06:35:42 RRSAgent has joined #tpac 06:35:42 logging to https://www.w3.org/2018/10/24-tpac-irc 06:35:55 Meeting: TPAC2018 06:36:07 Topic: CEO’s introduction 06:36:12 scribenick: dsr 06:36:34 phila has joined #tpac 06:36:38 Jeff Jaffe introduces the session and notes that we have a record number of attendees 06:36:40 ktoumura has joined #tpac 06:36:59 Today is for unstructured geeking following a short plenary 06:37:24 We’re going to hear from the TAG (W3C’s technical architecture group) on topical issues 06:37:40 rrsagent,set logs public 06:38:05 azaroth has joined #tpac 06:38:08 We thank our sponsor 06:38:08 jtandy has joined #tpac 06:38:24 vivien has joined #tpac 06:38:27 anssik has joined #tpac 06:38:28 We encourage you all to give us feedback on the meeting 06:38:29 NicJansma has joined #tpac 06:38:36 Youngsun has joined #tpac 06:38:40 JunGamo has joined #tpac 06:38:46 Xiaolu has joined #tpac 06:38:46 DaveB has joined #tpac 06:38:57 dan has joined #tpac 06:38:57 dom has joined #tpac 06:38:59 anne_thyme has joined #tpac 06:39:03 krit has joined #tpac 06:39:08 Jeff notes W3C’s code of conduct - let’s be on best behavior 06:39:17 kajimoto has joined #tpac 06:39:24 Guest80 has joined #tpac 06:39:26 colin has joined #tpac 06:39:27 Guest80 has left #tpac 06:39:28 martin has joined #tpac 06:39:28 Guest80 has joined #tpac 06:39:36 hiroshiota has joined #tpac 06:39:37 At 9:30 we will have the break out sessions building 06:40:14 I am fire up with the enthusiasmy ou all have. 06:40:23 s/fire/fired/ 06:40:51 Jeff shows a slide listing areas of innovation for the Web 06:41:46 and a second slide on an impressive pipeline of further innovations 06:42:56 This year we have a new way of measuring productivity … 06:43:11 Jeff shows a slide of GitHub commits across W3C 06:43:31 arnog has joined #tpac 06:43:33 something between a 1000 and 1500 commits a month 06:44:10 kaz has joined #tpac 06:44:46 You can see increased activity as groups approach deadlines 06:45:14 Next year’sTPAC will be in Fukouka in southern Japan from 16-20 October 2019 06:45:34 Questions? 06:45:47 [no] 06:45:55 Jeff introduces the TAG 06:46:00 horiuchi has joined #tpac 06:46:11 16 Oct 2019 is a Wednesday. TPAC 2019 runs Wed - Sun?? 06:46:53 tantek has joined #tpac 06:47:31 [note that TPAC 2019 will be held in September (Sep 16-20)] 06:47:36 please see also: https://www.w3.org/participate/eventscal.html 06:47:50 s/October/September/ 06:47:52 Thanks kaz 06:50:32 dap has joined #tpac 06:51:26 Dan introduces the TAG and explains its role 06:51:58 He explains how to open an issue with the TAG on GitHub 06:52:34 Each issue is assigned to a member of the TAG to manage 06:53:23 more info at https://tag.w3.org and https://github.com/w3ctag/meetings 06:54:35 We do regular developer outreach, locally where we are holding face to face meetings 06:54:56 We have an election coming up and three seats up for grabs 06:55:22 Please encourage your W3C Advisory Committee to vote in these elections 06:56:05 We recognise we have a diversity problem, so we encourage you to nominating a more diverse range of people 06:56:19 s/nominating/nominate/ 06:56:37 It is important that the TAG represents the diversity of the Web as a whole 06:57:07 Lukasz introduces the security and privacy questionaire 06:57:42 rachelandrew has joined #tpac 06:57:42 I am a new member of the TAG and a security and privacy researcher 06:57:54 and an advisor to the Red Cross 06:58:00 jeff has joined #tpac 06:58:42 It can be difficult to see how a web API feature can be abused to spy on your privacy 06:59:07 He cites the battery API and CSS max-blend mode 06:59:22 satakagi_ has joined #tpac 06:59:37 Sometimes precision matters, e.g. incognito detection with the Web payment API 07:00:02 We’ve found the perfect solution - more paperwork. :-) 07:00:26 Short video from Monte Python’s the Holy Grail 07:00:38 s/Monte/Monty/ 07:01:28 We need more clarity and context during reviews of security and privacy aspects of new APIs 07:01:55 The new process: privacy by design 07:02:17 Please seek review early 07:02:36 Best recommendations in 5 seconds 07:02:38 Jean-Gui has joined #tpac 07:03:01 xueyuan has joined #tpac 07:03:03 you could drop the feature, or sanitise the data handled, and make a privacy assessment. 