16:56:50 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #pbg
16:56:50 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2019/02/26-pbg-irc
16:56:51 <ivan> rrsagent, set log public
16:56:51 <ivan> Meeting: Publishing Business Group Telco
16:56:51 <ivan> Chair: luc
16:56:51 <ivan> Date: 2019-02-26
16:56:51 <ivan> Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-publishingbg/2019Feb/0029.html
16:56:51 <ivan> ivan has changed the topic to: Meeting Agenda 2019-02-26: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-publishingbg/2019Feb/0029.html
16:56:52 <ivan> Regrets+ jkamata, daihei, makoto, yoshii
16:57:08 <dauwhe> regrets+ dauwhe
16:57:24 <liisamk> liisamk has joined #pbg
16:58:06 <laudrain> present+
16:58:31 <laudrain> Dave : have a good time in FS !
16:58:37 <laudrain> s/FS/SF/
16:59:09 <ivan> present+
16:59:35 <ivan> present+ wendy, luc, liisa, wolfgang
17:00:30 <wolfgang> wolfgang has joined #pbg
17:01:09 <rkwright> present+
17:01:41 <wolfgang> present+ wolfgang
17:01:49 <Avneesh> Avneesh has joined #pbg
17:01:52 <wendyreid> present+
17:02:16 <Rachel> present+
17:02:20 <tzviya> present+
17:02:23 <jeff> present+ jeff
17:03:00 <julie_blair> julie_blair has joined #pbg
17:03:53 <garth> garth has joined #pbg
17:03:59 <garth> present+ Garth
17:04:38 <julie_blair> present+
17:04:44 <mateus> mateus has joined #pbg
17:04:56 <garth> scribenic: garth
17:05:02 <ivan> screibenick: garth
17:05:16 <jeff> scribenick: garth
17:05:21 <garth> Luc: Updates… meeting times.
17:05:40 <ivan> Topic: meeting timings
17:05:48 <Avneesh> present+
17:05:55 <ivan> q+
17:05:57 <garth> … Alternating Europe and Asian friendly times (each every two weeks)
17:06:04 <mateus> present+
17:06:06 <garth> … See how it goes after two months
17:06:09 <jeff> q+
17:06:20 <Jonathan_Greenberg> Jonathan_Greenberg has joined #pbg
17:06:24 <jeff> q-
17:06:40 <garth> … decisions by email due to two calls (with overlapping agendas)
17:07:07 <garth> … Folks should be sure to “present+” on IRC when on the calls.
17:07:08 <George> George has joined #pbg
17:07:13 <laudrain> ack ivan
17:07:17 <George> present+ George
17:07:28 <cristina> cristina has joined #pbg
17:07:32 <laudrain> q+
17:08:00 <liisamk> present + cristina
17:08:02 <rkwright> Mar 10, 2019 - Daylight Saving Time Starts
17:08:25 <garth> Ivan: US will go to DST offset from the rest of the world.   Perhaps ingore the three weeks where we’re offset (setting meetings in Boston time)?
17:08:42 <rkwright> Europe:  Mar 31, 2019 - Daylight Saving Time Starts
17:08:46 <laudrain> ack laudrain
17:09:00 <wolfgang> s/ingore/ignore/
17:09:21 <garth> Luc: Let’s just stay the course with invites as sent.
17:09:25 <garth> +1
17:09:36 <tzviya> q+
17:09:44 <liisamk> +1
17:09:57 <laudrain> ack tzviya
17:10:10 <Avneesh> q+
17:10:15 <laudrain> q+
17:10:29 <garth> Tzivya: European is linely fine, perhaps we should adjust Asian ones?
17:10:32 <laudrain> ack Avneesh
17:10:57 <garth> Avneesh: Most of Asia no DST time.  Stick with UTC?
17:11:25 <garth> … Trend is to use Boston/US time [which does match W3C trend].
17:11:48 <garth> Ivan: any group can do what it wants.
17:12:20 <ivan> +1 to Avneesh
17:12:20 <garth> Avneesh: Asia friendly time is really for East Asia friendly — not good for India, e.g..
17:12:29 <laudrain> q?
17:13:16 <garth> Luc: Be better foir all of Asia if an hour earlier.
17:13:31 <wolfgang> s/foir/for/
17:14:27 <garth> Various: time zome chitchat.
17:14:30 <jeff> q+
17:14:36 <laudrain> ack laudrain
17:14:39 <wolfgang> s/zome/zone/
17:14:50 <laudrain> ack jeff
17:14:52 <garth> Liisa: Discuss Asian time on next Asian time meeting.
17:15:12 <laudrain> q?
17:15:34 <garth> Jeff: Timezone missalignment is only for a couple of calls; but for non-chaging folks, it’s off for the whole summer.
