IRC log of rqtf on 2021-08-18

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12:47:59 [RRSAgent]
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12:47:59 [RRSAgent]
logging to https://www.w3.org/2021/08/18-rqtf-irc
12:48:01 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, make logs public
12:48:04 [trackbot]
Meeting: Accessible Platform Architectures Working Group Teleconference
12:48:04 [trackbot]
Date: 18 August 2021
12:48:09 [jasonjgw]
chair: jasonjgw
12:48:12 [jasonjgw]
present+
12:48:14 [jasonjgw]
agenda+ Joint working group meetings and break-out sessions planned for TPAC 2021.
12:48:14 [jasonjgw]
agenda+ Synchronization accessibility User Requirements.
12:48:14 [jasonjgw]
agenda+ Updates, issues or questions concerning other publication efforts of the Task Force (Natural Language, Remote Meetings, XR).
12:48:18 [jasonjgw]
agenda+ Miscellaneous topics.
12:48:25 [jasonjgw]
zakim, list agenda
12:48:25 [Zakim]
I see 6 items remaining on the agenda:
12:48:26 [Zakim]
4. Natural Language Interface Accessibility User Requirements. [from jasonjgw]
12:48:26 [Zakim]
5. Miscellaneous topics. [from jasonjgw]
12:48:26 [Zakim]
6. Joint working group meetings and break-out sessions planned for TPAC 2021. [from jasonjgw]
12:48:26 [Zakim]
7. Synchronization accessibility User Requirements. [from jasonjgw]
12:48:26 [Zakim]
8. Updates, issues or questions concerning other publication efforts of the Task Force (Natural Language, Remote Meetings, XR). [from jasonjgw]
12:48:28 [Zakim]
9. Miscellaneous topics. [from jasonjgw]
12:48:45 [jasonjgw]
zakim, clear agenda
12:48:45 [Zakim]
agenda cleared
12:48:50 [jasonjgw]
agenda+ Joint working group meetings and break-out sessions planned for TPAC 2021.
12:48:50 [jasonjgw]
agenda+ Synchronization accessibility User Requirements.
12:48:50 [jasonjgw]
agenda+ Updates, issues or questions concerning other publication efforts of the Task Force (Natural Language, Remote Meetings, XR).
12:48:53 [jasonjgw]
agenda+ Miscellaneous topics.
12:49:04 [jasonjgw]
zakim, list agenda
12:49:04 [Zakim]
I see 4 items remaining on the agenda:
12:49:06 [Zakim]
1. Joint working group meetings and break-out sessions planned for TPAC 2021. [from jasonjgw]
12:49:06 [Zakim]
2. Synchronization accessibility User Requirements. [from jasonjgw]
12:49:06 [Zakim]
3. Updates, issues or questions concerning other publication efforts of the Task Force (Natural Language, Remote Meetings, XR). [from jasonjgw]
12:49:07 [Zakim]
4. Miscellaneous topics. [from jasonjgw]
12:55:59 [janina]
janina has joined #rqtf
12:56:40 [janina]
agenda?
12:56:44 [janina]
present+
12:59:27 [JPaton]
JPaton has joined #rqtf
13:00:29 [Joshue108]
present+
13:00:54 [Joshue108]
scribe: Joshue108
13:06:04 [Joshue108]
<Troubleshooting issues with captions>
13:06:24 [jasonjgw]
zakim, next item
13:06:24 [Zakim]
agendum 1 -- Joint working group meetings and break-out sessions planned for TPAC 2021. -- taken up [from jasonjgw]
13:07:09 [Joshue108]
JW: When we last discussed this APA was planning and co-ordinating
13:07:28 [janina]
https://www.w3.org/WAI/APA/wiki/Meetings/TPAC_2021
13:07:29 [Joshue108]
We were to work those out - update from Janina.
13:07:40 [Joshue108]
JS: This will be the ongoing meeting link
13:08:08 [Joshue108]
It will be updated during TPAC, contain meeting info etc - please do bookmark.
13:08:18 [Joshue108]
<Janina gives overview of doc>
13:08:49 [Joshue108]
We will add Google calendar links etc
13:09:04 [Joshue108]
There are proposed sessions in this doc.
