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11:57:05 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2021/10/26-wot-irc
11:58:14 <kaz> meeting: WoT vF2F in October - Day 3
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11:59:26 <kaz> present+ Kaz_Ashimura, Michael_McCool, Hiroki_Endo, Hiroshi_Fujisawa, Kinji_Matsukura, Pierre-Antoine_Champin, Vincent_Chen
11:59:36 <kaz> present+ Takio_Yamaoka
11:59:56 <kaz> present+ Fuqiao_Xue, Ai_Mizokawa, Lance_Deng__Midea
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12:01:07 <kaz> present+ Michael_Lagally
12:01:08 <Qing_An> Qing_An has joined #wot
12:01:12 <kaz> -> https://www.w3.org/Consortium/Patent-Policy-20170801/ Patent Policy
12:01:15 <dezell> present+ David_Ezell
12:01:25 <Qing_An> present+
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12:01:54 <kaz> present+ David_Ezell, Jack_Dickinson
12:02:06 <kaz> present+ Klaus_Hartke
12:02:19 <kaz> present+ Daisuke_Ajitomi
12:02:36 <kaz> present+ Kunihiko_Toumura, Michael_Koster
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12:04:24 <kaz> present+ Hiroshi_Ota, Peter_Bruhn_Andersen, Qing_An, Takio_Yamaoka, Tetsuhiko_Hirata, Tomoaki_Mizushima
12:05:00 <dape> scribe: dape
12:05:13 <dape> TOPIC: Opening Session
12:05:20 <kaz> present+ Tomoya_Asai, Aritaka_Shinoda
12:05:25 <dape> MMC: Welcome to 3rd session
12:05:43 <dape> ... 2 regular sessions
12:05:51 <dape> ... and open day
12:06:13 <dape> ... today we will be discussing use-cases and Japanese WoT CG
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12:07:41 <dape> ... <mentioning W3C patent policy>
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12:08:41 <kaz> i|Welcome|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot/blob/main/PRESENTATIONS/2021-10-online-f2f/2021-10-26-WoT-F2F-Opening-McCool.pdf McCool's slides|
12:09:12 <kaz> rrsagent, make log public
12:09:16 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
12:09:16 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/10/26-wot-minutes.html kaz
12:09:23 <Adam_> Hello. I would like to request today's Webex link. I am presenting today on digital microscopes.
12:09:36 <dape> TOPIC: Use Cases
12:10:02 <dape> ML: Let's jump into the presentations
12:10:15 <kaz> chair: McCool
12:10:22 <dape> ... have some intro slides to give outline
12:10:37 <kaz> present+ Brian_Kardell
12:10:56 <kaz> present+ Daniel_Peintner, Ege_Korkan
12:10:57 <dape> ... after that we have presentations from Conexxus, NHK, MiniApps, Digital Microscopes, and Retail
12:11:03 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
12:11:03 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/10/26-wot-minutes.html kaz
12:11:08 <dape> ML: Objective of use case task force
12:11:13 <kaz> present, Fady_Salama
12:11:24 <dape> ... identify and describe relevant use cases
12:11:32 <zkis> zkis has joined #wot
12:11:44 <dape> ... collect uses cases from W3C and other stakeholders
12:11:56 <kaz> present+ Sudeep
12:11:58 <Adam_> !!! Hello. I am presenting today on digital microscopes. I need the Webex link?
12:12:04 <kaz> present+ Takashi_Minamii
12:12:23 <dape> ... collaborate with WoT task forces
12:12:41 <dape> ... and external groups
12:12:56 <ota> ota has joined #wot
12:13:09 <dape> ... we ensure quality with a proper process
12:13:39 <dape> ... document structure
12:14:05 <dape> ... horizontal use-cases... applicable to vertical use-cases
12:14:31 <kaz> present+ Steve_Lee
12:14:55 <dape> .. document has requirements section and liaison section
12:15:27 <dape> ... we use light-weight Markdown/HTML template for initial use-case
12:15:38 <dape> ... publication schedule
12:15:46 <dape> ... first publication in May 2021
12:16:02 <dape> ... new publication in December 2021
12:16:19 <kaz> q?
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12:17:12 <dape> SUBTOPIC: Conexxus
12:17:46 <Adam_> Thank you.
