06:36:27 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #coga
06:36:27 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2022/09/22-coga-irc
06:36:29 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
06:36:32 <trackbot> Meeting: Cognitive and Learning Disabilities Accessibility Task Force Teleconference
06:36:32 <trackbot> Date: 22 September 2022
06:38:02 <lisa> agenda+ tpac summary and next steps. Silver, Functional Needs and EO
06:38:58 <lisa> agenda+ EO scrips preety: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17nVmc7-9Whv0jtwVWNaX_svGC-asP9YBrU_BsfxnN80/edit#heading=h.e4ovh4cg5tf2
06:39:17 <lisa> agenda+ Yan https://docs.google.com/document/d/1XQaPkwJMjkhveFYGZ9deYuqTmU0xH8lFm5_03-DeKd8/edit?usp=sharing
06:39:36 <lisa> agenda+ Luis https://docs.google.com/document/d/1VzYUBM192J_pvuEcHAsdIywh7xngcbFYR2IaWhiQCLk/edit?usp=sharing
06:39:52 <lisa> agenda+ Ian https://docs.google.com/document/d/1zDinqPxwUdG60POmZ2vBkb0L02RpfgnMRKIQQG5k3jw/edit?usp=sharing
06:41:39 <lisa> agenda+ send out survey? https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSc4ugu4iWRlEQ84-NWJmaiwtVWkXD1mhdCxB6MMy8N_mT56Bg/viewform
06:42:19 <Roy> Roy has joined #coga
06:42:27 <lisa> agenda+ colaberation tool accessibility https://www.w3.org/WAI/APA/task-forces/research-questions/wiki/Collaboration_Tool_Accessibility
06:42:54 <lisa> Topic: subgroups:  Structure Review For Content Useable   and Research Plan and Strategy
06:43:17 <lisa> agenda + subgroups:  Structure Review For Content Useable   and Research Plan and Strategy
06:43:49 <lisa> agenda+ Research Plan and Strategy sending out survey.
06:44:09 <lisa> agenda+ Research Plan and Strategy: update on recruiting
13:47:53 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #coga
13:47:53 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2022/09/22-coga-irc
13:47:55 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
13:47:58 <trackbot> Meeting: Cognitive and Learning Disabilities Accessibility Task Force Teleconference
13:47:58 <trackbot> Date: 22 September 2022
13:48:11 <lisa> RRSAgent, publish minutes
13:48:11 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/09/22-coga-minutes.html lisa
13:57:59 <rashmi> rashmi has joined #coga
13:58:08 <rashmi> present+
13:59:20 <Jennie> Jennie has joined #coga
13:59:23 <Becca_Monteleone> Becca_Monteleone has joined #coga
13:59:47 <Jennie> present+
13:59:58 <Becca_Monteleone> present+
14:00:44 <Rain> Rain has joined #coga
14:00:53 <Rain> present+
14:01:15 <Rachael> present+
14:01:39 <ShawnT> ShawnT has joined #coga
14:01:46 <julierawe> julierawe has joined #coga
14:01:52 <julierawe> present+
14:02:16 <lisa> scribe+ rashmi, lisa
14:02:29 <lisa> zakim, next item
14:02:29 <Zakim> agendum 1 -- tpac summary and next steps. Silver, Functional Needs and EO -- taken up [from lisa]
14:02:34 <Roy> present+
14:02:36 <lisa> present+
14:02:52 <krisanne> krisanne has joined #coga
14:03:54 <rashmi> Lisa:The first subtopic we did was functional need
14:04:31 <rashmi> ...APA Josh Michael is working very hard.
14:04:51 <rashmi> First thing we are working on Categories
14:05:37 <Poornima> Poornima has joined #coga
14:05:43 <Poornima> present+
14:06:19 <rashmi> ...It may take longer so I am going to suggest a branch
14:07:17 <rashmi> ...We have done more than in need for basic cognitive function requirement
14:07:21 <Rachael> q+
14:07:30 <lisa> ack next
14:07:37 <rashmi> ...are people agreed for that
14:08:19 <rashmi> Rachael:give APA chairs the list of groups you want to have feedback from
14:09:56 <rashmi> Lisa:I am going to Ask Michael the idea suggest reviewing organization and the intersectionality and map to
14:10:13 <rashmi> ...The idea suggested by Rachael
14:12:35 <rashmi> Poornima:Introduces herself, she is SME in Holland America Organization.
