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12:00:54 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2022/02/23-wot-profile-irc
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12:01:33 <kaz> meeting: WoT Profile
12:01:48 <kaz> present+ Kaz_Ashimura, Ege_Korkan, Michael_Lagally
12:02:46 <Mizushima> Mizushima has joined #wot-profile
12:06:29 <mlagally> invite zakim
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12:08:13 <mlagally> https://www.w3.org/2001/12/zakim-irc-bot.html
12:08:55 <mlagally> zakim, start meeting
12:08:55 <Zakim> RRSAgent, make logs Public
12:08:56 <Zakim> please title this meeting ("meeting: ..."), mlagally
12:09:08 <mlagally> meetin: WoT Usecases
12:09:15 <mlagally> meeting: WoT Usecases
12:09:27 <mlagally> s/Usecases/Profile/
12:09:37 <Ege> Topic: Agenda
12:10:43 <Ege> ml: I would like to focus on the eventing model
12:11:12 <kaz> present+ Ben_Francis, Michael_McCool, Ryuichi_Matsukura, Sebastian_Kaebisch, Tomoaki_Mizushima
12:11:51 <kaz> agenda: https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/WG_WoT_Architecture_WebConf#WoT_Architecture_.28Profile.29_-_Feb_23rd.2C_2022
12:11:53 <Ege> topic: minute review
12:12:03 <kaz> |minute review|-> https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/WG_WoT_Architecture_WebConf#WoT_Architecture_.28Profile.29_-_Feb_23rd.2C_2022 agenda|
12:12:10 <kaz> i|minute review|-> https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/WG_WoT_Architecture_WebConf#WoT_Architecture_.28Profile.29_-_Feb_23rd.2C_2022 agenda|
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12:12:22 <kaz> s/minute review/minutes review/
12:12:35 <kaz> ->https://www.w3.org/2022/02/16-wot-profile-minutes.html Feb-16
12:12:53 <Ege> ml: anything to change?
12:13:33 <Ege> topic: OOTBI
12:14:07 <Ege> ml: i have added link to h-2020 project
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12:15:03 <kaz> i/OOTBI/(typo fixed, and minutes approved)/
12:15:16 <Ege> ml: i have added interoperability definitions into the text
12:15:23 <kaz> s/OOTBI/Out of the Box Interoperability/
12:15:32 <kaz> rrsagent, make log public
12:15:36 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
12:15:36 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/02/23-wot-profile-minutes.html kaz
12:15:54 <kaz> present+ Daniel_Peintner
12:15:56 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
12:15:56 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/02/23-wot-profile-minutes.html kaz
12:16:04 <Ege> ml: we can do the editorial fixes later after merging
12:16:42 <kaz> i|I have added link|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-profile/pull/176 PR 176 - OOTBI section|
12:17:10 <kaz> chair: Lagally
12:17:32 <kaz> (PR 176 merged)
12:18:01 <Ege> topic: requirements
12:18:16 <Ege> ml: I have added the accepted requirements with the supporters in the comments
12:18:32 <kaz> i|have add|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-profile/pull/175 PR 175 - incorporating accepted requirements|
12:18:33 <Ege> ml: We can delete them later as well
12:19:18 <Ege> ml: we should polish the text later
12:19:47 <Ege> mm: I think the editors note is important
12:21:06 <McCool> q+
12:21:49 <kaz> ack m
12:22:33 <Ege> ml: I am ok to change industrial vs home
12:23:33 <kaz> q?
12:24:03 <Ege> ml: other comments?
12:24:13 <Ege> bf: generally use cases and requirements are another document in w3c specs
12:24:56 <Ege> topic: PR 130
12:24:58 <kaz> s/another document/described by a separate document/
12:25:14 <kaz> s/w3c specs/w3c specs but we can deal with that later./
12:25:31 <kaz> i/PR 130/(merged)/
12:25:52 <Ege> mm: I agree with Ben that we should not have two use cases to maintain
12:26:05 <kaz> i|agree|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-profile/pull/130 PR 130 -Add Use cases section|
12:27:16 <benfrancis> q+
12:27:47 <Ege> mm: requirements should be driven from use cases. thus, it is better to have these in the use cases document so that internal links work better
12:28:03 <Ege> ml: this is not a new use case
12:29:17 <Ege> bf: I am ok with the text except for the last sentence
12:29:42 <McCool> q+
12:30:19 <Ege> bf: profile does not enable cross protocol interoparability so the text is misleading. You will need custom adapters
12:30:25 <McCool> ack b
12:30:47 <Ege> ml: The text says enhancing
12:31:07 <kaz> q?
