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13:44:42 <tidoust> Meeting: Media WG Call
14:01:52 <tidoust> Present+ Jer_Noble, Joey_Parrish, Peng_Liu, Francois_Daoust
14:01:59 <tidoust> Chair: Jer, Mounir
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14:02:10 <tidoust> Agenda: https://github.com/w3c/media-wg/blob/master/meetings/2020-06-09-Media_Working_Group_Teleconference-agenda.md
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14:03:04 <mounir> Present+ Mounir_Lamouri
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14:03:32 <tidoust> Present+ Andreas_Tai, Gary_Katsevman, Nigel_Megitt
14:05:04 <tidoust> present+ Chris_Needham, Tess_O_Connor, Simon_Thompson
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14:06:25 <tidoust> scribe: tidoust
14:06:33 <tidoust> Topic: Update about TPAC
14:07:09 <tidoust> mounir: We resolved to have a joint discussion with WebCodecs. TPAC has been moved to a fully virtual conference.
14:07:21 <hober> present+
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14:07:59 <tidoust> tidoust: Group can choose to meet at any time, not necessarily tied to TPAC.
14:08:45 <tidoust> tess: It might smart to try to time a vritual F2F at least 2 weeks away from TPAC, if not more. The virtual TPAC will be likely focused on meetings that span multiple groups, as the usual Wednesday.
14:08:53 <tidoust> mounir: This sounds good, thank you.
14:09:27 <tidoust> ... I think we should keep our usual schedule.
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14:09:50 <tidoust> ... Also organize a meeting with WebCodecs folks around TPAC.
14:10:29 <tidoust> cpn: That sounds good. Note I'm planning to invite WebCodecs folks to the Media & Entertainment IG next month or so. Everyone here would be most welcome.
14:10:52 <hober> s/tess/hober/
14:11:08 <tidoust> Topic: Debrief in CTA WAVE on Media Capabilities
14:11:28 <hober> s/as the usual Wednesday/as the usual Wednesday. I think we should aim for a F2F a month out from TPAC./
14:11:43 <tidoust> jernoble: I was invited to the CTA WAVE organization. There is overlap in participation between organizations.
14:12:19 <tidoust> ... They are trying to write a polyfill that, given a piece of media, will pull out the properties of the media and convert them into a request for Media Capabilities.
14:12:27 <jernoble> https://github.com/cta-wave/Media-Capability-APIs/issues
14:12:45 <tidoust> ... They identified properties that cannot be queried through Media Capabilities.
14:13:14 <tidoust> ... I tried to clarify with them design considerations, including fingerprinting issues.
14:14:03 <tidoust> ... MPEG Codec Independent Point collects properties from a bunch of codecs, including properties that have not been captured in Media Capabilities.
14:14:20 <tidoust> ... What I expect to come out of that is a bunch of issues against our Media Capabilities.
14:14:56 <tidoust> ... A liaison statement from our group to the CTA WAVE could be an option, to cover cases where CTA participants cannot directly contribute to W3C.
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14:15:29 <tidoust> Topic: Triage MSE/EME issues
14:15:34 <mounir> scribe: mounir
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14:16:04 <mounir> tidoust: there are a bunch of open issues for MSE and EME, most are accumulated historical issues
14:16:25 <mounir> tidoust: some of them have been flagged when they were in HTLM WG but many of these flags are no longer relevant as part of this group
14:16:42 <wolenetz> q+ I'm here to assist with MSE triage
14:16:43 <mounir> tidoust: we should update these flags so they better reflect what the Media WG is planning to work or not
14:16:59 <mounir> tidoust: I'm not the right person to do that but happy to help
14:17:18 <mounir> tidoust: I would like to make sure it's clear internally and externally what we are working on
14:17:32 <mounir> ack wolenetz
14:18:19 <tidoust> wolenetz: A lot of open issues are trivial, some of them are relevant. No editors from Microsoft for now?
14:18:33 <tidoust> mounir: Last time we asked, they said they would have no editors for MSE.
14:19:02 <mounir> scribe: tidoust
14:19:23 <tidoust> wolenetz: So 2 editors for MSE vNext. Mark Watson and myself. We could take the time on the call, but Mark is not around. I'll sync up with him.
14:19:55 <tidoust> ... If there are issues that you believe should be addressed for vNext, add a comment to them.
14:20:34 <tidoust> ... Right now, "vNext" is the spec we're working on right now. We should probably have a "v2" label.
14:20:48 <tidoust> ... 45 of the open issues don't even have a milestone yet.
14:21:19 <tidoust> ... Joey, from the EME side, will do the same thing for EME.
14:21:50 <tidoust> mounir: One of the ask is to differentiate what is the new vNext and what will be postponed to the future.
14:22:01 <tidoust> wolenetz: sounds good.
14:22:12 <nigel> q+
14:22:31 <tidoust> Topic: Media Playback Quality
14:22:46 <peng> https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues
14:22:59 <wolenetz> MSE issue tracker: https://github.com/w3c/media-source/issues
14:23:02 <nigel> q-
14:23:25 <tidoust> mounir: We are at the stage where we could go to a FPWD. Also, we had some feedback from folks that this spec should be merged in the HTML spec. Is it something that people feel strongly about one way or the other?