07:04:19 You need to consider regulatory aspects - and whether it is a good idea 07:05:16 We don’t want the security and privacy questionnaire to be a tick box exercise, we want you to think carefully before answering 07:05:58 ericlaw has joined #tpac 07:06:39 We hope to finalise the questionnaire next year 07:07:05 vkuntz has joined #tpac 07:07:19 present+ 07:07:36 martin has joined #tpac 07:07:42 Dan opens the floor to questions 07:08:34 Please queue at the microphones 07:09:20 Question: can you tell us what the time commitment is for people on thr TAG? 07:09:34 Dan: a weekly one hour call and 4 face to face meetings 07:10:00 we don’t generally meet during TPAC as we use the time to interact with other groups 07:11:06 It’s about 20% of your working time roughly speaking 07:11:27 We use WebRTC for our calls, so we can see each other 07:12:20 David Singer (Apple): please tell us about the tensions in best practices 07:12:23 tink has joined #tpac 07:13:03 … and trends 07:13:11 tomoyuki has joined #tpac 07:13:40 edent has joined #tpac 07:13:54 Answer: one example is better fidelity for Web APIs and a focus on WebIDL and new JavaScript features e.g. classes and promises and encouraging their use 07:14:42 These days we’re looking at streams and the best ways to deal with them 07:14:47 hirata has joined #tpac 07:15:52 We’re working up to a thorough review of HTML and revising features from the ancient past 07:15:54 vagner has joined #tpac 07:16:33 We’re trying to explain how the higher level of the web platform works underneath 07:16:35 nigel has joined #tpac 07:17:30 mfoltzgoogle has joined #tpac 07:17:30 dlieberman has joined #tpac 07:17:48 We’re seeing a lot of ideas coming from Google, which is great, but we want to see more from a diverse range of people 07:18:26 Dan: we want to better support people who find it hard to attend face to face meertings 07:18:42 tomoyuki has left #tpac 07:18:58 amy has joined #tpac 07:19:20 PhilArcher (GS1): is it time to update the TAG’s architecture of the Web which came out in 2004 and is looking rather dusty 07:19:42 sangchul has joined #tpac 07:19:46 tomoyuki has joined #tpac 07:19:47 hyojin has joined #tpac 07:19:52 jtandy has joined #tpac 07:19:52 Dan: we considered that and decided instead to focus on the design principles dociument instead 07:19:55 caribou has joined #tpac 07:20:00 dlieberman has joined #tpac 07:20:30 gildas has joined #tpac 07:20:49 rego has joined #tpac 07:21:05 The Web is more agile these days and we can address things in streams rather than a big tome 07:21:11 horiuchi has joined #tpac 07:21:36 horiuchi has joined #tpac 07:22:05 Roy has joined #tpac 07:22:07 horiuchi has joined #tpac 07:22:17 Ian Jacobs (W3C staff): web page sniffing is used in payments for risk assessments, how should bona fide needs be addressed 07:22:45 glazou has joined #tpac 07:23:32 Answer: we have no power and can only offer advice. We encourage designers to expose their thinking including what they’re seeking to achieve, along with an awareness of the potential for abuse 07:24:18 Alex: we have a very very rich platform (Dan shows the Unsanctioned Web Tracking document) 07:24:40 hirata has joined #tpac 07:24:49 We want to make sure people make good advice and for browser innovation to improve privacy 07:25:06 s/make/can get/ 07:25:15 Roy has joined #tpac 07:25:32 s/Answer/Hadley/ 07:26:03 rachelandrew_ has joined #tpac 07:26:16 Question: can the TAG comment on how well we’re doing in respect to privacy etc. 07:26:44 Dan: it is quite clear that the Web has had big impact on society, not all good 07:27:33 We have a tussle between browsers that disable features for improved privacy and companies that rely on those features for good business reasons 07:27:54 We as a community need to come together to discuss and reach a broad consenus 07:28:45 mweksler has joined #tpac 07:29:28 mweksler has joined #tpac 07:29:28 You can steal something, e.g. someone’s bag, but there are consequences under the law. This is also true for the Web and we need a balance and to ensure that overall the Web is positive for society 07:30:17 The Web has a great deal of functionality but isn’t exposed to web developer, the question is how to safely expose them to bring parity with native apps 07:30:28 Roy has joined #tpac 07:31:10 Question: is there much work on consulting end users in respect to API and feature design? 