IRC log of dpvcg on 2018-12-11

Timestamps are in UTC.

15:02:52 [RRSAgent]
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15:02:52 [RRSAgent]
logging to https://www.w3.org/2018/12/11-dpvcg-irc
15:02:54 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, make logs public
15:02:54 [Zakim]
Zakim has joined #dpvcg
15:02:56 [trackbot]
Meeting: Data Privacy Vocabularies and Controls Community Group Teleconference
15:02:56 [trackbot]
Date: 11 December 2018
15:02:59 [AxelPollleres]
AxelPollleres has joined #dpvcg
15:03:05 [rigo]
chair: AxelPollleres
15:03:28 [rigo]
RRSAgent, please set minutes public
15:03:28 [RRSAgent]
I'm logging. I don't understand 'please set minutes public', rigo. Try /msg RRSAgent help
15:03:45 [rigo]
RRSAgent, please set log\ public
15:03:45 [RRSAgent]
I'm logging. I don't understand 'please set log\ public', rigo. Try /msg RRSAgent help
15:03:51 [rigo]
RRSAgent, please set log public
15:04:28 [AxelPollleres]
PROPOSED: approve minutes rom F2F
15:04:31 [AxelPollleres]
https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-dpvcg/2018Dec/0042.html
15:04:53 [rigo]
scribe: rigo
15:05:09 [rigo]
rigo: all requested incorporated
15:05:40 [AxelPollleres]
Axel: Rigo confirmed all ACTION items have been collected
15:05:41 [rigo]
Action50?
15:05:57 [rigo]
trackbot: action50?
15:05:57 [trackbot]
Sorry, rigo, I don't understand 'trackbot: action50?'. Please refer to <http://www.w3.org/2005/06/tracker/irc> for help.
15:06:01 [AxelPollleres]
PROPOSED: approve minutes rom F2F, cf. https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-dpvcg/2018Dec/0042.html
15:06:08 [harsh]
+1
15:06:26 [rigo]
+1
15:06:38 [AxelPollleres]
RESOLVED: approve minutes rom F2F, cf. https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-dpvcg/2018Dec/0042.html
15:06:38 [rigo]
trackbot, ACTION-50?
15:06:38 [trackbot]
ACTION-50 -- Bud P. Bruegger to Suggest a new hierarchy of the usage policy diagram and integrate into the presentation of tuesday 11 -- due 2018-12-11 -- OPEN
15:06:38 [trackbot]
https://www.w3.org/community/dpvcg/track/actions/50
15:06:44 [rigo]
trackbot, ACTION-51?
15:06:44 [trackbot]
ACTION-51 -- Bud P. Bruegger to Prepare a presentation for next dpvcg telco on 11 december -- due 2018-12-11 -- OPEN
15:06:44 [trackbot]
https://www.w3.org/community/dpvcg/track/actions/51
15:06:53 [dlewis]
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15:08:33 [MarkL]
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15:08:44 [MarkL]
Hello
15:08:49 [rigo]
Hi Mark
15:09:16 [AxelPollleres]
present: dave lewis, rigo, harsh, eva, mark, martin, bert, bud, mark
15:09:40 [rigo]
Axel: Minutes were approved
15:10:04 [rigo]
... main goal is to to go through the minutes and report from the F2F
15:10:29 [rigo]
Eva: agenda+ for Bud to present his model of processing
15:10:51 [rigo]
Bud: 30 min and trying screen sharing
15:11:50 [rigo]
Axel: covered all the items we wanted to discuss [enumerates] for further info see https://www.w3.org/2018/12/03-dpvcg-minutes and https://www.w3.org/2018/12/04-dpvcg-minutes
15:12:17 [AxelPollleres]
topic: action review https://www.w3.org/community/dpvcg/track/actions/open
15:12:47 [rigo]
Axel: action-6 continued
15:13:05 [rigo]
... DMA and IDS project has no detailed response yet
15:14:40 [rigo]
trackbot, close ACTION-31
15:14:40 [trackbot]
Closed ACTION-31.
15:16:15 [rigo]
Axel: Keep Action-33 open
15:16:30 [rigo]
Mark: was hoping to align work with Kantara, there is a lot of benefit
15:16:47 [rigo]
Axel: we should talk at next call about Action-33
15:17:35 [rigo]
Axel: we start with Action-42
15:17:43 [rigo]
Eva: Action-42 is ongoing
15:18:16 [rigo]
... action-43 had some feedback, is not very usable for us. Will send email to the list
15:19:14 [rigo]
note action-43 eva will send email to the list
15:19:14 [trackbot]
Notes added to action-43 Have a look a study on aal that might help us.
