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15:41:39 <ivan> rrsagent, set log public
15:41:39 <ivan> Meeting: Publishing Business Group Telco
15:41:39 <ivan> Chair: luc
15:41:39 <ivan> Date: 2019-08-13
15:41:39 <ivan> Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-publishingbg/2019Aug/0005.html
15:41:39 <ivan> ivan has changed the topic to: Meeting Agenda 2019-08-13: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-publishingbg/2019Aug/0005.html
15:41:40 <ivan> Regrets+ rachel
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15:57:36 <laudrain> present+
15:59:08 <wolfgang> present+ wolfgang
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15:59:14 <MURATA> present+
15:59:35 <wendyreid> present+
15:59:43 <ivan> present+
16:00:05 <ivan> present+ daihei
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16:00:32 <ivan> present+ Jonathan_Greenberg
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16:03:06 <Avneesh> present+
16:03:14 <JulieBlair> present+
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16:06:04 <George> present+
16:06:13 <dauwhe> zakim, pick a victim
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16:06:13 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose wolfgang
16:06:14 <ivan> zakim, pick a victim
16:06:15 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose laudrain
16:06:26 <garth> scribenic: Garth
16:06:36 <dauwhe> scribenick: Garth
16:06:38 <ivan> scribenick: garth
16:06:56 <garth> Luc: Starting.  Late agenda.
16:07:08 <garth> … F2F in Fukuoka
16:07:10 <Julian_Calderazi_> preesnt+
16:07:12 <Julian_Calderazi_> present+
16:07:46 <garth> Daihei: Listing in the minutes: agenda
16:08:04 <laudrain> Minutes of last PBG SC available at https://www.w3.org/2019/08/09-pbgsc-minutes.html
16:08:32 <ivan> -> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-publishing-sc/2019Aug/att-0017/0808Update_Agenda_TPAC_Fukuoka_PBG_F2F_Confefrence_2_.docx latest version of the agenda
16:08:40 <garth> … PBG meeting in  Fukuoka on Thursday
16:08:46 <garth> … Sept 19th
16:08:58 <garth> … Two co-chairs: Luc & Daihei
16:09:19 <garth> … Most agenda  confirmed w/ speakers
16:09:54 <garth> … Need more folks for #4 on agenda for other perspectives of publishing on Web
16:10:13 <garth> … Program committee next week to confirm and finalize
16:10:17 <garth> Luc: Thank you
16:10:45 <garth> … Shared with SC for comments; non’s the time for comments
16:10:52 <garth> s/non/now/
16:10:54 <MURATA> Translataions available?
16:11:09 <Bill_Kasdorf> Bill_Kasdorf has joined #pbg
16:11:18 <Bill_Kasdorf> present+
16:11:21 <garth> Daihei: Will be live translators (both directions)
16:11:23 <ivan> s/Translataions/Translations/
16:12:09 <garth> Luc: Open for BG members, but also other TPAC folks too.
16:12:22 <Avneesh> q+
16:12:39 <laudrain> ack Avneesh
16:13:05 <garth> Avneesh: one sided lecture or discussion/seminar format?
16:13:47 <garth> Luc: More discussion format.
16:13:50 <MURATA> Will we have a list of attendees in advance?
16:14:21 <garth> … Will be discussions for each of the topics — speakers shouldn’t fill their time.
16:15:44 <garth> Daihei: MC’s will make sure there are discussions for each (with speaker answering first)
16:15:58 <garth> … plus audience participation
16:16:36 <garth> Avneesh: Audience participation should be clear in the agenda.
16:16:42 <laudrain> q?
16:16:57 <ivan> Topic: Report on Amazon meeting at PWG F2F of TPAC 2019 Fukuoka
16:17:24 <Avneesh> q+
16:17:46 <garth> Luc: Will allocate some time for AMZN.
16:17:46 <MURATA> Great news!
16:17:56 <laudrain> ack Avneesh
16:18:03 <garth> Avneesh: AMZN joinged W3C recently
16:18:19 <wolfgang> s/joinged/joined/
16:18:45 <garth> … Meeting in Seattle
16:18:49 <MURATA> Will they talk about detection of TTS-ready publications?
16:18:51 <garth> … A11Y is their priority
16:19:10 <garth> … Want to improve the state of A11Y on Kindle
16:19:37 <garth> … EPUB3 is a keen interest; likely being those features to Kindle
16:19:55 <MURATA> Fantastic!
16:19:59 <garth> … 250 people in EPUB CG — AMZN should join (and seem interested)
16:20:19 <garth> … Tables and MathML — in theory Kindlegen supports?
16:21:05 <garth> … Perhaps follow-up to be coming from Audible team.
16:21:18 <garth> … Not too much interest in WP (publishing on the Web)
16:21:18 <MURATA> Me too!
16:21:45 <MURATA> +q
16:22:08 <laudrain> ack MURATA
16:22:32 <ivan> q+
16:22:33 <garth> Murata: TTS ready publcations?
16:22:41 <laudrain> ack ivan
16:22:50 <garth> Avneesh: Didn’t get that deep; but hopefully in the future.