07:32:21 Alex: we are indeed interested in encouraging this, and one approach includes a focus on early review of proposed ideas and showing that they really solve end users real needs 07:32:34 "more science and less guessing" 07:33:26 We get feedback by attending conferences and giving talks 07:33:47 sangchul has joined #tpac 07:34:08 We encourage developers to write down why they did what they did as this is often missing from specifications 07:34:31 The lengthy discussion in WGs will be forgotten unless the record is made 07:34:47 (applause) 07:34:57 +1 07:35:44 We tend to review specs twice and find it really useful to have an account of the changes 07:36:26 Question: in our group we like the idea of a technical spec and an explainer spec 07:37:03 is this a pattern worth exploring more 07:37:31 (some technical details about role of URL handlers) 07:38:43 Some discussion about best practice and the need for further discussion 07:39:21 Question: what about domain specific languages such as math, music chemistry etc. 07:39:45 We we just convert everything to SVG or can we preserve the semantic info? 07:40:01 s/We we/Do we 07:40:10 Dan: Web Components are a useful building block 07:40:44 Alex: we’ve just issued guidance on how to use them effectively 07:41:25 it would be a shame to lose the domain semantics 07:42:24 Previously you had to wait on browers to integrate support, but now with WEeb Components you can do this yourselves 07:42:35 Dan thanks everyone 07:42:51 Topic: Unconference Planning 07:43:00 Coralie explains … 07:43:38 The sessions start at 11am and continue after lunch. We’ve prepared a grid for time slots and meeting rooms 07:44:56 Session proposers write down their idea on a stick note and put it on the matrix board 07:45:23 We can then move meetings around to reduce conflicts 07:45:43 Lunch is level -2. Breaks are between 3 and 4 one level up 07:46:02 rrsagent, make minutes v2 07:46:02 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/10/24-tpac-minutes.html dsr 07:47:00 MarkVickers has joined #tpac 07:48:23 tomoyuki has joined #tpac 07:48:29 PWinstanley has joined #tpac 07:50:13 rachelandrew has joined #tpac 07:53:03 jtandy has joined #tpac 07:54:48 JohnJansen has joined #tpac 07:56:46 horiuchi has joined #tpac 07:57:23 DaveB has left #tpac 08:02:35 horiuchi has joined #tpac 08:02:49 Roy has joined #tpac 08:02:56 Karen has joined #tpac 08:04:21 JunGamo has left #tpac 08:04:24 mfoltzgoogle has joined #tpac 08:05:10 takio has joined #tpac 08:06:10 jtandy has joined #tpac 08:08:47 phila has joined #tpac 08:10:33 Roy has joined #tpac 08:10:34 Karen_ has joined #tpac 08:16:03 Roy has joined #tpac 08:16:32 MarkVickers has joined #tpac 08:18:07 dom has joined #tpac 08:20:21 rachelandrew has joined #tpac 08:22:34 horiuchi has joined #tpac 08:26:21 mweksler has joined #tpac 08:30:01 dsr has joined #tpac 08:30:49 npdoty has joined #tpac 08:33:27 horiuchi has joined #tpac 08:37:36 horiuchi has joined #tpac 08:40:45 naomi has joined #tpac 08:46:04 horiuchi has joined #tpac 08:46:44 tomoyuki has joined #tpac 08:47:19 ericlaw has joined #tpac 08:47:54 naomi has joined #tpac 08:49:12 naomi_ has joined #tpac 08:50:53 rachelandrew has joined #tpac 08:52:17 Karen has joined #tpac 08:54:04 Karen_ has joined #tpac 08:54:30 Roy has joined #tpac 08:56:05 tink has joined #tpac 08:57:00 anssik has joined #tpac 08:59:21 horiuchi has joined #tpac 08:59:45 takio has joined #tpac 09:02:14 dsinger has joined #tpac 09:02:18 jeff has joined #tpac 09:02:46 horiuchi_ has joined #tpac 09:03:10 IRC channel for the Accessibility Tree session is #AccTree 