20:47:25 RRSAgent has joined #dxwg 20:47:25 logging to https://www.w3.org/2018/11/20-dxwg-irc 20:47:32 Zakim has joined #dxwg 20:47:39 rrsagent, make logs public 20:49:55 regrets+ Peter Winstanley, Alejandra, Makx 20:52:47 roba has joined #dxwg 21:01:05 SimonCox has joined #dxwg 21:01:19 DaveBrowning has joined #dxwg 21:02:10 present+ 21:02:12 antoine has joined #dxwg 21:02:16 present+ 21:02:21 present+ 21:02:23 present+ 21:02:42 annette_g has joined #dxwg 21:03:14 present+ 21:04:51 ncar has joined #dxwg 21:05:10 Jaroslav_Pullmann has joined #dxwg 21:05:18 scribenick: roba 21:05:25 present+ 21:05:32 present+ 21:06:30 present+ 21:07:12 rrsagent, make logs public 21:07:18 https://www.w3.org/2018/11/13-dxwg-minutes 21:07:59 PROPOSED: approve the minutes of November 13 21:08:04 +1 21:08:06 +1 21:08:13 +1 21:08:15 +1 21:08:19 +1 21:08:23 +1 21:08:26 +0 was not there 21:08:29 +1 21:08:36 RESOLVED: approve the minutes of November 13 21:08:36 rrsagent, generate minutes v2 21:08:36 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/11/20-dxwg-minutes.html DaveBrowning 21:09:38 https://www.w3.org/2017/dxwg/track/actions/244 21:09:39 AndreaPerego has joined #dxwg 21:09:58 chair: kcoyle 21:10:07 rrsagent, generate minutes v2 21:10:07 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/11/20-dxwg-minutes.html DaveBrowning 21:10:30 present+ AndreaPerego 21:11:12 antoine: this action is to do with guidance and the name of resourcedescriptor Class 21:12:21 close action 258 21:12:38 close action-258 21:12:38 Closed action-258. 21:12:46 Reply to Luca Trani's mail: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-dxwg-comments/2018Nov/0002.html 21:14:04 kcoyle: have docs passed pub rules 21:14:37 ncar: have passed recently - only text changes - will take an action to re-run 21:15:06 ACTION: ncar - re-scheck pubrules compliance for profiles ontology and conneg docs. 21:15:08 Created ACTION-260 - - re-scheck pubrules compliance for profiles ontology and conneg docs. [on Nicholas Car - due 2018-11-27]. 21:15:13 rrsagent, generate minutes v2 21:15:13 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/11/20-dxwg-minutes.html DaveBrowning 21:15:17 s/scheck/check/ 21:16:19 meeting: DXWG Plenary 21:16:22 agenda: https://www.w3.org/2017/dxwg/wiki/Meetings:Telecon2018.11.20 21:16:29 RRSAgent, draft minutes v2 21:16:29 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/11/20-dxwg-minutes.html AndreaPerego 21:16:54 TOPIC: naming of documents and artefacts 21:17:26 dsr: global space, names need to be indicative of the area 21:17:31 regrets+ Lars 21:17:34 RRSAgent, draft minutes v2 21:17:34 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/11/20-dxwg-minutes.html AndreaPerego 21:18:11 q? 21:18:18 ...need to look at other uses of profile 21:18:20 q+ 21:18:25 q+ 21:19:46 ...its not clear if its about DCAT, or dataset exchange 21:19:53 ack roba 21:21:00 roba: prof ontology not exclusive to catalogs; common abstract catalogs; europeana use case, ogc use case 21:21:10 ... not limited to data exchange 21:21:38 ... problem with developing specific use case is that people complain that they are too narrow 21:22:01 ... we tried to avoid that by working with a high-level scope, the DC terms standard 21:22:10 ... hard to narrow to w3c 21:22:42 dsr: many profiles types; definition was clear to me; the broader the defintion the more communities we need to reach to 21:23:08 ... suggest using the dx or dxwg in the namespace 21:23:27 ... doesn't restrict you, says this group is responsible 21:24:05 roba: I'm agnostic about that; looks like precident is changing (cf. prov) 21:24:21 ... general sense is profile is a specification conforming to something 21:24:27 ... prof meets that 21:24:42 ... semantically prof ontology not tied to DX case 21:25:08 q+ 21:25:08 How much has the technology been tested? (really?) if it is in DX context so far, then DX is probably the best option ... 21:25:10 dsr: "profile" means different things to different people 21:25:13 q+ 21:26:27 antoine: in the light of discussion would be OK with /dx - not preferred - but if it helps reduce discussion its good 21:26:29 ack antoine 21:26:46 ack annette_g 21:26:51 ... there doesnt appear to be any consistent policy at w3c 21:27:49 annette_g: suggest we think about use of term profile - and can it be refined? 21:27:56 q? 21:28:01 ack ncar 21:28:29 q+ 21:28:55 ack antoine 21:29:14 ncar: no-one wanted the /dx but if it will really make a difference at W3C we can live with it? 21:29:28 rrsagent, generate minutes v2 21:29:28 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/11/20-dxwg-minutes.html DaveBrowning 21:29:44 else first-come, first served - 21:29:56 q+ 21:30:11 ack SimonCox 21:31:16 SimonCox: the counter-argument - structure naming is appropriate if you have a lot of names - experience suggests that this is a bad idea. 21:31:34 ... tend not to eventuate. 