14:12:53 <rashmi> Welcome Poornima to the group!
14:13:45 <rashmi> Lisa:Offered Poornima that she can take orientation program with Poornima and anybody else who is intersected can join.
14:14:39 <rashmi> ...Lisa ask Rain to coordinate between subgroup and COGA
14:15:41 <rashmi> ...If they want to join we can find common times.
14:16:08 <julierawe> q+
14:16:18 <lisa> ack next
14:16:46 <rashmi> ...For Silver we should wait till the things are more in shape
14:17:43 <Jennie> q+
14:18:39 <Rain> q+
14:18:43 <Rachael> q+ to recommend putting it in  the test
14:18:49 <rashmi> Julie:Talked about pronunciation aspects discussed at TPAC
14:19:50 <rashmi> Julie:Would love to have more discussions about the methodology about pronounciation.
14:20:37 <lisa> ack next
14:21:11 <rashmi> Jennie:I think I like ideas about issue paper
14:21:57 <Rachael> +1 to use cases in content usable
14:22:02 <Becca_Monteleone> +1 for emphasizing use cases using public devices
14:22:21 <lisa> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1CeqiSy3tVDoeBzCG8LpkyFT1fvugGk86JuT6NvfSiAA/edit#heading=h.5to75iffpk77
14:22:24 <Jennie> ack Jennie
14:22:30 <lisa> ack next
14:22:34 <rashmi> Jennie: And so one of the things we talked about in Minnesota is the concept that many individuals with cognitive disabilities may be accessing digital information at the library or in a place where they don't own the computer.
14:23:14 <rashmi> And so, I personally think those use cases should be on content usable as well as just to help support the idea, but then also just reinforce the concept that even if something is applied only to one page, or one sites, organization, the person still
14:23:59 <rashmi> ...hope that it helps
14:24:40 <lisa> julie was saying that it is not helpful if needs are covered by new tech IF people in coga can not use them (too complex, dont know about it etc)
14:25:19 <rashmi> Rain:A github issue can be raised
14:25:23 <rashmi> in order for things to truly be accessible.  They need to be marked up right. We can't rely on people having the newest, most high end technology available to them and it's you know it's part of part of our job as people working on specifications. with W3c To ensure that people realize that only making something that works with the fanciest newest, most expensive technology is about the furthest thing you can get from equity.
14:25:27 <julierawe> q+
14:25:48 <julierawe> q-
14:26:11 <lisa> ack next
14:26:12 <Zakim> Rachael, you wanted to recommend putting it in  the test
14:26:33 <rashmi> ...My proposal is to document things to make sure that thing moves forward with silver
14:27:33 <rashmi> Rachael:I recommend I would add a comment so that its taken care and not can fall for next iterations
14:27:45 <lisa> ack next
14:28:05 <lisa> zakim, next item
14:28:05 <Zakim> agendum 2 -- EO scrips preety: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17nVmc7-9Whv0jtwVWNaX_svGC-asP9YBrU_BsfxnN80/edit#heading=h.e4ovh4cg5tf2 -- taken up [from lisa]
14:28:54 <Rachael> Testing subgroup is technically over but it can come into a new iteration of that subgroup.  I recommend adding a note within the test documentation created by COGA.  I've added it to a chairs list of key questions under accessibility supported and testing.  I also recommend someone from COGA engaging with the Accessibility Supported subgroup in addition to Rain's involvement with the testing subgroup.
14:29:14 <rashmi> Rashmi:my apologies this was told by Rain "in order for things to truly be accessible.  They need to be marked up right. We can't rely on people having the newest, most high end technology available to them and it's you know it's part of part of our job as people working on specifications. with W3c To ensure that people realize that only making something that works with the fanciest newest, most expensive technology is about the furthest thing you [CUT]
14:29:19 <julierawe> q+
14:29:51 <lisa> ack next
14:30:50 <rashmi> Julie:Big think with Pretty is the fact that she is 13 and need about safety for children the concern that John Kirkwood raised
14:37:24 <lisa> ready to submit put in +1
14:37:26 <julierawe> +1
14:37:29 <Becca_Monteleone> +1 - great job on revising!