09:04:03 toshiakikoike has joined #tpac 09:04:07 sangchul has joined #tpac 09:04:11 magnus has joined #tpac 09:04:15 dom has joined #tpac 09:05:58 jtandy has joined #tpac 09:06:30 azaroth has joined #tpac 09:07:00 Hexcles has joined #tpac 09:07:14 Karen has joined #tpac 09:07:22 phila has joined #tpac 09:07:54 frodek has joined #tpac 09:10:15 Karen_ has joined #tpac 09:12:01 #webmachinelearning for machinelearning 09:12:36 sangchul_ has joined #tpac 09:13:23 Karen_ has joined #tpac 09:14:35 Brian_R has joined #tpac 09:14:38 #css for CSS WG - the Community with testing 09:14:50 jtandy has joined #tpac 09:16:55 nigel has joined #tpac 09:23:35 satakagi_ has joined #tpac 09:24:05 sangchul_ has joined #tpac 09:24:29 Guest80 has joined #tpac 09:25:11 SofianeB has joined #tpac 09:31:52 naomi has joined #tpac 09:34:43 tantek has joined #tpac 09:47:23 tanya has joined #tpac 09:50:25 Guest80 has joined #tpac 09:59:07 jacques has joined #tpac 10:04:02 horiuchi has joined #tpac 10:05:58 simonstey has joined #tpac 10:09:37 naomi has joined #tpac 10:12:29 naomi_ has joined #tpac 10:13:01 phila has joined #tpac 10:23:34 mweksler has joined #tpac 10:30:44 horiuchi has joined #tpac 10:31:04 naomi has joined #tpac 10:32:23 mweksler has joined #tpac 10:38:26 mweksler has joined #tpac 10:51:22 tanya has joined #tpac 10:53:11 Brian_R has joined #tpac 10:56:07 Karen has joined #tpac 10:58:39 Karen_ has joined #tpac 11:02:10 frodek has joined #tpac 11:02:37 Guest80 has joined #tpac 11:03:29 toshiakikoike has joined #tpac 11:03:47 dom has joined #tpac 11:03:51 tanya has joined #tpac 11:03:52 dan has joined #tpac 11:06:23 jtandy has joined #tpac 11:06:56 tomoyuki has joined #tpac 11:07:13 phila has joined #tpac 11:07:37 satakagi_ has joined #tpac 11:07:40 Karen has joined #tpac 11:08:22 tantek has joined #tpac 11:08:27 dsinger has joined #tpac 11:09:05 horiuchi has joined #tpac 11:09:58 horiuchi has joined #tpac 11:10:09 Karen_ has joined #tpac 11:12:36 dsr has joined #tpac 11:14:08 Orphis has joined #tpac 11:15:24 nigel has joined #tpac 11:16:30 mweksler has joined #tpac 11:17:12 takio has joined #tpac 11:18:44 Brian_R has joined #tpac 11:18:58 sangchul has joined #tpac 11:28:06 Karen has joined #tpac 11:31:50 glazou has joined #tpac 11:32:13 Karen_ has joined #tpac 11:37:16 takio_ has joined #tpac 11:42:37 naomi has joined #tpac 11:44:00 Karen has joined #tpac 11:45:03 Karen_ has joined #tpac 11:45:25 mweksler has joined #tpac 11:46:57 cobrien_ has joined #tpac 11:47:35 horiuchi has joined #tpac 11:49:03 naomi_ has joined #tpac 11:50:04 dsr has joined #tpac 11:52:13 naomi has joined #tpac 11:53:38 nigel has joined #tpac 11:57:20 Guest80 has joined #tpac 12:01:13 sangchul has joined #tpac 12:01:31 dsinger has joined #tpac 12:01:54 horiuchi has joined #tpac 12:01:56 jtandy has joined #tpac 12:02:52 takio has joined #tpac 12:03:59 horiuchi_ has joined #tpac 12:04:25 toshiakikoike has joined #tpac 12:04:27 tomoyuki has joined #tpac 12:04:52 Hexcles has joined #tpac 12:05:26 horiuchi_ has joined #tpac 12:05:33 naomi has joined #tpac 12:05:43 dom has joined #tpac 12:06:14 tink has joined #tpac 12:07:07 JohnJansen has joined #tpac 12:07:09 sangchul has joined #tpac 12:07:36 horiuchi_ has joined #tpac 12:08:08 toshiakikoike has joined #tpac 12:08:47 web-platform-tests discussion in #testing 12:09:21 tantek has joined #tpac 12:11:17 horiuchi has joined #tpac 12:11:21 Karen has joined #tpac 12:13:19 satakagi_ has joined #tpac 12:15:00 t_homma has joined #tpac 12:15:03 horiuchi has joined #tpac 12:17:45 DonDiego has joined #tpac 12:18:09 horiuchi_ has joined #tpac 12:18:21 tink has left #tpac 12:29:01 #webgpu 12:36:13 Karen has joined #tpac 12:38:27 Karen_ has joined #tpac 12:42:28 SofianeB has joined #tpac 12:48:18 tanya has joined #tpac 12:53:55 xueyuan has joined #tpac 12:56:35 horiuchi has joined #tpac 12:58:13 sangchul has joined #tpac 12:59:27 naomi has joined #tpac 13:00:03 horiuchi has joined #tpac 13:01:37 mweksler has joined #tpac 13:05:34 Guest80 has joined #tpac 13:07:24 xueyuan has joined #tpac 13:10:53 JohnJansen has joined #tpac 13:11:36 vmpstr