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14:44:16 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2022/12/08-pcg-a11y-irc
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14:44:40 <AvneeshSingh> zakim, this will be pcg-a11y
14:44:40 <Zakim> ok, AvneeshSingh
14:44:50 <AvneeshSingh> present+
14:45:35 <AvneeshSingh> chair: AvneeshSingh
14:50:10 <AvneeshSingh> agenda+ Further discussion on the feedback for User experience guide for displaying accessibility metadata.
14:50:40 <AvneeshSingh> agenda+ Next steps for accessibility summary guide.
14:50:57 <AvneeshSingh> agenda+ Should we have meeting on December 22?
14:51:11 <AvneeshSingh> agenda+ Any other business.
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14:59:07 <gpellegrino> present+
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15:00:16 <GeorgeK> present+
15:00:27 <ChrisOliverOttawa> present+
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15:01:25 <Gautier> scribe+
15:01:28 <Gautier> q+
15:01:33 <Gautier> q-
15:01:38 <Gautier> present+
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15:01:57 <MURATA> +present
15:02:19 <tzviya> present+
15:02:19 <AvneeshSingh> zakim, next agendum
15:02:20 <Zakim> agendum 1 -- Further discussion on the feedback for User experience guide for displaying accessibility metadata. -- taken up [from AvneeshSingh]
15:02:41 <AvneeshSingh> https://github.com/w3c/publ-a11y/issues/136
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15:02:54 <Madeleine> present +
15:02:54 <JF> Present+
15:02:55 <AvneeshSingh> https://github.com/w3c/publ-a11y/issues/137
15:03:03 <AvneeshSingh> https://github.com/w3c/publ-a11y/issues/138
15:03:15 <Gautier> AvneeshSingh: the main issue is 136 and more issues are related: 137, 138 and 139
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15:03:27 <AvneeshSingh> q?
15:03:35 <Naomi> present+
15:04:44 <Gautier> gpellegrino: we tought about level and hired a designer to make mockups, starting by visual approach was usefull to get what place it takes, etc. I can share drafts with you...
15:05:11 <Gautier> ... on the screen you see 2 product pages, one on desktop and one on a phone screen...
15:05:49 <Gautier> ... it is to understand how level organisation could fit in a web page...
15:07:57 <Gautier> ... in thi scase we have a logo near the title that claims compliant with EAA... We think this is the more important information... Then we have a list of 6 tabs grouping informations as asscessibility properties, navigation, non textual content, vusal adjustements, audio and hasard. This is our second level... Certfier information is third level presented on the right of the page...
15:08:41 <AvneeshSingh> q?
15:08:47 <Madeleine>  q+
15:08:48 <JF> Q+
15:08:53 <Gautier> q+
15:08:59 <AvneeshSingh> ack madel
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15:09:46 <Bill_Kasdorf> present+
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15:10:34 <Gautier> Madeleine: it looks good as a first look, and good job. My concern is that there is a lot of energy putted on the accessibility summary too.
15:10:41 <GeorgeK> q+
15:10:46 <AvneeshSingh> ack jf
15:11:52 <Naomi> q+
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15:12:00 <Gautier> JF: iconography is a very high level information. my concern is related to the requirements of the EAA, is it the same as 501 in US? How to render multiple requirements?
15:12:13 <AvneeshSingh> q?
15:12:31 <tzviya> q+ to respond to JF
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15:13:23 <Gautier> JF: we adress global market, it's difficult to localize differently. There are multiple conformances possibles, how to adrsse that?
15:13:29 <AvneeshSingh> q?
15:13:38 <JamesY__> present+
15:13:49 <gpellegrino> q+ to rispond to JF
15:14:21 <JF> Q+
15:14:35 <JamesY__> q+
15:14:49 <Gautier> tzviya: it's a good point, but make sure we are not overloading.
15:14:55 <AvneeshSingh> ack next
15:14:57 <tzviya> q-
15:15:41 <gpellegrino> q-
15:16:44 <JF> ack me
15:17:12 <gpellegrino> q+
15:18:26 <Naomi> q-
15:19:09 <AvneeshSingh> q?
15:19:58 <Gautier> Gautier: french publishers says they need more information and reflexion time about infering EAA conformity from Epubaccessibility
15:19:59 <AvneeshSingh> ack george
15:20:27 <JF> +1 George
15:21:03 <AvneeshSingh> q?
15:21:13 <gpellegrino> +1 George
15:22:26 <Gautier> Georges: local legislations should be the first priority. Also about use of level we maybe should just prioritize informations and says this must be displayed and this is suplementary. Just rank all metadata.
15:22:34 <AvneeshSingh> ack next
15:23:07 <Gautier> JamesY_: i agree too much information will be ignored. we have to simplify. What is important is the user...
15:23:23 <AvneeshSingh> q?