14:37:32 <Rain> +1
14:37:44 <Poornima> +1
14:38:03 <lisa> +1 with comment that we realy need more time, but this is what we could do in the deadline
14:38:10 <lisa> zakim, next item
14:38:10 <Zakim> agendum 3 -- Yan https://docs.google.com/document/d/1XQaPkwJMjkhveFYGZ9deYuqTmU0xH8lFm5_03-DeKd8/edit?usp=sharing -- taken up [from lisa]
14:38:17 <Jennie> +1
14:38:32 <rashmi> Lisa:Next one isYun
14:41:28 <rashmi> q+
14:42:09 <lisa> ack next
14:42:46 <Jennie> q+
14:42:53 <lisa> ack next
14:43:05 <Poornima> q+
14:43:32 <julierawe> +1 to Rashmi's comment about light gray text
14:43:50 <lisa> ack next
14:44:19 <rashmi> Poornima:ad point about tooltips or hovering
14:44:56 <rashmi> ...with related to hand tremors
14:46:07 <lisa> zakim, next item
14:46:07 <Zakim> agendum 4 -- Luis https://docs.google.com/document/d/1VzYUBM192J_pvuEcHAsdIywh7xngcbFYR2IaWhiQCLk/edit?usp=sharing -- taken up [from lisa]
14:47:30 <rashmi> Julie:discussing about Louise
14:47:35 <Becca_Monteleone> q+
14:49:52 <julierawe> q+
14:50:02 <lisa> ack next
14:50:09 <lisa> ack next
14:50:38 <julierawe> +1
14:50:39 <Becca_Monteleone> +1
14:50:42 <Jennie> +1
14:50:42 <rashmi> Becca:place her concern about speech sound in the script
14:50:46 <Poornima> +1
14:50:46 <Rain> +1
14:51:00 <lisa> +1 to submit to eo as minum changes, with a more possitive alternive also present
14:51:10 <rashmi> Julie:+1 to Becca the sentence seems unuseful so may remove it
14:51:23 <rashmi> +1
14:51:24 <lisa> +1
14:51:30 <Jennie> +1
14:51:30 <julierawe> +1
14:51:32 <Poornima> +1
14:51:34 <Rain> +1
14:51:34 <Becca_Monteleone> +1
14:51:37 <lisa> zakim, next item
14:51:37 <Zakim> agendum 5 -- Ian https://docs.google.com/document/d/1zDinqPxwUdG60POmZ2vBkb0L02RpfgnMRKIQQG5k3jw/edit?usp=sharing -- taken up [from lisa]
14:52:12 <rashmi> Lisa:Next one is Ian and we want to change it in female
14:52:33 <Becca_Monteleone> +1 to changing from white male autistic stereotype
14:52:45 <rashmi> Julie:with person of color may be non-binary
14:55:14 <lisa> q?
14:55:21 <julierawe> q+
14:55:56 <lisa> ack next
14:56:10 <lisa> rain likes the additions
14:56:22 <rashmi> Rain:I appreciate all the additions done to the persona.
14:56:33 <lisa> are we ready to submit this (+1)
14:56:38 <lisa> +1
14:56:39 <Becca_Monteleone> +1
14:56:39 <julierawe> +1
14:56:46 <Jennie> +1
14:56:47 <Rain> +1
14:56:47 <rashmi> +1
14:57:00 <Poornima> +1
14:57:45 <julierawe> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1XQaPkwJMjkhveFYGZ9deYuqTmU0xH8lFm5_03-DeKd8/edit#
14:59:59 <Kiki> Kiki has joined #coga
15:00:31 <lisa> vote yun with this changes
15:00:33 <lisa> +1
15:00:33 <Becca_Monteleone> +1
15:00:35 <julierawe> +1
15:00:36 <Jennie> +1
15:00:42 <Rain> +1
15:00:43 <Poornima> +1
15:01:01 <rashmi> +1
15:01:20 <lisa> zakim, next item
15:01:20 <Zakim> agendum 6 -- send out survey? https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSc4ugu4iWRlEQ84-NWJmaiwtVWkXD1mhdCxB6MMy8N_mT56Bg/viewform -- taken up [from lisa]
15:02:17 <ShawnT> present+
15:02:28 <lisa> RRSAgent, publish minutes
15:02:28 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/09/22-coga-minutes.html lisa
15:03:29 <Poornima> I'll have to drop for today. Will join the sub-group meeting for next week. Thanks everyone!
15:07:09 <lisa> thanks for joining
15:07:21 <lisa> agenda?