has joined #tpac 13:14:19 horiuchi has joined #tpac 13:15:06 Guest80 has joined #tpac 13:16:51 sangchul has joined #tpac 13:17:50 Kelvin has joined #tpac 13:19:53 frodek has joined #tpac 13:22:16 mweksler has joined #tpac 13:24:04 mweksler has joined #tpac 13:27:30 t_homma has joined #tpac 13:28:31 Karen has joined #tpac 13:28:48 tomoyuki has joined #tpac 13:29:09 frodek has joined #tpac 13:29:13 horiuchi_ has joined #tpac 13:29:34 dsinger has joined #tpac 13:29:43 horiuchi has joined #tpac 13:31:17 nigel has joined #tpac 13:32:25 personalization in #personalization 13:33:22 dsr has joined #tpac 13:33:23 toshiakikoike has joined #tpac 13:33:26 phila has joined #tpac 13:34:34 satakagi_ has joined #tpac 13:34:52 sangchul has joined #tpac 13:35:55 Hexcles has joined #tpac 13:37:52 tantek has joined #tpac 13:42:45 Guest80 has joined #tpac 13:46:29 chrwilliams has joined #tpac 13:48:29 JohnJansen has joined #tpac 13:51:10 chrwilliams has joined #tpac 13:57:18 satakag__ has joined #tpac 13:59:38 tanya has joined #tpac 14:07:04 xueyuan has joined #tpac 14:09:15 xueyuan has joined #tpac 14:10:04 frodek has joined #tpac 14:10:54 glazou has joined #tpac 14:16:25 sangchul has joined #tpac 14:26:10 dsr has joined #tpac 14:29:06 horiuchi has joined #tpac 14:30:41 mweksler has joined #tpac 14:32:00 horiuchi_ has joined #tpac 14:34:04 satakagi_ has joined #tpac 14:41:31 Bert has joined #tpac 14:43:23 horiuchi has joined #tpac 14:44:20 dsinger has joined #tpac 14:45:55 Zakim has joined #tpac 14:49:13 MarkVickers has joined #tpac 14:50:21 mweksler has joined #tpac 14:50:45 nigel has joined #tpac 14:51:36 Topic: Break-out reports 14:51:45 scribenick: Bert 14:51:54 nigel_ has joined #tpac 14:52:10 mweksler has joined #tpac 14:52:20 Coralie introduces the session. Epxlains the procedure. Those who held sessions are invited to come to the stage. 14:52:50 (People are gathering on stage.) 14:53:06 Reports should be 1-2 minutes, not more. 14:53:27 AnnevK: contributing to HTML session. 14:53:45 ... Concl is you need 2 implementers on board, 14:53:50 mweksler has joined #tpac 14:54:02 ... Contribution need to standards-quality. 14:54:09 colin has joined #tpac 14:54:10 s/to/to be/ 14:54:54 Philip: Web Platform test. MS has built an online test tool. 14:55:16 Mats: ML for the Web: Kick of incubation 14:55:32 ... High interest. All major browsers there. 60 people in the room. 14:55:50 ... Proof of concept in Chromium showed that it can be done. 14:56:09 ... Findings from this impl. are that performance is good, close to native. 14:56:15 ... Optimizations possible. 14:56:29 ... Can be a polyfill on top of WebGL. 14:56:41 ... Leaning to exposing both high and low level API. 14:56:55 ... First ftf on Friday pm. 14:57:22 Peter: Maps for HTML: Value of lowering barriers to sptial info on the Web. 14:57:26 ... Gave a demo. 14:57:35 s/sptial/spatial/ 14:57:54 ... Talked about collab between geo-spatial and W3C communities. 14:57:59 ... Polyfills. 14:58:10 ... Progressive enhancements of those. 14:58:17 naomi has joined #tpac 14:58:34 ... SVG mapping community collab started at this TPAC. 14:58:50 Dan: Web and networks: 14:59:00 ... followup on a workshop 5 months ago. 14:59:09 ... Wanted to bounce off ideas. 14:59:32 ... Exposing hints between appls and networks, optimize without impacting privacy. 14:59:47 ... We stated som learned lessons. 14:59:55 ... Figure out the principles. 15:00:02 ... Mutually beneficial. 15:00:09 ... Cheat-proof 15:00:26 ... Emphasis on hints rather than strong controls. 15:00:32 ... Exploring interest. 15:00:39 ... Planning an IG. 15:00:40 atai has joined #tpac 15:00:59 Dom: MDN: 15:01:18 ... We had people form project advisory board of MDN. 15:01:34 ... Discussed reslts of collab between the various partners. 15:01:52 ... Discussed input from participnts in the breakout. 15:02:07 ... I18n and a11y to be added to MDN 15:02:15 ... Workflow of documentation. 15:02:22 hirata has joined #tpac 15:02:25 Ralph has joined #tpac 15:02:25 ... Approach me if you want to know more. 15:03:02 Mado@@): Decentralize IDs: 15:03:12 jtandy has joined #tpac 15:03:14 ... Showed presentation, use cases, next steps. 