14:57:09 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #rdf-star
14:57:09 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2021/05/07-rdf-star-irc
14:57:11 <Zakim> RRSAgent, make logs Public
14:57:12 <Zakim> please title this meeting ("meeting: ..."), pchampin_
14:58:31 <pchampin_> meeting: RDF-star
14:58:35 <pchampin_> chair: pchampin
14:58:46 <pchampin_> date: 7 May 2021
14:58:56 <pchampin_> agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-star/2021May/0021.html
14:58:56 <agendabot> clear agenda
14:58:56 <agendabot> agenda+ Announcements and newcomers
14:58:56 <agendabot> agenda+ Open actions
14:58:56 <agendabot> agenda+ Moving to standard track
14:58:56 <agendabot> agenda+ Open-ended discussions
14:59:24 <william> william has joined #rdf-star
14:59:27 <pchampin_> Previous meeting: https://w3c.github.io/rdf-star/Minutes/2021-04-30.html
14:59:27 <pchampin_> Next meeting: https://w3c.github.io/rdf-star/Minutes/2021-05-14.html
14:59:30 <gkellogg> gkellogg has joined #rdf-star
14:59:49 <thomas> thomas has joined #rdf-star
15:00:05 <pfps> pfps has joined #rdf-star
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15:02:09 <james> james has joined #rdf-star
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15:02:23 <james> present+
15:02:59 <AndyS> present+
15:03:09 <pchampin> present+
15:03:12 <thomas> present+
15:03:47 <gkellogg> present+
15:03:51 <rivettp> rivettp has joined #rdf-star
15:04:00 <rivettp> present+
15:04:23 <olaf> present+
15:05:11 <ora> ora has joined #rdf-star
15:05:18 <ora> present+
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15:06:19 <AndyS> zakim, pick Ora
15:06:19 <Zakim> I don't understand 'pick Ora', AndyS
15:06:58 <jbollema> I can scribe for a bit
15:07:01 <AndyS> I'll scribe
15:07:10 <AndyS> scribe: AndyS
15:07:21 <pchampin> Zakim, next agendum
15:07:21 <Zakim> agendum 1 -- Announcements and newcomers -- taken up [from agendabot]
15:07:23 <gatemezing> gatemezing has joined #rdf-star
15:08:10 <AndyS> Knowledge Graph Conference
15:08:35 <AndyS> ora: Got a Q about RDF-star - request for what's going on.
15:09:28 <AndyS> olaf: shorter version of Lotico event
15:10:55 <ora> q+
15:11:31 <AndyS> rivettp: There session on GQL and OSI.
15:11:46 <AndyS> ... is there unification of work going on?
15:12:34 <AndyS> pchampin: GQL is following a different track.
15:13:31 <pchampin> scribe: pchampin
15:13:39 <pchampin> AndyS: the process is partially responsible of that
15:13:52 <pchampin> ... the ISO process makes it hard to share with the public
15:14:39 <pchampin> rivettp: many people at the conference were asking about RDF-star
15:14:54 <pchampin> ... the seem to expect it to help a convergence between the two worlds
15:15:09 <pchampin> AndyS: not sure people expect "convergence"
15:15:12 <gatemezing> present+
15:16:05 <pchampin> rivettp: [something about data interoperability]
15:16:17 <AndyS> Ditto.
15:16:32 <pchampin> q?
15:16:37 <pchampin> ack ora
15:17:16 <AndyS> ora: Interesting results of EKGC survey - interoperation a priority
15:17:22 <pchampin> scribe: AndyS
15:17:51 <AndyS> ... very positive for standardization
15:18:02 <AndyS> ... least important "no code" tools.
15:18:15 <pchampin> q?
15:18:36 <pchampin> Zakim, next agendum
15:18:36 <Zakim> agendum 2 -- Open actions -- taken up [from agendabot]
15:18:49 <pchampin> https://github.com/w3c/rdf-star/issues?q=is%3Aopen+is%3Aissue+label%3Aaction
15:19:08 <pchampin> scribe: pchampin
15:19:11 <AndyS> https://github.com/w3c/rdf-star/issues/163
15:19:20 <AndyS> PR 167
15:19:46 <pchampin> AndyS: updated SPARQL grammar to allow << ... >> in expressions
15:20:05 <pchampin> ... and add corresponding test case
15:20:29 <pchampin> ... and a short section describing how to evaluate these expressions (refering to TRIPLE(...))