17:15:55 <wolfgang> s/non-chaging/non-changing/
17:16:12 <laudrain> q?
17:17:00 <ivan> topic: event calendar
17:17:29 <ivan> present+ mateus
17:17:32 <liisamk> shared event calendar: https://calendar.google.com/calendar?cid=NWhvMW05aTdsNHVzOXEzbWEyMGVlMmh2a2NAZ3JvdXAuY2FsZW5kYXIuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbQ
17:17:35 <jeff> scribenick: jeff
17:17:52 <jeff> Luc: Calendar ^^
17:17:59 <jeff> ... we've put some events
17:18:05 <jeff> ... we can add
17:18:23 <jeff> ... we'll open to Steering Committee
17:18:30 <jeff> Liisa: So you can send to any chair
17:18:37 <jeff> scribenick: garth
17:19:01 <laudrain> q?
17:19:25 <garth> Luc: Calendar to be maintained by chairs.
17:19:33 <ivan> Topic: EPUB 3.2
17:19:37 <garth> … EPUB 3.2
17:19:49 <garth> .. Testimonials.
17:19:55 <garth> s/../…/
17:20:12 <laudrain> q?
17:20:12 <Avneesh> q+
17:20:21 <laudrain> ack Avneesh
17:20:22 <garth> … Will hunt for them in the next few weeks… syncchronized with epubcheck, et al.
17:20:34 <garth> Avneesh: Do we have a PR plan?
17:20:40 <Rachel> +1 - thanks so much for suggesting these testimonials tzviya!
17:21:00 <ivan> present+ cristina
17:21:00 <ivan> zakim, who is here?
17:21:00 <Zakim> Present: laudrain, ivan, wendy, luc, liisa, wolfgang, rkwright, wendyreid, Rachel, tzviya, jeff, Garth, julie_blair, Avneesh, mateus, George, cristina
17:21:02 <Zakim> On IRC I see cristina, George, Jonathan_Greenberg, mateus, garth, julie_blair, Avneesh, wolfgang, liisamk, RRSAgent, Zakim, ivan, laudrain, rkwright, jeff, dauwhe, tzviya, Rachel,
17:21:02 <Zakim> ... wendyreid, bigbluehat, dmitry
17:21:06 <wolfgang> s/syncchronized/synchronized/
17:21:12 <garth> Luc: Blogging, tweeting, et al — that EPUB 3.2 is validated by epubhceck 4.2
17:21:18 <George> q+
17:21:23 <tzviya> q+
17:21:25 <ivan> present+ jonathan
17:21:28 <garth> … PR from W3C?
17:21:30 <laudrain> ack George
17:21:36 <cristina> q+
17:21:38 <jeff> q+ to comment on press release
17:21:41 <wolfgang> s/epubhcheck/EPUBCheck/
17:21:50 <garth> Geroge: Press Release would be good.
17:21:52 <laudrain> ack tzviya
17:22:10 <wolfgang> s/Geroge:/George:/
17:22:24 <liisamk> q+
17:22:28 <laudrain> ack cristina
17:22:38 <laudrain> q+
17:22:43 <Avneesh> q+
17:23:14 <garth> Cristina: Will have a training couse for Italian publishers Assoc.
17:23:16 <garth> Luc: It should go on the calendar.
17:23:42 <laudrain> ack jeff
17:23:42 <Zakim> jeff, you wanted to comment on press release
17:24:21 <garth> Jeff: Press Release, coordinate with Carly (sp?) — though we are trying to do fewer of them
17:24:52 <garth> … PR has not be a major focus; Home Page news is effective.
17:24:57 <laudrain> s/Carly (sp?)/Coralie Mercier/
17:25:03 <jeff> s/Carly/Coralie Mercier/
17:25:05 <laudrain> ack liisamk
17:25:22 <garth> Liisa: Should we just start a Google Doc to add testimonials too?
17:25:50 <garth> Luc: Folks in BG will push to their local press.
17:25:58 <George> q+
17:26:21 <laudrain> ack laudrain
17:26:27 <laudrain> ack Avneesh
17:26:49 <laudrain> q+
17:27:02 <garth> Avneesh: Should identify folks who are responsible for promotion in the various locales.
17:27:36 <laudrain> ack George
17:27:48 <garth> Geroge: Having a Talking Points document would be good.
17:28:02 <garth> s/Geroge/George/
17:28:07 <wolfgang> s/Geroge:/George:/
17:28:22 <garth> … so we’re all singing from the same page (or sheet music).
17:28:42 <laudrain> https://www.w3.org/blog/2019/02/epubcheck-4-2-beta-release-available/
17:29:09 <laudrain> q?
