IRC log of i18n on 2021-07-15

Timestamps are in UTC.

13:55:24 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #i18n
13:55:24 [RRSAgent]
logging to https://www.w3.org/2021/07/15-i18n-irc
13:55:30 [addison]
trackbot, prepare teleconference
13:55:33 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, make logs public
13:55:36 [trackbot]
Meeting: Internationalization Working Group Teleconference
13:55:36 [trackbot]
Date: 15 July 2021
13:56:08 [agendabot]
agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-core/2021Jul/0016.html
13:56:08 [agendabot]
clear agenda
13:56:08 [agendabot]
agenda+ Agenda Review
13:56:08 [agendabot]
agenda+ Action Items
13:56:10 [agendabot]
agenda+ Info Share
13:56:12 [agendabot]
agenda+ RADAR Review
13:56:12 [addison]
Chair: Addison Phillips
13:56:14 [agendabot]
agenda+ String-Meta PR for Unicode tag characters
13:56:14 [addison]
agenda+ Consider fully supporting RTL and Bidi URLs
13:56:17 [agendabot]
agenda+ DOMException localizability
13:56:19 [agendabot]
agenda+ "Awaiting Comment Resolution" reviews
13:56:22 [agendabot]
agenda+ AOB?
13:56:47 [addison]
regrets+ Felix
13:57:14 [addison]
agenda+ Web Authentication Update
13:57:30 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/07/15-i18n-minutes.html addison
13:59:08 [addison]
present+ Addison, Fuqiao
14:00:31 [addison]
present+ Richard, Atsushi
14:00:39 [addison]
present+ JcK
14:03:27 [xfq]
scribe+
14:03:33 [addison]
zakim, take up agendum 1
14:03:33 [Zakim]
agendum 1 -- Agenda Review -- taken up [from agendabot]
14:03:34 [addison]
agenda?
14:03:48 [addison]
present+ Peter
14:04:27 [xfq]
addison: anything to add to the agenda?
14:04:30 [addison]
zakim, take up agendum 2
14:04:30 [Zakim]
agendum 2 -- Action Items -- taken up [from agendabot]
14:04:38 [addison]
https://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/open
14:04:45 [Peter]
Peter has joined #i18n
14:05:29 [xfq]
addison: one of our issues is related to backwards deletion
14:05:44 [addison]
action-1034?
14:05:44 [trackbot]
action-1034 -- Addison Phillips to Triage awaiting comment resolution items -- due 2021-06-24 -- OPEN
14:05:44 [trackbot]
https://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/1034
14:06:21 [r12a]
there are a few more photos of Fushimi Inari here https://www.flickr.com/photos/ishida/albums/72157715616929641 (interspersed)
14:06:31 [r12a]
including, Fuqiao, some Chinese people https://www.flickr.com/photos/ishida/48984187053/in/album-72157715616929641/
14:07:27 [addison]
action-1038?
14:07:27 [trackbot]
action-1038 -- Richard Ishida to Create repo for developing-localizable-manifests -- due 2021-07-01 -- OPEN
14:07:27 [trackbot]
https://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/1038
14:07:31 [addison]
close action-1038
14:07:31 [trackbot]
Closed action-1038.
14:07:57 [addison]
action-1042?
14:07:57 [trackbot]
action-1042 -- Addison Phillips to Remind members to review techniques/authoring-html-new for next telecon -- due 2021-07-08 -- OPEN
14:07:57 [trackbot]
https://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/1042
14:08:18 [addison]
close action-1042
14:08:18 [trackbot]
Closed action-1042.
14:08:27 [addison]
action-1044?
14:08:27 [trackbot]
action-1044 -- Addison Phillips to Contact plh about webauthn issues and how to handle them -- due 2021-07-08 -- OPEN
14:08:27 [trackbot]
https://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/1044
14:08:37 [addison]
close action-1044
14:08:37 [trackbot]
Closed action-1044.
14:08:55 [addison]
action-1045?
14:08:55 [trackbot]
action-1045 -- Addison Phillips to Draft issues on webauth#sctn-strings-langdir -- due 2021-07-08 -- OPEN
14:08:55 [trackbot]
https://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/1045
14:09:03 [addison]
close action-1045
14:09:03 [trackbot]
Closed action-1045.
14:09:33 [addison]
action-1046?
14:09:33 [trackbot]
action-1046 -- Addison Phillips to Add mustard warning against unicode language tag characters to string-meta -- due 2021-07-15 -- OPEN
14:09:33 [trackbot]
https://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/1046
14:09:53 [addison]
close action-1046
14:09:53 [trackbot]
Closed action-1046.
14:10:06 [addison]
action-1047?
