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14:54:16 <Zakim> RRSAgent, make logs Public
14:54:17 <Zakim> please title this meeting ("meeting: ..."), Fazio_
14:54:34 <Fazio_> meeting Maturity Model Subgroup
14:54:48 <Fazio_> Chair, Fazio, Sheri B-H
14:54:54 <Fazio_> present+
14:56:25 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Lionel_Wolberger_ has joined #maturity
14:57:32 <Fazio_> Agenda+ Review and group GitHub issues
14:57:44 <Fazio_> > Agenda+ New business
14:58:05 <Fazio_> Agenda+ New business
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15:01:01 <CharlesL> present+
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15:06:14 <Fazio_> Scribe: Fazio
15:07:27 <Fazio_> IAAP/G3ICT  Maturity Model and W3C Maturity Model need a comparative analysis
15:10:30 <Fazio_> Lionel: what is going on with IAAP Maturity Model, and why no collaboration
15:13:23 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Lionel_Wolberger_: Good discussion of various maturity models out there like ISO/IEC 30071-1:2019 and Business Disability Forum accessibility maturity model
15:15:44 <Fazio_> Benetech Update:
15:16:24 <Lionel_Wolberger_> scribe: Lionel_Wolberger_
15:19:11 <Lionel_Wolberger_> CharlesL: In all the different sheets there seemed to be duplicated...
15:19:28 <Fazio_> Inspiring, Goal posts, leadership metrics, loved drop down menu on sheet 6
15:19:31 <Lionel_Wolberger_> ... Knowledge and Skills seemed to be repeated with the maturity stages section
15:19:56 <Lionel_Wolberger_> ... do we need this, or is it covered by outcomes and improvments?
15:20:10 <Lionel_Wolberger_> ... Example: Communications sheet row B, no effort.
15:20:25 <Lionel_Wolberger_> .... then B6 also says, no accessibility effort around communications
15:20:34 <Lionel_Wolberger_> ... it seemed duplicative and confused them
15:21:11 <Lionel_Wolberger_> CharlesL: Typo, curriculums v curricula -- fix spelling
15:22:19 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Sheri_B-H: This connects with a discussion here about whether K&S should be its own section, or a proof point for every section
15:22:42 <Lionel_Wolberger_> ... Example, ICT section clearly needs K&S. So we decided to incorporate it in the ICT section
15:22:51 <Lionel_Wolberger_> present+
15:23:10 <Sheri_B-H> present+
15:23:35 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Sheri_B-H: ... our approach was to do both. The specific K&S goes in the proper section, and global K&S has its own section.
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15:23:48 <Sheri_B-H> So the answer we ended up for in the draft is both:  general K&S goes in K&S, specific knowledge for a dimension goes in the dimension
15:23:59 <kline_> +present
15:24:21 <Sheri_B-H> so an example would be ARIA - only ICT folx need training in that, so it goes in ICT
15:25:00 <Lionel_Wolberger_> CharlesL: 'Executive sponsor in place' vs 'Executive leadership in place'
15:25:26 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Sheri_B-H: One indicates the presence of Executive level support for the overall program
15:25:42 <Lionel_Wolberger_> ... vs the Direction (or VP leadership) of a particular section
15:26:03 <Lionel_Wolberger_> ... perhaps add 'executive leadership of program' to distinguish
15:26:14 <Lionel_Wolberger_> ... also, small shops will not need this. This is for large organizations.
15:26:50 <Lionel_Wolberger_> CharlesL: 'IT accessibility policy in place and implemented'. These occurred twice, once with an indent
15:26:53 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Sheri_B-H: might be a typo
15:27:15 <Lionel_Wolberger_> CharlesL: 'Business strategy includes accessibility as a market differentiator'
15:28:05 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Sheri_B-H: Show that the business is actually advertising that they are accessible, as when one company promotes that they are accessible, other companies in the space start to prioritize accessibility
15:28:14 <Lionel_Wolberger_> ... it's a kind of corporate peer pressure
15:28:26 <Lionel_Wolberger_> CharlesL: May want to add the word, 'advertising'
15:28:42 <Lionel_Wolberger_> CharlesL: communities of practice. Question, communities we serve?
15:29:00 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Sheri_B-H: No, we meant disability communities and disability-related NGOs
15:29:32 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Jeff_Kline: I was thinking of internal communities of practice, internal to the company
15:33:31 <Lionel_Wolberger_> CharlesL: Each department may have different ways of responding to this. Should each have a separate row?
15:33:55 <Lionel_Wolberger_> ... if one dept answers one way, and a different dept answers another way, how to integrate?
