11:51:37 RRSAgent has joined #silver-functional 11:51:37 logging to https://www.w3.org/2021/07/16-silver-functional-irc 12:08:42 present+ 12:09:05 present+ 12:09:16 TOPIC: Overview of current work 12:09:23 scribe: Joshue108 12:09:39 JA: I've been working on something that lots of people seem to like 12:09:48 JA: Showed to Josh last week 12:09:55 Happy to show you Michael. 12:09:57 MC: please do 12:10:37 JA: Gives overview of his work - created some new terms 12:10:49 MC: How do functions and needs relate? 12:11:00 JA: 12:11:56 Josh: Jake will you share this deck? 12:12:03 JA: Yes 12:12:30 JA: Asks how far user needs should go, their granularity etc. 12:12:35 Lots of variability 12:12:51 Discusses intersections etc 12:13:18 Mentions the goal of creating new guidelines for WCAG etc, and that they are basd on requirements/outcomes 12:13:28 JA: I think the terms are interchangable. 12:14:04 JA, wonders what are the simple solutions are for those outcomes 12:14:24 We had variability in definitions of user needs 12:15:29 This is useful for helping define user outcomes 12:16:48 Gives overview of intersection between user needs and functions => Outcomes 12:17:37 JA: I deleted many of the categorisations 12:17:45 and simplified to just the high level 12:17:51 and I started to fit them in. 12:18:53 Demonstrating concise and clear requirements 12:19:49 It an relate to WCAG but does not have to be WCAG specific 12:20:21 JA: I found that when filling in I was identifying some needs being too granular for our definition 12:20:33 they should be moved as they represent an intersection 12:20:51 Doing this sets more clear boundaries on the high level user needs we are looking at 12:21:11 q+ to note that this will help with intersections 12:21:29 q? 12:22:06 JA: Working like this helps to create boundaries 12:22:25 JA: This feels like a complete, and right way of doing things. 12:23:25 JA: I think if we fill in this spreadsheet it could be what we want 12:23:34 It may also help with Principles 12:24:25 JOC: thanks Jake, looks great to me, need to understand a bit better but v promising 12:25:07 MC: So I'm wondering about the high level requirements, they seem like the guidelines in WCAG - will these be broken down into technology or tool guidelines? 12:25:25 JA: No. I'm not sure how to write these outcomes - but we need to figure that out. 12:26:07 JA: We need to spend some time writing these - some things can be taken from WCAG etc. 12:26:21 MC: We should take that from WCAG, put it into context and edit from there. 12:26:39 JA: My first exercise is to fill in the spread sheet, and identify clear user need and user function 12:26:44 then we are nearly complete 12:27:03 then next exercise is to add the WCAG criteria, as an exercise at intersections 12:27:16 JA: This helps us identify gaps 12:27:28 JOC: +1 to this as an exercise 12:28:15 MC: The DB I'm working on would allow some many to many mappings. 12:28:35 MC: It will be interesting to see if a certain outcome maps to many sections. 12:28:46 This is another dimension 12:30:30 JOC: 12:30:55 MC: +1 to that - as well look at things like WCAG, we may find it does mostly map except for things we can't place 12:31:14 That may indicate either a non essential requirement or we have an incomplete list 12:31:29 MC: Suggests looking at guidelines early 12:33:43 JOC: I'd like input from Charles on this also - so we can confirm that this idea as an abstraction and tool is going in the right direction. 12:33:58 ALso I'd like us to check, map with WCAG sooner rather than later 12:34:06 MC: Sounds good - 12:34:24 12:34:36 Some of this corresponds with what Jake has 12:34:47 We need to identify 'here is what is needed to enable these needs' 12:35:30 MC: If we had a model like this, we an plug in new technologies 12:35:37 To identify new guideline 12:37:01 MC: This seems like a good candidate framework 12:37:32 JOC: I like that we potentially have a global map of requirements that we can map to existing standards and identify gaps 12:37:48 MC: Ok, next steps - we need something mature enough to show 12:37:59 But also something that we can work on and iterate. 12:38:21 MC: If the feedback shows that this is broken, we have to make sure w haven't massively invested in it. 12:38:38 JA: I started with Percieved, Operable 12:38:45 Would like to work on personlisation.. 12:38:53 I'd like the group to look and add comments 12:39:34 Would like to get it 80% complete 12:39:40 THen we can take next steps 12:39:49 MC: Jake can you complete this by next week? 12:39:58 I can give it a shot. 12:40:06 Then on hols 12:40:21 JOC: We can review this when Jake is away 12:40:36 MC: It makes sense that the rest of us can work on this. 12:40:48 In Sept we can take a proposal to the Silver TF 12:40:56 JA: Really want to see peoples comments 12:41:29 https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1POhgI_xHZtSoNbHFp3r5HYIkl6ePaP8DC5d90SZ1tF4/edit?ts=608bfa6d#gid=752043294 12:41:32 JOC: URI for speadsheet 12:42:25 JOC: How does this work relate to the survey? 12:42:42 JA: I've been through it - and have added things - some suggestions are there etc 12:43:18 https://docs.google.com/document/d/1eJkgXqbh7dx3uD6XAy8XAANmwfbbVZ5GKb_gbsUdkVs/edit# 12:43:31 https://docs.google.com/document/d/1eJkgXqbh7dx3uD6XAy8XAANmwfbbVZ5GKb_gbsUdkVs/edit#heading=h.n89ecixaq6rg 12:45:32 JA: WOuld like to have a draft of the spreadsheet ready 12:45:43 WIthout the intersections between them all. 12:45:47 Maybe too open 12:46:00 Some people wanted to know where to start/stop etc 12:46:08 THe boundaries now are more clear. 12:54:31 rrsagent, draft minutes 12:54:31 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/07/16-silver-functional-minutes.html Joshue108 12:58:11 trackbot, end meeting 12:58:11 Sorry, but no Tracker is associated with this channel.