IRC log of miniapp on 2021-12-16

Timestamps are in UTC.

11:56:52 [RRSAgent]
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logging to https://www.w3.org/2021/12/16-miniapp-irc
11:57:28 [xfq]
Meeting: MiniApps WG/CG Teleconference
11:57:33 [xfq]
present+
11:57:38 [xfq]
scribe: xfq
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rrsagent, make log public
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rrsagent, make minutes
11:57:49 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/12/16-miniapp-minutes.html xfq
11:58:44 [xfq]
present+ Dan_Zhou
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rrsagent, make minutes
11:59:27 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/12/16-miniapp-minutes.html xfq
12:00:05 [xfq]
present+ tomayac
12:00:17 [xfq]
present+ Zitao_Wang
12:00:31 [xfq]
present+ Yulu_Chao
12:02:19 [xfq]
present+ Qing_An
12:02:43 [QingAn]
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12:04:31 [angel_]
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present+ Canfeng, angel_
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present+ martin, hax
12:06:23 [xfq_]
qing: @@
12:06:48 [xfq_]
... IoT
12:07:18 [QingAn]
?
12:07:21 [QingAn]
q?
12:07:47 [xfq_]
present+ yanyumeng
12:08:18 [xfq_]
... ui component
12:08:44 [xfq_]
[zitao shares his screen]
12:09:13 [xfq_]
zitao: we have solicited feedbak
12:09:29 [martin]
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12:09:30 [xfq_]
... would like to reuse w3c esiting standard
12:09:48 [xfq_]
... martin had some comments
12:09:58 [xfq_]
... maybe we can reuse web components
12:10:18 [xfq_]
... i reviewed martin's comments and i think it makes sense
12:10:29 [xfq_]
... think we should move in this direction
12:11:05 [xfq_]
... want to discuss the scope and method with the CG and WG
12:11:15 [xfq_]
... want to hear feedbakc from other vendors
12:12:18 [xfq_]
s/w3c esiting standard/existing standards in W3C/
12:12:56 [xfq_]
https://github.com/w3c/miniapp-components/issues/2
12:13:43 [xfq_]
martin: The challenges are not limited to these, but here are the more important challenges.
12:14:33 [xfq_]
... should adopt the proposals in the Open UI CG or jump into their discussions
12:15:06 [xfq_]
... another important challenge is that there is overlap with existing html elements
12:15:30 [xfq_]
... some of them are the same, like div
12:16:11 [xfq_]
... If they are really different, the elements could extend the HTML elements using inheritance
12:16:34 [xfq_]
... reuse the attributes and behavior of the existing html elements
12:16:43 [xfq_]
... if they are the same, just adopt HTML
12:17:33 [xfq_]
... Basic MiniApp components with a minimum set of non-standard attributes like disable, focusable..
12:18:02 [xfq_]
... we can create of a basic, essential MiniappElement that extends the HTMLElement with the specific requirements
12:18:07 [xfq_]
... as the base of all elements
12:18:35 [xfq_]
... the fourth challenge, MiniApp events that are similar to existing standard ones
12:19:20 [xfq_]
... we should adopt the existing standards if we can
12:19:45 [xfq_]
... New events on the MiniApp components (e.g., longpress, swipe…)
12:19:53 [xfq_]
... somewhat controversial
12:20:20 [xfq_]
... i think we can document the use cases to see if they're really necessary
12:20:48 [xfq_]
... if so, we can define new CustomEvents based on the standard DOM interfaces
12:21:08 [xfq_]
... so far we don't have specific features for accessibility in MiniApp components
12:21:21 [xfq_]
... like alternative text for images
12:21:38 [xfq_]
... in this case we adopt existing html css dom standards
12:21:48 [xfq_]
... because they already covered a11y features
12:22:37 [xfq_]
... please feel free to comment
12:22:46 [xfq_]
... we can iterate this
12:23:37 [xfq_]
zitao: i think we want to discuss open ui and other related work
12:23:51 [xfq_]
... need to make the gaps and challenges clearer
12:24:30 [xfq_]
... want to call for participation from other miniapp vendors
12:25:46 [xfq_]
qing: today in the WG we have three specs in development
12:26:24 [xfq_]
... i think the ui component work is very essential
12:26:34 [xfq_]
... personally i'm in favor of the direction
12:26:53 [xfq_]
... also need to consider the APIs
12:27:07 [xfq_]
... gap analysis on miniapp APIs and web APIs
12:28:02 [xfq_]
... we can incubate the ui component work in the CG
12:28:33 [xfq_]
zitao: i solicited feedbak from developers
12:28:52 [xfq_]
... they think our current work is good, but not enough
12:29:03 [martin]
+1 to analyze the MiniApp APIs/WebAPIs similarities
12:29:04 [xfq_]
... standardized ui component and APIs are useful
12:29:14 [xfq_]
... we can update our white paper
12:30:08 [xfq_]
qing: I agree
12:30:16 [QingAn]
q?
