13:58:50 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #sdw
13:58:50 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2021/02/04-sdw-irc
13:58:53 <Zakim> RRSAgent, make logs Public
13:58:54 <Zakim> please title this meeting ("meeting: ..."), ted
13:58:56 <ted> Chair: Linda, Jeremy
13:59:00 <ted> Scribe: Ted
13:59:02 <ted> scribenick: ted
13:59:09 <brinkwoman> regrets: Scott
13:59:11 <ted> Meeting: Spatial Data on the Web
14:00:14 <ted> Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-sdwig/2021Jan/0085.html
14:00:54 <billroberts> billroberts has joined #sdw
14:01:08 <ted> Present+ Linda, Jo, Emily, Ted, Andrea, RobS
14:01:21 <ted> agenda+ Responsible use note feedback and next steps
14:01:31 <ted> agenda+ Discussion on defining Convenience APIs with OGC Architecture Board members
14:01:32 <billroberts> just persuading webex to start.  Will be with you imminently I hope!
14:02:02 <ted> agenda+ AOB (WoT, OWL Time...)
14:02:14 <AndreaPerego> AndreaPerego has joined #sdw
14:02:15 <ted> present+ Peter
14:02:20 <AndreaPerego> present+
14:02:28 <ted> present+ Bill
14:02:54 <ted> present- Andrea
14:03:24 <MichaelGordon> MichaelGordon has joined #sdw
14:03:37 <RobSmith> RobSmith has joined #sdw
14:03:39 <ted> present+ Fran, MichaelG, Jeremy
14:04:53 <ted> Emily shares screen
14:05:00 <ted> zakim, next agendum
14:05:00 <Zakim> agendum 1 -- Responsible use note feedback and next steps -- taken up [from ted]
14:05:16 <ted> Fran: Emily, Jo, Rob and I worked on this document
14:05:46 <ted> … Ed as well, a diverse group of contributors
14:06:15 <PeterR> PeterR has joined #sdw
14:06:17 <ted> … we want to share the note at a high level and solicit feedback
14:06:27 <PeterR> present+
14:06:27 <brinkwoman> regrets+ Clara
14:06:40 <ted> … we also want people to promote this note to a wider audience
14:06:49 <ted> … please direct feedback to github
14:08:10 <ted> … we note we have a western bias and want more global input, aided by your sharing of the document
14:08:26 <ted> … spatial data has special characteristics requiring careful treatment
14:09:03 <ted> … situations and data points vary but the principles are general
14:09:28 <ted> … this is for end users, developers and those using the data
14:10:19 <brinkwoman> Shared link: https://w3c.github.io/sdw/responsible-use/
14:10:38 <brinkwoman> Published FPWD is at https://www.w3.org/TR/responsible-use-spatial/
14:10:40 <ted> … we want to give a quick tour, time permitted
14:11:08 <ted> … why spatial is special, existing [legal, other] frameworks, principles to follow
14:11:51 <ted> … this audience already understands the importance of this, new concept to others
14:11:52 <cperey> cperey has joined #sdw
14:12:11 <cperey> present+ Christine_Perey
14:12:15 <ted> … we explain some of the legal frameworks which are as mentioned western oriented, eg GDPR, CPAA...
14:12:35 <ted> … we want more geographic diversity on frameworks
14:12:51 <ted> … concepts like right to access data, right to be forgotten are explained in the note
14:13:22 <ted> … besides government there are corporate, group and other ethical frameworks
14:13:55 <ted> … UNICEF has a fairly large one for operating their drones evaluating developing areas
14:14:11 <ted> … most frameworks do not address spatial data in detail though
14:14:34 <ted> Emily: the note is aiming to show how to use location data ethically and responsibly
14:16:10 <PeterR> lots of chop
14:17:02 <brinkwoman> better
14:17:50 <ted> … we wrote from three perspectives, user, developer and regulator
14:18:09 <ted> … these [slide] are the main values/principles we wanted to cover
14:18:27 <ted> … data collection should be voluntary, there should be clear consent
14:18:50 <ted> … we added some guiding questions: do I need to store the location data? if so for how long?...
