14:44:15 RRSAgent has joined #me 14:44:15 logging to https://www.w3.org/2022/05/09-me-irc 14:44:42 Zakim has joined #me 14:44:53 Meeting: MEIG monthly meeting 14:56:48 jholland has joined #me 14:58:18 tidoust has joined #me 15:00:46 calvaris has joined #me 15:02:02 JohnRiv has joined #me 15:02:34 chair: ChrisN 15:03:09 present+ 15:03:12 present+ Kaz_Ashimura, Chris_Needham, Francois_Daoust, Jake_Holand, John_Rviello, Xabier_Rodriguez_Calvar 15:03:43 agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-web-and-tv/2022May/0000.html 15:05:18 scribe+ cpn 15:05:23 Topic: TPAC 2022 planning 15:08:40 ChrisN: We could meet in person at TPAC, good opportunity for cross group meetings, but not sure which other groups are meeting 15:10:48 q+ 15:11:23 Jake: We may organise something for the Multicast CG, but I'm unlikely to travel 15:11:50 John: Any responses to your GitHub question? 15:11:55 ChrisN: Not too many 15:12:54 Kaz: There's a questionnaire that we should look at. Related groups should meet at TPAC. I'd like to ask your ask your interest in digital twin services. WoT can think about the hardware, publishing about the content, and VR 15:13:05 ... It could be a possible keyword for potential joint meetings 15:13:40 ... It's virtualisation of hardware as cloud services, so the representation, UI for that kind of service can be implemented by immersive web tech and 3D 15:13:47 s/3D/3D videos etc/ 15:14:25 i|There's a|-> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/1/LogisticsTPAC2022/ TPAC Logistics questionnaire (Member-only)| 15:14:28 ChrisN: Suggest starting a thread with different group chairs, and we could organise it 15:14:56 Kaz: Start with some kind of brainstorming, to find out which parts people are interested in 15:15:56 Topic: Overview of Media Technologies for the Web 15:15:58 Chris: https://w3c.github.io/web-roadmaps/media/ 15:17:05 Francois: The spec status and implementation status are outdated. Don't need feedback on that, I need to fix the tooling to update those 15:17:51 ... Moving specs from exploratory to work in progress to well-deployed. The feedback that would be interesting would be new things that we're looking into but not captured yet 15:19:11 ... Also happy to take feedback on the overall structure 15:20:54 Chris: Open question about TV video plane resolution, Screen object rather than video-* media queries 15:21:34 ... For EME, drop Persistent Usage Record 15:22:54 ... PiP API and caption rendering. There's a proposal for a PiP API for arbitrary content that could be useful for that. I've also seen Mozilla have been working on WebVTT rendering in PiP windows 15:23:17 ... https://blog.mozilla.org/en/products/firefox/firefox-picture-in-picture-rolls-out-subtitles/ 15:23:48 ... Great for WebVTT, but what if you're doing your own custom TTML rendering? 15:24:28 Francois: in Firefox it's a browser-level feature, not with the PIP API 15:24:55 Jake: Ultra-low latency CMAF, you have to call dash.js differently. Is that covered in rendering here? 15:25:34 Francois: Are those changes at the dash.js level, that's a layer above this document 15:26:03 Chris: Chrome feature for low latency video mode? 15:26:13 q? 15:26:15 ack k 15:27:19 Francois: Would make sense to document if there's a specific way to handle chunks to trigger a browser's low latency mode 15:28:03 ... If dash.js does something special there, we'd want to capture it 15:28:41 Jake: Most discussion is at the higher layer, but if I find a resource, I'll let you know 15:29:38 Chris: Audio output rendering, MC API has spatialRendering capability 15:30:49 Francois: I think that's still an open question 15:31:24 Chris: Could deliver different audio encodings depending on speaker configuration, if there's a way to report that from the browser 15:31:37 Francois: Audio Device Client is no longer being worked on 15:32:06 Chris: Similar to AudioWorklet? 