21:31:39 ... because lots might not arrive 21:31:58 q+ 21:32:00 q+ 21:32:31 dxprof is still pretty short 21:32:37 ack roba 21:33:42 q- 21:33:54 roba: this isn't limited to data exchange - send to w3c as is 21:34:20 ... it's worthwhile looking at it on its own merits 21:34:46 dsr: definition in document meant very little; come up with a few words to narrow it down 21:35:02 +1 21:35:33 dsr: the way you are using profile and assumptions you are making; others could use word in other ways 21:35:47 ... what other words would you add to make it clearer? 21:36:02 roba: profiles guidance document has those words 21:36:11 Think of how many of us were unsure about what a profile was when we joined this group. 21:36:17 q+ 21:36:27 dsr: profiles of what? of datasets? protocols? 21:36:33 roba: all of the above 21:36:48 dsr: if you claim general than you need to reach out to a broader community 21:37:04 q? 21:37:16 ... need words that unambiguously identify the area - there will be other groups coming along who use this word 21:37:30 ack ncar 21:38:08 NB: pther communities are "in the room" in the sense of their published definitions and usages we have taken into account 21:38:44 ncar++ 21:38:48 ncar: adding the short wg code in the name adds barrier to understanding - its not interpretable 21:38:52 +1 dx 21:39:11 straw vote: use dx as intermediate level in domain name 21:39:19 q+ 21:39:33 +1 time to move on - we don't want FPWD held up any longer 21:39:57 straw vote: use dx as intermediate level in domain name in the TR documents 21:40:03 +1 21:40:05 -1 put it in the name of a profile 21:40:08 so /TR/dx/profile-guidance? 21:40:09 -1 21:40:26 1+ 21:40:29 +1 21:40:33 0 21:40:37 q+ 21:40:41 0 21:40:42 0 21:40:51 ack roba 21:40:57 ack AndreaPerego 21:42:27 so /TR/dx-profile-guidance? 21:42:46 so /TR/dx-profiles & /ns/dx/prof 21:42:58 so /TR/dx-prof-conneg 21:43:28 this group wont exist in 6 months .. so for documents these are legacy and OK - but for ongoing things like dcat and prof ontologies is just messy and looks different for all others. 21:44:47 q+ 21:45:00 ack AndreaPerego 21:45:23 so dx- avoids /dx/ 21:45:47 q+ 21:45:48 could we do /TR/dx-prof and /ns/dx-prof? 21:46:00 ack annette_g 21:46:06 ack ant 21:46:12 yes! (annette_g) 21:46:13 http://www.w3.org/2004/02/skos/core# 21:46:14 q? 21:47:06 q+ 21:47:11 ack ncar 21:47:34 q+ 21:47:45 q- 21:47:51 strawpoll: use dx- instead of /dx/ as per ncar above (e.g. dx-prof-conneg) 21:48:11 q+ 21:48:11 +1 21:48:17 +1 21:48:20 +1 21:48:27 +1 21:48:31 +0 21:49:11 +1 21:49:14 +1 21:49:18 +1 21:49:27 +1 21:49:41 ack roba 21:50:15 resolved: group wishes to use /TR/dx-... for namespaces 21:50:28 can't it be both? 21:50:32 resolved: group wishes to use /TR/dx-... for docment namespaces 21:51:32 proposed: group wishes to use /TR/dx-... for docment namespaces 21:51:45 +1 21:51:47 +1 21:51:48 +1 21:51:50 +1 21:51:51 +1 21:51:51 +1 21:51:58 +1 21:51:59 +1 21:52:17 q+ 21:52:22 resolved: group wishes to use /TR/dx-... for docment namespaces 21:52:25 ack roba 21:52:46 propose consistent approach 21:53:06 -1 to change DCAT namespace 21:54:05 https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/353571-a-foolish-consistency-is-the-hobgoblin-of-little-minds-adored 21:55:09 q+ 21:55:55 ack antoine 21:56:34 q+ 21:57:44 ack ncar 21:59:01 rrsagent, generate minutes v2 21:59:01 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/11/20-dxwg-minutes.html DaveBrowning 22:00:28 http://www.w3.org/ns/prov#, http://www.w3.org/ns/org# therefore http://www.w3.org/ns/prof/. It is as abstract! 22:01:55 dsr: two things - the document shortnames and the ontology namespaces 22:02:34 kcoyle: we have resolution for the document namespaces - can the ontology namespaces come later? 22:02:36 dsr: no 22:02:57 kcoyle: what about using github locations 22:03:10 AndreaPerego has joined #dxwg 22:03:21 dsr: profiles ontology - definition should not be in abstract. 22:03:40 q+ 22:03:54 Namespace in abstract follows SSN precedence 22:04:26 action: roba to change abstract to take out definition to add explanation of scope, to change document shortnames 22:04:26 Error finding 'roba'. You can review and register nicknames at . 22:04:27 ACTION: change abstract to take out the definition, to add explanation and change document shortnames. 22:04:27 Error finding 'change'. You can review and register nicknames at . 22:04:36 ack annette_g 22:05:17 ACTION: roba to change abstract to take out the definition, to add explanation and change document shortnames. 22:05:17 Error finding 'roba'. You can review and register nicknames at . 22:05:20 ACTION: @roba change abstract to take out the definition, to add explanation and change document shortnames. 22:05:20 Error finding '@roba'. You can review and register nicknames at . 22:05:33 rrsagent, generate minutes v2 22:05:33 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/11/20-dxwg-minutes.html DaveBrowning 22:06:08 bye! 22:06:11 present-