IRC log of silver-conf on 2021-08-19

Timestamps are in UTC.

15:41:05 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #silver-conf
15:41:05 [RRSAgent]
logging to
15:41:20 [sajkaj]
Meeting: Silver Conformance Options Subgroup
15:41:26 [sajkaj]
Date: 19 Aug 2021
15:41:31 [sajkaj]
Chair: sajkaj
15:41:41 [sajkaj]
rrsagent, make log public
15:41:45 [sajkaj]
15:41:54 [sajkaj]
zakim, clear agenda
15:41:54 [Zakim]
agenda cleared
15:41:59 [sajkaj]
Agenda+ Agenda Review & Administrative Items
15:41:59 [sajkaj]
agenda+ User Generated Content -- What Next?
15:42:02 [sajkaj]
agenda+ Glossary Candidates
15:42:05 [sajkaj]
agenda+ Media Considerations
15:42:08 [sajkaj]
agenda+ Other Business
15:42:11 [sajkaj]
agenda+ Be Done
15:43:44 [sajkaj]
Regrets: Bruce_Bailey, Bryan_Trogdon
15:43:52 [sajkaj]
rrsagent, make minutes
15:43:52 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate sajkaj
15:46:57 [sajkaj]
15:50:42 [jeanne]
15:57:54 [PeterKorn]
PeterKorn has joined #silver-conf
16:01:05 [Azlan]
Azlan has joined #silver-conf
16:01:14 [Azlan]
16:01:36 [PeterKorn]
16:03:00 [JF]
JF has joined #silver-conf
16:03:02 [Azlan]
scribe: Azlan
16:03:05 [JF]
16:03:14 [JF]
16:05:36 [Azlan]
zakim, take up item 1
16:05:36 [Zakim]
agendum 1 -- Agenda Review & Administrative Items -- taken up [from sajkaj]
16:06:27 [Azlan]
sajkaj: New category for feedback we think may be helpful
16:07:24 [Wilco]
Wilco has joined #silver-conf
16:07:48 [Azlan]
sajkaj: zakimn next item
16:07:55 [Azlan]
zakim, next item
16:07:55 [Zakim]
agendum 2 -- User Generated Content -- What Next? -- taken up [from sajkaj]
16:09:37 [Azlan]
sajkaj: Next working draft has slipped a little. We are included in that. No further comments on that.
16:10:42 [Azlan]
jeanne: Looked at editors note for the explainer and a number felt uncomfortable publishing so frequently with incomplete work. Resolved to postpone publishing from August to mid-September.
16:11:34 [Azlan]
Chairs will send out a survey that includes the publishing sequence. They will be looking for feedback on a plan they have.
16:12:44 [sajkaj]
16:13:00 [PeterKorn]
16:13:07 [Azlan]
Plan for publishing in November has yet to be discussed. Concern people had about things being incomplete - suggest we now make these more complete.
16:14:05 [sajkaj]
ack pet
16:15:37 [JF]
16:16:13 [PeterKorn]
16:18:41 [sajkaj]
ack jf
16:21:00 [Azlan]
zakim, next item
16:21:00 [Zakim]
agendum 3 -- Glossary Candidates -- taken up [from sajkaj]
16:21:58 [PeterKorn]
16:22:08 [Azlan]
sajkaj: We might add terms to define and tweak the intro.
16:22:50 [jeanne]
Platform definition from ATAG 2.0 <-
16:23:07 [jeanne]
A programmatic interface that is specifically engineered to provide communication between applications and assistive technologies (e.g. MSAA, IAccessible2 and UI Automation for Windows applications, AXAPI for Mac OS X applications, GNOME Accessibility Toolkit API for GNOME applications, Java Access for Java applications). On some platforms, it may be conventional to enhance communication
16:23:07 [jeanne]
further by implementing a document object.
16:23:59 [sajkaj]
16:24:06 [jeanne]
Author definition from ATAG <-
16:24:10 [sajkaj]
ack pet
16:24:17 [jeanne]
People who use authoring tools to create or modify web content. The term may cover roles such as content authors, designers, programmers, publishers, testers, etc. (see Part B Conformance Applicability Note 6: Multiple authoring roles). Some authoring tools control who may be an author by managing author permissions.
16:25:04 [Azlan]
PeterKorn: Seems a fine idea but having deifnitions before we have language calling for them may constrain our thinking - where and how we want to use them.
16:25:41 [JF]
+1 to Janina
16:26:00 [Azlan]
sajkaj: I picked these because of the comments we had when discussing third party and they could have been addressed if people had understanding of these terms.
16:26:16 [JF]
16:26:37 [jeanne]
q+ to talk aobut existing definitions in W3C
16:26:49 [Azlan]
it might be useful to go back through recent documents and gather quotations for what we are trying to resolve and have that need drive the glossary.