13:09:44 [Joshue108]
We've asked Timed-text group if they want a session on the Synchronization Accessibility User Requirements
13:10:09 [Joshue108]
We hope to be at FPWD or beyond at TPAC
13:10:09 [Joshue108]
https://raw.githack.com/w3c/apa/main/saur/
13:10:42 [Judy]
q+
13:10:42 [Joshue108]
JS: We also have proposed longer meetings - one on the future of a11y APIs - there are some concerns over their potential end of life
13:11:00 [Judy]
q+ to suggest a re-framing of the time context, and to update on AOM
13:11:09 [Joshue108]
Discussions on how frameworks would handle this - or what next gen A11y APIs need to look like
13:11:25 [becky]
becky has joined #rqtf
13:11:32 [Joshue108]
There are also near term requirements out of our pronunciation task force that we need to bridge
13:11:41 [Joshue108]
Relating to TTS specs etc
13:12:09 [Joshue108]
We also have breakouts - an introduction to APA publications
13:12:35 [Joshue108]
We may need more time to discuss various specs and our extensive user requirement documents
13:12:52 [Joshue108]
Should that be two sessions? Need more time?
13:13:01 [Joshue108]
COGA, will talk about content usable
13:13:14 [Joshue108]
Remote meetings with Judy and Scott to present work
13:13:45 [Joshue108]
Our main interest it scheduling so there is no clash
13:14:42 [Joshue108]
Also we have mechanisms for live captioning etc that we need to plan
13:15:05 [Joshue108]
A question is do we want to join with personalisation and pronunciation or is that too much?
13:15:13 [Joshue108]
ack judy
13:15:13 [Zakim]
Judy, you wanted to suggest a re-framing of the time context, and to update on AOM
13:15:40 [Joshue108]
JB: Regarding the future of APIs discussion..
13:15:52 [Joshue108]
there are other discussions relating..
13:16:27 [Joshue108]
There is an issue around how to frame the A11y API -we need to be careful about what we imply about the timing of that.
13:16:47 [Joshue108]
They may need to transition in the next 5 years but we dont want to scare people out of using them
13:16:57 [Joshue108]
Should be framed in the future tense.
13:17:20 [Joshue108]
JB: There are discussion at W3C Management and team about the AOM
13:17:40 [Joshue108]
These conversations should also happen in APA before TPAC
13:17:53 [Joshue108]
JB: Sounds good
13:18:22 [Joshue108]
JS: Fine to all the above - the issue of coming to end of life - is about exploring the future before we get there to avoid trouble.
13:18:40 [Joshue108]
That meeting needs to have the right people there.
13:18:59 [Joshue108]
We aim to invite some key people. Then if so we can chat, otherwise won't schedule.
13:19:20 [Joshue108]
JS: I did raise this on a WAI co-ordination call.
13:19:32 [Joshue108]
James Craig was positive about doing this
13:19:44 [Joshue108]
At TPAC, as a good forum
13:20:16 [Joshue108]
Cc'ing Joanie Diggs also - and Alice Boxhall , Aaron etc
13:20:36 [Joshue108]
We can also learn from their input.
13:20:41 [Joshue108]
q?
13:21:03 [Joshue108]
JW: The closest connection is with the XR A11y work
13:21:08 [Joshue108]
But there are others.
13:21:36 [Joshue108]
If you are interested in how these all connect then that is a good conversation to be a part of.
13:22:17 [Joshue108]
JW: Regarding diagrams and charts - that is one area that ARIA is interested in, as well as limitations in current approaches
13:22:37 [Joshue108]
JS: If we can frame these an engineering problems, I'd be happy to list them
13:22:46 [Judy]
q+
13:23:02 [Joshue108]
JS: Near term challenges are important conversations
13:23:57 [Joshue108]
JB: I'm looking at this from the perspective of how others who are new to the group - so want to give some background
13:24:03 [Joshue108]
<Judy gives background>
13:24:21 [Joshue108]
<on TPAC and how it works>
13:25:40 [Joshue108]
ack judy
13:25:46 [Joshue108]
JW: Any questions?
13:26:16 [Joshue108]
q?
13:26:32 [Joshue108]
JS: Can I return to the time issue a la breakouts?
13:26:56 [Joshue108]
Single session or presentation of individual sessions on each user requirements document.