14:19:11 <ted> … from a user perspective Rob came up with some helpful icons
14:19:58 <ted> … from regulators perspective we encourage them to have bar as high as possible and consequences for breaching
14:20:22 <ted> … this is still an early version and expect considerable changes
14:20:55 <ClemensPortele> ClemensPortele has joined #sdw
14:21:32 <ted> Chris: one principle from GDPR I didn't see covered is portability
14:21:38 <ClemensPortele> present+ ClemensPortele
14:22:02 <ted> … portability to your own data, to be able to bring your data with you to new platforms
14:22:22 <ted> … this should be part of the ethical use
14:22:28 <ted> Fran: agree, it should be there
14:22:44 <ted> Present+ Chris
14:22:48 <ted> Jo: missed in review
14:22:56 <ted> Chris: that's another beer you owe me :)
14:23:07 <ted> present+ Cheazel
14:23:25 <ted> Fran: any other questions for now?
14:23:28 <brinkwoman> q?
14:23:41 <ted> Linda: how widely do you want it shared at this early stage?
14:23:45 <ted> Emily: as widely as possible
14:24:14 <jtandy> jtandy has joined #sdw
14:24:21 <ted> Jo: most of the points we wanted to cover are there, certainly more to add but want to start the conversation
14:24:22 <jtandy> present+ jtandy
14:24:32 <jtandy> q+
14:25:14 <jtandy> q?
14:25:20 <ted> Chris: one of the things I found helpful about GDPR was their guiding principles and clear, separate set of individual rights
14:25:36 <ted> Fran: users generally don't know their rights
14:25:49 <ted> … this should be governed more by ethos than law
14:26:12 <ted> Jeremy: great work bringing this to FPWD
14:26:29 <ted> … timing is great and intend to leverage for IoT data project proposal
14:26:43 <ted> … especially important with smart home devices
14:26:52 <ted> … I'll provide feedback I get
14:27:49 <ted> Fran: applying to specific situations will be beneficial
14:28:00 <ted> Jo: Ted, how do we ping PING?
14:28:26 <RobSmith> Christine Runnegar
14:29:50 <jtandy> q?
14:31:07 <ted> s/Ted, how do we ping PING?/Ted, PING pinged me on W3C Auto
14:31:21 <ted> Ted rambles somewhat sensically @@link to issue
14:31:23 <ted> zakim, next agendum
14:31:23 <Zakim> agendum 2 -- Discussion on defining Convenience APIs with OGC Architecture Board members -- taken up [from ted]
14:32:28 <ted> Linda: Chuck can you introduce yourself and give us update on OAB Convenience API
14:32:53 <ted> Chuck: I'm concerned we are defining concepts without broader context, including these separate Convenience APIs
14:33:09 <ted> … we have a division between data provider and user perspectives
14:33:54 <ted> … a Convenience API is similar to analysis ready data
14:34:36 <ted> … provider has to deal with unanticipated user. user wants as few variables as possible enabled by API
14:34:59 <ClemensPortele> q+
14:35:00 <jtandy> q+
14:35:02 <ted> … we are not discussing necessarily humans performing the analysis
14:35:18 <brinkwoman> ack next
14:35:48 <ted> Clemens: we mention Convenience API in our Best Practices document and raised issue recently
14:36:00 <ted> … these are very broad, generic APIs
14:36:50 <ted> … on the web, APIs are usually more specific for a given problem
14:37:54 <ted> @@
14:38:38 <brinkwoman> ack next
14:38:41 <brinkwoman> q?
14:39:31 <ted> Jeremy: Convenience API useful for coverage or feature. consumer versus provider perspective helps
14:39:56 <ted> … they are typically tailored to specific uses
14:40:13 <ted> … as Clemens said, most things being created at OGC are convenience APIs
14:40:21 <MichaelGordon> q+
14:40:23 <billroberts> q+
14:40:50 <ted> q+ Chris
14:41:05 <ted> zakim, next agendum
14:41:06 <Zakim> I see a speaker queue remaining and respectfully decline to close this agendum, ted
14:41:54 <ted> Michael: these APIs are for making things simpler and easier, not necessarily tailored to specific use
14:42:11 <ted> … they make interaction with data easier and improve understanding
14:42:26 <ted> … they are usually designed towards the underlying data
14:42:54 <ted> … for a specific set of use cases
14:43:19 <ted> … there are differences with generic APIs, convenience APIs more structured to the use cases
14:44:03 <ted> Chuck: consider API features and coverages to EDR model
14:44:18 <ted> … there may be processing of data before exposing through API
14:44:23 <jtandy> q?