14:23:28 <jernoble> q+
14:23:40 <tidoust> ack jernoble
14:24:05 <tidoust> jernoble: I don't have a strong feeling one way or the other. It is such a small spec that it probably belongs to the HTML spec.
14:24:29 <wolenetz> EME issue tracker: I think it is at https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues (joeyparrish@google.com would know best)
14:24:31 <tidoust> ... Unless we take over the whole media section of the HTML spec, I think it fits well with the video section in the HTML spec.
14:25:02 <tidoust> mounir: Are you aware of any change compared to what's in the spec?
14:25:07 <tidoust> jernoble: Not aware of any.
14:25:31 <tidoust> mounir: We also have an open issue about what to do with the whole media section, but no update on that so far.
14:25:42 <tidoust> ... What would be the best way to proceed?
14:26:09 <wolenetz> q+
14:26:14 <tidoust> ... It's an official deliverable of the WG.
14:26:31 <tidoust> ... Should we resolve to take the spec to HTML LS?
14:26:38 <nigel> -> https://w3c.github.io/media-playback-quality/ Media Playback Quality
14:26:56 <tidoust> tidoust: Sounds like a good first step. I'll check internally possible other needed steps.
14:26:57 <nigel> q+
14:27:03 <mounir> ack wolenetz
14:27:08 <mounir> ack nigel
14:27:11 <tidoust> wolenetz: I note that MSE references Media Playback Quality.
14:27:22 <tidoust> ... with a non-normative link.
14:28:08 <tidoust> nigel: We're talking about FPWD for this but it already has some deprecated feature in it. How do you plan to deal with it?
14:28:28 <tidoust> ... Having a deprecated feature in a spec that has never been published for real seems weird.
14:28:51 <tidoust> mounir: This used to be part of MSE, and was in the FPWD of MSE.
14:29:03 <tidoust> ... The section got pruned to its own spec on the way to Rec.
14:29:34 <tidoust> ... That property is still available in some browsers, so we need to keep the property around to explain the situation.
14:30:48 <mounir> RESOLUTION: send an official vote to check what the WG wants to do with regards to merging the specification
14:31:11 <tidoust> Topic: Picture-in-Picture
14:31:31 <tidoust> mounir: Implemented by Apple and Google. We have most of what we need to move to CR.
14:31:52 <tidoust> ... Most open issues can probably be marked with a vNext flag.
14:32:07 <tidoust> ... Only one to solve is naming issue on pseudo-class.
14:32:12 <jernoble> q+
14:32:16 <tidoust> ... I wanted to check how people felt about moving to CR?
14:32:20 <tidoust> ack jernoble
14:32:24 <cpn> q+ (later) to mention video-* media queries
14:32:44 <tidoust> jernoble: Off the top of my head, I don't know of any feature that Apple is willing to see added to the spec before it goes to CR.
14:33:09 <tidoust> mounir: OK, I'll check with François Beaufort. We may need to check the test suite.
14:33:16 <mounir> ack cpn
14:33:25 <tidoust> topic: Video-* media queries
14:33:43 <tidoust> cpn: I wanted to mention briefly that the CSS WG has some of the video-* media queries on their agenda.
14:33:53 <nigel> q+
14:33:56 <tidoust> ... video-width and video-height.
14:34:06 <tidoust> ... Please do join the call if you're interested in those.
14:34:22 <tidoust> jernoble: This is the video-* prefixed viewport width and height, right?
14:34:25 <tidoust> cpn: That's right.
14:34:48 <mounir> ack nigel
14:34:52 <tidoust> ... Two parts to the media capabilities story. The API talks about the decoding capability, and CSS media display rendering capabilities.
14:34:59 <mounir> ack (later)
14:34:59 <Zakim> (later), you wanted to mention video-* media queries
14:35:23 <tidoust> nigel: I think it is crucial for people in this group to make sure that their needs are captured by the envisioned CSS media queries.
14:35:50 <jernoble> q+
14:35:55 <tidoust> ack jernoble
14:36:21 <tidoust> jernoble: Tess, do you have the relevant context? Or would you want me to show up in the CSS WG?
14:36:45 <tidoust> tess: Either way. You're welcome to join.
14:37:05 <tidoust> jernoble: OK, we'll coordinate offline to make sure the Media WG gets represented.
14:37:11 <tidoust> cpn: Nigel and I will be there as well.
14:37:39 <tidoust> jernoble: This query is really for devices that have different plane capabilities for video and graphics. Set-top boxes and TVs in practice, right?
14:37:42 <tidoust> cpn: That's right.
14:38:36 <tidoust> RRSAgent, draft minutes v2
14:38:36 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2020/06/09-mediawg-minutes.html tidoust
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14:41:12 <tidoust> Present+ Matt_Wolenetz, Eric_Carlson
14:43:05 <tidoust> RRSAgent, draft minutes v2
14:43:05 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2020/06/09-mediawg-minutes.html tidoust
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