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16:45:56 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2022/04/21-aria-irc
16:45:57 <Zakim> RRSAgent, make logs Public
16:45:58 <Zakim> please title this meeting ("meeting: ..."), jamesn
16:46:03 <jamesn> meeting: ARIA WG
16:46:10 <jamesn> chair: JamesNurthen
16:46:18 <jamesn> agendabot, find agenda
16:46:18 <agendabot> jamesn, OK. This may take a minute...
16:46:18 <agendabot> agenda: https://www.w3.org/events/meetings/2b92a902-1365-4ea0-8c68-9f8ae2106fe3/20220421T130000
16:46:18 <agendabot> clear agenda
16:46:18 <agendabot> agenda+  -> New Issue Triage https://bit.ly/3OmbN9e
16:46:19 <agendabot> agenda+  -> New PR Triage https://bit.ly/3OpLsY0
16:46:21 <agendabot> agenda+  -> Deep Dive planning https://bit.ly/aria-meaty-topic-candidates  - Next week OpenUI, week after <Dialog>
16:46:24 <agendabot> agenda+  -> 1.2 Status https://github.com/orgs/w3c/projects/8/views/1?layout=board
16:46:27 <agendabot> agenda+  -> Update authoring requirement for aria-selected on options https://github.com/w3c/aria/pull/1719  - reviews needed from  -> @chlane https://github.com/chlane   -> @mcking65 https://github.com/mcking65
16:46:31 <agendabot> agenda+  -> Support aria-description https://github.com/w3c/accname/pull/69
16:46:34 <agendabot> agenda+  -> When is hidden content taken into calculation of name and description? https://github.com/w3c/accname/pull/150  - reviews needed from  -> @cookiecrook https://github.com/cookiecrook   -> @cyns https://github.com/cyns   -> @jnurthen https://github.com/jnurthen   -> @MelSumner
16:46:38 <agendabot> … https://github.com/MelSumner
16:46:41 <agendabot> agenda+  -> 1.3 Triage https://github.com/w3c/aria/issues?q=is%3Aopen+is%3Aissue+milestone%3A%22ARIA+1.3%22+no%3Aproject+sort%3Acreated-asc
16:53:17 <jamesn> agenda?
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17:04:34 <myasonik> present+
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17:04:40 <chlane> present +
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17:05:36 <MarkMcCarthy> present+
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17:07:26 <Matt_King> regrets+
17:07:30 <jamesn> present+
17:07:37 <chlane> scribe:chlane
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17:07:59 <sarah> present+
17:08:01 <spectranaut> present+
17:08:03 <chlane> Zakim, next agendum
17:08:03 <Zakim> agendum 1 -- -> New Issue Triage https://bit.ly/3OmbN9e -- taken up [from agendabot]
17:08:51 <chlane> #1726
17:09:29 <chlane> jcraig to look into it
17:09:37 <chlane> per jamesn
17:09:44 <Siri> Siri has joined #aria
17:09:48 <chlane> no idea for milestone yet
17:10:06 <chlane> #1725
17:10:12 <chlane> already a pr
17:10:21 <chlane> Siri:
17:10:36 <chlane> this was discussed, if matt is here discuss during deep dive?
17:11:01 <chlane> whether combobox select only , list box may or may not need aria label
17:11:11 <chlane> apg says if listbox is part of comobobox, no label needed
17:11:21 <chlane> conflict in documentation
17:11:28 <chlane> jcraig: jogund has done a pr
17:11:48 <chlane> correcton jamesn said last line
17:12:04 <chlane> separate deep dive?
17:12:11 <MarkMcCarthy> s/jcraig: jogund has done a pr/jamesn: jogund has done a pr
17:12:11 <chlane> listboxes donte need a11y name?
17:12:16 <chlane> if in combobox
17:12:18 <MarkMcCarthy> s/correcton jamesn said last line/
17:12:31 <chlane> milestone 1.3
17:12:39 <chlane> #113
17:12:42 <spectranaut> https://github.com/w3c/core-aam/issues/113
17:12:56 <chlane> jamesn: valerie discuss later?
17:13:00 <chlane> yes
17:13:02 <chlane> 1724
17:13:30 <chlane> jamesn: yes it doesn't match non normative section needs update
17:13:39 <chlane> about disambiguation
17:13:52 <chlane> preferred syntax for those kind of elememts
17:13:57 <chlane> assinged to jscriag
17:14:01 <chlane> 1723
17:14:56 <chlane> https://github.com/w3c/aria/issues/1723
17:15:30 <chlane> jamesn: 1.4
17:15:43 <chlane> we need to look at mathml
17:16:06 <MarkMcCarthy> s/#1726/https://github.com/w3c/aria/issues/1726
17:16:07 <chlane> Joan has done some mathml in the past, adding Siri too
17:16:14 <MarkMcCarthy> s/#1725/https://github.com/w3c/aria/issues/1725
17:16:34 <MarkMcCarthy> s/1724/https://github.com/w3c/aria/issues/1724
17:16:46 <chlane> https://github.com/w3c/aria/issues/1722
17:16:53 <chlane> 1722
17:16:54 <chlane> https://github.com/w3c/aria/issues/1722
17:17:18 <chlane> jamesn: should be filed against browsers?