12:17:52 <kaz> present+ Adam_Sobieski
12:17:59 <dape> DE: Conexxus, we write standards
12:18:12 <dape> ... 1991 at W3C
12:18:15 <dape> ... we are consumers
12:18:29 <dape> ... not really creators of standards
12:19:13 <dape> ... retails store
12:19:31 <dape> .. interest in WoT-  how to to write standards in the space
12:19:54 <dape> JD: convenience stores.. retailers
12:20:06 <dape> ... interested in data or sensors
12:20:29 <dape> ... organizations have separate groups
12:20:45 <dape> ... focused on general operation but also security, management, ...
12:20:48 <steve> steve has joined #wot
12:20:52 <dape> ... planning teams
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12:21:09 <dape> ... General Business Issues & Benefits
12:21:21 <dape> ... Equipment & Facilities
12:21:29 <dape> ... Sales & Marketing
12:21:37 <dape> ... Safety & Compliance
12:21:41 <dape> ... Operations
12:21:54 <dape> ... dynamic group of people
12:22:02 <dape> ... problems & challenges
12:22:09 <dape> ... data in silos
12:22:33 <dape> ... data is often limited .. and access is limited
12:22:44 <dape> ... not shared across devices
12:22:57 <dom> dom has joined #wot
12:23:06 <dape> ... Common Data Points
12:23:09 <kaz> present+ Ryuichi_Matsukura
12:23:21 <dape> ... online vs offline status of device
12:23:22 <dom> dom has left #wot
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12:23:30 <dape> ... software level of a device
12:24:00 <dape> ... status of peripherals such as displays, printers, ...
12:24:54 <kaz> q+ to mention it's available at: https://github.com/w3c/wot-usecases/tree/main/USE-CASES/retail
12:24:56 <dape> DE: We are in the process of attempting our use-cases to GH
12:25:00 <pebran> pebran has joined #wot
12:25:00 <dape> ... about 20 use-cases
12:25:20 <dape> ... divided in several groups
12:25:20 <McCool> s/about 20/27/
12:25:38 <dape> ... e.g., indoor sales devices
12:25:55 <kaz> present+ Xiaoqian_Wu
12:26:03 <dape> ... target users: owner, manufacturer, ...
12:26:08 <kaz> present+ Tetsushi_Matsuda
12:26:20 <kaz> present+ Richard_Lea
12:26:31 <dape> ... interested in expected data
12:27:04 <dape> ... need to know the status of devices like printers are up
12:27:16 <kaz> q?
12:27:41 <dape> ... dependencies with TD and Discovery
12:27:56 <kaz> ack k
12:27:56 <Zakim> kaz, you wanted to mention it's available at: https://github.com/w3c/wot-usecases/tree/main/USE-CASES/retail
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12:28:09 <dape> ... sometimes we have read-only information from sensors
12:28:28 <stevelee> present+
12:28:31 <dape> ... e.g., indoor door sensor  use-case
12:28:51 <kaz> s/... sometimes/de: sometimes/
12:28:56 <dape> ... process: we want to know time.. who is accessing
12:29:07 <dape> ... or locked in cooler et cetera
12:29:19 <dape> ... safety issues, security issues
12:29:32 <bkardell_> bkardell_ has joined #wot
12:29:48 <dape> ... the use-case templates helped us to fit in our use-cases
12:29:52 <matsuda> matsuda has joined #wot
12:29:59 <bkardell_> present+
12:30:02 <dape> ... stakeholders... we call them target users
12:30:25 <dape> ... is about "who" wants  the information
12:30:51 <dape> ... e.g. use case: stop button
12:31:07 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot-usecases/blob/main/USE-CASES/retail/Retail-outdoor-allStopButton.md
12:31:17 <dape> ... big red button for emergency case
12:31:29 <kaz> s/... big/de: big/
12:31:53 <dape> ... inside the store we need a better UI
12:32:07 <kaz> present+ Kazuhiro_Hoya
12:32:27 <dape> DJ: button hit accidentally or on purpose
12:32:40 <dape> DE: expected data is very thin
12:32:58 <dape> ... devices are not created by us
12:33:05 <kaz> present+ Philippe_Le_Hegaret
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12:33:27 <dape> ... we would like to say here is a TD .. helps us to understand the data
12:33:48 <dape> ... manufacturer providing input
12:33:57 <kaz> q?