14:10:06 [trackbot]
action-1047 -- Addison Phillips to File issues against webauthn and ping plh when complete -- due 2021-07-15 -- OPEN
14:10:06 [trackbot]
https://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/1047
14:10:15 [addison]
close action-1047
14:10:15 [trackbot]
Closed action-1047.
14:10:38 [addison]
zakim, take up agendum 3
14:10:39 [Zakim]
agendum 3 -- Info Share -- taken up [from agendabot]
14:11:22 [addison]
fuqiao: google docs will move from html rendering to canvas-based rendering
14:11:41 [addison]
... made a new text rendering engine vs. using content-editable
14:11:55 [addison]
... includes complex text layout (bidi, etc. etc.)
14:12:17 [addison]
... complex features developed at W3C will be reimplemented?
14:12:38 [xfq]
https://workspaceupdates.googleblog.com/2021/05/Google-Docs-Canvas-Based-Rendering-Update.html
14:12:42 [addison]
... tencent docs also did this; made a preso about how they implemented a11y features
14:13:37 [David]
David has joined #I18n
14:14:41 [addison]
present+ David
14:15:04 [addison]
agenda?
14:15:44 [addison]
zakim, take up agendum 4
14:15:44 [Zakim]
agendum 4 -- RADAR Review -- taken up [from agendabot]
14:15:53 [addison]
https://github.com/w3c/i18n-request/projects/1
14:16:54 [r12a]
https://github.com/w3c/htmlwg/issues/17
14:17:26 [xfq]
r12a: looked at the i18n issues they pointed out
14:18:50 [xfq]
addison: we're building up a number of completed
14:19:04 [xfq]
s/completed/"Completed"
14:19:11 [xfq]
... do we want to close them?
14:20:20 [xfq]
r12a: we see open and closed issues in the Completed column
14:21:33 [xfq]
... the close? tag is no longer relevant when the issue is moved to Completed
14:21:46 [xfq]
s/close?/'close?'
14:21:51 [JcK]
JcK has joined #i18n
14:23:29 [xfq]
addison: the action is somebody should go through the Completed column and close the issues
14:24:10 [addison]
action: addison: close open completed reviews
14:24:10 [trackbot]
Created ACTION-1049 - Close open completed reviews [on Addison Phillips - due 2021-07-22].
14:24:23 [addison]
agenda?
14:24:38 [addison]
zakim, take up agendum 10
14:24:38 [Zakim]
agendum 10 -- Web Authentication Update -- taken up [from addison]
14:25:08 [xfq]
addison: I attended the web authentication meeting
14:25:27 [xfq]
... they will immediately remove the section we're unhappy with
14:25:55 [xfq]
... i18n WG will contribute a PR
14:26:24 [xfq]
... we talked about a few things
14:26:31 [xfq]
... there are some limitations
14:26:48 [xfq]
... i'm currently holding the action to write the PR
14:27:14 [xfq]
... we will review the PR in this group before we send it to web authentication
14:27:23 [xfq]
r12a: well done
14:29:00 [xfq]
addison: a couple of people understand the importance of i18n support
14:29:42 [addison]
agenda?
14:30:20 [addison]
zakim, take up agendum 5
14:30:20 [Zakim]
agendum 5 -- String-Meta PR for Unicode tag characters -- taken up [from agendabot]
14:30:40 [addison]
https://github.com/w3c/string-meta/pull/56
14:31:18 [addison]
https://github.com/aphillips/string-meta
14:31:19 [xfq]
agenda+ localizable-manifests
14:31:43 [addison]
https://aphillips.github.io/string-meta/
14:32:07 [addison]
https://aphillips.github.io/string-meta/#bp_unicode_tag_chars_nonuse
14:32:21 [addison]
https://aphillips.github.io/string-meta/#unicodeTags
14:33:21 [xfq]
r12a: typo: langauge
14:34:59 [xfq]
r12a: otherwise looks good to me
14:35:48 [xfq]
addison: made the glossary cleaner, consistent
14:36:02 [xfq]
... re-arranged the order
14:37:35 [xfq]
JcK: not just in W3C, but also in IETF and Unicode Consortium
14:38:34 [addison]
[Unicode] says that the "... use of tag characters to convey language tags is strongly discouraged" and that the use of the character U+E0001 LANGUAGE TAG is strongly discouraged. The only current use of characters in this block of Unicode is to form various flag emoji.
14:38:34 [xfq]
addison: Unicode says that the use of tag characters to convey language tags is strongly discouraged
14:39:15 [xfq]
r12a: i'll be inclined to omit the last sentence
14:39:55 [xfq]
addison: any objection on removing that sentence?