12:31:20 <McCool> ack
12:31:21 <Ege> ek: I also agree with mccool
12:31:21 <McCool> ack m
12:32:06 <Ege> ml: can we approve this MR then?
12:32:16 <Ege> (group agrees)
12:32:28 <Ege> topic: PR 109
12:32:45 <Ege> ml: I was removing rfc assertions
12:33:06 <Ege> mm: we should rerun the tool then, which will remove some assertions
12:35:15 <kaz> q+
12:35:48 <Ege> ml: mandating json schema makes a lot of sense
12:35:50 <Ege> q+
12:36:37 <McCool> q+
12:36:37 <Ege> kaz: pr 130 to be merged after fixing the sentences right?
12:36:39 <McCool> ack k
12:36:53 <kaz> s/sentences/3 sentences/
12:36:54 <kaz> [[
12:36:55 <kaz>           separation of the interaction model and the protocol binding.
12:36:55 <kaz>           This separation makes it possible to define common protocol agnostic
12:36:55 <kaz>           rules that enhance interoperability between different protocols.
12:36:56 <kaz> ]]
12:37:00 <kaz> @@@ to be moved
12:37:04 <kaz> q?
12:37:41 <kaz> i|I was re|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-profile/pull/130 PR 130 - Add Use cases section|
12:38:02 <McCool> ack e
12:40:09 <Ege> ek: there is an annoying problem with the format keyword that different json schema implementations use the formats in different "lazyness" levels, like checking @ sign for email or doing full regex validation
12:40:22 <Ege> mm: this is just a cleanup though
12:40:43 <Ege> mm: please create a separate issue on that
12:40:57 <Ege> topic: event model
12:41:33 <McCool> q+
12:43:19 <kaz> i|I was removing|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-profile/pull/109 PR 109 - preparing implementation report - cleanup assertions|
12:43:40 <Ege> ml: there are TDs from TUM, Siemens and NHK that use longpoll
12:43:56 <benfrancis> q+
12:44:24 <McCool> ack m
12:44:52 <Ege> mm: if the Consumer cannot have the server functionality
12:45:13 <Ege> ml: I would approach this in another way, we can have a conditional language
12:46:13 <McCool> q+
12:46:18 <McCool> ack b
12:47:05 <Ege> bf: we just merged a requirement saying that consumer must be able to interact with all interactions
12:47:26 <Ege> bf: so if the Thing has webhook as the single event approach, some consumers cannot use it
12:47:36 <Ege> bf: so I think that for this we would need a separate profile for this
12:47:49 <Ege> mm: we can also define a profile without events
12:48:24 <Ege> q+
12:48:58 <Ege> mm: we have multiple options, let's list them and weigh pros and cons
12:49:20 <Ege> mm: we can have fallback
12:50:41 <Ege> mm: like if the Thing cannot offer webhooks, it must offer sse in the worst case
12:53:12 <McCool> q+
12:53:50 <Ege> bf: having server capability requirement on consumers imply change for all interactions
12:55:00 <Ege> mm: let's open an issue for discussion
12:55:11 <Ege> bf: we have already 6 issues on this topic, another issue will not help
12:55:20 <Ege> mm: let's pick one in this case
12:55:23 <kaz> q?
12:55:31 <Ege> ml: I think we should list them
12:55:32 <McCool> ack m
12:55:57 <kaz> q+
12:56:02 <kaz> ack e
12:57:28 <Ege> ek: I think that having options for consumers or fallbacks, increase implementation complexity for consumers
12:57:41 <kaz> ack k
12:57:57 <Ege> ... not having events means that if my use case have events, I will not be able to use this profile and write non-profile TDs
12:58:09 <Ege> topic: PR 117
12:58:31 <Ege> ml: any objections to merge?
12:58:39 <Ege> ml: (merges)
12:58:42 <Ege> ml: aob?
12:58:48 <Ege> adjourned
12:58:56 <kaz> i/PR 117/kaz: given we're out of time, I agree we'll continue the discussion next week, but we should think about how to proceed as well, e.g., need another use case? need a concrete implementation?/
12:59:49 <kaz> i|any obj|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-profile/pull/117 PR 117 - Add Identifier section to Core Profile - closes #111|
13:00:01 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
13:00:01 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/02/23-wot-profile-minutes.html kaz
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