12:34:01 <kaz> q+
12:34:07 <kaz> q+ brian
12:34:18 <kaz> ack b
12:34:34 <dape> Brian: Who to contact?
12:34:42 <dape> DE: manufacturer
12:34:53 <dape> ... helpful for us
12:35:12 <dape> ... industry contact...
12:35:36 <dape> ML: Out of the box TDs, right?
12:35:45 <VincentChen> VincentChen has joined #wot
12:35:48 <dape> DE: Yes, correct
12:36:04 <dape> ... opportunity to help with TDs
12:36:23 <kaz> q?
12:36:24 <dape> q?
12:36:53 <dape> Kaz: Provided use-cases are very useful
12:37:27 <mjk> q+
12:37:32 <kaz> ack k
12:37:48 <dape> ... many use-cases ... maybe prioritize ?
12:38:03 <dape> DE: Yes, will try to come up with top 3 list
12:38:15 <kaz> q?
12:38:18 <dape> q?
12:38:22 <kaz> ack mjk
12:39:18 <dape> MK: use-cases are more about how devices provide TDs
12:39:34 <dsr> dsr has joined #wot
12:39:44 <dape> ... how to interop across industry ?
12:40:02 <dape> ... ThingModels being more generic?
12:40:32 <dape> ML: Suggest to tackle this observation in next use-case call
12:41:03 <dape> SUBTOPIC: MiniApps
12:41:13 <sebastian> sebastian has joined #wot
12:41:22 <dape> QA: from MiniApps groups
12:41:34 <kaz> present+ Zoltan_Kis
12:41:34 <dape> ... Alibaba group
12:42:03 <dape> ... miniApp CG and WG at W3C
12:42:12 <kaz> i/from/@@@QinAn's slides/
12:42:26 <dape> ... this year  we started work on IoT
12:42:31 <kaz> present+ Sebastian_Kaebisch
12:42:35 <dape> ... MiniApp overview
12:42:43 <dape> ... new format of mobile application
12:42:54 <dape> ... running on top of native apps or os
12:43:07 <dape> ... web-like, free installation
12:43:14 <dape> ... What is MiniApp for IoT
12:43:27 <dape> ... running on IoT devices
12:43:43 <dape> ... similar architecture...
12:43:51 <dape> ... run on top if IoT OS
12:44:09 <dape> ... unique features: packaging, life-cycle
12:44:13 <dape> ... Some use cases
12:44:20 <dape> ... -> switch panel
12:44:22 <xfq> ←ReSpec
12:44:22 <xfq> MiniApp for IoT -> https://w3c.github.io/miniapp-iot/
12:44:24 <dape> ... -> smart speaker
12:44:29 <dape> ... -> checkout pad
12:44:30 <xfq> s/←ReSpec//
12:44:38 <dape> ... -> video conference terminal
12:44:50 <dape> ... -> face recognition terminal
12:44:56 <dape> ... -> locator
12:45:35 <dape> ...Hardware supporting MiniApp for IoT
12:45:43 <dape> ... - LTE Cat 1 Module
12:45:49 <dape> ... - Wi-Fi module
12:45:56 <dape> ... - AliOS things
12:46:09 <dape> ... Benefits of MiniApp for IoT
12:46:18 <kaz> s/... -> video/qa: -> video/
12:46:24 <kaz> s/...H/... H/
12:46:43 <dape> ... traditionally developers write code -> obj -> binary
12:47:14 <dape> ... with MiniApps, Coding based on libraries/API (JS+JSON)
12:47:21 <dape> ... easy to integrate
12:47:34 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
12:47:34 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/10/26-wot-minutes.html kaz
12:47:36 <dape> ... web developers can write apps for IoT
12:48:04 <dape> ... Develop and Debug
12:48:05 <kaz> s/present, F/present+ F/
12:48:07 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
12:48:07 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/10/26-wot-minutes.html kaz
12:48:16 <dape> ... local write vs. online write
12:48:44 <dape> ... How to develop miniApp for IoT
12:49:07 <dape> ... use app.js + app.json -> single page miniApp application
12:49:34 <dape> ... more files possible like XML and CSS
12:50:01 <McCool> q?
