IRC log of wai-curricula on 2021-06-15

Timestamps are in UTC.

14:46:52 [RRSAgent]
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logging to
14:47:21 [Daniel_]
Meeting: WAI Curricula Task Force Teleconference
14:47:29 [Daniel_]
Date: 15 June 2021
14:47:33 [Daniel_]
Chair: Daniel
14:48:06 [Daniel_]
rrsagent, make logs Public
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15:06:38 [Daniel_]
zakim, take up agendum 1
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agendum 1 -- Setting up meeting, choosing scribe -- taken up [from Daniel_]
15:08:17 [Estella_]
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15:08:39 [GN]
15:08:48 [Daniel_]
15:09:37 [Daniel_]
zakim, take up item 2
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agendum 2 -- Move module "Understanding and Involving Users" to "Foundation Modules" -- taken up [from Daniel_]
15:09:48 [Daniel_]
15:10:06 [Daniel_]
EOWG has proposed to move current designer module "Understanding and Involving Users" to "Foundation Modules". Rationale:
15:10:06 [Daniel_]
15:10:06 [Daniel_]
- Its content touches on several roles: user researcher, designer, developer, content author, and project manager.
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- Some organizations may skip these contents entirely if they are placed in the designer modules, as designer and user researcher may be completely separate roles for them.
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15:10:07 [Daniel_]
See EOWG minutes at
15:10:48 [Howard]
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present+ Howard
15:12:52 [Donal-F]
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15:13:01 [Donal-F]
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scribe: Howard
15:13:50 [Daniel_]
GerhardÑ Ver y good place. User involvement is not only managed form the designer, it is also handled by developers rand other roles
15:14:25 [Howard]
Gherhard: GerhardÑ Ver y good place. User involvement is not only managed form the designer, it is also handled by developers rand other roles Daniel_ Donal-F Estella_ GN Howard RRSAgent shadi Zakim
15:15:35 [Howard]
Topic: Moving User Involvement module to Foundations
15:16:08 [Howard]
Daniel: feedback from EO was that User involvement/design should be moved to foundation modules
15:16:27 [Howard]
Daniel: has put together a proposal for implementing this change.
15:16:45 [Howard]
Donal: agrees with the premise
15:17:31 [Howard]
Daniel: proposal - accept suggestion from EO but not going to get into the details at this point.
15:18:03 [Howard]
... How can we make sure understanding and involving users does not get lost?
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... Any ideas on avoiding that?
15:19:51 [Howard]
Estella: Understanding and involving users can be looked out in 2 ways.
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... One, as looking at all the discussion that went on previously.
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... Second, as an applied approach where you involve users.
15:21:19 [Howard]
Daniel: will go back to EO saying we will make this change but will continue with developing the designer ...
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... modules.
15:21:26 [Daniel_]
zakim, take up item 3
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agendum 3 -- Learning outcomes for topic "Alternatives to Multimedia Content" -- taken up [from Daniel_]
15:21:36 [Estella_]
+1 to move it fundational modules
15:21:47 [Daniel_]
15:25:16 [Howard]
Estella: likes the new approach but missing the subtitles mention - need this to be understandable outside U.S.
15:25:49 [Howard]
Daniel: will make note in section that "captions (also known as subtitles)".
15:26:09 [Howard]
Estella: should be mention of content in different languages.
15:26:22 [Howard]
Daniel: How do we relate that to accessibility?
15:27:32 [Howard]
Estella: example of a video in Chinese. Need for subtitles in other languages, including audio description.
15:28:37 [Daniel_]
HowardÑ Wonders if it fits into accessibility, not clear where this is in WCAG. Definitely good to have, but probably out of scope
15:28:55 [Howard]
Howard: Not sure that translation falls in the scope of accessibility.
15:29:33 [Howard]
Gerhard: agrees that not in scope. Nothing in WCAG covers this.
15:30:18 [Howard]
Estella: WCAG does address the "lang" tag. In Europe, multilingualism is part of accessibility.
15:30:55 [Howard]
Gerhard: Perhaps should be responsibility on content authors.
15:31:04 [shadi]
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rrsagent, pointer?
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15:32:40 [Howard]
Daniel: What is our responsibility to encourage multi-language access is provided. Not sure this can be done.
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... Will work on it.
15:34:49 [Howard]
Daniel: should we address accessibility of players in multimedia module?
15:35:00 [Howard]
Estella: what about mention of color contrast?
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15:36:05 [CarlosD]
15:36:49 [Howard]
Howard: What about mention of keyboard access to media players?
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Daniel: covered in other modules but should make some mention of this.
15:38:52 [Howard]
Estella: Should audio descriptions, transcripts, etc., how far content authors are responsible vs. designers.
15:39:21 [Howard]
Donal: content of audio description is responsibility of the content author. But how they ...
15:40:12 [Howard]
... are displayed and where the audio description would appear is decided by the designer.
15:41:13 [Howard]
Donal: example - on YouTube, audio descriptions are auto-announced. Could also span to role of developer.
15:42:04 [Howard]
Daniel: these distinctions not coming through clear at this point. Will work on this.
15:45:10 [Daniel_]
zakim, take up item 4
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agendum 4 -- Improving teaching ideas for topic "Textual Information" -- taken up [from Daniel_]
15:45:17 [Daniel_]
15:46:10 [Howard]
Daniel: this section is about the way we can split text into smaller pieces.
15:46:42 [Howard]
... Also different ways of complementing textual info with graphics, etc.
15:47:47 [Howard]
... Usually author orientated. Responsibility of designer for this not specified. How do we make this more specific for the designer?
15:48:58 [Howard]
... For example, we can say that the designer needs to specify how user will navigate page - ex. headings, use of sidebars, etc.
15:50:24 [Howard]
Daniel: Are these strategies - splitting of text, etc. - a designers responsibility.
15:50:53 [Howard]
Gerhard: think it's shared with authors.
15:51:10 [Howard]
Daniel: hearing that we need to emphasize the visuals.
15:51:28 [Howard]
Donal: think it's the relationship between the visuals and the structure.
15:52:06 [Howard]
Carlos: Agree with Donal and Gerhard.
15:55:09 [Howard]
Daniel: more emphasis should be put on visuals and structures such as headings, regions and more cross-reference to way
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... splitting of text is addressed in previous 'navigation' module, for example, uses of tables of content, etc.
15:56:46 [Howard]
Estella: agree with what has been said. 4 different topics to teach in this module, more than 2 that is found in most...
15:57:03 [Howard]
... other modules. Should we balance this out?
15:58:45 [Howard]
Daniel: will look at this.
15:58:56 [Daniel_]
Topic: Next Steps
16:00:57 [Howard]
Daniel: recap - movement of user research and input into foundation module.
16:01:33 [Howard]
... will cross-reference from Designer modules to this content in the foundation modules.
16:02:34 [Daniel_]
rrsagent, draft minutes
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I have made the request to generate Daniel_
16:07:43 [Daniel_]
rrsagent, draft minutes
16:07:43 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate Daniel_