12:30:20 [xfq_]
... any comment on ui component?
12:31:07 [xfq_]
... we can continue the discussion in github issue
12:31:11 [xfq_]
zitao: ok
12:32:13 [xfq_]
canfeng: we have further update on the widget requirement
12:32:34 [xfq_]
https://github.com/w3c/miniapp-widget/pull/3
12:32:53 [xfq_]
... we have started writing an explainer
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... still a draft
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... contains three parts
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... 1. explain what is a widget
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... @@
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... hope to upload an initial draft of widget spec before the next meeting
12:35:06 [xfq_]
qing: we can look at it before the next meeting
12:35:54 [xfq_]
qing: are we satisfied with https://github.com/w3c/miniapp-widget/pull/3 ?
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... dan has expressed her support
12:37:06 [QingAn]
+1
12:37:09 [xfq_]
zitao: +1
12:37:09 [martin]
+1
12:37:31 [xfq_]
+1
12:39:36 [xfq_]
xfq: publish @@
12:39:58 [QingAn]
https://github.com/w3c/miniapp-widget/issues
12:43:56 [xfq_]
canfeng: @@
12:45:11 [xfq_]
dan: @@
12:47:12 [xfq_]
dan: i think #2 can be closed
12:47:47 [xfq_]
canfeng: checked with yinli about #1
12:47:50 [xfq_]
... it can be closed
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s/... it can be closed//
12:49:37 [xfq_]
present+ taofengping
12:50:16 [martin]
+1 Jan 13
12:50:18 [xfq_]
next cg call: Jan 13
12:51:17 [xfq_]
qing: switch to WG meeting after the break
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[10min break]
12:54:15 [xfq_]
rrsagent, make minutes
12:54:15 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/12/16-miniapp-minutes.html xfq_
12:58:01 [xfq_]
chair: Qing, Zitao
13:00:41 [xfq_]
zitao: wg meeting
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... lifecycle
13:01:31 [xfq_]
qing: no big update for lifecycle
13:01:39 [xfq_]
... try to share more in the next meeting
13:01:48 [xfq_]
zitao: manifest
13:01:54 [xfq_]
martin: a few changes
13:02:01 [xfq_]
... some comments from xfq
13:02:15 [xfq_]
... regarding the examples
13:02:41 [xfq_]
... i fixed the issue raised by xfq
13:03:16 [xfq_]
... we also need to consider the URL story in the future
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... feel free to comment
13:05:07 [xfq_]
zitao: packaging
13:05:38 [xfq_]
... xfq filed https://github.com/w3c/miniapp-packaging/issues/42
13:06:28 [xfq_]
... we want to discuss whether we need to document this in the packaging spec
13:06:51 [xfq_]
... or we need to define it in a seperate document?