12:50:02 <dape> ... packaging structure
12:50:03 <McCool> q+
12:50:05 <Ege> q+
12:50:28 <kaz> i/Let's jump into the presentations/-> @@@Lagally's slides/
12:50:54 <dape> ... working experience similar to mobile
12:51:14 <dape> ... we are working on spec called miniApp for IoT
12:51:16 <kaz> i/Conexxus, we write standards/-> @@@David's slides/
12:51:37 <dape> ... packaging / lifecycle / components
12:51:57 <kaz> present+ zhoudan
12:52:02 <pchampin> present+
12:52:03 <kaz> q?
12:52:08 <kaz> q+
12:52:11 <dape> ... we think there is joint work & discussions
12:52:21 <pchampin> q+ to ask how WASM / WASI fit in that picture
12:52:25 <sebastian> q+
12:52:41 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
12:52:41 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/10/26-wot-minutes.html kaz
12:53:14 <dape> MMC: Difference to WebApps?
12:53:25 <dape> QA: broader aspect
12:53:56 <dape> ... runtime is different
12:54:32 <dape> ... not used in web only, native also
12:54:32 <kaz> present+ shane
12:55:19 <dynamis> q+ how about the status/plan about UART/SPI/GPIO/I2C APIs?
12:55:23 <kaz> q?
12:55:55 <zkis> q+ to ask about packaging and expected runtime (collating with the WASM question from @pchampin)
12:56:01 <kaz> ack mc
12:56:03 <kaz> ack e
12:56:37 <dape> Ege: Use miniApp to attach HW
12:57:06 <dape> ... can other packages be used?
12:57:17 <dape> QA: other packages can be used for UI
12:57:29 <dape> ... for HW limited to miniApp API
12:57:58 <dape> Kaz: Device capability description ? Is there a model?
12:58:40 <dape> QA: we have data model ... called data profile
12:58:50 <kaz> present- shane
12:58:51 <dape> .. similar to WoT
12:59:05 <dape> ... service, actions, events
12:59:07 <kaz> present+ Shane_Unfred
12:59:16 <xfq> present- zhoudan
12:59:22 <xfq> present+ Dan_Zhou
12:59:46 <dape> Kaz: We can discuss data-format in future
12:59:50 <dape> q?
12:59:55 <kaz> ack k
13:00:04 <zkis> q- (explanation found in MiniApp various specs)
13:00:06 <dape> ML: Time is running
13:00:15 <dape> ... suggest to move the question to next use-case call
13:00:40 <kaz> q?
13:00:45 <dape> QA: I can attend the call
13:00:58 <dape> ... questions beforehand would be even better
13:01:19 <dape> ML: Okay, please provide questions ahead of time
13:01:25 <kaz> q?
13:01:26 <dape> ack pchampin
13:01:27 <Zakim> pchampin, you wanted to ask how WASM / WASI fit in that picture
13:01:32 <dape> ack sebastian
13:01:34 <pchampin> my question was about WebAssembly and WASI. Whether the mini-app group had considered them in their architecture.
13:01:39 <zkis> q-
13:01:40 <dape> ack zkis
13:02:09 <dape> SUBTOPIC: NHK
13:03:07 <dape> HE: Hiroki Endo from NHK
13:03:39 <kaz> i|Hiroki|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot/blob/main/PRESENTATIONS/2021-10-online-f2f/2021-10-26-WoT-F2F-UseCases-NHK-Endo.pdf NHK's slides|
13:03:42 <dape> ... Objective
13:04:12 <kaz> present+ Rachel_Yager
13:04:20 <dape> ... future broadcaster will deliver content not only for TV sets but also for various IoT devices
13:04:43 <dape> ... IoT-based media framework
13:05:08 <dape> ... content according different devices
13:05:20 <dape> ... and user
13:05:28 <dape> ... 2 implementations
13:06:00 <dape> ... 1. Physical laboratory
13:06:35 <dape> ... space is modeled on the interior of a house
13:07:01 <dape> ... <video>
13:07:55 <dape> ... track people -> update interest if back to home
13:08:37 <dape> .. e.g. soccer games ... TV informs other devices about goal
13:09:51 <dape> ... in half time coffee machine starts
13:10:45 <dape> ... or weather warnings will be shown on TV screen and other devices
13:11:18 <dsr> dsr has joined #wot
13:12:16 <dape> ... System configuration uses node-RED
13:12:27 <dape> ... using WoT device emulator
13:12:41 <dape> ... provided toe the PlugFest at TPAC 2021
13:12:48 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
13:12:48 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/10/26-wot-minutes.html kaz
13:13:01 <dape> ... 2. Virtual Web app
13:13:44 <dape> ...select device where you will go
13:13:57 <dape> ...select what you will watch
13:14:07 <dape> ... location can be changed
13:14:39 <dape> ... typhon alert will  be shown
13:14:46 <dape> ... each device has TD
13:15:11 <dape> ... node-wot library used to interact with devices
13:15:21 <dape> ... Findings
13:15:27 <dape> ... issues on discovery
13:15:46 <dape> ... broadcaster cannot handle WoT devices in user environment
13:16:03 <dape> ... typically houses to not have network manager
13:16:24 <dape> ... we implemented DNS-SD for local networks
13:17:05 <dape> ... Action affordance for media presentations
13:17:30 <dape> ... need link information to WoT actions and content
13:17:50 <dape> ... mediaType of content
13:18:05 <sebastian> q+
13:18:21 <dape> ... corresponding action type like "playAudio"
13:18:35 <dape> q?