15:23:57 <JF> Q+ to note there are technical standards and "legal" standards
15:24:03 <gpellegrino> q-
15:24:09 <Gautier> ... for legal aspect, technical standards are probably the best way to express conformity
15:24:23 <AvneeshSingh> q?
15:24:32 <AvneeshSingh> ack next
15:24:33 <Zakim> JF, you wanted to note there are technical standards and "legal" standards
15:25:34 <Naomi> q+
15:25:35 <JamesY__> q+
15:25:52 <Gautier> JF: poiting to technical standards is the goal and legal requirements don't point at standards. Having 2 reporting values is needed (one for each)
15:25:53 <AvneeshSingh> ack next
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15:27:09 <Bill_Kasdorf> +1 to Naomi
15:27:37 <JamesY__> +1 to Naomi
15:27:39 <Bill_Kasdorf> q+
15:28:16 <Gautier> Naomi: many books don't pass conformance, a user may buy a book partially passing but corresponding to his needs. And the two levels thing helps with that. If there is nothing at first level, then let seen what's in second level. It adress intermediary period
15:28:20 <AvneeshSingh> ack bill
15:29:17 <Gautier> Bill_Kasdorf: publisher need is can i sell this book vs user need is can i read this book?
15:29:51 <AvneeshSingh> q?
15:29:51 <Gautier> Bill_Kasdorf: even if it's not conformant details may tell me it feets my needs.
15:29:58 <AvneeshSingh> ack next
15:30:28 <tzviya> +1 to JamesY__  maintaining compliance badges is going to be complicated
15:30:49 <Gautier> JamesY_: technical and legal changes everytime and may not change in the same directeion. How do we maintain that  in time?
15:31:15 <AvneeshSingh> q?
15:31:30 <gpellegrino> q+
15:33:36 <Gautier> JF: 501 explicitly point to WCAG2.0, not 2.1 or 2.2. If any futur WCAG is not compatible with 2.0 it's regulaor problem, not our.
15:34:00 <Bill_Kasdorf> s/501/508/
15:34:11 <AvneeshSingh> ack next
15:34:56 <Gautier> gpellegrino: what we invision here is similar to other european legislation (exemple is products with CE mark).
15:35:33 <Naomi> q+
15:35:46 <Naomi> q-
15:36:18 <gpellegrino> q+
15:37:20 <gpellegrino> q-
15:37:37 <gpellegrino> +1 to Avneesh to how to interpret metadata
15:37:47 <Bill_Kasdorf> +1 to Avneesh
15:38:31 <gpellegrino> q+
15:38:32 <Gautier> @AvneeshSingh: there are so many users over the world and so many needs. When we started this document we had 22 objectives : provide a guidance to interpret and display machine readble information and how to prioritize the information needed? We should mainly focus on prioritization, then find labels and at the end build exemples.
15:38:38 <AvneeshSingh> q?
15:38:49 <AvneeshSingh> ack next
15:39:02 <GeorgeK> q+
15:39:55 <AvneeshSingh> ack george
15:41:18 <Gautier> GeorgeK: it clearly needs to redivise and look at the language proposed (screen reader friendly don't work in french), i wonder if we could have a localization table in our recomandation.
15:41:50 <AvneeshSingh> q?
15:42:05 <Gautier> @AvneeshSingh: editors of the document willl meet to start the writing.
15:42:10 <AvneeshSingh> zakim, next agendum
15:42:10 <Zakim> agendum 2 -- Next steps for accessibility summary guide. -- taken up [from AvneeshSingh]
15:42:14 <Gautier> Gautier: I enlist as editor.
15:43:39 <GeorgeK> https://htmlpreview.github.io/?https://github.com/w3c/publ-a11y/blob/main/drafts/schema-a11y-summary/index.html
15:43:41 <Gautier> GeorgeK: i went thru the document and fixed everything. from my perspective it's done. I expect that when refactoring principles and techniques this will trigger more changes needs to the accessibility Summary.
15:43:47 <AvneeshSingh> zakim, next agendum
15:43:48 <Zakim> agendum 3 -- Should we have meeting on December 22? -- taken up [from AvneeshSingh]
15:44:26 <AvneeshSingh> q?
15:44:36 <Gautier> @all: skip it, meet next year
15:44:40 <AvneeshSingh> zakim, next agendum
15:44:40 <Zakim> agendum 3 was just opened, AvneeshSingh
15:45:18 <Gautier> so 12th of january
15:46:34 <AvneeshSingh> rrsagent, make minutes
15:46:34 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/12/08-pcg-a11y-minutes.html AvneeshSingh
15:46:48 <AvneeshSingh> rrsagent, make logs public
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15:49:09 <AvneeshSingh> zakim, bye
15:49:09 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees have been AvneeshSingh, gpellegrino, GeorgeK, ChrisOliverOttawa, Gautier, present, tzviya, JF, Naomi, Bill_Kasdorf, JamesY__
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