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15:27:19 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2020/02/18-did-irc
15:27:21 <Zakim> RRSAgent, make logs Public
15:27:22 <Zakim> please title this meeting ("meeting: ..."), ivan
15:27:33 <ivan> Meeting: DID Working Group Telco
15:27:34 <ivan> Chair: burn
15:27:34 <ivan> Date: 2020-02-18
15:27:34 <ivan> Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-did-wg/2020Feb/0025.html
15:27:34 <ivan> ivan has changed the topic to: Meeting Agenda 2020-02-118: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-did-wg/2020Feb/0025.html
15:50:57 <burn> burn has joined #did
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15:59:04 <ivan> present+
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16:00:39 <chriswinc> present+
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16:01:22 <markus_sabadello> present+
16:01:25 <manu> present+
16:01:29 <dlongley> present+
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16:02:28 <jonathan_holt> present+ jonathan_holt
16:02:33 <Orie> present+
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16:02:39 <agropper> present+
16:03:01 <ken> present+
16:03:12 <dmitriz> present+
16:03:37 <ken> scribe+
16:03:39 <ivan> present+ chriswinc
16:03:43 <burn> Topic: Agenda Review, Introductions, Re-introductions
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16:03:55 <ken> dan: Agenda for today is simple.
16:03:55 <JoeAndrieu> present+
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16:04:04 <ivan> present+ jonathan_holt
16:04:09 <ken> ... Working mode, and then issues.
16:04:16 <ken> ... Questions or changes?
16:04:16 <manu> q+
16:04:20 <burn> ack manu
16:04:33 <ken> manu: Updates on registry doc.
16:04:44 <brent> brent has joined #did
16:04:50 <brent> present+
16:04:57 <ivan> present+ agropper
16:05:08 <ken> ... A lot of changes and we would feedback to editors on where we should be working.
16:05:11 <ivan> present+ joel
16:05:22 <ken> s/dan/burn/
16:05:29 <ken> burn: Introductions?
16:05:53 <drummond> drummond has joined #did
16:05:57 <drummond> present+
16:06:00 <burn> Topic: Editorial team for new docs
16:06:25 <ken> burn: Several new documents were created as holding places for new discussions.
16:06:46 <selfissued> q+
16:06:53 <ken> ... Implementation guide, registry. We need editors
16:06:54 <ivan> present+ selfissued
16:07:01 <kimhd> kimhd has joined #did
16:07:08 <ivan> present+ sumita
16:07:16 <ken> ... In the case of the registry doc, Orie volunteered along with Manu.
16:07:19 <burn> q?
16:07:26 <burn> ack selfissued
16:07:33 <kimhd> present+ kimhd
16:07:37 <ken> ... If others volunteer we could make adjustments.
16:07:53 <ken> selfissued: There are likely to be more than one registry.
16:08:16 <ivan> present+ gannan
16:08:35 <ivan> present+ kaliya
16:08:36 <ken> burn: There has been some disagreement on the number of registries. When I say registry I mean registry or registries or registry mechanisms.
16:08:54 <ken> selfissued: Terminology is important.
16:09:08 <ken> burn: Yes. We should discuss the mechanism.
16:09:22 <burn> q?
16:09:23 <ken> ... We need a place for the discussion.
16:09:48 <Orie> I nominate daniel b from microsoft and sam smith
16:09:58 <ken> ... We are looking for people to be editors on the other documents. If you are interested, please contact the chairs.
16:10:25 <ken> ... I see people making nominations.
16:10:38 <burn> Topic: Group work mode
16:11:02 <ken> burn: We have some big decisions to make. We need to get into more detail.
16:11:18 <ken> ... We need to switch into a more detailed work mode.
16:11:26 <ken> ... Please write pull requests.
16:11:29 <deiu> present+ Andrei_Sambra
16:11:45 <selfissued> q+
16:11:46 <ken> ... Editors will merge PRs when they believe there is consensus.
16:12:03 <ken> ... Please object within two days if you disagree.
16:12:20 <ken> ... If there is not consensus, the editors will back out changes.
16:12:46 <ken> ... Don't quit, or be upset. Let the chairs know if there is not consensus.
16:13:03 <drummond> Yeah, we'll be more productive if we don't live in fear :-)
16:13:14 <ken> ... We want to move faster, but not try to push things through.