13:18:38 <McCool> q+
13:18:56 <kaz> q+
13:19:56 <dape> ML: w.r.t. action types,  simple string?
13:20:20 <kaz> qq+
13:20:25 <kaz> q-
13:20:27 <kaz> q-
13:20:28 <kaz> qq+
13:20:33 <dape> HE: not enough to determine media
13:20:58 <dape> ... TD don't define schema
13:21:36 <dape> ML: Write-up of gaps helps us to understand the problem better
13:21:47 <dape> ... use-case description with the gaps
13:21:58 <dape> HE: Yes, will try to work on it
13:22:06 <dape> q?
13:23:02 <kaz> ack k
13:23:02 <Zakim> kaz, you wanted to react to zkis
13:23:20 <dape> SK: I liked the showcase
13:23:27 <kaz> i/I like/kaz: @@@
13:23:37 <dape> ... w.r.t. to the action gap
13:23:49 <dape> ... maybe additional context may help
13:24:06 <dape> ... special context for broadcasters
13:24:32 <dape> ... w.r.t. mediaType, we can use IANA media-types
13:24:42 <dape> ack sebastian
13:24:50 <pchampin> is "mediaType" in this slide really meant as in IANA's media-types?
13:25:00 <pchampin> looks like something different
13:26:05 <kaz> s/@@@/Wanted to help Endo-san. MEIG also had discussion yesterday, and there was some discussion on having a virtual device for media distribution. For that purpose, various mediaTypes can be specified and also various actions can be specified to handle video distribution/playback/recording services. Further detail to be provided by NHK based on this use case and implementation./
13:26:06 <pchampin> considering an ontology that could be used here: https://www.ebu.ch/metadata/ontologies/ebucore/
13:26:20 <dape> MMC: Orchestration ?
13:26:33 <dape> HE: Our implementation is limited
13:26:58 <mlagally_> I think it is a description of a media stream, this could be complex, such as a MPEG DASH media descriptors, ...
13:27:01 <zkis> q?
13:27:04 <dape> ... SPARQL search
13:27:41 <dape> q?
13:27:44 <dape> ack McCool
13:28:39 <dape> Kaz/ML: invite Endo-san to use-case call
13:28:51 <dape> SUBTOPIC: Digital Microscopes
13:29:37 <McCool> (are there slides?  Not seeing anything)
13:29:37 <dape> AS: Digital Microscopes ... high quality
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13:30:08 <dape> ... share work
13:30:46 <dape> ... no manual adjustment needed
13:30:56 <dape> ... 4 concepts
13:31:34 <dape> ... 1. digital microscopes
13:31:39 <kaz> q?
13:31:57 <dape> ... 2. mixed reality collaborative spaces
13:32:02 <dape> ... 3. Services
13:32:19 <dape> ...  - free vs paid et cetera
13:32:32 <dape> ... 4. Multimodal user interfaces
13:32:57 <kaz> present+ Christian_Block__ECLASS
13:33:10 <dape> .... 2 Examples
13:33:20 <dape> ... 1. A droplet water
13:33:49 <dape> ... 2. A Living cell
13:34:08 <dape> ... WoT topics
13:34:26 <dape> ... Digital Microscopes are important class of devices
13:34:49 <dape> ... streams could contain metadata
13:35:01 <dape> ... using computer vision
13:35:10 <dape> ... semantic labels
13:36:10 <dape> ... requirements not addressed: interconnecting services
13:36:19 <dape> ... Considerations
13:36:23 <dape> ... - Security
13:36:29 <dape> ... - Privacy
13:36:35 <dape> ... - Accessibility
13:36:50 <dape> ... - Internationalization
13:37:07 <kaz> q?