14:40:39 [xfq]
Peter: in ยง 5.3.3 it says "Unicode tag characters are strongly deprecated by the Unicode Consortium"
14:41:15 [xfq]
... they only say "strongly discouraged" instead of "strongly deprecated"
14:41:46 [xfq]
r12a: "deprecated" and "discourage" do not mean the same thing in W3C too
14:42:36 [addison]
Use of Unicode tag characters for language identification are strongly discouraged by the Unicode Consortium (and thus deprecated).
14:42:59 [xfq]
JcK: +1
14:43:01 [xfq]
Peter: +1
14:43:10 [David]
+1
14:44:19 [addison]
action: addison: merge string-meta changes pending richard's review of the glossary changes
14:44:20 [trackbot]
Created ACTION-1050 - Merge string-meta changes pending richard's review of the glossary changes [on Addison Phillips - due 2021-07-22].
14:44:27 [addison]
agenda?
14:44:54 [addison]
zakim, take up agendum 7
14:44:55 [Zakim]
agendum 7 -- DOMException localizability -- taken up [from agendabot]
14:45:05 [addison]
https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-core/2021Jul/0011.html
14:46:11 [xfq]
addison: localization of exceptions
14:46:37 [addison]
https://github.com/heycam/webidl/issues/996
14:46:45 [xfq]
... I tend to think we should make exceptions localizable
14:47:11 [xfq]
... how do we want to address this?
14:47:19 [Peter]
Unicode deprecation of language tagging: http://www.unicode.org/versions/Unicode13.0.0/ch23.pdf#G30427
14:48:11 [atsushi]
https://heycam.github.io/webidl/#idl-DOMException
14:48:20 [r12a]
https://heycam.github.io/webidl/
14:48:42 [addison]
(and in TR at https://www.w3.org/TR/WebIDL/#idl-DOMException)
14:50:15 [xfq]
addison: should we file the equivalent comment for Geolocation to Web IDL?
14:50:28 [xfq]
r12a: language and direction, right?
14:50:34 [xfq]
addison: that's right
14:52:43 [xfq]
xfq: should we add metadata to the interface?
14:53:01 [xfq]
... as optional attributes?
14:53:21 [xfq]
addison: preferably not optional
14:54:13 [addison]
"present but optional"
14:54:16 [xfq]
addison: the field should be there, but the value can be optional
14:54:53 [addison]
https://github.com/w3c/geolocation-api/issues/50#issuecomment-828626695
14:56:30 [r12a]
https://github.com/heycam/webidl/issues/996
14:56:39 [xfq]
r12a: do we create a new issue or do we extend the issue marcos filed?
14:57:11 [xfq]
addison: I think it's better to file separate specific issues
14:57:57 [addison]
action: addison: file issues about DOMException against WebIDL to add metadata and to provide for localizability
14:57:58 [trackbot]
Created ACTION-1051 - File issues about domexception against webidl to add metadata and to provide for localizability [on Addison Phillips - due 2021-07-22].
14:58:11 [addison]
agenda?
14:58:34 [addison]
zakim, takeup agendum 11
14:58:36 [Zakim]
I don't understand 'takeup agendum 11', addison
14:58:50 [addison]
zakim, take up agendum 11
14:58:50 [Zakim]
agendum 11 -- localizable-manifests -- taken up [from xfq]
14:58:55 [addison]
put to top in next week
14:58:59 [addison]
zakim, take up agendum 9
14:59:00 [Zakim]
agendum 9 -- AOB? -- taken up [from agendabot]
14:59:58 [xfq]
r12a: wrote a report on the i18n sponsorship program
15:00:45 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/07/15-i18n-minutes.html addison
15:00:47 [xfq]
rrsagent, make minutes
15:00:47 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/07/15-i18n-minutes.html xfq
15:01:41 [addison]
present+ Bert
15:01:46 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/07/15-i18n-minutes.html addison
15:02:59 [xfq_]
xfq_ has joined #i18n
15:17:04 [addison]
zakim, bye
15:17:04 [Zakim]
leaving. As of this point the attendees have been Addison, Fuqiao, Richard, Atsushi, JcK, Peter, David, Bert
15:17:04 [Zakim]
Zakim has left #i18n
15:24:57 [r12a]
s|there are a few more photos of Fushimi Inari here https://www.flickr.com/photos/ishida/albums/72157715616929641 (interspersed)||
15:25:11 [r12a]
s|including, Fuqiao, some Chinese people https://www.flickr.com/photos/ishida/48984187053/in/album-72157715616929641/||
15:25:19 [r12a]
rrsagent, draft minutes
15:25:19 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/07/15-i18n-minutes.html r12a