16:13:36 <ken> ... On the calls, we will review status, not do the detailed work of each issue.
16:13:51 <ken> ... Issues are assigned to someone to push the work forward.
16:13:54 <dlongley> q?
16:14:06 <manu> q+ to note Editors auto-assigning issues to people.
16:14:19 <ken> ... If an issue sits with no progress, we may suggest closing the issue.
16:14:34 <jonathan_holt> q+
16:14:36 <ken> ... Work needs to move forward between calls.
16:14:54 <ken> ... Watch the repos that you are interested in.
16:14:55 <ivan> regrets+ dezell
16:15:03 <drummond> +1 to Orie's point
16:15:29 <ken> ... Anything with discussion will remain in discussion until resolution.
16:15:38 <burn> q?
16:15:41 <burn> ack selfissued
16:15:44 <ken> ... Make PRs to get your changes in.
16:16:03 <ken> selfissued: I request that weekends be excluded from the two days.
16:16:06 <JoeAndrieu> +1 to business days
16:16:11 <gannan> +1 for excluding weekends
16:16:15 <drummond> +1 to 2 business days
16:16:15 <kimhd> that seems reasonable
16:16:28 <ken> burn: I agree. Two business days is the guideline.
16:16:59 <ken> ... Editors should ensure that those who have concerns should be sought out for feedback.
16:17:14 <ken> ... Don't try to sneak things in.
16:17:26 <drummond> -1 to ever "sneaking anything past anyone"
16:17:32 <dlongley> +1 to no sneaking
16:17:45 <ken> ... We don't want to overrun people's concerns.
16:17:55 <dlongley> +1 to benefit of the doubt on good faith of editors
16:18:06 <ken> ... If you will be gone, let the editors know so that your concerns can be addressed.
16:18:09 <burn> q?
16:18:11 <burn> ack manu
16:18:11 <Zakim> manu, you wanted to note Editors auto-assigning issues to people.
16:18:14 <brent> q+ to stand on a soapbox and preach the good word of writing PRs
16:18:30 <ken> manu: (no audio)
16:18:31 <burn> ack jonathan_holt
16:18:32 <manu> q+  note Editors auto-assigning issues to people.
16:18:43 <dlongley> q?
16:18:46 <dlongley> q+ manu
16:19:32 <ken> jonathan_holt: I appreciate the need to move forward. I raised issues a long time ago in Barcelona. As an invited expert, I have added thoughts, but this is not my full-time gig.
16:20:07 <ken> ... I am trying to guide the discussion, but don't have all the time I need to contribute.
16:20:51 <drummond> This is my life!!!
16:20:59 <ken> burn: All of us have differing time constraints. There are companies who need to implement this, and need to make progress.
16:21:14 <ken> ... The editors have to review all the issues and PRs every week.
16:21:25 <burn> q?
16:21:28 <burn> ack brent
16:21:28 <Zakim> brent, you wanted to stand on a soapbox and preach the good word of writing PRs
16:21:36 <ken> ... Please do your best. We are all busy and we need to do the best we can.
16:22:11 <ken> brent: Every in the group, please create PRs. Even if they are not perfect, the editorial team will help.
16:22:18 <ken> ... Be the change you want to see.
16:22:19 <burn> ack manu
16:22:31 <ken> manu: (no audio)
16:22:54 <burn> q?
16:23:01 <burn> zakim, close the queue
16:23:01 <Zakim> ok, burn, the speaker queue is closed
16:23:17 <ken> manu: We are auto-assigning issues. If you raise the issue and you are in the WG, you will likely be assigned.
16:23:39 <ken> ... For those outside the group, the editors will use best judgement to make assignments.
16:23:40 <brent> if someone WANTS to work on an issue to which they are not assigned, they can also be assigned
16:23:43 <burn> zakim, open the queue
16:23:43 <Zakim> ok, burn, the speaker queue is open
16:23:55 <burn> Topic: Issue status check
16:24:04 <burn> https://github.com/w3c/did-core/issues?q=is%3Aissue+is%3Aopen+sort%3Aupdated-asc
16:24:15 <ken> burn: Here is a link to the did-core repo.
16:24:25 <ken> ... It is sorted by progress.
16:24:55 <ken> ... The goal is to move issues forward.
16:25:23 <burn> https://github.com/w3c/did-core/issues/33
16:25:45 <ken> ... dmitriz?
