16:02:51 RRSAgent has joined #tt 16:02:51 logging to https://www.w3.org/2019/02/14-tt-irc 16:02:53 RRSAgent, make logs public 16:02:53 Zakim has joined #tt 16:02:55 Meeting: Timed Text Working Group Teleconference 16:02:55 Date: 14 February 2019 16:02:59 Log: https://www.w3.org/2019/02/14-tt-irc 16:03:10 Agenda: https://github.com/w3c/ttwg/issues/18 16:03:27 Present+ Glenn, Nigel, Philippe 16:03:30 scribe: nigel 16:03:33 Chair: Nigel 16:03:50 Regrets: Thierry, Cyril, Pierre 16:04:08 mike has joined #tt 16:05:08 Present+ Mike 16:06:08 Present+ Gary 16:06:50 Topic: This meeting 16:07:32 Nigel: Today we have profile registry, Future Reqs status, TTML in RTP IETF submission, 16:07:43 .. WebVTT implementation report, and I have no AOB yet. 16:07:52 .. Anything else to raise or specific points to mention? 16:08:04 Regrets+ Andreas 16:08:30 group: [no AOB] 16:08:44 Topic: TTML Profile Registry 16:09:20 Nigel: No issues marked for the agenda, 2 pulls open. Anything holding us back? 16:09:34 Glenn: I need to implement the decision from last week and deal with the comments on the use of 16:09:49 .. specref, to go through and check to see if Specref is generating through respec the correct information 16:10:05 Nigel: easy way to do this 16:10:16 -> https://github.com/w3c/tt-profile-registry/pull/59 PR #59 16:10:25 Nigel: Then click Diff 16:10:26 glenn has joined #tt 16:10:47 -> https://pr-preview.s3.amazonaws.com/w3c/tt-profile-registry/59/5483f8e...c847a99.html Diff 16:11:26 Nigel: The only deltas are in the References at the bottom. 16:11:44 Glenn: Okay I'll take a look at that and try to wrap it up later today. 16:11:47 Nigel: Thank you 16:12:40 Philippe: TTML2 is only informative somehow. 16:12:50 Nigel: That's because we haven't done issue #39. 16:13:05 Glenn: Good that diff tool will be helpful. 16:13:19 Philippe: By the way you want to check those TTML references, I do not think the 2nd Ed references 16:13:26 .. should be normative. I could be wrong. 16:14:13 Glenn: Thanks for that comment. 16:14:41 Nigel: Is there anything else to discuss on the profile registry? 16:14:55 Glenn: There are 8 open issues to resolve. 16:15:19 Philippe: By the way one more thing on the normative thing, if you click the link it will tell you the version 16:15:22 .. is outdated anyway. 16:15:31 Nigel: You mean only 3rd Ed should be normative? 16:15:35 Philippe: Correct 16:15:49 Glenn: It's a conceptual fine point, we're using dated URLs in this registry. 16:16:00 Philippe: Yes but you're normatively referencing outdated specifications. 16:16:12 Glenn: Yes you're probably right I'll take a close look at that. Thanks. 16:16:19 Philippe: Thank you. 16:16:39 Topic: TTWG Future Requirements 16:17:04 Nigel: A few things here: 16:17:17 .. 1. I need to do the Charter draft updates. 16:17:34 .. 2. Glenn was going to prepare a TTML requirements doc - not sure if we need that? 16:17:51 .. 3. Reminder about explainers being a good idea. 16:18:07 .. And I'd like to give a status report on issue 2. 16:18:23 .. 16:18:58 .. On the Charter draft I thought Philippe was going to make some changes to the charter draft repo. 16:19:06 Philippe: I thought it was not urgent. 16:19:19 Nigel: Oh sorry my fault, I need to make the updates by the end of February I think. 16:19:26 Philippe: Okay I'll bump up the priority! 16:19:48 Nigel: And Glenn are you still intending to create a document for the TTML requirements? 16:20:05 Glenn: I think I have one, it hasn't been updated for a while. 16:20:12 .. It's still the intent. 16:20:36 .. I've basically used one of the IMSC1.1 requirements documents as a boilerplate to start with. 16:20:43 Philippe: Do you need a repo? 16:20:50 Nigel: We'll use the tt-reqs repo. 16:21:24 .. 16:21:36 .. Re Explainers, anything complicated enough to warrant a horizontal review should have an 16:21:39 .. explainer. 16:21:49 Glenn: I was looking at that. I see there's a TTML2 2nd Ed requirements doc, 16:22:01 .. so I need a TTML3 1st ed requirements document as well, so I'll create that. 16:22:30 Philippe: Explainer documents have become more of a trend nowadays. 16:22:43 .. The TAG requires one if you want them to review your document, so it is a Thing. 16:22:55 Glenn: We used to call those White Papers, it may be out of vogue now. 16:23:15 Nigel: I also wanted to open up issue #2. 16:23:25 Topic: Add generic CSS property functionality tt-reqs#2 16:23:32 github: https://github.com/w3c/tt-reqs/issues/2 16:23:57 Nigel: Been discussing with implementers for BBC. 16:25:39 .. Thinking about adding a "decorations" approach to embellish existing semantics without affecting 16:25:40 .. layout. 16:26:00 .. One thing that we probably will ask for though is a change to the value of the tts:fontWeight 16:26:21 .. attribute, to allow numbers as per XSL-FO and CSS, because the current two options weren't enough 16:26:26 .. for the implementers. 16:27:26 Glenn: I know Vlad is not on the call, but I imagine he would suggest something like using the 16:27:41 .. fontVariant style by adding more richness to its value space to support parameterised fonts. 16:27:59 .. One dimension or axis of those is weight along with width for example, narrow vs wide, and heavy vs light. 16:28:14 .. Those are in a number of fonts, as continuous parameters that can be passed to the font 16:28:21 .. rendering system to produce a continuous range of weight. 