15:19:26 [AxelPollleres]
close ACTION-46
15:19:27 [trackbot]
Closed ACTION-46.
15:19:46 [AxelPollleres]
close ACTION-47
15:19:47 [trackbot]
Closed ACTION-47.
15:20:25 [rigo]
Harsh: was discussing action-48 on email.
15:20:36 [rigo]
Axel: maybe put a link to ??
15:20:46 [AxelPollleres]
https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-dpvcg/2018Dec/0021.html
15:21:12 [rigo]
note action-48 add https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-dpvcg/2018Dec/0021.html
15:21:12 [trackbot]
Notes added to action-48 Look into classifications of organisations that could serve as a basis for clsssifying data controllers.
15:22:05 [rigo]
Eva: action-49 did not know how to put the image to the wiki. Do not know where to put it
15:22:51 [rigo]
eva: the boxes where we added "legal grounds" in Vienna
15:23:01 [rigo]
harsh: under policy would be an option
15:23:10 [rigo]
Axel: Link it from the taxonomy page
15:23:52 [AxelPollleres]
close ACTION-50
15:23:52 [trackbot]
Closed ACTION-50.
15:24:16 [AxelPollleres]
close ACTION-51
15:24:16 [trackbot]
Closed ACTION-51.
15:24:17 [rigo]
Bud: Action-50 will be treated in the presentation later today
15:25:43 [rigo]
harsh: suggestion from Javier that I like, will continue to discuss
15:25:56 [rigo]
Axel: on mailing-list for further discussion
15:26:31 [harsh]
mail for Action 53 (check thread for more conversations) https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-dpvcg/2018Dec/0014.html
15:26:57 [AxelPollleres]
slides ACTION-54 are here https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-dpvcg/2018Dec/0036.html
15:27:04 [rigo]
note action-53 thread with further conversation at https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-dpvcg/2018Dec/0014.html
15:27:04 [trackbot]
Notes added to action-53 Together with harsh, fajar, javier start on a base ontology, suggest a namespace, etc. and start populate the sub-taxonomies, agree on language to model it..
15:27:07 [AxelPollleres]
close ACTION-54
15:27:07 [trackbot]
Closed ACTION-54.
15:27:46 [rigo]
Topic: Bud about the new processiong
15:29:06 [rigo]
Eva: screen sharing via webex.
15:29:25 [rigo]
Bud: processing operations
15:29:51 [rigo]
Eva: images with core processing model sent yesterday as first in the slide deck
15:30:23 [rigo]
Bud: it is only about processing personal data, then there is processing, only those necessary for the given purpose
15:30:43 [rigo]
AxelPollleres: also location for processing, do we need the time for processing
15:31:12 [rigo]
Bud: it is time to store, storage and transfer are special cases of processing
15:31:48 [rigo]
... lower right corner could also be deletion, then timestamp would be relevant
15:32:08 [rigo]
Axel: we have temperal elements in SPECIAL
15:32:17 [rigo]
Bud: storage location is relevant
15:33:09 [rigo]
... can be many locations, because of backup etc, also time of storage
15:34:14 [AxelPollleres]
Axel: don't we also need temporal aspects for processing?
15:34:14 [rigo]
Bud: core purpose for exchange of services or goods, but often things are bundled to make a package deal. Other purposes are not core
15:34:39 [rigo]
... base consent to multiple purposes, then optional purpose
15:35:17 [rigo]
... than optional additional purposes that are not bundled
15:36:01 [AxelPollleres]
Axel: why is there the distinction between base and additional consent?
15:36:30 [rigo]
... what is the relation between purpose and data, does addtional purpose mean additional data or same data?
15:37:57 [rigo]
Mark: time period for consent and time for data retention
15:37:58 [AxelPollleres]
Mark: time period for consent?
15:38:31 [rigo]
... update consent which is linked to data retention in GDPR
15:39:24 [rigo]
=> slides will be sent to the list after the meeting
15:40:34 [AxelPollleres]
Axel: I think that legal ground needs a temporal dimension (at least law or consent)
15:41:03 [AxelPollleres]
q?