17:29:14 <laudrain> ack laudrain
17:30:00 <garth> Luc: I will take the task of writing  a blog post for W3C blog.  That could be the talking points document.  EPUB Summit in June is appropriate for this timing.
17:30:08 <ivan> Topic: Epubcheck 4.2 (beta version)
17:30:34 <garth> … Beta version of epubhceck supporting EPUB 3.2 is out now (not quite feature complete yet).
17:30:51 <garth> … Real release candidate scheduled for March.
17:30:51 <laudrain> q?
17:31:04 <garth> Various: Bravo!
17:31:05 <wolfgang> s/epubhceck/EPUBCheck/
17:31:33 <ivan> Topic: Pop-up content
17:31:45 <garth> Luc: Pop-up content discussion in previous calls.
17:31:53 <garth> … issue in EPUB CG
17:31:56 <laudrain>  https://github.com/w3c/publ-cg/issues/80
17:32:22 <garth> … Really is a technical discussion.
17:32:55 <garth> Liisa: Need to know what the problem we’re trying to solve really is.
17:33:14 <laudrain> q?
17:33:32 <garth> … Some RS’s mgiht pop-up, but others won’t — need to expect fall-back.
17:33:43 <garth> s/mgiht/might/
17:34:13 <garth> … Similar to use case of children’s picture books.
17:34:14 <laudrain> last call East-Asian call minutes : https://w3c.github.io/publ-bg/Meetings/Minutes/2019/2019-02-19-pbg
17:34:23 <garth> … Liisa is drafting use-case document.
17:34:45 <garth> Luc: BG should gather use-cases and expectations.
17:35:10 <tzviya> q+
17:35:20 <wolfgang> it makes a lot of sense to me to gather use cases to understand the function of pop-ups for publishers and users
17:35:26 <laudrain> ack tzviya
17:35:30 <garth> … best practices, perhaps, such that there could be some cross-RS exopectations.
17:35:53 <wolfgang> s/exopectations/expectations/
17:36:22 <garth> Tzviya: BG and CG need to work together.   Pop-ups are not part of the spec, but are built on something in the spec.
17:36:27 <garth> q+
17:37:11 <jeff> q+
17:37:32 <garth> Garth: not sure it’s really that broken; some pop-up, some don’t (whcih is  fine fallback) — no harm no foul.
17:37:42 <laudrain> ack garth
17:37:57 <wolfgang> s/whcih/which/
17:38:09 <laudrain> q+
17:38:24 <ivan> ack jeff
17:38:26 <laudrain> ack jeff
17:38:46 <garth> Jeff: Good to try to organize thinking with use-case document,.
17:39:06 <dauwhe> https://twitter.com/JiminyPan/status/1098989566818701312
17:39:09 <garth> … Opportunity for incubation, perhaps?
17:39:24 <Rachel> q+
17:40:08 <ivan> ack laudrain
17:40:36 <garth> Luc: We have a standard way to express markup.  Good for BG to work with CG.  Good to see more RS’s implement the affordance.
17:41:19 <garth> … Need to decide if it’s an interesting user experience (from CG thread).
17:41:25 <garth> q?
17:41:41 <laudrain> ack Rachel
17:41:56 <garth> Rachel: Will raise incubation topic in next CG call.
17:42:19 <laudrain> q?
17:42:34 <garth> Luc: First need to know how it is experessed for RS’s that pop-ups work.
17:42:43 <liisamk> q+
17:42:45 <garth> s/ups/up’s/
17:43:00 <wendyreid> q+
17:43:02 <laudrain> ack liisamk
17:43:03 <garth> Liisa: RS’s could chime in with that data.
17:43:08 <wolfgang> s/experessed/expressed/
17:43:14 <laudrain> ack wendyreid
17:43:40 <liisamk> q+
17:43:41 <mateus> +1 to liisa — reading system docs are 'not ideal', to put it nicely
17:43:42 <garth> Wendy: Some sample content would be good.
17:44:14 <laudrain> q?
17:44:26 <laudrain> ack liisamk
17:44:50 <garth> Various: what kind of pop-ups — footnotes, endnotes — are we really talking?
17:45:10 <garth> Liisa: Maybe just a list of ISBD’s would be good?
17:45:18 <ivan> q+
17:45:19 <garth> s/ISBD/ISBN/
17:45:22 <wolfgang> s/ISBD/ISBN/
17:45:42 <laudrain> ack ivan
17:46:04 <garth> Ivan: Good to have exmaples (and such) in the github.
17:46:17 <garth> Liisa: BG will start with sheet to be more friendly.