13:27:22 [Joshue108]
JW: First reaction, is if covering all of them - that session could be tricky.
13:27:36 [Joshue108]
Brevity vs sufficiency
13:27:43 [Joshue108]
In one hour
13:28:02 [Joshue108]
Recent publications also will entail more exposition as well as questions.
13:28:13 [Joshue108]
Seems crowded to me
13:28:20 [Joshue108]
JS: Will we split it?
13:28:29 [Judy]
s/Judy gives background/Judy describes Technical Plenary and Advisory Committee meeting as (currently) a two-week virtual opportunity for the W3C accessibility area to sync up with other W3C working groups, with a lot of pre-arranged joint meetings/
13:28:36 [Joshue108]
JW: Yes, are they in hour long blocks
13:28:37 [Joshue108]
q+
13:29:06 [Joshue108]
JW: some prep and advance notice would be needed
13:29:35 [Joshue108]
JW: Other points of view
13:29:37 [Joshue108]
ack me
13:30:23 [jasonjgw]
Josh: suggests organizing the sessions to group related documents together.
13:30:52 [Joshue108]
JS: Wants to know what to do.
13:31:10 [Joshue108]
JS: If slots are at a premium, you could tend towards one over two.
13:31:39 [Joshue108]
If you could get two sessions set up - that may be better approach - time needed for questions etc
13:31:51 [Joshue108]
JS: I'm looking at Jason and Josh as presenters.
13:32:19 [Joshue108]
Thinking of the docs we have - and some new items for TPAC - such as the Natural Language A11y User Requirements.
13:32:24 [Joshue108]
What do you want to do?
13:32:40 [Joshue108]
Can they be combined? What should the wider W3C need to know.
13:32:58 [Joshue108]
Add up the time - 25 mins max each?
13:33:44 [Joshue108]
JW: 5 min summaries of each - Media Syn, Natural Language, XR, WebRTC etc
13:33:57 [Joshue108]
Remote meetings - looking at 2-25 minutes.
13:34:22 [Joshue108]
JOC: Are we looking at divided sessions?
13:35:57 [Joshue108]
JS: We can look at this and I can be a good referee.
13:36:04 [Joshue108]
JS: We can set up a page etc
13:36:14 [Joshue108]
JW: Should we revisit this next week?
13:36:34 [Judy]
Judy has joined #rqtf
13:36:43 [Joshue108]
JS: Coming to a decision soon would be good
13:36:49 [Joshue108]
JW: Next weeks agenda
13:37:12 [Joshue108]
JS: There is a link also to the Silver / Accessibility Guidelines Working Group also
13:37:26 [Joshue108]
Some of our user requirements doc are relevant here also
13:37:58 [Joshue108]
JS: Looks to Judy for tech solution, CSS? To prevent flashing.
13:38:08 [Joshue108]
JB: Gives overview on MIT research
13:38:50 [Joshue108]
Flash mitigation in streaming video using micro second sandboxing techniques that scans luminosity variance.
13:39:17 [Joshue108]
Can reduce seizure triggers - we need to work out how to deploy that
13:40:01 [Joshue108]
JB: Lets follow up on that
13:40:13 [Joshue108]
JS: Want to discuss how to deploy solutions
13:40:48 [Joshue108]
In browsers or media platforms.
13:41:02 [Joshue108]
JS: Questions license
13:41:08 [Joshue108]
JB: Answers question
13:41:37 [Joshue108]
JS: Will add an agendum to following week
13:41:46 [Joshue108]
<chat on schedule>
13:42:31 [Joshue108]
JW: Other questions?
13:42:38 [jasonjgw]
zakim, next item
13:42:38 [Zakim]
agendum 2 -- Synchronization accessibility User Requirements. -- taken up [from jasonjgw]
13:43:09 [Raja]
Raja has joined #rqtf
13:43:12 [Joshue108]
JW: This is the first of our new docs that we want to bring to first public working draft (FPWD)
13:43:14 [Joshue108]
https://raw.githack.com/w3c/apa/main/saur/
13:43:34 [Joshue108]
JW: It is pretty stable.
13:43:56 [Joshue108]
What more do we want to do before we publish?
