IRC log of rdf-star on 2021-09-03

Timestamps are in UTC.

15:01:49 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #rdf-star
15:01:49 [RRSAgent]
logging to https://www.w3.org/2021/09/03-rdf-star-irc
15:01:51 [Zakim]
RRSAgent, make logs Public
15:01:51 [gatemezing]
Zakim, who is here?
15:01:53 [Zakim]
please title this meeting ("meeting: ..."), pchampin
15:01:53 [Zakim]
Present: (no one)
15:01:53 [Zakim]
On IRC I see RRSAgent, Zakim, ora, olaf, gatemezing, gkellogg, TallTed, AndyS, pchampin, driib, agendabot, rhiaro
15:02:02 [rivettp]
rivettp has joined #rdf-star
15:02:03 [pchampin]
meeting: RDF-star
15:02:04 [ora]
(Too long of a break to again remember all the chat commands...)
15:02:06 [TallTed]
present+
15:02:08 [pchampin]
chair: pchampin
15:02:12 [rivettp]
present+
15:02:12 [ora]
present+
15:02:15 [pchampin]
agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-star/2021Sep/0000.html
15:02:15 [agendabot]
clear agenda
15:02:15 [agendabot]
agenda+ Announcements and newcomers
15:02:15 [agendabot]
agenda+ Open actions
15:02:15 [agendabot]
agenda+ PR #198: Suggest metadata in manifest turtle file
15:02:15 [agendabot]
agenda+ Issue #200: RDF-star and reasoning
15:02:18 [agendabot]
agenda+ WG draft charter
15:02:19 [gatemezing]
present+
15:02:20 [agendabot]
agenda+ Open-ended discussions
15:02:27 [olaf]
present+
15:03:00 [thomas]
thomas has joined #rdf-star
15:03:21 [AndyS]
present+
15:03:58 [gkellogg]
present+
15:04:18 [gatemezing]
scribe: gatemezing
15:04:28 [thomas]
present+
15:04:34 [pchampin]
zakim, next agendum
15:04:34 [Zakim]
agendum 1 -- Announcements and newcomers -- taken up [from agendabot]
15:05:00 [gatemezing]
Introduction of the new comer fabio
15:05:41 [gatemezing]
...Prof in Italy and working a lot on semantic technologies
15:06:25 [gatemezing]
...He was also involved in many W3C, like anything around markup
15:06:36 [gatemezing]
pchampin: thanks for the introduction
15:06:48 [gatemezing]
Topic: Announcement
15:07:53 [gatemezing]
ora: Should write a comparison for next week. They write a paper for SCG workshop
15:08:23 [Doerthe_]
Doerthe_ has joined #rdf-star
15:08:23 [gatemezing]
... and they realize there are somethings that are not taken into account by this rdf-star work
15:09:11 [gatemezing]
...thinking to write a use case on that aspect, and apologize before if this is late
15:09:46 [pchampin]
https://w3c.github.io/rdf-star/cg-spec/editors_draft.html#occurrences
15:09:48 [gatemezing]
pchampin: Maybe it is related to some discussions we had before @ora joined the group
15:10:07 [thomas]
ora: do you have a link to the paper?
15:10:20 [pchampin]
https://mosaicrown.github.io/scg2021/
15:10:46 [ora]
Paper is not public yet, I will provide a link soon.
15:11:18 [thomas]
ora, thanks! looking forward to it
15:11:26 [gatemezing]
pchampin: explain the venue of SCG workshop at SemantiCs2021
15:11:34 [pchampin]
q?
15:11:43 [pchampin]
zakim, next agendum
15:11:43 [Zakim]
agendum 2 -- Open actions -- taken up [from agendabot]
15:11:52 [gatemezing]
Topic: Open actions
15:11:55 [pchampin]
https://github.com/w3c/rdf-star/issues/196
15:12:45 [pchampin]
https://github.com/w3c/rdf-star/issues/195
15:12:51 [gatemezing]
Issue #196 is still pending
15:13:11 [gatemezing]
s/Issue #196 is still pending / pchampin: Issue #196 is still pending
15:13:32 [pchampin]
https://github.com/w3c/EasierRDF/issues/88
15:14:43 [gatemezing]
pchampin: the process for a "living standard" is possible
15:15:57 [gatemezing]
...check what could be a new feature in the W3C process
15:16:52 [pchampin]
q?