15:21:31 <pchampin> s/test case/negative test cases/
15:21:39 <gkellogg> +1 to merge
15:21:44 <pchampin> ... ready to merge in a few days
15:22:16 <AndyS> scribe: AndyS
15:22:18 <pchampin> q?
15:22:24 <AndyS> pchampin: other actions?
15:22:58 <AndyS> ... semantics PR in-progress
15:23:23 <pchampin> q?
15:23:43 <pchampin> zakim, next agendum
15:23:43 <Zakim> agendum 3 -- Moving to standard track -- taken up [from agendabot]
15:23:54 <pchampin> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-star/2021May/0015.html
15:24:23 <AndyS> pchampin: Summary of email: W3C suggests starting the chartering process soon as possible.
15:24:37 <AndyS> ... flow from CG(-like) to WG
15:24:52 <AndyS> ... do not give impression that the WG is a rubber stamp
15:25:40 <AndyS> ... Q1 : Are we OK with that?
15:26:10 <thomas> q+
15:26:15 <pchampin> ack thomas
15:26:56 <AndyS> thomas: Who will participate?
15:27:13 <ora> q+
15:27:27 <AndyS> (This is a W3C process question not specific to this WG)
15:28:16 <AndyS> pchampin: W3C member organisations nominate individuals.
15:28:33 <gkellogg> q+
15:29:01 <AndyS> phcampin: we can help with the charter text
15:29:14 <AndyS> ... and we need chairs
15:29:15 <pchampin> ack ora
15:29:43 <AndyS> ora: WG may have invited experts
15:29:45 <pchampin> https://www.w3.org/Consortium/Process/
15:29:55 <AndyS> q+
15:30:59 <AndyS> q-
15:32:20 <pchampin> ack gkellogg
15:32:49 <AndyS> gkellogg: IE at chairs' discretion
15:33:09 <AndyS> ... not bypass your own W3C member org
15:33:40 <AndyS> ... CG stands on its own. We will have a final report.
15:34:41 <pchampin> q?
15:34:41 <AndyS> ... (another another WG) ...
15:34:59 <AndyS> s/another another/about another/
15:35:31 <jbollema> q
15:35:35 <jbollema> q+
15:35:39 <ora> q+
15:35:46 <pchampin> ack jbollema
15:36:07 <AndyS> q+
15:36:29 <AndyS> jbollema: Do we need two WGs? - one for RDF, one for SPARQL.
15:36:58 <gkellogg> q+
15:37:35 <pchampin> scribe: pchampin
15:37:52 <pchampin> AndyS: in the past, some WG have modified other WG's documents
15:37:56 <TallTed> q+ to say it's all about the charter
15:38:16 <pchampin> ... there is a preference to have less WGs
15:38:44 <AndyS> pchampin: Both would be in scope - will check.
15:38:46 <ora> (Are we not using the queue anymore...?)
15:39:35 <AndyS> gkellog: Charter will list docs in-scope.
15:39:42 <pchampin> ack ora
15:39:46 <AndyS> q-
15:39:51 <gkellogg> q-
15:40:15 <AndyS> ora: Original RDF, RDFS got combined.
15:40:45 <AndyS> ora: There will be a delay - chartering, ramp up, IP review
15:40:52 <AndyS> q+
15:40:58 <thomas> are we talking months?
15:41:51 <AndyS> pchampin: because it will take time, is one reason to start chartering soon. And CG can continue while process proceeds.
15:42:04 <AndyS> thomas - yes
15:42:12 <pchampin> ack TallTed
15:42:12 <Zakim> TallTed, you wanted to say it's all about the charter
15:43:15 <AndyS> TallTed: Qs: "CG" input can taken at the point of WG-start-up. Wording in charter.
15:43:32 <gkellogg> q+
15:43:43 <AndyS> ... concern is this RDF 1.2, fork, RDF 2.