14:44:46 <ClemensPortele> q+ to talk about publisher/user centric
14:45:37 <ted> Bill: problem with purpose specific APIs is discovering them
14:46:00 <ted> … what are the most popular use cases and how are they addressed with a generic API
14:46:21 <ted> … they could be simple mappings or documentation on how to use the generic for specific uses
14:46:56 <ted> Chuck: that is the hard part of the problem. it is great to say something is user focused but you need clear understanding of what their needs are
14:47:25 <ted> … how much can you standardize a convenience API if it is provider focused instead of user centric?
14:47:32 <brinkwoman> ack next
14:48:22 <ted> Chris: issue is what is in the eye of the beholder - perspective being addressed
14:49:17 <ted> … data can be discrete or categorical. where do you draw dividing lines in a modular approach?
14:49:25 <ted> Chuck: proper scoping helps address it
14:49:49 <ted> Linda: a key part is convenience API is for a set of use cases, making it easier for non-experts to use the data
14:49:53 <Zakim> ClemensPortele, you wanted to talk about publisher/user centric
14:51:27 <ted> Clemens: there are just different types of users
14:51:43 <ted> … drawing borders is a fine line, not necessarily user or provider specific perspective
14:52:49 <ted> Chuck: an API can simplify beyond the modules used to define it
14:53:09 <ted> … API can find considerable detail
14:53:12 <jtandy> q?
14:53:15 <ted> s/find/hide/
14:53:39 <ted> … need clear understanding of space being defined
14:53:40 <jtandy> q+
14:53:53 <ted> Linda: do you have draft definitions?
14:54:00 <clittle> clittle has joined #sdw
14:54:08 <ted> Chuck: I have some ideas but wanted to get input before putting them down
14:54:11 <brinkwoman> ack next
14:54:13 <clittle> present+ clittle
14:54:44 <ted> Jeremy: hope discussion today has informed your thinking. we would be happy to review candidate definition
14:54:58 <josephabhayaratna> josephabhayaratna has joined #sdw
14:55:16 <ted> Chuck: I want to take convenience APIs, EDR, ADE, other APIs and put them together in some abstract architecture and see how they come together
14:55:40 <ted> … goal is to create a federated cloud for analytics, how does each component play into that?
14:55:54 <jtandy> q?
14:56:40 <ted> Jeremy: one of the things we wanted to do from Chairs perspective, Linda, Ted and I took another pass at refining the charter
14:56:52 <ted> … moving from an Interest Group to Working Group
14:57:04 <ted> … we know we are not in 2020 but look past that in URI
14:57:15 <ted> https://w3c.github.io/sdw/roadmap/charter-2020.html
14:57:42 <ted> … scope was refined, deliverables moved around a bit
14:58:29 <ted> … plan for Time OWL is to roll extensions into main spec
14:58:46 <RobSmith> q+
14:58:57 <ted> Linda: any final anouncements?
14:59:35 <ted> Action: Chuck to bring definitions back to group
14:59:35 <trackbot> Sorry, but no Tracker is associated with this channel.
14:59:40 <jtandy> q?
14:59:43 <brinkwoman> ack next
14:59:50 <AndreaPerego> q+ to ask about updates on SDWBP wrt DCAT2
15:00:00 <ted> RobS: I've been working in OGC testbed 16 and published a video since last meeting
15:00:17 <RobSmith> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j9ayV2_gskY
15:00:17 <brinkwoman> ack next
15:00:18 <Zakim> AndreaPerego, you wanted to ask about updates on SDWBP wrt DCAT2
15:01:20 <ted> Andrea: is SDWBP being updated to try to fill in some gaps with DCAT2?
15:01:21 <brinkwoman> https://github.com/w3c/sdw/issues/1084
15:01:45 <ted> Jeremy: Clara has that within her scope, please provide feedback in github on examples you want to see clarified
15:02:32 <jtandy> q?
15:02:41 <ted> … you can create a patch for consideration?
15:02:43 <ted> Andrea: yes
15:02:44 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/02/04-sdw-minutes.html ted
15:02:47 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees have been Linda, Jo, Emily, Ted, Andrea, RobS, Peter, AndreaPerego, Bill, Fran, MichaelG, Jeremy, PeterR, Christine_Perey, ClemensPortele,
15:02:47 <Zakim> Zakim has left #sdw
15:02:49 <clittle> bye
15:02:51 <RRSAgent> I see 1 open action item saved in https://www.w3.org/2021/02/04-sdw-actions.rdf :
15:02:51 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Chuck to bring definitions back to group [1]
15:02:51 <RRSAgent>   recorded in https://www.w3.org/2021/02/04-sdw-irc#T14-59-35