IRC log of rqtf on 2021-05-12
Timestamps are in UTC.
- 12:48:28 [RRSAgent]
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- logging to https://www.w3.org/2021/05/12-rqtf-irc
- 12:48:30 [trackbot]
- RRSAgent, make logs public
- 12:48:30 [Zakim]
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- 12:48:32 [trackbot]
- Meeting: Accessible Platform Architectures Working Group Teleconference
- 12:48:32 [trackbot]
- Date: 12 May 2021
- 12:48:38 [jasonjgw]
- chair: jasonjgw
- 12:48:43 [jasonjgw]
- present+
- 12:49:33 [jasonjgw]
- agenda+ RAUR: Status.
- 12:49:53 [jasonjgw]
- agenda+ XAUR: open issues.
- 12:50:17 [jasonjgw]
- agenda+ Accessibility of remote meetings.
- 12:50:36 [jasonjgw]
- agenda+ Media synchronization.
- 12:50:59 [jasonjgw]
- agenda+ Web of Things and Devices/Sensors use cases - introduction to topic.
- 12:51:19 [jasonjgw]
- agenda+ Joint working group meetings at TPAC 2021.
- 12:51:43 [jasonjgw]
- agenda+ Meeting with Immersive Captions Community Group.
- 12:52:17 [jasonjgw]
- zakim, list agenda
- 12:52:17 [Zakim]
- I see 7 items remaining on the agenda:
- 12:52:18 [Zakim]
- 1. RAUR: Status. [from jasonjgw]
- 12:52:18 [Zakim]
- 2. XAUR: open issues. [from jasonjgw]
- 12:52:18 [Zakim]
- 3. Accessibility of remote meetings. [from jasonjgw]
- 12:52:18 [Zakim]
- 4. Media synchronization. [from jasonjgw]
- 12:52:18 [Zakim]
- 5. Web of Things and Devices/Sensors use cases - introduction to topic. [from jasonjgw]
- 12:52:19 [Zakim]
- 6. Joint working group meetings at TPAC 2021. [from jasonjgw]
- 12:52:19 [Zakim]
- 7. Meeting with Immersive Captions Community Group. [from jasonjgw]
- 12:59:32 [Joshue108]
- present+
- 12:59:47 [janina]
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- 12:59:51 [JPaton]
- present+ John_Paton
- 13:00:00 [janina]
- agenda?
- 13:00:07 [janina]
- present+
- 13:00:58 [becky]
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- 13:02:08 [scott_h]
- scott_h has joined #rqtf
- 13:02:10 [Joshue108]
- scribe: Joshue108
- 13:02:17 [jasonjgw]
- zakim, next item
- 13:02:17 [Zakim]
- agendum 1 -- RAUR: Status. -- taken up [from jasonjgw]
- 13:02:28 [Joshue108]
- JW: This is to discuss CFC
- 13:02:43 [Joshue108]
- Some favourable responses
- 13:02:57 [Joshue108]
- JS: Open till midnight Boston Friday
- 13:03:10 [scott_h]
- present+
- 13:03:12 [jasonjgw]
- zakim, next item
- 13:03:12 [Zakim]
- agendum 1 was just opened, jasonjgw
- 13:03:19 [Joshue108]
- zakim, take up next
- 13:03:19 [Zakim]
- agendum 2 -- XAUR: open issues. -- taken up [from jasonjgw]
- 13:04:19 [SteveNoble]
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- 13:04:41 [jasonjgw]
- Josh: acknowledges that we need to publish a new working draft, or address the comments and proceed to publication. Josh is considering the schedule.
- 13:05:10 [SteveNoble]
- present+
- 13:05:39 [jasonjgw]
- Josh notes we have new user needs/requirements.
- 13:06:03 [jasonjgw]
- He also notes there aren't many outstanding issues at this point. We could address them in the coming weeks.
- 13:06:29 [Joshue108]
- JW: I think we can proceed on that basis that we will have a CFC shortly
- 13:06:43 [Joshue108]
- If we need another review we can add one.
- 13:06:46 [Joshue108]
- Reasonable?
- 13:06:52 [Joshue108]
- JOC: Sounds good
- 13:07:38 [jasonjgw]
- Josh is waiting for responses on several comments.