13:37:12 <McCool> q+
13:37:14 <kaz> q+
13:37:44 <dape> ML: Question: When you think about controlling microscopes ?
13:38:00 <dape> ... who determines this living object
13:38:26 <dape> AS: AI could do automatic focusing but also manual override
13:39:03 <dape> MMC: Video streaming and AI are important use-cases
13:39:05 <dape> q?
13:39:07 <kaz> q?
13:39:09 <kaz> ack m
13:39:09 <dape> ack McCool
13:39:47 <dape> Kaz: Microscope requires precise handling?
13:40:57 <dape> ... we can think about meta framework ... recall Takenaka discussions
13:41:13 <dape> ML: Adam provided use-case already
13:41:28 <dape> ... follow-up conversation
13:41:40 <dape> ... medical category or lab category
13:41:46 <dsr> dsr has joined #wot
13:42:29 <dape> TOPIC: Retail use case with ECLASS semantics
13:42:43 <Ege> yes
13:42:52 <dape> CB: Sebastian and I worked on use-case document
13:43:11 <Ege> @kaz, I will take over scribing
13:43:13 <kaz> scribenick: Ege
13:44:03 <kaz> s/@kaz, I will take over scribing//
13:44:17 <Ege> cb: working on an rdf representation of the eclass standard
13:44:21 <kaz> s/handling?/handling/
13:44:34 <Ege> ... with sebastian we have worked on a use case document, it is on github
13:45:31 <kaz> s/meta framework/meta framework for handling precise movement and video streaming along with AI./
13:45:36 <Ege> cb: (shows the uc document)
13:46:06 <kaz> s/follow-up conversation/follow-up conversation during the Use Cases call./
13:46:18 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
13:46:18 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/10/26-wot-minutes.html kaz
13:46:22 <Ege> ... motivation is to embed device information
13:46:45 <Ege> ... all data that is needed for purchasing, sales, product master data
13:47:28 <kaz> i|ECLASS semantics|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-usecases/pull/150 Adam's use case|
13:48:44 <kaz> i|Sebastian and I|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-usecases/pull/140 Retail use case with ECLASS semantics #140|
13:48:53 <Ege> cb: internationalization is very important and we have different languages available
13:49:03 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
13:49:03 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/10/26-wot-minutes.html kaz
13:49:19 <Ege> cb: we need a way to include these models in TD, like templates
13:49:46 <Ege> q+
13:50:08 <Ege> cb: there are other related standards like gs1 and w3c data exchange group
13:50:17 <mlagally_> q+
13:50:19 <dezell> q+
13:50:22 <kaz> q-
13:50:33 <mlagally_> q-
13:51:14 <Ege> ack
13:51:18 <Ege> ack e
13:51:22 <kaz> q+
13:52:06 <Ege> ege: can we link via link via the links container?
13:52:09 <Ege> cb: yes
13:53:42 <Ege> sk: live data annotations will be also possible
13:53:49 <mlagally_> q?
13:53:54 <Ege> ... that way we can annotate TDs in the interaction level
13:54:27 <Ege> cb: (shows CDP interface of eclass)
13:54:37 <McCool> (time check: now 5m into the break...)
13:55:05 <mjk> q?
13:55:25 <McCool> (so I am sliding the schedule forward...)