15:32:30 q+ 15:32:40 Francois: Had more configuration options, sample rate, which AudioWorklet doesn't give you. There was a need to expose something lower level 15:32:56 nigel has joined #me 15:32:58 ... Motivation was allowing cross-compilation of audio libraries 15:33:57 Kaz: This page in the document describes media related technologies in general. On the other hand, if we think about a roadmap for media handling, that should describe our expectations for future technologies and when they should be standardised 15:34:54 ... If the purpose is to explain the current status, we should clarify and think about which part should be handled by which group. There's so many topics here, we can't handle it all in this group 15:36:01 Francois: We renamed the document to say that it's not a roadmap. The goal is to track what's going on and identify which are potential useful features. MEIG should prioritise things, and then work with other groups to push those features 15:36:16 ... The document is a first step on that 15:36:43 Kaz: Do you want to ask MEIG to update this page directly? 15:36:58 Francois: I'm acting as the editor 15:38:23 Chris: Editorial help from MEIG members would be welcome 15:40:11 ... But also, input to identify emerging needs is helpful 15:40:38 Kaz: Clarify which sections are to be edited and how 15:41:47 ... It's too big and I'd like to suggest we start with the topics we're interested in first 15:41:59 ... Who is interested in which topic today? 15:43:22 Chris: Could jump to the distribution section, to look at multicast 15:43:34 Jake: May be too soon for that. Perhaps next year 15:43:57 Francois: It's there as a feature not covered by ongoing work, so we could move it to exploratory work 15:44:03 Jake: Good idea 15:44:35 ... The current goal is that not much changes at the web API level 15:45:57 Francois: The document also allows us to create a list of groups, so we can include Multicast CG there 15:46:19 Jake: https://github.com/w3c/multicast-cg and https://www.w3.org/community/multicast/ 15:47:15 Francois: I'm happy to write some words for Jake to review 15:47:45 q? 15:47:47 ack k 15:47:51 q+ 15:48:37 Kaz: As a starting point, have a brainstorming, and think about how to describe the ideas 15:48:39 ack k 15:50:49 Chris: The WebRTC DASH requirements could be good to include 15:51:04 Jake: Is it under distribution, or rendering? 15:51:49 Francois: Rendering doesn't cover WebCodecs right now. But it's OK if we mention technologies in multiple pages. We have WebCodecs in Media Processing 15:52:09 maybe a link to https://dashif.org/webRTC/#documents under exploratory work 15:52:52 Chris: Is WebRTC Insertable Streams included in Processing section? 15:54:54 ... But what if you're doing segmented delivery and MSE rather than WebRTC delivery. Needs use cases? 15:55:29 ... Also the outcomes from the media production could be interesting here 15:56:10 Francois: The Web Media API spec is also interesting, should match the well-deployed sections in our document. I'll look at that 15:56:49 Francois: Main question is what's missing? 15:57:15 ... Questions about Media Session. But there may be other things. Interested to add those 16:00:06 Chris: For DataCue, we separate DASH emsg handling from DataCue itself, to progress them independently 16:00:26 ... Also, the MEIG thread on frame accurate rendering and seeking 16:01:04 Francois: Canvas rendering, where you control the pixels, Lightning.js framework 16:03:20 Chris: How to suggest changes? Can we file GitHub issues? 16:03:51 Francois: And I'll update the tooling 16:04:50 rrsagent, make log public 16:04:55 rrsagent, draft minutes 16:04:55 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/05/09-me-minutes.html kaz 16:06:20 Chris: Next meeting is 7th June, agenda TBD 16:06:38 [adjourned] 16:06:46 rrsagent, draft minutes 16:06:46 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/05/09-me-minutes.html kaz 16:43:44 nigel has joined #me 16:57:16 s/John_Rviello/John_Riviello/ 16:57:23 rrsagent, draft minutes 16:57:23 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/05/09-me-minutes.html cpn 17:15:50 nigel has joined #me 17:46:51 nigel has joined #me 19:12:41 nigel has joined #me 19:25:15 Zakim has left #me 20:13:32 nigel has joined #me 22:20:25 gkatsev_ has joined #me 22:34:46 nigel has joined #me