15:01:49 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #rdf-star
15:01:49 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2021/09/03-rdf-star-irc
15:01:51 <Zakim> RRSAgent, make logs Public
15:01:51 <gatemezing> Zakim, who is here?
15:01:53 <Zakim> please title this meeting ("meeting: ..."), pchampin
15:01:53 <Zakim> Present: (no one)
15:01:53 <Zakim> On IRC I see RRSAgent, Zakim, ora, olaf, gatemezing, gkellogg, TallTed, AndyS, pchampin, driib, agendabot, rhiaro
15:02:02 <rivettp> rivettp has joined #rdf-star
15:02:03 <pchampin> meeting: RDF-star
15:02:04 <ora> (Too long of a break to again remember all the chat commands...)
15:02:06 <TallTed> present+
15:02:08 <pchampin> chair: pchampin
15:02:12 <rivettp> present+
15:02:12 <ora> present+
15:02:15 <pchampin> agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-star/2021Sep/0000.html
15:02:15 <agendabot> clear agenda
15:02:15 <agendabot> agenda+ Announcements and newcomers
15:02:15 <agendabot> agenda+ Open actions
15:02:15 <agendabot> agenda+ PR #198: Suggest metadata in manifest turtle file
15:02:15 <agendabot> agenda+ Issue #200: RDF-star and reasoning
15:02:18 <agendabot> agenda+ WG draft charter
15:02:19 <gatemezing> present+
15:02:20 <agendabot> agenda+ Open-ended discussions
15:02:27 <olaf> present+
15:03:00 <thomas> thomas has joined #rdf-star
15:03:21 <AndyS> present+
15:03:58 <gkellogg> present+
15:04:18 <gatemezing> scribe: gatemezing
15:04:28 <thomas> present+
15:04:34 <pchampin> zakim, next agendum
15:04:34 <Zakim> agendum 1 -- Announcements and newcomers -- taken up [from agendabot]
15:05:00 <gatemezing> Introduction of the new comer fabio
15:05:41 <gatemezing> ...Prof in Italy and working a lot on semantic technologies
15:06:25 <gatemezing> ...He was also involved in many W3C, like anything around markup
15:06:36 <gatemezing> pchampin: thanks for the introduction
15:06:48 <gatemezing> Topic: Announcement
15:07:53 <gatemezing> ora: Should write a comparison for next week. They write a paper for SCG workshop
15:08:23 <Doerthe_> Doerthe_ has joined #rdf-star
15:08:23 <gatemezing> ... and they realize there are somethings that are not taken into account by this rdf-star work
15:09:11 <gatemezing> ...thinking to write a use case on that aspect, and apologize before if this is late
15:09:46 <pchampin> https://w3c.github.io/rdf-star/cg-spec/editors_draft.html#occurrences
15:09:48 <gatemezing> pchampin: Maybe it is related to some discussions we had before @ora joined the group
15:10:07 <thomas> ora: do you have a link to the paper?
15:10:20 <pchampin> https://mosaicrown.github.io/scg2021/
15:10:46 <ora> Paper is not public yet, I will provide a link soon.
15:11:18 <thomas> ora, thanks! looking forward to it
15:11:26 <gatemezing> pchampin: explain the venue of SCG workshop at SemantiCs2021
15:11:34 <pchampin> q?
15:11:43 <pchampin> zakim, next agendum
15:11:43 <Zakim> agendum 2 -- Open actions -- taken up [from agendabot]
15:11:52 <gatemezing> Topic: Open actions
15:11:55 <pchampin> https://github.com/w3c/rdf-star/issues/196
15:12:45 <pchampin> https://github.com/w3c/rdf-star/issues/195
15:12:51 <gatemezing> Issue #196 is still pending
15:13:11 <gatemezing> s/Issue #196 is still pending / pchampin: Issue #196 is still pending
15:13:32 <pchampin> https://github.com/w3c/EasierRDF/issues/88
15:14:43 <gatemezing> pchampin: the process for a "living standard" is possible
15:15:57 <gatemezing> ...check what could be a new feature in the W3C process
15:16:52 <pchampin> q?