15:08:19 <lisa> close item 6
15:08:23 <lisa> close item 7
15:08:26 <lisa> close item 8
15:10:12 <Kiki> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ql32NLUquUtJwGuMuORZpNN4iNdLdcWtdBbIfWsRYW0/edit?usp=sharing
15:10:23 <ShawnT> scribe: ShawnT
15:11:03 <lisa> topic: content usable survey
15:11:31 <ShawnT> Kiki : Walking though the document
15:11:49 <ShawnT> ... to give us an idea of how many participants we need
15:12:12 <ShawnT> ... haven't reviewed all the results but this should give us an overview
15:12:53 <ShawnT> ... this is a draft research plan
15:13:13 <lisa> q?
15:13:21 <lisa> send out survey? https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSc4ugu4iWRlEQ84-NWJmaiwtVWkXD1mhdCxB6MMy8N_mT56Bg/viewform,
15:13:25 <ShawnT> lisa: This gives a person a chance to come out with ideas
15:13:43 <lisa> topic: reserch survey
15:14:05 <julierawe> q+
15:14:08 <ShawnT> ... can we talk about the research survey now?
15:14:29 <ShawnT> ... we got rid of the grid questions
15:14:29 <lisa> ack next
15:15:07 <ShawnT> julierawe: What would the formate of the qualitative interviews
15:15:28 <lisa> q+
15:15:40 <ShawnT> Kiki : we normally setup a live stream and see if we can record, easier to annualize
15:15:42 <Rain> q+
15:16:27 <ShawnT> julierawe : usually when we do interviews we have other people watching and send questions to the interviewer live
15:17:07 <ShawnT> Kiki : I will be using a script, not sure what the standards are that we have here
15:17:13 <lisa> ack next
15:17:46 <julierawe> q+
15:17:49 <ShawnT> Rain : will take the action item about checking with Shawn Henry and M Cooper to see what processes we can take
15:17:58 <lisa> ack next
15:18:07 <julierawe> q-
15:19:01 <ShawnT> lisa : a question we should ask is when do you give up on using the document
15:19:21 <ShawnT> ... another question, when do you find that you can't use a website
15:19:56 <ShawnT> ... specific tasks that people won't use online (like online banking)
15:19:57 <lisa> ack next
15:20:20 <julierawe> q+
15:20:25 <lisa> send out survey? https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSc4ugu4iWRlEQ84-NWJmaiwtVWkXD1mhdCxB6MMy8N_mT56Bg/viewform,
15:20:36 <ShawnT> lisa : are we ready to go to the next topic about the survey?
15:20:43 <lisa> ack next
15:21:18 <ShawnT> julierawe : one more question would be, what topic would you expect to find in the document and to show us how they would find it in the document?
15:21:20 <lisa> q?
15:22:10 <ShawnT> Kiki : took down the questions lisa suggested
15:22:29 <ShawnT> ... we want to try to understand their behaviours
15:22:31 <lisa> q?
15:23:00 <lisa> send out survey? https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSc4ugu4iWRlEQ84-NWJmaiwtVWkXD1mhdCxB6MMy8N_mT56Bg/viewform,
15:23:01 <ShawnT> lisa : the research survey...
15:23:18 <julierawe> q+
15:23:24 <ShawnT> ... can we send it out before the bigger group votes on it
15:23:30 <lisa> ack next
15:23:38 <ShawnT> ... will put it in the agenda for next week
15:23:43 <Rain> q+
15:23:59 <ShawnT> julierawe : small suggestions, the first page is a lot of scroll
15:24:18 <ShawnT> ... maybe put it into smaller pages
15:24:26 <lisa> ack next
15:24:34 <ShawnT> lisa : planning on breaking it up
15:24:51 <ShawnT> Rain : also has a recommendation on the questions themselves
15:24:52 <ShawnT> ...
15:25:30 <julierawe> Q+
15:25:36 <ShawnT> ... it might be helpful to put the topics into bold to help users identify the questions
15:25:41 <lisa> ack next
15:26:32 <ShawnT> julierawe : one other small things, sometimes there's squares, sometimes there's circles, can we make it uniform?
15:26:36 <Kiki> Q+
15:27:02 <Kiki> Rain asked my question, can remove my q
15:27:12 <ShawnT> lisa : it's using common radio buttons and checkboxes
15:27:42 <ShawnT> Rain : there are some questions iin the survey that should be radio buttons instead of checkboxes
15:27:51 <ShawnT> lisa : I will change them
15:28:12 <Kiki> q+
15:28:27 <ShawnT> ... I will change them and add it to the agenda for next week
15:28:40 <julierawe> q+
15:28:45 <ShawnT> ... I was a little bit concerned that the questions sounded redundant
15:28:45 <lisa> ack next
15:30:13 <ShawnT> Kiki : clustering questions into different sections
15:31:09 <ShawnT> ... there were no follow up questions if the user selected to allow more questions
15:31:32 <ShawnT> lisa : it should have asked for an email if they allowed more questions
15:32:32 <ShawnT> Rain : that question was used to collect demographic information in the previous survey.