15:16:56 [ora]
q+
15:17:02 [AndyS]
q+
15:17:02 [gatemezing]
...and sent an email to a boss at W3C awaiting for the response
15:17:03 [thomas]
q+
15:17:15 [pchampin]
ack thomas
15:17:24 [pchampin]
q?
15:17:34 [pchampin]
q+ thomas
15:17:42 [pchampin]
ack ora
15:18:25 [gatemezing]
ora: I was wondering the impact on product delivery processes
15:18:33 [gkellogg]
q+ caniuse
15:18:36 [pchampin]
ack AndyS
15:19:28 [Doerthe]
Doerthe has joined #rdf-star
15:19:47 [pchampin]
scribe+
15:19:48 [pchampin]
A d
15:19:52 [pchampin]
A dh
15:19:55 [gatemezing]
AndyS: There's must be a public discussion on new features
15:20:02 [gatemezing]
s/ A d /
15:20:07 [gatemezing]
s/ A dh /
15:20:31 [pchampin]
AndyS: my gut feeling is that RDF-star would be to big to be considered a "new feature"
15:20:40 [pchampin]
scribe-
15:20:42 [ora]
q+
15:20:47 [gatemezing]
...It would set a high expectation
15:20:50 [pchampin]
ack thomas
15:21:03 [olaf]
q+
15:21:35 [Fabio_Vitali]
Fabio_Vitali has joined #rdf-star
15:21:41 [gatemezing]
thomas: could it be better to send to the public semantic Web W3C list?
15:22:00 [pchampin]
action: pchampin to notify semantic.web@w3.org about https://github.com/w3c/EasierRDF/issues/88
15:22:54 [pchampin]
ack caniuse
15:23:42 [gatemezing]
Gregg: A balance should be reach between the limitations and the features
15:25:11 [gatemezing]
...the charter should limit the types of the group can do or not
15:26:13 [pchampin]
+1 for a feature-annoucement mechanism of some kind
15:26:47 [gatemezing]
...RDF-star should consider annoucemenent features like MDN with HTML
15:26:59 [pchampin]
q?
15:27:04 [pchampin]
ack ora
15:27:41 [pchampin]
ack olaf
15:27:50 [gatemezing]
ora: a risk to choose what to implement in a living document could be also a risk
15:28:45 [rivettp]
q+
15:29:20 [pchampin]
ack rivettp
15:29:22 [gatemezing]
olaf: The concern is to better seperate and consider it
15:30:43 [gatemezing]
rivettp: How the ecosystem would evolve with somehow different implementations of the specs
15:31:32 [pchampin]
scribe+
15:31:51 [pchampin]
rivettp: OWL and other standards have not caught up with RDF 1.1
15:32:03 [pchampin]
... How would that go with RDF being a living standard?
15:32:49 [rivettp]
my concern generally was the challenge of managing the ecosystem as a whole if one standard is "living"
15:33:05 [pchampin]
AndyS: migrations are hard. People will wait until something is a standard to implement it
15:33:10 [pchampin]
q?
15:33:29 [gatemezing]
+1 with AndyS's point
15:34:06 [rivettp]
maybe you try for synchronized configurations or releases of multiple projects - which is what Eclipse tries to do
15:34:11 [pchampin]
zakim, next agendum
15:34:11 [Zakim]
agendum 3 -- PR #198: Suggest metadata in manifest turtle file -- taken up [from agendabot]
15:34:16 [gatemezing]
pchampin: This discussion should be push forward in the public mailing list
15:34:59 [pchampin]
gatemezing: this PR aims to add more metadata in the manifest files.
15:35:19 [pchampin]
... AndyS, gatemezing, TallTed commented on it.
15:35:40 [pchampin]
... There's general agreement that it should be done, more discussion on what to add exactly.
