IRC log of wcag3-scoping on 2022-06-08

Timestamps are in UTC.

16:02:36 [RRSAgent]
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16:02:36 [RRSAgent]
logging to
16:02:44 [mbgower]
16:02:50 [Rachael]
16:02:58 [jspellman]
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16:03:03 [thbrunet]
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16:03:08 [Rachael]
objective vs subjective document:
16:03:15 [thbrunet]
16:03:18 [jspellman]
16:03:36 [Francis_Storr]
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16:03:43 [Rachael]
16:04:11 [Wilco_]
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16:05:55 [Rachael]
scribe: Rachael
16:06:00 [Rachael]
reviewed wiki page
16:10:57 [Rachael]
Jenne is referring to
16:11:06 [Rachael]
16:16:39 [Wilco_]
16:19:40 [Wilco_]
q+ to ask about creating an example outcome
16:19:43 [Rachael]
mbgower: walks through work to date.
16:20:24 [Rachael]
Jeanne: Test reliability is trying to make outcomes more precise than WCAG 2 SC. Currently testing out process.
16:21:57 [mbgower]
16:22:37 [Rachael]
mbgower: Is what we are doing redundant with test reliability group?
16:22:53 [Rachael]
Jeanne: Trying to avoid contradictory work.
16:23:03 [Rachael]
..already know they could be more objective.
16:23:25 [Rachael]
mbgower: There is not a lot of agreement that current SC are not objective.
16:23:27 [Rachael]
16:25:11 [Rachael]
Rachael: I think there is value in showing that the current guidelines have a certain level of subjectivity
16:25:13 [Rachael]
16:25:27 [Wilco_]
inter-rater reliability
16:25:34 [Rachael]
Some people think objective = high inter-rater reliability
16:25:48 [Rachael]
...may be a definition problem.
16:26:18 [Rachael]
also inner-reater reliability. Same person gets same result. Inter-rater reliability = many people test and all get the same result
16:26:22 [mbgower]
inner-rater reliability = can the same person get the same result (do the same thing)
16:26:27 [Rachael]
...we mean objective as is there any judgement call.
16:26:41 [thbrunet]
I think it's intra-rater rather than inner-rater.
16:26:52 [Rachael]
16:27:09 [Francis_Storr]
this reminds me of the Challenges with Accessibility Guidelines Conformance and Testing, and Approaches for Mitigating Them document:
16:28:28 [Wilco_]
16:29:08 [Rachael]
16:29:42 [Rachael]
16:29:52 [Rachael]
Rachael: can we get a list of agreed upon terms for these conversations
16:30:21 [Rachael]
Michael adds problem statement
16:30:24 [mbgower]
We lack defined terms for discussing testing concepts, which makes it difficult for us to all be talking about the same thing – or agreeing we are.
16:30:53 [Rachael]
Jeanne suggests we go back to look at research from research development working group, symposium summary paper
16:31:25 [Rachael]
Jeanne to provide link
16:32:33 [Francis_Storr]
Reminds me of this information architecture article on defining things: I'll dig through that and see what might be useful.
16:34:58 [Rachael]
thbrunet: There are 3 things: 1. Completely objective, automatable. 2. Well defined through human intervention 3. Human interpretation
16:38:07 [Rachael]
Rachael: Also maybe 4) implied (audio description has good timing, accessible name is a good name
16:38:49 [jspellman]
16:40:17 [jspellman]
Web Accessibility Metrics Symposium->
16:41:27 [Rachael]
mbgower: Trying for a quick exercise to help move along work
16:41:33 [Rachael]
wilco: May be test reliability more than this
16:41:57 [Rachael]
16:44:00 [Rachael]
16:45:24 [Rachael]
Rachael: Maybe review and revise the categorization content, Maybe write visible controls, need to work on terminology (both definitions and also for test types and scoping)
16:45:35 [Rachael]
Wilco - test reliability may be able to take test terminology work.
16:47:57 [Rachael]
16:50:34 [Rachael]
mbgower: Focus on a better set of terms.
16:54:06 [Rachael]
testing concepts (objective, inter-rater reliability, etc) and test matrix terminology
16:56:52 [Wilco_]
16:59:50 [Rachael]
mbgower will continue to work on exercise as a double check to migration.
17:01:00 [Rachael]
zakim, generate minutes
17:01:00 [Zakim]
I don't understand 'generate minutes', Rachael
17:01:04 [Rachael]
rrsagent, make minutes
17:01:04 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate Rachael
17:01:18 [Rachael]
zakim, make logs world
17:01:18 [Zakim]
I don't understand 'make logs world', Rachael
17:01:44 [Rachael]
zakim, make log world
17:01:47 [Zakim]
I don't understand 'make log world', Rachael
17:01:58 [jspellman]
RRSAgent, make logs world
17:01:59 [Rachael]
rrsagent, make log world
17:02:15 [Rachael]
zakim, end meeting
17:02:15 [Zakim]
As of this point the attendees have been mbgower, Rachael, thbrunet, jspellman
17:02:17 [Zakim]
RRSAgent, please draft minutes
17:02:17 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate Zakim
17:02:20 [Zakim]
I am happy to have been of service, Rachael; please remember to excuse RRSAgent. Goodbye
17:02:24 [Zakim]
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17:12:52 [mbgower]
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