16:28:39 .. If we assign integer numbers then I don't know how interoperable that would be in terms of saying 16:28:54 .. which integer maps to a keyword used in the industry for labelling points on the continuous weight 16:29:10 .. axis. One thing we did not do in TTML2 with fontVariant, though it was on my list and I think there's 16:29:27 .. a TTML3 issue, is to bring in some of the more rich capabilities that CSS had discussed that tie it to the 16:29:39 .. OpenType and other font systems to allow you to specify low level feature labels and parameters 16:29:45 .. to those labels, one of which could be weight. 16:30:01 .. Before we decide to add integer values to the fontWeight attribute we need to look at the bigger picture. 16:30:08 Nigel: Interesting, thank you for that. 16:30:20 .. I just wanted to note that thinking is ongoing. 16:32:11 github-bot, end topic 16:32:37 Topic: TTML3 modules 16:33:01 Glenn: It's high on my priority list to create a boilerplate template for modules so that there's consistency 16:33:03 .. on them. 16:33:34 Topic: Add generic CSS property functionality tt-reqs#2 (continued) 16:33:43 github: https://github.com/w3c/tt-reqs/issues/2 16:33:59 Glenn: On the class attribute, it seems to require a link to a stylesheet. 16:34:38 .. If we add a class attribute we would need some way to reference it. 16:34:49 Nigel: Yes we could add it as a resource like audio or font. 16:35:09 Glenn: That's an interesting idea, I kind of like it, it would be different from the way SVG does it. 16:36:38 Topic: Spoken subtitle tt-reqs#13 16:36:43 github: https://github.com/w3c/tt-reqs/issues/13 16:36:58 Glenn: Nigel have you managed to contact the issue raiser on this? 16:37:22 Nigel: No, sorry, thanks for the reminder, I need to follow up with Pilar. 16:37:50 Topic: Fade in/out tt-reqs#11 16:37:58 github: https://github.com/w3c/tt-reqs/issues/11 16:38:06 Glenn: Any word from Andreas about following up on this? 16:38:12 Nigel: I've not heard anything more yet. 16:38:27 Glenn: The only potential action I can see is possibly adding support to IMSC for fade. 16:38:33 .. I don't see any feature definitions coming out of that. 16:39:03 Topic: TTML in RTP IETF submission 16:39:10 Nigel: Quick update from me on this. 16:39:22 .. You'll have seen on the reflector I submitted the feedback as agreed last week, 16:39:35 .. and have been working with the author to get that processed. 16:39:43 .. I have high confidence that will be done. 16:40:00 .. The Chair of the Payload group added a comment that it is okay to remove the duplication of the 16:40:06 .. media type registration. 16:41:56 Mike: That's good. 16:42:11 Glenn: Is section 7.1 going to be removed? 16:48:30 https://www.iana.org/assignments/media-types/media-types.xhtml#application 16:53:46 group: [discussion] 16:54:05 Glenn: I think the only thing it should say is it uses application/ttml+xml and omit any other comments 16:54:17 .. about IANA or W3C responsibilities. 16:54:52 Mike: Any request for changes to the media type registry should be external to this document, we can 16:54:56 .. certainly make the changes. 16:55:54 .. My preference would be to remove the IANA and W3C considerations sections. 16:56:09 .. It may be a required section about IANA in which case scale it back as Glenn suggests. 16:56:24 .. The W3C section should be removed. We will make the reference in the profile registry but it doesn't 16:56:28 .. need to be in the document. 16:56:33 Glenn: That's fine with me. 16:56:36 Nigel: Okay, thank you. 16:56:58 Topic: WebVTT Implementation report 16:57:14 Gary: I've been working on this. I submitted a pull request to WPT to fix the references for some of 16:57:30 .. the align tests because they were out of date, and that has made those tests go green. 16:57:53 .. I've started looking at the other failures in VLC and vt.js and Edge and make some passes. 16:58:05 .. A lot of other failing tests are because there's a mismatch between the reference and the implementations 16:58:21 .. mostly around collision avoidance for cue boxes. I'm still trying to wrap my head around how the 16:58:35 .. algorithm works but it seems like the references are incorrect so hopefully I will be able to walk through 16:58:50 .. this with Silvia and update the references, and that may improve the status of those tests. 16:59:10 .. The wpt.fyi website now allows you to select browser versions and you can see that a bunch of 16:59:26 .. newer experimental browser versions have more passing tests so they are working on fixing things, 16:59:28 .. which is good. 16:59:48 .. For the next week I'll continue focusing on the failing tests, updating vtt.js, and probably filing bugs 16:59:58 .. with browsers so they can get started on fixing things as well. 17:00:08 Nigel: Thanks for the update. 17:00:23 Topic: Meeting close 17:00:56 Nigel: Thank you, that brings us to time on this meeting, so I'll adjourn it now. [adjourns meeting] 17:01:01 rrsagent, make minutes 17:01:01 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2019/02/14-tt-minutes.html nigel 17:05:02 github-bot, end topic 17:05:09 s/github-bot, end topic//g 17:07:28 rrsagent, make minutes 17:07:28 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2019/02/14-tt-minutes.html nigel 17:08:22 scribeOptions: -final -noEmbedDiagnostics 17:08:23 Scribe 17:08:27 s/Scribe// 17:08:29 rrsagent, make minutes 17:08:29 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2019/02/14-tt-minutes.html nigel 18:08:13 Zakim has left #tt