15:37:07 [pchampin]
[discussion on the representation of licenses in RDF]
15:37:29 [pchampin]
q?
15:38:31 [pchampin]
zakim, next agendum
15:38:31 [Zakim]
agendum 4 -- Issue #200: RDF-star and reasoning -- taken up [from agendabot]
15:38:40 [pchampin]
https://github.com/w3c/rdf-star/issues/200
15:38:54 [pchampin]
scribe-
15:39:23 [thomas]
q+
15:40:22 [olaf]
+1
15:40:34 [gatemezing]
AndyS: We have to choose which types of discussions and maybe add labels
15:40:42 [pchampin]
ack thomas
15:41:28 [TallTed]
ugh. Github discussion "threads" are one-level deep, and don't do well with shifting active conversation in either direction (issue->disc or disc->issue)
15:42:10 [TallTed]
q+
15:42:11 [gatemezing]
thomas: how to settle some other discussions in our document
15:42:57 [gatemezing]
...can someone put where to write it up so that it's part of the community report
15:43:06 [olaf]
q+
15:43:21 [gatemezing]
...so that that everyone can easily find it
15:43:25 [pchampin]
ack olaf
15:43:53 [gatemezing]
olaf: I can do it, but I can't do it by next week
15:44:44 [pchampin]
action: olaf to write a part on "per-property semantics" in the report -- pchampin to help
15:44:53 [pchampin]
ack TallTed
15:45:37 [gatemezing]
TallTed: I'm against using Github discussion since it's not mature for this purpose
15:45:47 [pchampin]
q+
15:46:12 [gatemezing]
...Use mailing list for other type of discussion
15:46:18 [pchampin]
ack pchampin
15:47:26 [gatemezing]
pchampin: Not also fan with discussions on Github. There are different special "kind" of issues ...
15:47:44 [TallTed]
Probably for next time, it can be good to review issues (with whatever label) based on oldest last activity -- e.g., https://github.com/w3c/rdf-star/issues?q=is%3Aissue+is%3Aopen+sort%3Aupdated-asc
15:47:50 [pchampin]
q?
15:47:56 [gatemezing]
... The mailing list has an archive but still difficult to follow
15:48:22 [gatemezing]
Zakim, who is here?
15:48:22 [Zakim]
Present: TallTed, rivettp, ora, gatemezing, olaf, AndyS, gkellogg, thomas
15:48:24 [Zakim]
On IRC I see Fabio_Vitali, Doerthe, thomas, rivettp, RRSAgent, Zakim, ora, olaf, gatemezing, gkellogg, TallTed, AndyS, pchampin, driib, agendabot, rhiaro
15:49:02 [pchampin]
STRAWPOLL: use github 'discussions' to replace de 'discussion' label on actions
15:49:05 [gatemezing]
AndyS: When do we know we've finished
15:49:24 [Fabio_Vitali]
trivial question by newcomer: how do I let Zakim know I am present?
15:49:47 [thomas]
+1 to ted
15:49:49 [rivettp]
Are we not talking about GH Discussions as opposed to GH Issues - they are distinct things?
15:49:50 [Fabio_Vitali]
Present
15:49:53 [Fabio_Vitali]
Present+
15:49:59 [pchampin]
STRAWPOLL: use github 'discussions' to replace de 'discussion' label on actions
15:50:06 [gatemezing]
Zakim, who is here?
15:50:06 [Zakim]
Present: TallTed, rivettp, ora, gatemezing, olaf, AndyS, gkellogg, thomas, Fabio_Vitali
15:50:08 [Zakim]
On IRC I see Fabio_Vitali, Doerthe, thomas, rivettp, RRSAgent, Zakim, ora, olaf, gatemezing, gkellogg, TallTed, AndyS, pchampin, driib, agendabot, rhiaro
15:50:18 [pchampin]
+0.5
15:50:21 [AndyS]
+0.5
15:50:24 [gkellogg]
+0
15:50:27 [Fabio_Vitali]
@gatemezing: thanks
15:50:28 [TallTed]
-0.9
15:50:34 [ora]
+0
15:50:42 [rivettp]
-1
15:50:42 [thomas]
-0
15:50:46 [olaf]
0 (no experience with the github discussion feature)
15:50:51 [Doerthe]
+0
15:50:51 [gatemezing]
+0.56
15:50:58 [Fabio_Vitali]
there was a standard sentence to agree with majority
15:51:17 [Fabio_Vitali]
+0
15:51:40 [Doerthe]
present+
15:52:20 [gatemezing]
Zakim, who is here?