- 13:08:27 [Judy]
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- 13:09:07 [Joshue108]
- [New User Need] 4.20 Wayfinding - Review of XR Accessibility User Requirements COGA
- 13:09:18 [Joshue108]
- https://github.com/w3c/apa/issues/180
- 13:10:17 [Joshue108]
- JS: Why mono?
- 13:10:27 [Joshue108]
- JS: Dont understand that? Why?
- 13:10:41 [Joshue108]
- For sign posts having spatial orientation is useful.
- 13:10:56 [Joshue108]
- JP: Espec for limited vision - you would need 3D sound?
- 13:11:04 [Joshue108]
- JB: What about hearing on one side?
- 13:11:08 [Judy]
- s/JS: Dont/JB: Don't/
- 13:11:25 [Joshue108]
- JS: That is a separate question. This is listed as accomodation for vision
- 13:11:30 [Joshue108]
- I don't understand
- 13:11:36 [Joshue108]
- JOC: I'll follow up on that
- 13:11:46 [Joshue108]
- NEEDS INFO
- 13:12:03 [Joshue108]
- JS: Are bread crumbs needed? Is that useful?
- 13:12:13 [Joshue108]
- NEEDS INFO
- 13:12:47 [Joshue108]
- JB: May be useful in some environments, but not something that is found too much in gaming.
- 13:13:13 [Joshue108]
- There is a functional issue for people with spatial disorientation. Will that carry over into virtual space?
- 13:14:11 [Joshue108]
- There is also a NEEDS INFO request to COGA from me on this one
- 13:14:13 [Joshue108]
- https://github.com/w3c/apa/issues/176
- 13:14:19 [Joshue108]
- 4.12 Does not provide enough information for actionable implementation [XAUR]
- 13:14:25 [Joshue108]
- Immersive time limits
- 13:15:14 [Joshue108]
- JW: This could be useful in some contexts but also dealt with by other means, portals etc
- 13:15:37 [Joshue108]
- JS: Why is this specificly useful for vision.
- 13:16:11 [Joshue108]
- JB: What if not just for vision? Something that they raised, multisensory etc.
- 13:16:21 [Joshue108]
- JS: Yes - it may be
- 13:16:35 [Joshue108]
- Could be a series of reasons.
- 13:17:47 [Judy]
- q+
- 13:19:08 [Joshue108]
- JB: Regarding https://github.com/w3c/apa/issues/176 I can thinks of lots of reasons why this is valid.
- 13:19:11 [janina]
- q+ to note that we have a technological solution with MQ5
- 13:20:15 [Joshue108]
- acj judy
- 13:20:18 [Joshue108]
- ack judy
- 13:20:27 [Joshue108]
- ack jan
- 13:20:27 [Zakim]
- janina, you wanted to note that we have a technological solution with MQ5
- 13:20:51 [Joshue108]
- JS: Regarding Gottfrieds students preso, this showed us a solution
- 13:21:03 [Joshue108]
- Via Media Queries 5 - we can control that.
- 13:21:28 [Joshue108]
- JB: The Immersive Captions CG may also have some useful research.
- 13:22:30 [Joshue108]
- [New User Need] 4.21 Understanding Actionable Targets - Review of XR Accessibility User Requirements COGA #181
- 13:22:36 [Joshue108]
- https://github.com/w3c/apa/issues/181
- 13:22:57 [Joshue108]
- https://raw.githack.com/w3c/apa/6d5bf713d9d7c65ecda104c213ad47b0e98cfbe1/xaur/index.html#interaction-and-target-customization
- 13:24:04 [Joshue108]
- JOC: Read out the new suggested need etc
- 13:24:21 [janina]
- q+
- 13:24:23 [Joshue108]
- JW: In the 'real world' e'thing is touchable and actionable.
- 13:24:46 [Joshue108]
- SH: Is this covered by character sets?
- 13:24:56 [Joshue108]
- q+ to talk about affordances
- 13:25:17 [Joshue108]
- SH: There is already indication that something is a target, for personalisation this is covered already.
- 13:25:24 [Joshue108]
- ack jan
- 13:25:35 [Joshue108]
- JS: There is semantic confusion here, about how words are used
- 13:25:53 [Joshue108]
- JS: They may mean the palette of controls by which you can do something to a target.