15:43:55 <ora> q+
15:44:16 <pchampin> ack AndyS
15:45:06 <gatemezing> +1 to TallTed on using the input of this work for the next WG
15:45:54 <pchampin> AndyS: there are RDF systems not supporting bnodes
15:46:14 <pchampin> ... we can live with RDF systems not supporting embedded triples.
15:46:30 <pchampin> ... The important point is that what we propose does not invalidated existing data.
15:46:39 <james> .. but ... it will invalidate applications
15:47:11 <pchampin> ack gkellogg
15:47:46 <AndyS> gkellogg: Not so much an either/or -- RDF 1.1 has generalized RDF graph.
15:48:41 <AndyS> ... key is updating docs  for abstract syntax or in "generalized" abstraction
15:48:58 <AndyS> ... AZ mentioned quoted graphs
15:49:07 <pchampin> ack ora
15:49:39 <AndyS> ora: concern what does this do to the wider community
15:50:20 <AndyS> ... we should pay attention to the adoption and presentation
15:50:21 <AndyS> q+
15:50:27 <pchampin> ack AndyS
15:51:06 <jbollema> AndyS Would chartering avoid implementers submit implementation reports
15:51:51 <jbollema> hope to make internal implementors experiments public.
15:52:03 <jbollema> hope to make internal implementors experiments public so that we can learn of it.
15:53:07 <pchampin> q?
15:53:59 <pchampin> pchampin: implementation reports might look like we just want to rubber stamp the existing spec
15:54:10 <pchampin> AndyS: this can be turned into something positive
15:55:20 <thomas> q+
15:55:41 <pchampin> ... implementation reports will inform the charter
15:55:47 <pchampin> ack thomas
15:57:35 <AndyS> thomas: who writes the charter?
15:58:11 <AndyS> pchampin: Usually W3C team member who will be team contact. Wide review and revision.
15:58:47 <AndyS> ... general agreement this is the way forward.
15:58:51 <pchampin> STRAWPOLL: let's write a charter draft
15:58:57 <jbollema> +1 for starting on a charter for a WG.
15:58:57 <pchampin> +1
15:59:01 <thomas> +1
15:59:01 <ora> +1
15:59:07 <AndyS> +1
15:59:08 <olaf> +1
15:59:09 <gkellogg> +1
15:59:11 <james> +1
15:59:12 <rivettp> +1
15:59:19 <TallTed> +1
16:01:17 <pchampin> q?
16:01:38 <pchampin> action: pchampin to create a repo for the charter
16:01:42 <william> +1
16:02:36 <pchampin> STRAWPOLL: have a call next week
16:02:40 <TallTed> +0
16:02:47 <pchampin> +0
16:02:48 <thomas> +0
16:02:51 <james> +0
16:02:51 <gkellogg> +0
16:02:52 <william> +0
16:02:55 <olaf> +0
16:03:03 <AndyS> +0
16:03:16 <rivettp> +1
16:03:57 <jbollema> +1
16:04:12 <william> thanks
16:04:16 <ora> bye
16:04:24 <TallTed> present+
16:04:25 <olaf> bye
16:04:28 <jbollema> bye and thanks
16:04:28 <olaf> olaf has left #rdf-star
16:04:32 <AndyS> zakim, end meeting
16:04:32 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been gkellogg, gatemezing, pchampin, james_, olaf, thomas, AndyS, TallTed, ora, james, rivettp
16:04:34 <Zakim> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
16:04:34 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/05/07-rdf-star-minutes.html Zakim
16:04:37 <Zakim> I am happy to have been of service, AndyS; please remember to excuse RRSAgent.  Goodbye
16:04:41 <Zakim> Zakim has left #rdf-star
16:04:50 <AndyS> rrsagent, please excuse us
16:04:50 <RRSAgent> I see 1 open action item saved in https://www.w3.org/2021/05/07-rdf-star-actions.rdf :
16:04:50 <RRSAgent> ACTION: pchampin to create a repo for the charter [1]
16:04:50 <RRSAgent>   recorded in https://www.w3.org/2021/05/07-rdf-star-irc#T16-01-38