15:52:20 [Zakim]
Present: TallTed, rivettp, ora, gatemezing, olaf, AndyS, gkellogg, thomas, Fabio_Vitali, Doerthe
15:52:20 [thomas]
q+
15:52:22 [Zakim]
On IRC I see Fabio_Vitali, Doerthe, thomas, rivettp, RRSAgent, Zakim, ora, olaf, gatemezing, gkellogg, TallTed, AndyS, pchampin, driib, agendabot, rhiaro
15:52:27 [pchampin]
ack thomas
15:53:02 [gatemezing]
thomas: how do we go on this problem? Do we wait for the creator to join?
15:54:00 [gatemezing]
pchampin: Once we have the vocabulary added, then we could move forward with that point
15:54:56 [pchampin]
topic: roadmap
15:55:53 [thomas]
q+
15:56:25 [gatemezing]
pchampin: few things regarding the vocab section, do think that all can be done before we send out a "final community report"
15:56:27 [pchampin]
qN
15:56:29 [pchampin]
q?
15:56:35 [pchampin]
ack thomas
15:56:50 [gatemezing]
s/qN/q?
15:57:56 [gatemezing]
thomas: I proposed to review the sections in the document before the summer..
15:59:10 [gatemezing]
s/review/reordoring
15:59:26 [pchampin]
q?
16:00:27 [pchampin]
q?
16:02:47 [gatemezing]
AndyS: I'm concerned about the PR on restructuring before having a consensus on it is desirable
16:04:22 [pchampin]
action: pchampin to draft an introduction paragraph to show the interconnection between the section
16:04:31 [rivettp]
I need to drop
16:04:34 [gatemezing]
Zakim, who is here?
16:04:34 [Zakim]
Present: TallTed, rivettp, ora, gatemezing, olaf, AndyS, gkellogg, thomas, Fabio_Vitali, Doerthe
16:04:37 [Zakim]
On IRC I see Fabio_Vitali, Doerthe, thomas, rivettp, RRSAgent, Zakim, ora, olaf, gatemezing, gkellogg, TallTed, AndyS, pchampin, driib, agendabot, rhiaro
16:05:06 [gatemezing]
pchampin: Thanks everyone and see you!
16:05:16 [gkellogg]
Regrets for the next meeting.
16:05:24 [pchampin]
Previous meeting: https://w3c.github.io/rdf-star/Minutes/2021-07-16.html
16:05:24 [pchampin]
Next meeting: https://w3c.github.io/rdf-star/Minutes/2021-09-17.html
16:06:18 [pchampin]
gatemezing, no I'll take care of the rest
16:06:21 [pchampin]
thanks
16:07:19 [pchampin]
RRSAgent, pointer
16:07:19 [RRSAgent]
See https://www.w3.org/2021/09/03-rdf-star-irc#T16-07-19
17:41:13 [gkellogg]
zakim, end the meeting
17:41:13 [Zakim]
As of this point the attendees have been TallTed, rivettp, ora, gatemezing, olaf, AndyS, gkellogg, thomas, Fabio_Vitali, Doerthe
17:41:15 [Zakim]
RRSAgent, please draft minutes
17:41:15 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/09/03-rdf-star-minutes.html Zakim
17:41:18 [Zakim]
I am happy to have been of service, gkellogg; please remember to excuse RRSAgent. Goodbye
17:41:22 [Zakim]
Zakim has left #rdf-star
17:41:37 [gkellogg]
rssagent, bye
17:42:10 [gkellogg]
rssagent, please leave