15:03:26 ... Workshop at MS in December 15:03:45 ... Propisng a WG early next year. 15:04:04 @@@: Verifiable credentials. 15:04:06 s/Mado@@/Manu 15:04:17 ... What other standards do we need to create. 15:04:27 ... How to improve our messaging. 15:04:36 ... Does Blockchain solve our pbs. 15:04:49 s/@@@/Joe Andrieu 15:05:13 Cyril: Make a communtiy at W3C or join an existing one. 15:05:19 tomoyuki has joined #tpac 15:06:22 @@@@: [Sorry, scribe doesn't understand what the topic is] 15:06:51 ... Proposal is a new feature to set a header to allow browser to create new toplevel browing context. 15:07:03 ... We figuredout a way for level-2 protection. 15:07:23 ... So that web site cannot load resources from another. 15:07:50 fantasai: Spec-editing best practices: 15:07:59 ... 1) define the overall model. 15:08:12 ... 2) Start with an overview, high-level 15:08:29 ... Both overall for spec and per section. 15:08:50 ... Example from CSS is how borders interact with tables. 15:09:04 ... 3) Keep examples close to the definitions. 15:09:25 .. 4) Use illustrations and diagram generously, but not as a replacement for normative prose. 15:09:59 ... 5) Possible modes are constraint-based and @1-based spec writing. 15:10:25 toshiakikoike has joined #tpac 15:10:25 ... 6) Esptablish convention for writign about things. 15:10:48 ... 7) Read tou spec form top to bottom to see if your local edits still make sense in the whole. 15:11:10 ... 8) Review the table of contemnts regularly, see if it makes sense. 15:11:24 ...9) section titles should be evacative. 15:11:57 ... 10) Generous with sub-headings, so you can point to bits of the spec. 15:12:32 ... *) Use preprocessor, source contriol, link checker, and respond to all comments 15:12:47 ... Invite the commenter to respond to your answer. 15:12:57 tomoyuki has joined #tpac 15:13:18 phila has joined #tpac 15:13:25 Tosha@: 15:13:43 ... I shared my program. 15:14:00 ... We discussed how to send haptic info and vision sinultaneaously 15:14:06 ... Discussed methods. 15:14:15 ... Still research. 15:14:30 ... Not ready for commercial use. 15:14:36 ... Media IG 15:14:55 Charles: Personalization: 15:15:10 ... Goal is to adapt content much more than is currently supported. 15:15:25 ... Some people need content without numbers, e.g., 15:15:37 ... Suggestion for attribute "purpose" 15:15:39 s/Tosha@/Toshiya 15:15:49 ... Could also be helpful for others such as Publishing WG. 15:15:53 Ian has joined #tpac 15:16:05 ... There ay be other options, such as Web Components. 15:16:15 ... NExt step s are to explore them. 15:16:25 ... We will ask the TAG for a review of our explainer. 15:16:44 Mark: Improving spoken presentations: 15:16:55 ... IMS global learning consortium. 15:17:11 ... Education space, students facing mispronounced content. 15:17:27 ... Content eventually ends up in HTML, so we need support for HTML. 15:17:44 ... We have SSML, we had CSS speech, which went mute. 15:18:00 ... We will take disussion to task force. 15:18:22 ... Will here be voice fonts, like Web fonts? 15:18:29 s/here/there 15:18:45 @3: Spatial navigation 15:18:54 ... Gathered some feedback 15:19:02 ... We currently consider 4 ways. 15:19:09 ... But need to consider more. 15:19:30 ... Friday at 10 there will be another session 15:20:06 @4: Implemented voice communication surveys 15:20:15 ... Launched commercial surveys 15:20:29 ... About 5 million uses expected in 2019 15:20:34 s/@4/Bobby_Tung:/ 15:20:40 ... Sign language recognition 15:21:08 ... Community group. 15:21:17 @5: Fair use 15:21:23 s/@3/JihyeHong/ 15:21:30 ... Use cases 15:21:47 ... Conclusion is to I will contact experts for more uses cases. 15:21:54 s/@5/Shigeru/ 15:21:59 Jasoon: DNT: 15:22:06 s/Bobby_Tung:/Baoping Chen: 15:22:12 s/Jasoon/JNovak/ 15:22:14 ... WG ended, CR will become a Note. 15:22:30 ... Try to find privacy-friendly alternatived 15:22:41 ... W3C still cares. 15:22:55 ... Web advertising CommGroup continues. 15:23:05 Michael: Domain-specific languages: 15:23:19 ... Examples: Math, Chemistry. 