17:17:22 <chlane> spec change here?
17:18:16 <chlane> Zakim, next agendum
17:18:16 <Zakim> agendum 2 -- -> New PR Triage https://bit.ly/3OpLsY0 -- taken up [from agendabot]
17:18:57 <chlane> https://github.com/w3c/aria/pull/1727
17:19:15 <chlane> https://github.com/w3c/accname/pull/157
17:19:41 <chlane> jamesn: it is reasonable
17:19:54 <chlane> doen'st work with label, Bryan agrees
17:20:12 <chlane> jamesn: will review
17:20:14 <chlane> and Siri
17:20:19 <chlane> will review
17:20:29 <chlane> https://github.com/w3c/html-aam/pull/396
17:20:40 <chlane> update / expand input value mappings
17:20:50 <chlane> jamesn: it's an html aam thing
17:21:43 <chlane> sarah: related to combobox work
17:21:53 <chlane> jamesn: almost a prereque
17:21:57 <chlane> sarah: will take a look
17:22:21 <chlane> jamesn: aaron may not have time
17:22:46 <chlane> jamesn: james assigned as well
17:23:02 <chlane> Zakim, next agendum
17:23:02 <Zakim> agendum 3 -- -> Deep Dive planning https://bit.ly/aria-meaty-topic-candidates  - Next week OpenUI, week after <Dialog> -- taken up [from agendabot]
17:23:38 <chlane> Open UI, help and guide them
17:23:43 <chlane> not an in depth look
17:23:57 <chlane> more like these are the things we are working on
17:24:01 <chlane> weve lost touch
17:24:07 <chlane> more engagement needed
17:24:19 <chlane> we could help them get a11y implementation
17:24:32 <chlane> jamesn: working on formal agenda
17:24:43 <chlane> diaogs will be first week of may
17:25:01 <chlane> may 19?
17:25:11 <chlane> GAAD is on that date
17:25:16 <chlane> may have conflicting events
17:25:24 <chlane> Bryan G is unavailable
17:25:35 <chlane> we may want to attend other events
17:25:41 <chlane> jamesn: proposes cancelling
17:25:44 <chlane> no objections
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17:26:16 <chlane> Zakim, next agendum
17:26:16 <Zakim> agendum 4 -- -> 1.2 Status https://github.com/orgs/w3c/projects/8/views/1?layout=board -- taken up [from agendabot]
17:27:15 <chlane> spectranaut:3 items from 1.2 are unfinished
17:27:33 <chlane> aria value now on spinbutton requires core AAM changes that are not cleared
17:27:39 <chlane> it is "at risk"
17:28:04 <chlane> jamesn: we can drop it
17:28:28 <chlane> spectranaut: go to spec or I can just talk
17:28:54 <chlane> spectranaut: aria-valuenow is mapped to a range value that doesn't have a concept of no value in ATK and UIA
17:29:03 <chlane> what do we do in those cases?
17:29:16 <chlane> who do we who to reach out to
17:29:27 <chlane> aaronlev: ATK would not support the value interface
17:29:44 <chlane> spectranaut: joanies suggestion is to add state intderminant
17:29:59 <chlane> jamesn: what does input type=number when there is no value
17:30:11 <chlane> sarah: not sure, need to check spec html
17:30:24 <chlane> jamesn: jamesn: does it have to have a value in html?
17:30:38 <chlane> aaronlev: I think it might have to have it
17:30:48 <chlane> sarah: we will check or they will
17:30:58 <chlane> jamesn: we should just do whatever that does
17:31:13 <chlane> (referring in input type=number)
17:31:25 <chlane> has zero in IAA
17:31:46 <chlane> jamesn: should never have put that in in the first place
17:32:03 <chlane> sarah: makes sense for arrow keys to work
17:32:12 <chlane> no idea why not shown visually
17:32:21 <chlane> jamesn: seems like a bug
17:32:24 <chlane> but not aria
17:32:34 <chlane> sarah: min max should not default to 0
17:32:51 <chlane> sarah: it doesn't make sense to not have a value
17:32:56 <chlane> jamesn: yep
17:33:14 <MarkMcCarthy> s/intderminant/indeterminate
17:33:25 <chlane> jamesn:rendering with nothing there makes no sense
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17:34:39 <Jem> present+
17:34:42 <chlane> spectranaut: seems like there are questions
17:34:44 <Jem> agenda?
17:34:55 <chlane> jamesn: timeline is longer then we want to have
17:35:14 <chlane> jamesn: pulls this out
17:35:22 <chlane> any objections?