16:25:54 <ken> ... What needs to happen>
16:26:29 <ken> dmitriz: I think this is out of scope but migration is in scope.
16:26:43 <ken> ... Chaining for delegation should be discussed.
16:27:08 <ken> ... I think the issue should be rephrased or a more narrow issue created.
16:27:26 <ken> burn: I recommend that you write what you said into the issue.
16:27:36 <ken> ... Orie has jumped in.
16:27:59 <burn> https://github.com/w3c/did-core/issues/35
16:29:21 <ken> drummond: I feel that we should be settling on matrix parameters first.
16:29:55 <ken> ... Are we keeping the current syntax or query parameter?
16:30:11 <ken> ... I'll add a comment.
16:30:19 <markus_sabadello> Depends on resolution of https://github.com/w3c/did-core/issues/159
16:30:37 <burn> https://github.com/w3c/did-core/issues/64
16:30:56 <burn> q?
16:31:03 <dmitriz> one second having trouble unmuting
16:31:08 <jonathan_holt> q+
16:31:57 <ken> dmitriz: I'll add a comment recommending closing this issue with reasons.
16:32:00 <jonathan_holt> q-
16:32:04 <ivan> q+
16:32:15 <ivan> q-
16:32:22 <ken> manu: Should issues be marked as pending close first?
16:32:39 <ken> burn: That would reflect an editor's opinion.
16:32:44 <brent> dmitri opened this, so should he be able to just close it?
16:32:51 <drummond> +1 to editors marking issues as "pending close"
16:32:53 <ken> ... dmitriz is not an editor; it would be his opinion.
16:32:55 <ivan> q+
16:32:59 <burn> ack ivan
16:33:28 <ken> ivan: "Suggest close" label?
16:33:51 <ken> burn: We will discuss how to do this with the editors and chairs.
16:34:10 <ken> ... Rules, etc.
16:34:17 <burn> https://github.com/w3c/did-core/issues/20
16:35:48 <ken> selfissued: My question stands. I think we should close it.
16:36:44 <ken> burn: Michael is not a member of the WG, please add @name to let him know that he needs to respond.
16:37:14 <ken> ... That will be a courtesy notice to him.
16:37:36 <ken> selfissued: I can do that.
16:37:59 <burn> https://github.com/w3c/did-core/issues/25
16:38:56 <ken> drummond: This feels like it should be attended to as editorial.
16:39:33 <ken> burn: Please add a comment that says that and see if there is any disagreement.
16:39:42 <ken> ... Everything needs a PR.
16:40:02 <ivan> q+
16:40:06 <ken> drummond:  I will do this.
16:40:08 <burn> https://github.com/w3c/did-core/issues/36
16:40:14 <burn> ack ivan
16:40:56 <JoeAndrieu> -1 to auto-close
16:41:04 <ken> ivan: Github usage; if drummond writes "fixes #25" in the PR then it will be automatically close the issue.
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16:41:14 <Tom_S__USAA_> present+
16:41:33 <manu> q+
16:41:43 <burn> ack manu
16:41:47 <ken> burn: Sometimes a PR submitter puts "fixes 25" but there is additional discussion in the issue, then the other work will be lost.
16:41:52 <justin> -1 to auto-close. Issues can be re-opened but that's a problem
16:42:04 <burn> -1 to auto-close
16:42:26 <ken> manu: Editors should scan for the this corner case to ensure that the PR really does fix all of the issue.
16:42:32 <burn> q+ to talk about trackability
16:42:52 <justin> q+ to talk about issue tracking/linking on github
16:43:12 <burn> ack burn
16:43:12 <Zakim> burn, you wanted to talk about trackability
16:43:15 <ken> ... I would encourage highly focused PRs so that we can truly address a single issue and the "fixes 25" is accurate.
16:43:37 <ken> ... It is an extra burden for the editors, but useful functionality.
16:43:55 <ken> burn: Closed issues can be re=opened if there is a mistake.
16:44:04 <burn> ack justin
16:44:04 <Zakim> justin, you wanted to talk about issue tracking/linking on github
16:44:32 <Orie> +1 to linking...
16:44:40 <brent> +1 to "addresses" for linking
16:44:42 <drummond> +1 to linking
16:44:53 <ken> justin: I have a lot of experience with github managing issues. We have used "addresses" because it creates a link without taking automatic action.
16:45:06 <ken> ... Also works to reference PRs.