15:23:32 ... They need semantics and a11y. 15:23:40 ... Houdini may help. 15:23:57 ... Use cases from publishing showed convergence. 15:24:06 ... Horizontal review breakout: 15:24:21 ... Challenges, how hard it is, how long it takes. 15:24:35 ... At what time to do the review. 15:24:45 ... Github workflow issues 15:24:48 ... Self-review 15:25:15 @6: Quick apps: 15:25:30 ... Combine potability and native efficiency 15:25:41 ... API and memory footprint 15:25:49 s/@6:/Zhiqiang Yu: 15:25:51 ... We looked at details, uses cases, motivation 15:26:07 ... This topic raised a lot of interest. 15:26:19 ... Make more capabilities in quick apps. 15:26:39 ... Push for XR integration 15:27:00 ... AI, low and high level 15:27:21 ... High level, such as face recognition. 15:27:31 ... New community group recently formed 15:27:48 ... Another potential step is work with Web packaging 15:27:56 sugiuchiH has joined #tpac 15:28:04 ... Easier distibution of app 15:28:12 ... Welcome all collaborations 15:28:33 @7: Web packaging: 15:28:42 s/@7/Kinuko/ 15:28:50 ... Lots of different groups showed interest, e.g., ebooks. 15:29:01 ... How can people get involved? 15:29:15 ... Web packaging currently designed for short, caching. 15:29:36 scribenick: Ian 15:29:39 ... Can probably make some other use cases. 15:29:49 David Singer: Speaking with my AB hat on. 15:30:05 ...we had a lively session on evergreen standards 15:30:16 ...apparently we need to do registries here (at W3C) 15:30:28 ...we wondered whether we could use evergreen standards for maintenance 15:30:37 ...also wondered whether we need IPR commitments for those specs 15:30:57 ...there's also a question about review...tension between early review v. infrequent review; we want to bridge gaps 15:31:11 ...we can use tooling / automation to our advantage (e.g., diffs) 15:31:19 ...next steps - there is a wiki page for use cases and aspirations 15:31:29 ...we will take discussion into the Process CG that EVERYONE SHOULD JOIN!! 15:32:05 Eric Eggert: We did a talked about WAI resources 15:32:16 ...videos 15:32:22 ...evaluation tools 15:32:28 ...WCAG quick references 15:32:34 ...we also redesigned the WAI Website 15:32:46 ...we also plan to revamp our business case for accessibility documentation 15:32:55 ...we plan to ask you for translations of these materials. 15:32:55 mdadas has joined #tpac 15:33:00 ..thanks to all (4) who came to my session. 15:33:08 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/10/24-tpac-minutes.html Ian 15:33:27 Sandro Hawke: I ran the credit web session. We hate the term "fake news"! 15:33:32 ...we typically say "misinformation" 15:33:39 s/credit/credible 15:33:50 ...we had good turnout but some were not there due to Misinformation conference in London 15:34:06 ...focus is how people can trust what they find online; how can we help people being misled 15:34:23 ...we aim to create an ecosystem of tools that can assist in evaluation of credibility 15:35:00 ...e.g., warnings or annotations about content 15:35:00 ...someone even suggested (as a joke) spooky music on risky pages 15:35:00 ...question in our session on role of browsers in enabling evaluation tools to plug in 15:35:09 ...we welcome feedback on our CG report and also our spec 15:35:18 ...next steps: We meet Friday this week; please review the stuff at credweb.org ! 15:36:05 Tzvia + Angel: We ran a session with Natasha Rooney on positive work environment and effectives task forces 15:36:15 jtandy has joined #tpac 15:36:19 ....one thing we did was update /Guide with more information useful to chairs; also overhauled it 15:36:26 ...there's also a process doc for busy people 15:36:33 ..and a chair buddies option available 15:36:45 ...there were many suggestions for outreach to members especially for new members 15:36:53 ...some suggestions for making specs easier to digest 15:36:56 s/Tzvia + Angel/Tzviya_and_Angal/ 15:36:58 ...and how to write them 15:37:00 s/..and/...and 15:37:07 ...time zone challenges.... 15:37:09 s/Angal/Angel/ 15:37:23 ...we welcome participation and suggestions for the working effectiveness task force. 