13:56:05 <Ege> cb: we have this list of devices in different application domains
13:58:17 <kaz> kaz: @@@
13:59:02 <Ege> kaz: we need to discuss further which part of the eclass ontology should be included in the TD @context
13:59:14 <kaz> s/@@@/2 comments. regarding the use case itself, it would be better to have concrete use case description rather than general concept on using ECLASS ontology with TD/
13:59:20 <kaz> s/we need/also we need/
13:59:20 <Ege> ml: can you elaborate on the relation to the other standards
13:59:32 <Ege> sk: it was an input from your side but we can add more information
13:59:35 <Ege> cb: I can do it
14:00:34 <Ege> mm: let's have a 10 minute break
14:02:14 <kaz> s/@context/@context. We've been talking with both ECLASS and ISO TC184/SC4, but that is still our big question./
14:02:41 <kaz> [10-min break]
14:02:46 <kaz> rragent, draft minutes
14:09:40 <kaz> -> https://w3c.github.io/spec-releases/milestones/ milestones calc
14:11:47 <Ege> Topic: WoT Japanese CG update
14:13:27 <dsr> dsr has joined #wot
14:14:38 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot/blob/main/PRESENTATIONS/2021-10-online-f2f/2021-10-26-WoT-F2F-WoT-JP-CG-Mizushima.pdf Mizushima-san's slides
14:15:05 <Ege> tm: w3c standardization has standarded the tackle the interoperability problem
14:15:32 <kaz> s/standarded the/started to/
14:15:36 <Ege> tm: improve the future society via improving the e.g. infrastructure
14:16:03 <mlagally_> q+
14:16:07 <kaz> ack d
14:16:08 <kaz> ack k
14:16:45 <Ege> tm: main communication language is japanese
14:17:20 <Ege> tm: we have 4 task forces, use cases, outreach, deployment and translation
14:18:22 <Ege> ... translation tf is working on translating td and architecture recommendations
14:18:50 <Ege> tm: we have a tutorial page
14:19:22 <Ege> tm: and also this is the japanese version of wot architecture
14:19:54 <Ege> tm: we want to exchange with the WG and IG, like today's report
14:20:01 <McCool> q?
14:20:34 <kaz> ack ml
14:21:19 <kaz> q+
14:22:05 <Ege> ml: the CG is bringing input to the IG right?
14:22:09 <Ege> tm: yes correct
14:22:23 <McCool> q?
14:22:26 <Ege> ml: thank you for reaching out to japanese manufacturers
14:22:26 <McCool> ack k
14:23:12 <kaz> kaz: will help Mizushima-san and Toumura-san, note Kasuya-san from Takenaka is also joining the CG
14:23:16 <kaz> q?
14:23:32 <kaz> s/, note/. note/
14:24:09 <McCool> q?
14:24:32 <kaz> q?
14:24:35 <McCool> q?
14:24:40 <Ege> mm: reaching out to the japanese community is very important, thank you
14:24:48 <Ege> kaz: thank you all the task force leaders for their efforts
14:25:04 <Ege> Topic: Charter Discussion
14:25:17 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot/blob/main/PRESENTATIONS/2021-10-online-f2f/2021-10-26-WoT-F2F-Charters-McCool.pdf McCool's slides
14:25:23 <Ege> mm: we need to discuss our deliverables and schedule
14:29:12 <Ege> ... schedule is July 26 for REC, June 21 for PR and CR is May 5. FPWD Jan 13
14:29:32 <Ege> ... mid april for PR and mid march for CR are more realistic deadline
14:31:11 <kaz> q+
14:31:35 <sebastian> sorry, I have to leave the meeting
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14:31:46 <sebastian> +1 for the charter extension
14:34:03 <Ege> ege: (goes through the definitions of the CR, PR and REC)
14:35:36 <Ege> mm: testfest would be by mid february meaning that the specs should freeze by 31.12
14:38:22 <kaz> kaz: @@@
14:40:17 <mlagally_> q+
14:40:24 <Ege> mm: 2.0 needs to be pushed to next charter
14:41:07 <kaz> s/@@@/given the upcoming wide reviews and implementation experience, would agree we freeze the features by the end of this year. btw, is the "current" drafts stable enough? For example, would it possible for us to finalize the drafts right away?/
14:41:11 <kaz> q-
14:42:03 <kaz> mm: that's a good question. may need to rollback some things for KISS, compatibility
14:42:14 <kaz> ek: wondering about testing
14:42:33 <Ege> mm: we should limit the amount of rec style publications
14:42:48 <kaz> s/style/track/
14:43:12 <kaz> mm: we have 3 implementations for Discovery already
14:43:15 <kaz> q?
14:43:50 <kaz> ... what about Profile?