13:44:08 [Raja]
q+
13:44:08 [Joshue108]
JS: I want to take an editors pass.
13:44:52 [Joshue108]
JS: If we want to publish early Sept, the first week may be bad - but we may have participation problems, hols and labour day etc.
13:45:02 [Joshue108]
ack Raja
13:45:27 [Joshue108]
RK: Please clarify - for the information access, the synchronization was a little bit unclear
13:45:41 [Joshue108]
THere is a subtle difference between the two.
13:45:50 [Joshue108]
The use cases vs information
13:46:04 [Joshue108]
JS: Something in the doc could be better presented?
13:46:22 [Joshue108]
RK: Is it tor both info like video or conferences?
13:46:29 [Joshue108]
s/tor/for
13:46:49 [Joshue108]
JS: One reason to take an editor pass, is to be sure we have made things clear.
13:47:00 [Joshue108]
What real world expectations should be etc.
13:47:15 [Joshue108]
Maybe our RTC doc needs to contain more of this?
13:47:54 [Joshue108]
JS: It starts with people needing speech and audio latency falling within certain tolerances
13:48:06 [Joshue108]
Regular people lip read without knowing it.
13:48:52 [Joshue108]
We need to be clear about distinctions - so movies and live things are covered properly.
13:49:17 [Joshue108]
JW: The doc does discuss tolerances in different media
13:49:42 [Joshue108]
Mostly similar, but what can be realistically be done in various contexts is different.
13:50:17 [Joshue108]
What is reasonable and appropriate may differ
13:50:38 [Joshue108]
JW: Sounds tight, so what is your availability for editors pass?
13:51:01 [Joshue108]
JB: Michael back next week.
13:51:07 [Joshue108]
q+
13:51:22 [Joshue108]
JS: We can give ourselves a week to review?
13:51:36 [Joshue108]
We can say we will publish and that triggers an APA CFC
13:51:50 [Joshue108]
maybe into the second full week of September.
13:52:06 [Joshue108]
We could publish around the 14th and 16th of Sept
13:52:23 [Joshue108]
we could keep the comment period open through TPAC
13:52:29 [Joshue108]
how does that sound?
13:53:06 [Joshue108]
JW: We been discussing live and pre-recorded media - and if there are issues that can be fixed or resolved in a second working draft.
13:53:31 [Joshue108]
JS: An editors note may be sufficient.
13:53:58 [Joshue108]
We are presenting available research etc - vs other guidance that is experiential
13:54:30 [Joshue108]
JS: Asking for comments is not a bad thing to ask.
13:54:39 [Raja]
I agree
13:54:53 [Joshue108]
JW: Summary and guidance - also good. Editors note I can add.
13:55:14 [Joshue108]
JS: Any reply from the Madeline?
13:55:18 [Joshue108]
JW: Yes
13:55:29 [Joshue108]
They are interested.
13:55:50 [Joshue108]
And window to review.
13:55:53 [Joshue108]
ack me
13:56:17 [jasonjgw]
Josh: offers to help with the editorial review as well as the publication preparation.
13:57:16 [Joshue108]
JS: We will be looking for others to review
13:57:26 [jasonjgw]
zakim, next item
13:57:26 [Zakim]
agendum 3 -- Updates, issues or questions concerning other publication efforts of the Task Force (Natural Language, Remote Meetings, XR). -- taken up [from jasonjgw]
13:57:40 [Joshue108]
JS: Regarding our other publication efforts
13:57:59 [Joshue108]
There has work been going on with Natural Language Accessibility from Josh
13:58:19 [Joshue108]
A11y of remote meetings - I've raised an issue on Github, clarity needed
13:58:28 [Joshue108]
Thats it mostly
13:59:29 [jasonjgw]
Josh: XR Accessibility User Requirements is in a publication-ready state; Michael will address the publication process upon his return.
13:59:58 [Joshue108]
trackbot, end meeting
13:59:58 [trackbot]
Zakim, list attendees
13:59:58 [Zakim]
As of this point the attendees have been jasonjgw, scott_h, Joshue, janina, SteveNoble, Judy
14:00:06 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, please draft minutes
14:00:06 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/08/18-rqtf-minutes.html trackbot
14:00:07 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, bye
14:00:07 [RRSAgent]
I see no action items