15:34:03 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Sheri_B-H: least common denominator
15:34:49 <Lionel_Wolberger_> CharlesL: So if one dept gets a 3, and IT gets a 0; I would indicate which dept was at which level
15:35:02 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Sheri_B-H: This way you can focus on the low hanging fruit, and get a better score
15:35:26 <Lionel_Wolberger_> CharlesL: Objective or subjective?
15:35:33 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Jeff_Kline: It is subjective
15:35:49 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Sheri_B-H: Since it is self-reported, it is GIGO (garbage in, garbage out)
15:36:34 <Lionel_Wolberger_> ... they don't have to buy an ISO standard, or pay a consultant-- just answer the questions.
15:37:03 <Lionel_Wolberger_> CharlesL: The asked that overall we feature an examples column, stating examples of implementation
15:37:17 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Sheri_B-H: We are planning to add case studies.
15:37:48 <Lionel_Wolberger_> CharlesL: They recommended to have a 'TO DO' column, to record what things are needed to get the organization to the next stage
15:38:15 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Jeff_Kline: I see that as a project management parallel track. This is not a forward looking document, it is a snapshot in time
15:38:27 <Lionel_Wolberger_> .... like a VPAT expresses where you ARE, not where you are GOING
15:38:39 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Sheri_B-H: It can be used as a basis for such a forward-looking planning document
15:40:05 <Lionel_Wolberger_> CharlesL: Linking would make it easier to use
15:40:30 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Sheri_B-H: We wait for the HTML version to link things
15:41:19 <Lionel_Wolberger_> CharlesL: How are people implementing it? Dept by Dept? Survey the entire company? One on one with different dept managers?
15:42:37 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Sheri_B-H: I did it at one major corporation, dept by dept. Bring to each dept the one sheet that matches that dept best
15:44:06 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Jeff_Kline: The person running the model needs to decide the process. Every organization is unique.
15:44:57 <Lionel_Wolberger_> CharlesL: Each sheet should track, which dept answered this sheet? That way you can know who to return to, to update a particular sheet
15:45:50 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Jeff_Kline: Organizations running the model can add fields, columns, whatever can help them, without impacting any of the formulas
15:45:58 <Lionel_Wolberger_> CharlesL: Such customization would be helpful
15:46:52 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Sheri_B-H: There is narrative at the beginning that can be extended
15:47:42 <Lionel_Wolberger_> ... indicate that modifications can be made to help you (the organization) action and complete the sheet
15:49:05 <Lionel_Wolberger_> CharlesL: Can a user check a row, to make a row be left out of the final score?
15:49:13 <Lionel_Wolberger_> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1fzPlHjHIaSQn9GvpJd86SDpV49U8Beg_iXj6K5aeyGg/edit#gid=1588739210
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15:50:51 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Lionel_Wolberger_: Suggest we name the role of the person shepherding the model through their organization: curator, sherpa, maturity model manager
15:51:06 <Lionel_Wolberger_> ... then the sheet can provide instructions directly to this role
15:51:41 <Lionel_Wolberger_> rrsagent, make minutes
15:51:41 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/11/02-maturity-minutes.html Lionel_Wolberger_
15:52:53 <Sheri_B-H> https://w3c.github.io/maturity-model/
15:53:10 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Sheri_B-H: We need to add "N/A" to the dropdowns
15:53:27 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Action: Sheri_B-H Add N/A to the dropdowns
15:53:27 <trackbot> Sorry, but no Tracker is associated with this channel.
15:53:59 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Action: SByrneHaber Add N/A to the dropdowns
15:53:59 <trackbot> Sorry, but no Tracker is associated with this channel.
15:54:06 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Action: Sheri Add N/A to the dropdowns
15:54:06 <trackbot> Sorry, but no Tracker is associated with this channel.
15:54:28 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Action: Helixopp Sort out labelling
15:54:28 <trackbot> Sorry, but no Tracker is associated with this channel.
15:54:43 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Action: Fazio Sort out labelling
15:54:43 <trackbot> Sorry, but no Tracker is associated with this channel.
15:55:34 <Lionel_Wolberger_> rrsagent, make minutes
15:55:34 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/11/02-maturity-minutes.html Lionel_Wolberger_
15:56:00 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Action: Charles Read the minutes, convert into issues all items where we agreed to make changes
15:56:00 <trackbot> Sorry, but no Tracker is associated with this channel.
15:56:09 <Lionel_Wolberger_> rrsagent, make minutes
15:56:09 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/11/02-maturity-minutes.html Lionel_Wolberger_
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