15:16:56 <ora> q+
15:17:02 <AndyS> q+
15:17:02 <gatemezing> ...and sent an email to a boss at W3C awaiting for the response
15:17:03 <thomas> q+
15:17:15 <pchampin> ack thomas
15:17:24 <pchampin> q?
15:17:34 <pchampin> q+ thomas
15:17:42 <pchampin> ack ora
15:18:25 <gatemezing> ora: I was wondering the impact on product delivery processes
15:18:33 <gkellogg> q+ caniuse
15:18:36 <pchampin> ack AndyS
15:19:28 <Doerthe> Doerthe has joined #rdf-star
15:19:47 <pchampin> scribe+
15:19:48 <pchampin> A d
15:19:52 <pchampin> A dh
15:19:55 <gatemezing> AndyS: There's must be a public discussion on new features
15:20:02 <gatemezing> s/ A d /
15:20:07 <gatemezing> s/ A dh /
15:20:31 <pchampin> AndyS: my gut feeling is that RDF-star would be to big to be considered a "new feature"
15:20:40 <pchampin> scribe-
15:20:42 <ora> q+
15:20:47 <gatemezing> ...It would set a high expectation
15:20:50 <pchampin> ack thomas
15:21:03 <olaf> q+
15:21:35 <Fabio_Vitali> Fabio_Vitali has joined #rdf-star
15:21:41 <gatemezing> thomas: could it be better to send to the public semantic Web W3C list?
15:22:00 <pchampin> action: pchampin to notify semantic.web@w3.org about https://github.com/w3c/EasierRDF/issues/88
15:22:54 <pchampin> ack caniuse
15:23:42 <gatemezing> Gregg: A balance should be reach between the limitations and the features
15:25:11 <gatemezing> ...the charter should limit the types of the group can do or not
15:26:13 <pchampin> +1 for a feature-annoucement mechanism of some kind
15:26:47 <gatemezing> ...RDF-star should consider annoucemenent features like MDN with HTML
15:26:59 <pchampin> q?
15:27:04 <pchampin> ack ora
15:27:41 <pchampin> ack olaf
15:27:50 <gatemezing> ora: a risk to choose what to implement in a living document could be also a risk
15:28:45 <rivettp> q+
15:29:20 <pchampin> ack rivettp
15:29:22 <gatemezing> olaf: The concern is to better seperate and consider it
15:30:43 <gatemezing> rivettp: How the ecosystem would evolve with somehow different implementations of the specs
15:31:32 <pchampin> scribe+
15:31:51 <pchampin> rivettp: OWL and other standards have not caught up with RDF 1.1
15:32:03 <pchampin> ... How would that go with RDF being a living standard?
15:32:49 <rivettp> my concern generally was the challenge of managing the ecosystem as a whole if one standard is "living"
15:33:05 <pchampin> AndyS: migrations are hard. People will wait until something is a standard to implement it
15:33:10 <pchampin> q?
15:33:29 <gatemezing> +1 with AndyS's point
15:34:06 <rivettp> maybe you try for synchronized configurations or releases of multiple projects - which is what Eclipse tries to do
15:34:11 <pchampin> zakim, next agendum
15:34:11 <Zakim> agendum 3 -- PR #198: Suggest metadata in manifest turtle file -- taken up [from agendabot]
15:34:16 <gatemezing> pchampin: This discussion should be push forward in the public mailing list
15:34:59 <pchampin> gatemezing: this PR aims to add more metadata in the manifest files.
15:35:19 <pchampin> ... AndyS, gatemezing, TallTed commented on it.
15:35:40 <pchampin> ... There's general agreement that it should be done, more discussion on what to add exactly.