- 13:26:00 [Joshue108]
- SH: Already covered.
- 13:26:06 [Joshue108]
- ack me
- 13:26:06 [Zakim]
- Joshue, you wanted to talk about affordances
- 13:26:11 [janina]
- ack ja
- 13:27:28 [Joshue108]
- JOC: What do you mean by palette of controls?
- 13:27:47 [Joshue108]
- JS: Actionable items etc like in a browser radio buttons, sliders etc
- 13:28:06 [Joshue108]
- JOC: Does this relate to the translation of affordances?
- 13:28:20 [Joshue108]
- JS: Gives a medical example.
- 13:28:54 [Joshue108]
- JW: <reexplains for Josh>
- 13:29:30 [Joshue108]
- JW: I think some things do need to made conspicuous
- 13:30:33 [Joshue108]
- JOC: I think there is a potential need here.
- 13:30:40 [Joshue108]
- JS: Agreed but it is not clear,
- 13:30:50 [Joshue108]
- JOC: I'll take an action for more info on this.
- 13:31:04 [Joshue108]
- NEEDS INFO
- 13:31:44 [Joshue108]
- SH: I'm not clear of how this would be implemented?
- 13:32:00 [Joshue108]
- JOC: This is covered to some degree already, a la Personalisation AAC etc
- 13:32:12 [Joshue108]
- JW: We need more detail on the use cases.
- 13:32:13 [jasonjgw]
- zakim, next item
- 13:32:13 [Zakim]
- agendum 3 -- Accessibility of remote meetings. -- taken up [from jasonjgw]
- 13:32:46 [Joshue108]
- SH: We have been working on this, thanks for suggestions etc
- 13:32:56 [Joshue108]
- <Go Notepad>
- 13:33:11 [Joshue108]
- SH: Wording has been tightened
- 13:33:34 [Joshue108]
- We have clarified some key points, definitions on Hybrid meetings
- 13:33:54 [Joshue108]
- We have outlined sections, issues - there are 5 sections.
- 13:34:01 [Joshue108]
- <Gives over view of structure>
- 13:34:52 [Joshue108]
- SH: We relate much of it to existing W3C guidance.
- 13:35:25 [Joshue108]
- There is a new section in this draft, hosting an accessible hybrid meeting.
- 13:35:39 [Joshue108]
- Still Work in Progress - looking forward to feedback.
- 13:36:16 [Joshue108]
- JB: I'd like to mention some new things I've added.
- 13:36:37 [Joshue108]
- Would like a more indepth discussion soon, when we have gone through backlog.
- 13:36:56 [Joshue108]
- JB: Question around structure and presentation.
- 13:37:34 [Joshue108]
- https://www.w3.org/WAI/APA/task-forces/research-questions/wiki/Accessibility_of_Remote_Meetings:_Structured_Draft
- 13:38:11 [Joshue108]
- There are placeholders for some new things..
- 13:38:34 [Joshue108]
- Such as W3C is starting to look at accessible virtual meeting platforms
- 13:39:04 [Joshue108]
- s/virtual meeting /virtual conferences
- 13:39:18 [Joshue108]
- JB: I'll update that.
- 13:39:27 [Joshue108]
- Also a new section on working with vendors to improve a11y
- 13:39:59 [Joshue108]
- JB: Reactions to these?
- 13:40:15 [Joshue108]
- q?
- 13:40:42 [Joshue108]
- JW: Seems like a chance for W3C members to look at their platforms a11y support.
- 13:41:18 [Joshue108]
- JOC: Sounds like a good direction.
- 13:41:38 [Joshue108]
- JB: Scott and I have been discussing hybrid meetings
- 13:41:52 [Joshue108]
- https://www.w3.org/WAI/APA/task-forces/research-questions/wiki/Accessibility_of_Remote_Meetings:_Structured_Draft#Holding_accessible_hybrid_meetings
- 13:42:04 [janina]
- q+
- 13:42:14 [Joshue108]
- JB: Where virtual and real meetings can interface correctly.
- 13:43:21 [Joshue108]
- JB: Any ideas on the hybrid meetings?
- 13:43:38 [Joshue108]
- JS: Yes, It is important to look at what tech resources are available.