16:22:51 <wolfgang> s/publcations/publications/
16:23:20 <garth> Ivan: Will have some time with AMZN during PWG meeting in Fukuoka.
16:23:44 <garth> … submit suggestions on that topic to Wendy.
16:24:09 <Avneesh> q+
16:24:13 <MURATA> I see.
16:24:20 <laudrain> ack Avneesh
16:24:20 <garth> Wendy: Wendy and Rachel are working on a “getting started” email to AMZN
16:25:04 <MURATA> I would like to know their reaction to EPUB A11Y.
16:25:13 <garth> Luc: We’re not too deep in technical details yet — but hopefully will get that way.   Interoperability and A11Y at top of list.
16:26:18 <laudrain> q?
16:26:35 <garth> … Discussion both in france & W3C on this topic — Luc & Avneesh.
16:26:44 <garth> s/fr/Fr/
16:27:17 <MURATA> Sorry but I'l go to bed.  Bye now.
16:27:24 <ivan> Topic: HTML longesc is proposed to be obsolete
16:27:39 <wolfgang> s/longesc/longdesc/
16:27:42 <laudrain> q?
16:28:00 <garth> Luc: In HTML longdesc attribute proposed to be obsolete.  Seeking usage info on this attribute.
16:28:20 <George> q+
16:28:25 <garth> s/lete/leted/
16:28:37 <laudrain> ack George
16:28:41 <Bill_Kasdorf> q+
16:28:59 <garth> Geroge: Longdesc created a long time ago, pointing to page, not much usage
16:29:18 <wolfgang> s/Geroge/George/
16:29:27 <garth> … Not liked by various W3C members; was added back as extension
16:29:42 <garth> … APA asking if it should be eliminated?
16:29:44 <laudrain> q?
16:30:14 <garth> … Can <details> be used instead.  ARAI details can  point to such also.
16:30:28 <wolfgang> s/ARAI/ARIA/
16:30:42 <ivan> zakim, who is here?
16:30:42 <Zakim> Present: laudrain, wolfgang, MURATA, wendyreid, ivan, daihei, Jonathan_Greenberg, dauwhe, Avneesh, JulieBlair, Dan_Sanicola, Garth, George, Julian_Calderazi_, Bill_Kasdorf
16:30:45 <Zakim> On IRC I see Bill_Kasdorf, Julian_Calderazi_, George, garth, JulieBlair, Dan_Sanicola, Avneesh, Jonathan_Greenberg, MURATA, Daihei, laudrain, wolfgang, RRSAgent, Zakim, Karen,
16:30:45 <Zakim> ... ivan, dauwhe, wendyreid, Rachel, bigbluehat
16:31:12 <laudrain> q+
16:31:12 <Julian_Calderazi_> I'm here!
16:31:26 <garth> … At epubtest.org has a title that can be used to determine best practices for a longdeac replacement.
16:31:45 <wolfgang> s/longdeac/longdesc/
16:32:22 <laudrain> ack Bill_Kasdorf
16:32:44 <garth> Bill_Kasdorf: Has not recommended use of longdesc in HTML.  Looking forward to resolution.
16:32:47 <JulieBlair> q+
16:33:04 <garth> Luc: discussion here to see if publishers currently using longdesc in HTML.
16:33:09 <laudrain> ack laudrain
16:33:46 <laudrain> ack JulieBlair
16:33:52 <garth> JulieBlair: We do use it now; looking for alternatives.
16:33:57 <laudrain> q+
16:34:08 <garth> … Very interested in this topic.
16:34:12 <Bill_Kasdorf> Note that SAGE is a scholarly publisher--so it doesn't surprise me that they're using longdesc
16:34:28 <Bill_Kasdorf> q+
16:34:28 <Avneesh> q+
16:34:31 <garth> Luc: Accepted by ACE.
16:34:38 <laudrain> ack laudrain
16:34:50 <laudrain> ack Bill_Kasdorf
16:35:41 <garth> Bill_Kasdorf: Will contact various other scholarly folks for more info (journal hosting, et al).
16:35:58 <laudrain> ack Avneesh
16:36:34 <dauwhe> q+
16:36:49 <laudrain> q?
16:36:52 <laudrain> q+
16:36:54 <garth> Avneesh: Need to get this data before decision (re longdesc) is made (beyond EPUB too).
16:36:55 <Karen> Karen has joined #pbg
16:37:19 <laudrain> ack dauwhe
16:37:40 <garth> … EPUB CG  should help  gather usage data
16:38:15 <garth> dauwhe: Browser folks can gather such usage data, and this drives deprecation decisions.
16:38:36 <laudrain> ack laudrain
16:38:39 <garth> … Using a feature doesn’t mean it’s really acted upon by Reading System.
16:38:45 <laudrain> https://html.spec.whatwg.org/multipage/obsolete.html
16:39:11 <garth> Luc: See above link.
16:39:24 <George> Q+
16:39:28 <garth> … non-conforming feature.
16:39:35 <laudrain> ack George
16:40:39 <garth> George: Industry has changed; announced by screen reader users, but not other renderers.  Need to provide it to other users.