15:37:07 <pchampin> [discussion on the representation of licenses in RDF]
15:37:29 <pchampin> q?
15:38:31 <pchampin> zakim, next agendum
15:38:31 <Zakim> agendum 4 -- Issue #200: RDF-star and reasoning -- taken up [from agendabot]
15:38:40 <pchampin> https://github.com/w3c/rdf-star/issues/200
15:38:54 <pchampin> scribe-
15:39:23 <thomas> q+
15:40:22 <olaf> +1
15:40:34 <gatemezing> AndyS: We have to choose which types of discussions and maybe add labels
15:40:42 <pchampin> ack thomas
15:41:28 <TallTed> ugh. Github discussion "threads" are one-level deep, and don't do well with shifting active conversation in either direction (issue->disc or disc->issue)
15:42:10 <TallTed> q+
15:42:11 <gatemezing> thomas: how to settle some other discussions in our document
15:42:57 <gatemezing> ...can someone put where to write it up so that it's part of the community report
15:43:06 <olaf> q+
15:43:21 <gatemezing> ...so that that everyone can easily find it
15:43:25 <pchampin> ack olaf
15:43:53 <gatemezing> olaf: I can do it, but I can't do it by next week
15:44:44 <pchampin> action: olaf to write a part on "per-property semantics" in the report -- pchampin to help
15:44:53 <pchampin> ack TallTed
15:45:37 <gatemezing> TallTed: I'm against using Github discussion since it's not mature for this purpose
15:45:47 <pchampin> q+
15:46:12 <gatemezing> ...Use mailing list for other type of discussion
15:46:18 <pchampin> ack pchampin
15:47:26 <gatemezing> pchampin: Not also fan with discussions on Github. There are different special "kind" of issues ...
15:47:44 <TallTed> Probably for next time, it can be good to review issues (with whatever label) based on oldest last activity -- e.g., https://github.com/w3c/rdf-star/issues?q=is%3Aissue+is%3Aopen+sort%3Aupdated-asc
15:47:50 <pchampin> q?
15:47:56 <gatemezing> ... The mailing list has an archive but still difficult to follow
15:48:22 <gatemezing> Zakim, who is here?
15:48:22 <Zakim> Present: TallTed, rivettp, ora, gatemezing, olaf, AndyS, gkellogg, thomas
15:48:24 <Zakim> On IRC I see Fabio_Vitali, Doerthe, thomas, rivettp, RRSAgent, Zakim, ora, olaf, gatemezing, gkellogg, TallTed, AndyS, pchampin, driib, agendabot, rhiaro
15:49:02 <pchampin> STRAWPOLL: use github 'discussions' to replace de 'discussion' label on actions
15:49:05 <gatemezing> AndyS: When do we know we've finished
15:49:24 <Fabio_Vitali> trivial question by newcomer: how do I let Zakim know I am present?
15:49:47 <thomas> +1 to ted
15:49:49 <rivettp> Are we not talking about GH Discussions as opposed to GH Issues - they are distinct things?
15:49:50 <Fabio_Vitali> Present
15:49:53 <Fabio_Vitali> Present+
15:49:59 <pchampin> STRAWPOLL: use github 'discussions' to replace de 'discussion' label on actions
15:50:06 <gatemezing> Zakim, who is here?
15:50:06 <Zakim> Present: TallTed, rivettp, ora, gatemezing, olaf, AndyS, gkellogg, thomas, Fabio_Vitali
15:50:08 <Zakim> On IRC I see Fabio_Vitali, Doerthe, thomas, rivettp, RRSAgent, Zakim, ora, olaf, gatemezing, gkellogg, TallTed, AndyS, pchampin, driib, agendabot, rhiaro
15:50:18 <pchampin> +0.5
15:50:21 <AndyS> +0.5
15:50:24 <gkellogg> +0
15:50:27 <Fabio_Vitali> @gatemezing: thanks
15:50:28 <TallTed> -0.9
15:50:34 <ora> +0
15:50:42 <rivettp> -1
15:50:42 <thomas> -0
15:50:46 <olaf> 0 (no experience with the github discussion feature)
15:50:51 <Doerthe> +0
15:50:51 <gatemezing> +0.56
15:50:58 <Fabio_Vitali> there was a standard sentence to agree with majority
15:51:17 <Fabio_Vitali> +0
15:51:40 <Doerthe> present+
15:52:20 <gatemezing> Zakim, who is here?