15:32:47 <ShawnT> lisa : we will remove that question
15:33:21 <ShawnT> julierawe : I support clustering by different sections
15:34:16 <lisa> ack next
15:34:28 <ShawnT> ... I think it would it would be better to have shorter sections / multiple pages than one longer sections
15:34:31 <ShawnT> +1
15:35:32 <ShawnT> julierawe : I think we are close to sharing
15:36:16 <lisa> ack next
15:36:16 <ShawnT> lisa : we had subheadings and I think it was harder to read with a screen reader so I put it all on one line
15:36:38 <ShawnT> ... would people be interested in moving forward
15:36:54 <ShawnT> Kiki : I don't think there's that much more to do
15:37:29 <ShawnT> lisa : we can move it forward in the group
15:37:49 <ShawnT> Kiki : suggest that the survey link should said how many pages in the survey
15:38:35 <Rain> Oureach - https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1xXjHPCfWm00iAJqmjdwFq_RQ80vKwwxFAoiEGI3NOlM/edit#gid=0
15:38:40 <ShawnT> lisa : next question how many people to send it out, Rain do we have the list of people we send it out.
15:39:00 <ShawnT> Rain : shared the outreach
15:39:59 <ShawnT> lisa : should we make a new spreadsheet
15:40:10 <ShawnT> Rain : there's a new tab in that document
15:41:02 <ShawnT> lisa : this is a little different, it might be the research community that might be interested
15:41:04 <lisa> q?
15:41:08 <ShawnT> .. any questions?
15:41:31 <lisa> zakim, next item
15:41:31 <Zakim> agendum 9 -- Research Plan and Strategy sending out survey. -- taken up [from lisa]
15:41:39 <lisa> close item 9
15:41:46 <lisa> zakim, next item
15:41:46 <Zakim> agendum 10 -- Research Plan and Strategy: update on recruiting -- taken up [from lisa]
15:42:06 <lisa> https://docs.google.com/document/d/15HtPkkYx1CIl6bAwP2nsSZKhqTVbqcuMDRz5RmtmvXg/edit#heading=h.6co50luve41b
15:42:16 <ShawnT> lisa : we had a lot of recruiting for research
15:42:49 <ShawnT> Rain : we are waiting on doing the final assessment on the survey
15:43:17 <ShawnT> ... we will figure out who we will reach out to and how after the assessment
15:43:49 <ShawnT> lisa : I thought this was to reach out to new partners to help update our research documents
15:44:04 <ShawnT> .. we very much wanted to update our core research documents
15:44:18 <Rain> q+
15:44:35 <lisa> ack next
15:44:42 <ShawnT> ... we could plug into community work
15:44:56 <ShawnT> Rain : yes that was what we talked about in the face to face
15:45:24 <ShawnT> ... Kiki is here because of the out reach
15:45:36 <lisa> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1DoohB2-tREjXx7PF6sCi3jLt6OrjE1ciAb0Dcb7FgyU/edit#heading=h.fuatm6qk6a2h
15:46:03 <ShawnT> ... a clear message from the COGA task force and I want to make sure this is W3C and not Google specific
15:46:27 <ShawnT> lisa : supplied the document
15:47:16 <ShawnT> ... does anyone else have any new research inside your organizations
15:47:35 <julierawe> q+
15:47:39 <lisa> ack next
15:47:54 <ShawnT> julierawe : two coga members come to mind
15:48:25 <ShawnT> ... John Rochford, and Jennie
15:48:32 <ShawnT> +1 to those two folks
15:49:05 <ShawnT> lisa : I'm going to add E.A., John K and David F
15:49:49 <ShawnT> ... I think we are good, any other issues to discuss?
15:49:53 <lisa> ack next
15:50:01 <lisa> zakim, next item
15:50:01 <Zakim> I do not see any more non-closed or non-skipped agenda items, lisa
15:50:29 <lisa> RRSAgent, publish minutes
15:50:29 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/09/22-coga-minutes.html lisa
17:57:10 <Zakim> Zakim has left #coga