16:45:07 <burn> +1 to "addresses" for linking
16:45:14 <burn> q?
16:45:15 <manu> -1 to addresses, but I won't stand in the way of the group.
16:45:18 <ken> ... The automatic actions are problematic.
16:45:48 <ken> ... Narrow PRs are good, but often issues are broad and tend to expand.
16:46:08 <manu> The Editor's process is designed to work well with the Fix #XYZ mechanism.
16:46:23 <justin> to be clear, there's nothing special about "addresses", it's just readable
16:46:30 <manu> (but again, I won't stand in the way of the group -- it creates more work for the Editors)
16:46:30 <burn> https://github.com/w3c/did-core/issues/36
16:46:30 <ken> burn: Please don't use "fixes" or "closes". Please do link with "addresses" or something else.
16:47:08 <ken> drummond: this is the same status as dlongley has commented.
16:48:00 <brent> perhaps there could be a "Depends on Matrix Parameters" label?
16:48:10 <burn> https://github.com/w3c/did-core/issues/55
16:48:25 <ken> burn: Please add content to issues, not just comments that will show an update without progress.
16:49:15 <ken> selfissued: I think we should remove all instances of ethereum addresses from the spec and close this issue.
16:49:41 <Orie> q+ to discuss registry blockers for issues...
16:49:46 <ken> burn: I think there will be some interesting discussion in this issue.
16:49:52 <burn> q?
16:50:22 <ken> Orie: There will be issues around "where is this term defined?"
16:50:48 <ken> ... I think there will be discussion around where the definitions are stored.
16:51:37 <burn> https://github.com/w3c/did-core/issues/14
16:51:43 <ken> burn: I think it is important to distinguish between comments as an editor and comments as an individual contributor.
16:52:10 <jonathan_holt> q+
16:52:38 <ken> ... None of those assigned is present today.
16:52:50 <ken> ... I'll ping them all!
16:52:52 <burn> q?
16:52:56 <burn> ack Orie
16:52:56 <Zakim> Orie, you wanted to discuss registry blockers for issues...
16:53:04 <burn> ack jonathan_holt
16:53:12 <jonathan_holt> q-
16:53:26 <ken> jonathan_holt: I think this should be a revocation methodology, not just a list.
16:53:37 <burn> https://github.com/w3c/did-core/issues/5
16:53:38 <ken> burn: Please add that to the issue.
16:54:23 <ken> ivan: We had a discussion before the f2f. We arrived at a tentative decision, but manu had some concerns.
16:54:51 <ken> manu: I'm happy to close if there is no objection to the URL that has been selected.
16:55:07 <ken> ... We need a versioning and caching strategy for the group.
16:55:35 <ken> burn: Ivan please add your opinion. Manu please add your concerns.
16:55:56 <ken> ivan: I am happy leaving this issue open.
16:56:54 <ken> burn: On the issues list, look at the sorting options so that you can look at the recently updated issues. This will help you stay up to date without having to review all of the issues,
16:56:56 <ivan> q+
16:57:07 <burn> ack ivan
16:58:15 <manu> I agree with what Ivan just said.
16:58:24 <ken> ivan: There are two issues that can be (104 105) addresses after the core changes settle.
16:58:43 <ken> s/addresses/addressed/
16:59:06 <ken> burn: We will continue to review issues weekly.
16:59:34 <burn> q?
16:59:40 <ken> ... When there are PRs we will close related issues.
16:59:51 <ken> ... Thanks all!
17:00:02 <ken> ... See you next week.
17:00:11 <ivan> zakim, end meeting
17:00:11 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been ivan, justin, joel, chriswinc, markus_sabadello, manu, dlongley, jonathan_holt, Orie, yancy, agropper, ken, dmitriz, JoeAndrieu, brent,
17:00:14 <Zakim> ... drummond, selfissued, sumita, kimhd, gannan, kaliya, Andrei_Sambra, Tom_S__USAA_
17:00:14 <Zakim> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
17:00:14 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2020/02/18-did-minutes.html Zakim
17:00:16 <Zakim> I am happy to have been of service, ivan; please remember to excuse RRSAgent.  Goodbye
17:00:18 <ken> ken has left #did
17:00:20 <Zakim> Zakim has left #did
17:01:06 <ivan> rrsagent, bye
17:01:06 <RRSAgent> I see no action items