger> Bev: It's not just epilepsy that is affected
18:49:56 <janina> derek: notes there will be populations that have adverse reactions to this
18:50:47 <janina> rrsagent, make minutes
18:50:49 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/02/13-a11yedge-minutes.html janina
18:55:53 <janina> [group looks at branching to add content to our doc]
18:58:56 <janina> [discussion on how to do a good, fully cross-referenced pull request]
19:02:14 <janina> [discussion on what's appropriate under redundancy]
19:02:21 <janina> sometimes ok, sometimes not
19:02:33 <janina> derek: if it augments, it's probably ok
19:02:36 <Lionel_Wolberger> derek: There's times where redundancy is appropriate because it augments functionality rerather than only replicating
19:02:40 <janina> derek: as opposed to just replicate
19:02:59 <janina> derek: TTS generated might have pronunciation support that enhances
19:03:03 <Lionel_Wolberger> ... readspeaker for example has a role with cognitive disabilities and neurodiversity who appreciate the redundancy
19:03:36 <Lionel_Wolberger> Bev: Not to limit the capacity for tuning.
19:03:43 <janina> bev: don't limit the ability to fine tune
19:03:58 <Lionel_Wolberger> ... we should do everything in our power to allow the user to tune to their needs
19:04:21 <janina> rrsagent, make minutes
19:04:22 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/02/13-a11yedge-minutes.html janina
19:06:00 <janina> zakim, bye
19:06:00 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees have been janina, Lionel_Wolberger, derek
19:06:00 <Zakim> Zakim has left #A11yEdge
19:06:12 <janina> rrsagent, make minutes
19:06:13 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/02/13-a11yedge-minutes.html janina
19:07:03 <janina> clear agenda