17:46:27 <wolfgang> s/exmaples/examples/
17:46:31 <laudrain> q+
17:46:52 <wolfgang> s/friendly/business-friendly/
17:46:54 <wendyreid> q+
17:47:12 <garth> Liisa: Will eventaully need non-comercial content demos.
17:47:18 <ivan> q+
17:47:23 <ivan> ack laudrain
17:47:28 <tzviya> q+
17:47:40 <laudrain> ack wendyreid
17:48:07 <Avneesh> The old epubtest.org had a huge test suite, can it be reused for this kind of testing?
17:48:08 <wolfgang> s/eventaully/eventually/
17:48:14 <garth> Wendy: ISBN’s are okay — but, be better to have pared down examples.
17:48:24 <wolfgang> s/non-comercial/non-commercial/
17:48:33 <rkwright> +1 to Wendy
17:48:43 <laudrain> ack ivan
17:49:22 <garth> Ivan: Should get “ineresting” samples too… RTL and vertical, et al.
17:49:30 <garth> s/ineresting/interesting/
17:49:43 <laudrain> ack tzviya
17:49:47 <ivan> present+ rkwright
17:50:10 <laudrain> q+
17:50:27 <liisamk> q+
17:50:31 <garth> Tzviya: We should prioritize the types of pop-ups (e.g., footnotes could be way easier ).
17:50:39 <garth> q?
17:51:10 <garth> Luc: Need to note whether JS is required for various types of pop-ups.
17:51:12 <laudrain> ack laudrain
17:51:21 <laudrain> ack liisamk
17:52:01 <garth> Liisa: Maybe hold off on prioritization until we get further in… to make sure needs are gathered.
17:52:05 <garth> q?
17:52:25 <garth> Luc: Work to do!
17:52:38 <ivan> Topic: collect ideas for future discussions
17:52:54 <garth> … What are good topics for futrure discussions?
17:53:05 <jeff> q+
17:53:14 <liisamk> gathering ideas at: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1kq5zOMzOxvHkM8yAgoqao0M0-z5FBzqtWWoO9qLS8PM/edit?usp=sharing
17:53:14 <wolfgang> s/futrure/future/
17:53:15 <laudrain> ack jeff
17:53:40 <garth> Jeff: Still looking for a Publishing Champion in W3C.
17:54:38 <garth> Luc: See above link for document to accumulate topics for future discussion.
17:55:30 <garth> … Lots of EPUBs created from InDesign — A11Y could be improved.
17:55:44 <garth> … How are epub:type’s used today in the market?
17:55:59 <laudrain> q?
17:56:28 <garth> … Please edit the document with other ideas.
17:56:43 <ivan> q+
17:56:58 <laudrain> ack ivan
17:57:15 <garth> Ivan: Augthoring should go way beyiond InDesign.
17:57:23 <Rachel> q+
17:57:34 <garth> Luc: Though InDesign pretty ubiquitous.
17:57:43 <wolfgang> s/Augthoring/Authoring/
17:57:56 <liisamk> adding discussion of authoring tools to the list!
17:57:58 <wolfgang> s/beyiond/beyond/
17:58:58 <garth> Ivan: InDesign may not play same dominate role in non-Book authoring.
17:59:05 <laudrain> q+
17:59:05 <Rachel> q-
17:59:18 <Rachel> +1 to everything ivan said
17:59:28 <wolfgang> +1 to Ivan's proposal of authoring tools
17:59:37 <Avneesh> Outside US, INDESIGN is vrey widely used. People are using it for years and find it very difficult to change.
17:59:39 <garth> Luc: More about work flows rather than authoring tools.
17:59:56 <wolfgang> s/vrey/very/
18:00:14 <mateus> +1 ivan / I added another line to discussion topics spreadsheet
18:00:20 <ivan> Thanks mateus
18:00:22 <laudrain> q?
18:00:22 <garth> … Thank you!
18:00:55 <Rachel> Focusing solely on an Adobe product feels like an endorsement of that product and workflow - I'm not comfortable with that. I hope this discussion continues.
18:01:01 <jeff> Thanks Luc for chairing
18:01:02 <garth> … We’re done.
18:01:03 <laudrain> ack laudrain
18:01:08 <ivan> rrsagent, draft minutes
18:01:08 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2019/02/26-pbg-minutes.html ivan
18:01:08 <ivan> zakim, bye
18:01:08 <ivan> rrsagent, bye
18:01:08 <RRSAgent> I see no action items
18:01:08 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees have been laudrain, ivan, wendy, luc, liisa, wolfgang, rkwright, wendyreid, Rachel, tzviya, jeff, Garth, julie_blair, Avneesh, mateus,
18:01:08 <Zakim> Zakim has left #pbg
18:01:11 <Zakim> ... George, cristina, jonathan