15:41:36 [rigo]
AxelPollleres: we discussed purposes in meeting with harsh
15:41:49 [rigo]
harsh: started discussion on mailing-list
15:42:01 [harsh]
https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-dpvcg/2018Dec/0041.html
15:42:12 [rigo]
AxelPollleres: we wanted to insantiate purposes
15:42:12 [harsh]
described on the wiki https://www.w3.org/community/dpvcg/wiki/Purposes_for_handling_Personal_Data#High-level_categories_.28to-be-discussed.29
15:43:26 [rigo]
=> discussion on purposes
15:43:40 [rigo]
eva: suggest to raise this as an issue
15:44:41 [dlewis]
q+
15:45:15 [rigo]
Axel: core purpose, without this, no service can be provided
15:45:22 [rigo]
... research etc
15:48:26 [AxelPollleres]
ACTION: Axel And Bert to collect ACTIONS and emails to be discussed in subsequent calls
15:48:27 [trackbot]
Created ACTION-56 - And bert to collect actions and emails to be discussed in subsequent calls [on Axel Polleres - due 2018-12-18].
15:48:33 [AxelPollleres]
q?
15:49:31 [rigo]
dlewis: good start, logic and high level makes sense, just wondering about the distinction between optimization and optimization for the client that I would call personalization
15:50:05 [rigo]
AxelPollleres: we may make the distinction, server of consumer side
15:50:54 [rigo]
q+
15:50:57 [AxelPollleres]
Dave: personalisation is an optimization for a single data subject
15:51:01 [rigo]
ack dlewis
15:52:01 [rigo]
ack ri
15:52:19 [dlewis]
q+
15:52:43 [rigo]
discussion about the optimization term
15:53:04 [rigo]
optimization for service or optimization for data subject
15:53:26 [AxelPollleres]
local language can be considered personalisation, but affects more than a single consumer, but is not optimization
15:53:28 [rigo]
dlewis: what is an optimization anyway, how to distinguish from other functionalities
15:53:36 [AxelPollleres]
Harsh: local language can be considered personalisation, but affects more than a single consumer, but is not optimization
15:53:49 [harsh]
We should create an issue and discuss this later/in mails. (conscious of time)
15:54:27 [harsh]
q+
15:56:40 [rigo]
ack harsh
15:56:41 [MarkL]
(thanks for call I have to drop )
15:57:00 [AxelPollleres]
ACTION: harsh to start definitionsions of the high-level purposes at https://www.w3.org/community/dpvcg/wiki/Purposes_for_handling_Personal_Data#High-level_categories_.28to-be-discussed.29 and map them to purposes collected from use cases
15:57:00 [trackbot]
Created ACTION-57 - Start definitionsions of the high-level purposes at https://www.w3.org/community/dpvcg/wiki/purposes_for_handling_personal_data#high-level_categories_.28to-be-discussed.29 and map them to purposes collected from use cases [on Harshvardhan Pandit - due 2018-12-18].
15:57:22 [MarkL]
great work everyone -- great to see this am looking forward to contributing..
15:58:39 [rigo]
next meeting 8 Jan?
15:58:54 [rigo]
Axel: suggest we target that date?
15:59:10 [rigo]
Bert: will be available on 8 Jan
15:59:44 [rigo]
Axel: season's greetings....
15:59:49 [AxelPollleres]
Bert is available to char on 8th.
15:59:56 [rigo]
adjourned
16:00:06 [rigo]
trackbot, end meeting
16:00:06 [trackbot]
Zakim, list attendees
16:00:06 [Zakim]
As of this point the attendees have been dave, lewis, rigo, harsh, eva, mark, martin, bert, bud
16:00:14 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, please draft minutes
16:00:14 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/12/11-dpvcg-minutes.html trackbot
16:00:15 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, bye
16:00:15 [RRSAgent]
I see 2 open action items saved in https://www.w3.org/2018/12/11-dpvcg-actions.rdf :
16:00:15 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Axel And Bert to collect ACTIONS and emails to be discussed in subsequent calls [1]
16:00:15 [RRSAgent]
recorded in https://www.w3.org/2018/12/11-dpvcg-irc#T15-48-26
16:00:15 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: harsh to start definitionsions of the high-level purposes at https://www.w3.org/community/dpvcg/wiki/Purposes_for_handling_Personal_Data#High-level_categories_.28to-be-discussed.29 and map them to purposes collected from use cases [2]
16:00:15 [RRSAgent]
recorded in https://www.w3.org/2018/12/11-dpvcg-irc#T15-57-00