16:27:39 [Azlan]
PeterKorn: Third paragraph starts with "glossary of terms" but feels premature without the terms in their context to know where they apply.
16:27:50 [sajkaj]
16:28:19 [jeanne]
Publishing definition from ATAG <-
16:28:39 [Azlan]
ack JF
16:28:44 [sajkaj]
ack jf
16:29:21 [Azlan]
JF: generally agree but we have to start somewhere. When we add a term to this running list we capture where it is being used - this would be valuable.
16:31:37 [Azlan]
Suggests a draft definition of each term alongside the locations and validate the definition against the locations where they are used.
16:32:35 [Azlan]
ack jeanne
16:32:35 [Zakim]
jeanne, you wanted to talk aobut existing definitions in W3C
16:33:30 [Azlan]
jeanne: Have added definitions as found in ATAG and WCAG for the terms listed
16:34:30 [JF]
there may also be existing 'definitions' in the wild:
16:34:59 [Azlan]
sajkaj: There is desire in APA and across W3C to coordinate on glossaries
16:35:44 [sajkaj]
16:35:46 [JF]
"What are some examples of digital products? Online courses and webinars. Kindle books. Audiobooks. Software programs. Web elements like Shopify or WordPress themes. Printables. Membership sites. Workbooks."
16:37:02 [jeanne]
"A digital product is any product you sell online that doesn’t have physical form or substance."
16:38:52 [jeanne]
"A digital product is a software enabled product or service that offers some form of utility to a human being.
16:40:04 [JF]
A digital product is a software enabled product or service that is made available via the internet. (??)
16:40:11 [Azlan]
sajkaj: next step on definitions is to find examples in our docs and see where disambiguation is necessary
16:40:45 [Azlan]
jeanne: Suggest "accessibility statement" as a defined term
16:42:30 [Azlan]
PeterKorn: Would drop the third paragraph because we don't know.
16:44:07 [Azlan]
PeterKorn: we will start by collating our references of accessibility statements
16:44:32 [jeanne]
EO document <-
16:45:15 [Azlan]
jeanne: EO document under development on accessiblilty statements requirements. Has a list of optional and required requirements. Resources section. Encourage everyone to read this.
16:45:17 [jeanne]
Lainey Feingold <-
16:46:17 [Azlan]
Links to other resources eg. requirements in various locales. Includes the components of accessibility statements. This is another very helpful resource
16:46:47 [Azlan]
sajkaj: Feel some of the things we have talked about may add to their list of requirements
16:47:02 [jeanne]
"can be easily found, preferably linked from the home page and all page footers, available through any Help section, and available through on-site and external search engine"
16:47:40 [sajkaj]
16:47:42 [Azlan]
jeanne: Relatively precise if a little "web specific" but we may be able to make of
16:48:04 [jeanne]
16:49:50 [Azlan]
PeterKorn: "statement of intent with direction"
16:50:41 [Azlan]
sajkaj: We shold set up communications with EO
16:51:08 [Azlan]
PeterKorn: Not seeing a definition of an accessibility statemnt in the requirements doc
16:51:26 [JF]
16:51:53 [PeterKorn]
16:52:41 [jeanne]
official EO page
16:53:24 [Azlan]
JF: do we want those accessibility statements should be machine readable?
16:54:12 [PeterKorn]
Sorry for jumping in; I need to leave for an emergency.
16:54:13 [Azlan]
sajkaj: maybe. Maybe we want certain metadata to be exposed in a particular way?
16:55:47 [Azlan]
JF: there is a metadata component in epub - conforms to - to meet the requirement
16:57:45 [Azlan]
JF: supportive of a mechanism for the accessibility statement to be programmatically linked to the content
16:58:17 [Azlan]
jeanne: Concerned we might be putting too much into the accessibility statement - we might need a different thing
16:58:41 [Azlan]
JF: An accessibility statement and a conformance stratement?
16:59:36 [sajkaj]
16:59:43 [Azlan]
Wilco: In EU we talked about the distinction between the statement (readable) and the reporting piece (which may or may not be machine readable)
17:00:32 [Azlan]
sajkaj: Expect that kind of tension. Machine readable would be difficult to be human readable
17:01:22 [Azlan]
jeanne: It's a really interesting idea and interested in how it can be addressed.
17:01:49 [JF]
Past examples of linked statements: P3P (, SafeSirf (
17:02:05 [JF]
17:04:38 [Azlan]
The above statements are machine readable. P3P was machine generated. So there is a precedent for linked statements.
17:10:05 [Azlan]
zakim, bye
17:10:05 [Zakim]
leaving. As of this point the attendees have been sajkaj, Jeanne, Wilco_, PeterKorn, Azlan, JF
17:10:05 [Zakim]
Zakim has left #silver-conf
17:10:31 [Azlan]
rrsagent , make minutes
17:10:52 [Azlan]
rrsagent, make minutes
17:10:52 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate Azlan