15:52:20 <Zakim> Present: TallTed, rivettp, ora, gatemezing, olaf, AndyS, gkellogg, thomas, Fabio_Vitali, Doerthe
15:52:20 <thomas> q+
15:52:22 <Zakim> On IRC I see Fabio_Vitali, Doerthe, thomas, rivettp, RRSAgent, Zakim, ora, olaf, gatemezing, gkellogg, TallTed, AndyS, pchampin, driib, agendabot, rhiaro
15:52:27 <pchampin> ack thomas
15:53:02 <gatemezing> thomas: how do we go on this problem? Do we wait for the creator to join?
15:54:00 <gatemezing> pchampin: Once we have the vocabulary added, then we could move forward with that point
15:54:56 <pchampin> topic: roadmap
15:55:53 <thomas> q+
15:56:25 <gatemezing> pchampin: few things regarding the vocab section, do think that all can be done before we send out a "final community report"
15:56:27 <pchampin> qN
15:56:29 <pchampin> q?
15:56:35 <pchampin> ack thomas
15:56:50 <gatemezing> s/qN/q?
15:57:56 <gatemezing> thomas: I proposed to review the sections in the document before the summer..
15:59:10 <gatemezing> s/review/reordoring
15:59:26 <pchampin> q?
16:00:27 <pchampin> q?
16:02:47 <gatemezing> AndyS: I'm concerned about the PR on restructuring before having a consensus on it is desirable
16:04:22 <pchampin> action: pchampin to draft an introduction paragraph to show the interconnection between the section
16:04:31 <rivettp> I need to drop
16:04:34 <gatemezing> Zakim, who is here?
16:04:34 <Zakim> Present: TallTed, rivettp, ora, gatemezing, olaf, AndyS, gkellogg, thomas, Fabio_Vitali, Doerthe
16:04:37 <Zakim> On IRC I see Fabio_Vitali, Doerthe, thomas, rivettp, RRSAgent, Zakim, ora, olaf, gatemezing, gkellogg, TallTed, AndyS, pchampin, driib, agendabot, rhiaro
16:05:06 <gatemezing> pchampin: Thanks everyone and see you!
16:05:16 <gkellogg> Regrets for the next meeting.
16:05:24 <pchampin> Previous meeting: https://w3c.github.io/rdf-star/Minutes/2021-07-16.html
16:05:24 <pchampin> Next meeting: https://w3c.github.io/rdf-star/Minutes/2021-09-17.html
16:06:18 <pchampin> gatemezing, no I'll take care of the rest
16:06:21 <pchampin> thanks
16:07:19 <pchampin> RRSAgent, pointer
16:07:19 <RRSAgent> See https://www.w3.org/2021/09/03-rdf-star-irc#T16-07-19
17:41:13 <gkellogg> zakim, end the meeting
17:41:13 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been TallTed, rivettp, ora, gatemezing, olaf, AndyS, gkellogg, thomas, Fabio_Vitali, Doerthe
17:41:15 <Zakim> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
17:41:15 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/09/03-rdf-star-minutes.html Zakim
17:41:18 <Zakim> I am happy to have been of service, gkellogg; please remember to excuse RRSAgent.  Goodbye
17:41:22 <Zakim> Zakim has left #rdf-star
17:41:37 <gkellogg> rssagent, bye
17:42:10 <gkellogg> rssagent, please leave