- 13:43:54 [Joshue108]
- You can treat e'one there as if they are remote.
- 13:44:03 [Judy]
- ack j
- 13:44:12 [Judy]
- q+
- 13:44:31 [Joshue108]
- There are also solutions that will keep the camera on who is talking, and move the focus accordingly - as well as only pipe the active content down the wire.
- 13:44:49 [Joshue108]
- SH: <Gives overview of experience with hybrid meetings>
- 13:45:05 [Joshue108]
- SH: There are challenges.
- 13:45:29 [Joshue108]
- JB: This is great feedback.
- 13:45:53 [Joshue108]
- <Gives over view of hybrid meeting in Seattle for Inclusive Web etc>
- 13:47:04 [Joshue108]
- q?
- 13:47:26 [Joshue108]
- JB: THere is a big section of unprocessed comments
- 13:48:13 [Joshue108]
- JB: The language needs to be regularised - here is what you need to know.
- 13:48:19 [Joshue108]
- Then we need review/vetting.
- 13:49:01 [Joshue108]
- JW: I'm happy to review after next round.
- 13:49:36 [Joshue108]
- JB: Anyone else?
- 13:50:05 [Joshue108]
- JW: With hybrid meetings we also need to look at captions etc
- 13:50:05 [jasonjgw]
- zakim, next item
- 13:50:05 [Zakim]
- I see a speaker queue remaining and respectfully decline to close this agendum, jasonjgw
- 13:50:16 [Judy]
- ack j
- 13:50:19 [Joshue108]
- zakim, take up next
- 13:50:19 [Zakim]
- agendum 4 -- Media synchronization. -- taken up [from jasonjgw]
- 13:51:01 [Joshue108]
- JW: This may be a discussion for later. Janina has suggested that this move towards a NOTE track deliverable.
- 13:51:08 [Joshue108]
- JS: Very much
- 13:51:35 [Joshue108]
- There is value here - the wiki would be useful but better elevated to NOTE status.
- 13:52:17 [Joshue108]
- JW: Ok, it can evolve on the wiki and can be moved later.
- 13:52:50 [Joshue108]
- JS: Anyone concerned?
- 13:53:31 [Joshue108]
- <crickets>
- 13:53:44 [Joshue108]
- JS: I'll follow up with APA
- 13:53:46 [jasonjgw]
- zakim, next item
- 13:53:46 [Zakim]
- agendum 5 -- Web of Things and Devices/Sensors use cases - introduction to topic. -- taken up [from jasonjgw]
- 13:54:24 [Joshue108]
- JW: This is coming via APA - we can note this but discuss later.
- 13:54:41 [Joshue108]
- JS: This came up in APA a la our new work etc
- 13:55:01 [SteveNoble]
- have to jump off to prep for my next meeting
- 13:55:07 [Joshue108]
- I'd like RQTF to see if we can identify a11y specific applications for some devices and sensors.
- 13:55:15 [Joshue108]
- Similar to WoT request
- 13:55:42 [Joshue108]
- JS: Is there an a11y use case that we should cover?
- 13:55:56 [Joshue108]
- There is a WG being rechartered.
- 13:56:12 [Joshue108]
- Can we take some time soon to explore?
- 13:56:58 [jasonjgw]
- zakim, next item
- 13:56:58 [Zakim]
- agendum 6 -- Joint working group meetings at TPAC 2021. -- taken up [from jasonjgw]
- 13:57:19 [Joshue108]
- JW: We have to start thinking on this.
- 13:57:55 [jasonjgw]
- zakim, take up item 7
- 13:57:55 [Zakim]
- agendum 7 -- Meeting with Immersive Captions Community Group. -- taken up [from jasonjgw]
- 13:58:22 [Joshue108]
- JB: I'll co-ordinate necessary supports
- 13:58:54 [Joshue108]
- JW: We can find tune agenda etc - then circulate meeting etc
- 13:59:36 [Joshue108]
- zakim, list attendees
- 13:59:36 [Zakim]
- As of this point the attendees have been jasonjgw, Joshue, John_Paton, janina, scott_h, SteveNoble
- 13:59:43 [Joshue108]
- rrsagent, draft minutes
- 13:59:43 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/05/12-rqtf-minutes.html Joshue108
- 15:52:52 [janina]
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