14:44:23 <kaz> ml: it's a chicken and egg situation
14:44:23 <Ege> mm: profile spec is not complete, so we should do that before talking about testing
14:44:46 <kaz> s/ml: it's a chicken and egg situation//
14:46:35 <Ege> ml: we need a stable td spec first for the profile spec
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14:48:21 <kaz> s/ td / TD /
14:48:38 <Ege> mm: we should freeze td so that profile can base on that
14:48:44 <kaz> s/ td / TD /
14:48:53 <kaz> q?
14:48:56 <kaz> ack ml
14:51:41 <kaz> q+
14:52:53 <Ege> mm: we can mark more things at risk this time
14:55:21 <Ege> mm: since sebastian is not here, we should wait his opinion
14:55:29 <Ege> ... we can do a tentative resolution
14:55:46 <kaz> q-
14:55:53 <kaz> s/... we/kaz: we/
14:56:35 <kaz> s/resolution/resolution now, and check with Sebastian during the vF2F tomorrow./
14:58:29 <McCool> proposal: request a 6mo extension to the WG charter, based on the following plan: 1. roll back TD spec to 1.1 features by Nov 30; 2. feature freeze TD 1.1 spec by Dec 15; 3. feature freeze Discovery spec by Dec 15; 4. feature freeze Profile spec by Jan 31; 5. Testfest in mid-Feb; 6. CR transition in mid-March; PR transition in mid-April; REC transition before end of extended charter end of July
14:58:43 <dape> q?
14:59:47 <McCool> resolution: (tentative) request a 6mo extension to the WG charter, based on the following plan: 1. roll back TD spec to 1.1 features by Nov 30; 2. feature freeze TD 1.1 spec by Dec 15; 3. feature freeze Discovery spec by Dec 15; 4. feature freeze Profile spec by Jan 31; 5. Testfest in mid-Feb; 6. CR transition in mid-March; PR transition in mid-April; REC transition before end of extended charter end of July
15:00:54 <kaz> topic: AOB?
15:01:01 <kaz> mm: IG Charter updated
15:01:08 <kaz> ... comments welcome for the PR
15:01:12 <kaz> kaz: when to review it?
15:01:20 <kaz> mm: next main call at the latest
15:01:27 <kaz> [adjourned]
15:01:37 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:01:37 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/10/26-wot-minutes.html kaz
15:02:20 <takio> takio has left #wot
15:10:42 <kaz> i/Wanted to help Endo/scribenick: kaz/
15:11:06 <kaz> i/I liked the showcase/scribenick: dape/
15:11:06 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:11:06 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/10/26-wot-minutes.html kaz
15:12:16 <kaz> s/react to zkis/react to mlagally/
15:12:17 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:12:17 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/10/26-wot-minutes.html kaz
15:12:52 <kaz> s/... recall/recall/
15:13:24 <kaz> i/kaz: 2 comments/scribenick: kaz/
15:13:40 <kaz> i/also we need to discuss further/scribenick: dape/
15:13:43 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:13:43 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/10/26-wot-minutes.html kaz
15:13:54 <kaz> s/rragent/rrsagent/
15:13:56 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:13:56 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/10/26-wot-minutes.html kaz
15:14:14 <kaz> i/will help Mi/scribenick: kaz/
15:14:38 <kaz> i/reaching out to j/scribenick: Ege/
15:14:40 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:14:40 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/10/26-wot-minutes.html kaz
15:15:51 <kaz> i/also we need to discuss further/scribeinck: Ege/
15:15:52 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:15:52 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/10/26-wot-minutes.html kaz
15:16:33 <kaz> s/scribeinck/scribenick/
15:16:35 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:16:35 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/10/26-wot-minutes.html kaz
15:17:15 <kaz> i/we need to discuss our/scribenick: Ege/
15:17:17 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:17:17 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/10/26-wot-minutes.html kaz
15:18:08 <kaz> i/given the upcoming wide/scribenick: kaz/
15:18:20 <kaz> i/2.0 needs to be/scribenick: Ege/
15:18:30 <kaz> i/that's a good question/scribenick: kaz/
15:18:47 <kaz> i/profile spec is not/scribenick: Ege/
15:18:50 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:18:51 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/10/26-wot-minutes.html kaz
15:20:04 <dsr> dsr has joined #wot
15:20:43 <kaz> i/IG Charter updated/scribenick: kaz/
15:22:13 <kaz> i|IG Charter updated|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot/pull/998 IG charter updates addressing W3M comments #998|
15:22:20 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:22:20 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/10/26-wot-minutes.html kaz
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