16:40:55 <laudrain> q?
16:41:05 <garth> … Deprecate with better alternative would likely be good.
16:41:23 <Avneesh> our action items for long desc?
16:41:29 <ivan> Topic: call schedules
16:41:50 <garth> Luc: different schedule for calls?
16:42:23 <garth> … Go to two calls per month?  Every other week.  One Europe time, one Asia time.
16:42:48 <garth> … Work items done outside call with reports back to group on calls.
16:43:05 <garth> … resolutions on calls (followed by email).
16:43:48 <garth> … Maybe using github issues.
16:43:55 <laudrain> q?
16:44:20 <Avneesh> q+
16:44:30 <laudrain> ack Avneesh
16:45:08 <garth> Avneesh: Could work better, if motivation is maintained.
16:45:47 <Bill_Kasdorf> q+
16:46:06 <garth> Luc: Non-urgent items like pop-ups.
16:46:21 <garth> … Need to gather actions and resolutions.
16:46:37 <laudrain> ack Bill_Kasdorf
16:46:42 <Avneesh> This highly focused task force looks god
16:46:44 <garth> … Task  forces could work well.
16:46:58 <wolfgang> s/god/good/
16:47:12 <garth> Bill_Kasdorf: PCG could be used for development of proposed solutuions.
16:47:34 <garth> s/solutuions/solutions/
16:47:43 <wolfgang> s/solutuions/solutions/
16:47:58 <wendyreid> q+
16:48:07 <laudrain> ack wendyreid
16:48:20 <garth> Luc: Proposed new dates for calls to come along with a list of items coming.
16:48:44 <garth> Wendy: What about roadmap of future work of publishing actrivity?
16:49:06 <wolfgang> s/actrivity/activity/
16:49:08 <garth> … needs to drive WG roadmap.  Needs to be on agenda soon (for BG).
16:49:31 <Julian_Calderazi_> +1 to Wendy also
16:50:04 <garth> Luc: Unclear if this falls to PBG.
16:50:06 <laudrain> q?
16:50:08 <Avneesh> q+
16:50:49 <laudrain> ack Avneesh
16:50:55 <garth> Avneesh: Some assignments to BG in Strategy meeting.  Wiki page with action items and objectives.
16:51:06 <garth> Luc: Will look and propose.
16:51:28 <ivan> -> https://w3c.github.io/publ-bg/Steering_Committee/Meetings/2019/2019-07-23-pbgsc Minutes of the strategy call
16:51:40 <garth> Wendy: WG has objective for remainder of Charter — need to think about next Charter (if there is one) — need this data.
16:51:42 <ivan> q+
16:52:00 <garth> ack ivan
16:52:01 <laudrain> ack ivan
16:53:18 <garth> Ivan: WG’s connection to BG hasn’t generated (historically) what business needs are — this can drive WG direction.  So, +1 to Wendy.
16:53:25 <laudrain> q+
16:53:58 <garth> Luc: Such will now be on task  force agenda.
16:54:12 <ivan> ack laudrain
16:54:29 <garth> … Should be on agenda for next calls.
16:54:31 <ivan> q+
16:54:39 <laudrain> ack ivan
16:54:52 <garth> Ivan: Will this  BG call change impact SC meetings?
16:54:59 <garth> Luc: Likely not.
16:55:27 <Avneesh> Frequent SC meetings are required for strtegy development
16:55:32 <garth> … AOB?
16:55:39 <ivan> +1 to Avneesh
16:55:46 <wolfgang> s/strtegy/strategy/
16:56:30 <Avneesh> q+
16:56:33 <garth> Luc: Output form Stretegy call… are these really requests/resolutions?
16:56:39 <ivan> q+
16:56:48 <wolfgang> s/Stretegy/Strategy/
16:57:16 <garth> Wendy: Yes, assignments for other groups; EPUB 3 CG is well on it’s way.
16:57:23 <wolfgang> s/form/from/
16:57:41 <wolfgang> s/it's/its/
16:57:59 <laudrain> q?
16:58:05 <laudrain> ack Avneesh
16:58:41 <ivan> See the table drawn by Rachel in the -> minutes of the strategy call https://w3c.github.io/publ-bg/Steering_Committee/Meetings/2019/2019-07-23-pbgsc
16:59:11 <laudrain> ack ivan
16:59:12 <garth> Avneesh: Coordination in SC.   Publishing Champion.  W3M too.
16:59:54 <garth> Ivan: Above link has summary of requests to other groups at the end.
17:00:37 <ivan> rrsagent, draft minutes
17:00:37 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2019/08/13-pbg-minutes.html ivan
17:00:37 <ivan> zakim, bye
17:00:37 <ivan> rrsagent, bye
17:00:37 <RRSAgent> I see no action items
17:00:37 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees have been laudrain, wolfgang, MURATA, wendyreid, ivan, daihei, Jonathan_Greenberg, dauwhe, Avneesh, JulieBlair, Dan_Sanicola, Garth,
17:00:37 <Zakim> Zakim has left #pbg
17:00:40 <Zakim> ... George, Julian_Calderazi_, Bill_Kasdorf