13:07:32 [xfq_]
martin: yes, it's something we need to discuss
13:08:08 [xfq_]
zitao: for sub-packaging we need to document it
13:08:26 [xfq_]
... for streaming, it's another format
13:08:41 [xfq_]
... do we want to document it in the packaing spec or another spec
13:09:28 [xfq_]
martin: it may affect the future of the packaging spec
13:10:35 [xfq_]
dan: i suggesta we put streaming and sub-packaging in the packaging spec
13:10:41 [xfq_]
... i can ask tengyuan to help the streaming part
13:11:15 [xfq_]
zitao: great
13:11:22 [martin]
We really appreciate as much input as possible, thanks!
13:11:58 [xfq_]
zitao: addressing
13:11:59 [xfq_]
https://github.com/w3c/miniapp-addressing/pull/4
13:12:17 [xfq_]
dan: i have answered yongjing's question
13:13:31 [xfq_]
... comments welcome
13:14:29 [xfq_]
zitao: i noticed that you mentioned why miniapp:// is introduced, but you did not mention platform://
13:15:42 [xfq_]
... maybe you can explain why you designed the URL like this
13:16:13 [xfq_]
dan: i'm not sure the deep linking technology can appear in a w3c note
13:16:16 [xfq_]
... need your help
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zitao: encourage folks to help dan revise the draft
13:17:24 [xfq_]
... this spec is impoartant for miniapps standardization
13:17:48 [xfq_]
zitao: widget
13:18:08 [xfq_]
... anything else, canfeng?
13:18:21 [xfq_]
canfeng: nothing for widget
13:18:25 [xfq_]
... white paper?
13:18:31 [xfq_]
zitao: it's the next agenda item
13:21:22 [xfq_]
zitao: white paper
13:21:27 [xfq_]
[xfq shares his screen]
13:21:32 [xfq_]
zitao: maybe we can add miniapp API
13:23:07 [xfq_]
canfeng: in the upcoming widget spec we will write some concrete API proposals related to widget
13:23:51 [xfq_]
[qing introduces his changes]
13:24:48 [xfq_]
qing: miniapps for iot
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... miniapps for TV
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... if you think it needs more content, please let me know
13:26:13 [xfq_]
zitao: we can have 1-2 weeks to review this
13:26:43 [xfq_]
qing: lifecycle
13:27:39 [xfq_]
canfeng: i updated the widget part
13:27:50 [xfq_]
... currently mixed chinese and englighs
13:27:58 [xfq_]
.... wil translate into english later
13:28:27 [xfq_]
... in the first paragraph i described the widget requirement document
13:28:47 [xfq_]
... in the second paragraph i gave a very very brief introduction of the widget spec
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... it's the first time i get involded in a white paper work in w3c
13:29:56 [xfq_]
... advice needed
13:32:02 [xfq_]
... any open issues against the white paper?
13:32:09 [xfq_]
xfq: https://github.com/w3c/miniapp/issues?q=is%3Aissue+is%3Aopen+label%3A%22white+paper%22
13:33:34 [xfq_]
canfeng: when we complete the widget spec we can write more next year
13:34:30 [xfq_]
zitao: next meeting time
13:35:34 [xfq_]
... joint meeting CG/WG?
13:35:53 [xfq_]
jan 27 is too close to chinese new year
13:36:21 [xfq_]
canfeng: i prefer separate meetings
13:36:31 [xfq_]
... jan 20?
13:36:44 [xfq_]
qing: fine by me
13:36:45 [martin]
+1 Jan 20
13:37:28 [xfq_]
topic: aob
13:37:31 [xfq_]
martin: will include a section about a11y for manifest and packaging
13:39:33 [xfq_]
zitao: a11y joint meeting?
13:39:36 [xfq_]
xfq: @@
13:40:04 [xfq_]
zitao: need to add the a11y, security, priviacy sections
13:40:30 [xfq_]
... does the WG htink we can add these sections before the next meeting?
13:40:45 [xfq_]
martin: i can add them, but i think we have gaps in a11y
13:42:45 [martin]
+1 to early review
13:43:01 [xfq_]
xfq: @@ early review
13:43:59 [xfq_]
canfeng: yinli said the widget plan issue can be closed
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... other "plan" issues were also closed
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rrsagent, make minutes
13:46:51 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/12/16-miniapp-minutes.html xfq_
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