17:35:30 <chlane> call for concensus needed
17:35:39 <chlane> may ne needed
17:35:50 <MarkMcCarthy> s/ne/be
17:36:00 <chlane> s/ne/be
17:36:30 <chlane> jamesn: no default valuenow for spin button, no implementations of it
17:36:43 <chlane> jamesn: it seems like it could change
17:37:26 <chlane> jamesn: will discuss procedure to pull out
17:38:02 <chlane> spectranaut: 2 other things missing implementations
17:38:47 <chlane> do we push for implementations
17:39:01 <chlane> jamesn: Gecko exposes everything already
17:39:09 <chlane> thats what they do
17:39:41 <chlane> aaronlev: linux and blink are 2 diff implementations
17:39:45 <chlane> jamesn: that one is ok
17:40:21 <chlane> role desc on generic -
17:40:39 <jamesn> https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=174248
17:41:33 <chlane> aaronlev: if there is no patch
17:41:41 <chlane> cant' make next public seec
17:41:47 <chlane> s/seec/seed
17:42:17 <chlane> jamesn: double checking
17:42:24 <chlane> items at risk
17:42:31 <chlane> it is there
17:42:51 <chlane> jamesn: don't want to pull it out but it seems reasonable
17:43:25 <chlane> just removing it from prohibited states and properties
17:43:58 <chlane> jamesn: is there anywhere else where it is prohibited
17:44:02 <chlane> would be wierd
17:44:29 <chlane> aaronlev: generic already implemented in chromium?
17:44:46 <chlane> yes implemented on chrome
17:45:58 <chlane> aaronlev: earliest is late summer not a high priority for webkit
17:46:18 <chlane> if getting into webkit source, might happen
17:46:33 <chlane> from now to fall it is ramped down to only critical bugs
17:46:37 <chlane> this is not critical
17:47:00 <chlane> jamesn: will anyone object to text for role description
17:47:35 <chlane> aaronlev: put in the note to plan to prohibit it
17:47:52 <chlane> spectranaut: seems reasonable
17:48:00 <chlane> jamesn: have to ship it
17:48:46 <chlane> s/aaronlev/jcraig/
17:49:15 <chlane> spectranaut: suggest a note to add
17:49:43 <chlane> jamesn: a way to prohibit for authors
17:49:54 <chlane> jamesn: have to talk to micheal
17:50:09 <chlane> spectranaut: ok we have a way forward
17:50:46 <chlane> Zakim, next agendum
17:50:46 <Zakim> agendum 5 -- -> Update authoring requirement for aria-selected on options https://github.com/w3c/aria/pull/1719  - reviews needed from  -> @chlane https://github.com/chlane   ->
17:50:49 <Zakim> ... @mcking65 https://github.com/mcking65 -- taken up [from agendabot]
17:51:30 <chlane> jamesn: done
17:52:04 <chlane> Zakim, next agendum
17:52:04 <Zakim> agendum 6 -- -> Support aria-description https://github.com/w3c/accname/pull/69 -- taken up [from agendabot]
17:52:28 <chlane> jamesn: outstanding comments still
17:52:52 <chlane> Zakim, next agendum
17:52:52 <Zakim> agendum 6 was just opened, chlane
17:53:05 <MarkMcCarthy> zakim, close this item
17:53:05 <Zakim> agendum 6 closed
17:53:06 <Zakim> I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
17:53:06 <Zakim> 7. -> When is hidden content taken into calculation of name and description? https://github.com/w3c/accname/pull/150  - reviews needed from  -> @cookiecrook
17:53:06 <Zakim> ... https://github.com/cookiecrook   -> @cyns https://github.com/cyns   -> @jnurthen https://github.com/jnurthen   -> @MelSumner [from agendabot]
17:53:09 <MarkMcCarthy> zakim, take up item 7
17:53:09 <Zakim> agendum 7 -- -> When is hidden content taken into calculation of name and description? https://github.com/w3c/accname/pull/150  - reviews needed from  -> @cookiecrook
17:53:10 <chlane> Zakim, next agendum
17:53:13 <Zakim> ... https://github.com/cookiecrook   -> @cyns https://github.com/cyns   -> @jnurthen https://github.com/jnurthen   -> @MelSumner -- taken up [from agendabot]
17:53:13 <Zakim> agendum 7 was just opened, chlane
17:53:35 <chlane> jamesn: hidden content, waiting for reviews, it has been merged
17:53:48 <chlane> still would like jcraig to review
17:54:02 <chlane> jamesn: it is critical for jcraig to review
17:54:25 <chlane> can't have it in the spec if not passing jcraigs review
17:54:33 <chlane> pr 150
17:55:16 <chlane> aaronlev: ping if needed
17:55:36 <chlane> Zakim, next agendum
17:55:36 <Zakim> agendum 8 -- -> 1.3 Triage https://github.com/w3c/aria/issues?q=is%3Aopen+is%3Aissue+milestone%3A%22ARIA+1.3%22+no%3Aproject+sort%3Acreated-asc -- taken up [from agendabot]
17:56:13 <chlane> rrsagent, make minutes
17:56:13 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/04/21-aria-minutes.html chlane
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