15:37:37 ...e.g., internal tooling for GitHub would be welcome if you have internal tools 15:37:57 Angel: Regarding PWE, we have an ombudsman program and plan to improve it 15:38:06 RRSAgent, make minutes v2 15:38:06 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/10/24-tpac-minutes.html Bert 15:38:17 s/ombudsman/ombudsperson 15:38:24 ...we identified two cases from past experience (1) harassment (2) distractions 15:38:44 s/Sandro Hawke/Sandro_Hawke/ 15:38:47 ...to deal with these complicated cases we think the current ombudspeople need to be more empowered. 15:38:57 ...we also plan to call them "ombuddies" 15:39:05 s/Eric Eggert/Eric_Eggert 15:39:19 ...one suggestion we heard was to publish a calendar feed to help people with calendaring 15:39:20 s/David Singer/David_Singer 15:39:37 s/Zhiqiang Yu/Zhiqiang_Yu 15:39:55 ...there is an ongoing review of the code of conduct document; we want some review from diverse cultural perspectives to avoid it being misused. 15:40:03 s/Baoping Chen/Baoping_Chen 15:40:28 ...we also need some additional cultural sensitivities (e.g., around assertion of one's expertise) 15:40:36 s/communtiy/community/ 15:40:50 ...we would also like to increase support (including monetarily) to help people participate who would not otherwise be able to. 15:41:03 s/Joe Andrieu/Joe_Andrieu 15:41:04 ...we have a PWE CG; please join, and give feedback on the revised Code of Conduct 15:41:21 Rob_Smith: I chaired a session on video metadata cues supporting geolocation 15:41:23 s/Manu)/Manu 15:41:40 ...I am leading work on video/geolocation sync ... we have identified requirements for emerging markets 15:41:48 ...see @@ for demos in action 15:41:51 dsinger has joined #tpac 15:42:08 ...question for the breakout session was whether we could piggyback the html text tract channel for geolocation metadata 15:42:16 ...or do we need a special kind of cue for maps 15:42:22 ...we plan to resolve this in the WICG 15:42:30 ...please join us there. 15:42:45 ..many thanks to the media and entertainment group and others who contributed to the discussion 15:43:01 ...we'll report the results of this session to the Spatial Data IG and the CG. Thanks! 15:43:25 Francois_Daoust: Gaming on the Web! In 2011 W3C organized a workshop where we identified a number of technical gaps: 15:43:27 - orientation 15:43:30 - game pad 15:43:36 - pass params by reference cross workers 15:43:46 ...led to the games CG 15:43:46 horiuchi has joined #tpac 15:43:57 ..that CG continued to work on use cases and requirements, which went to WGs. 15:44:11 ...good news: the gaps that had been identified have been filled! 15:44:17 ...of course things have changed since then 15:44:24 s/ - /... - / 15:44:24 s/ - /... - / 15:44:25 s/ - /... - / 15:44:34 RRSAgent, make minutes v2 15:44:34 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/10/24-tpac-minutes.html Bert 15:44:38 ...we have more work underway: WebGPU, WebVR...other capabilities emerging to support games on the web 15:44:58 ...gamers are a tough audience for specs. They want perfection! 15:45:13 ..looking at games is a good way to achieve more "professional" results 15:45:21 ...with that in mind, we looked at some remaining gaps 15:45:30 ...should we 15:45:35 .... - organize a second workshop? 15:45:36 Guest80 has joined #tpac 15:45:44 ... - revive the CG? 15:45:51 s/ - /... -- / 15:45:51 ...it was exciting to see motivated people. Thanks! 15:45:52 s/ - /... -- / 15:45:54 s/ - /... -- / 15:46:04 s/... .../.../ 15:46:10 s/... .../.../ 15:46:19 RRSAgent, make minutes v2 15:46:19 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/10/24-tpac-minutes.html Bert 15:46:29 Kaz_Ashimura: Demos! Come to CSS meeting. 15:47:03 s/- orientation/... - orientation 15:47:11 @@8: Ran a couple of sessions. One was on privacy / fingerprinting. We distinguished "mechanism" from "features exposed". We concluded that the mechanism was not harmful. 15:47:17 s/- game pad/... - game pad 15:47:19 ...there's open debate still on the features themselves 15:47:53 ...second session on the exposure of resources; we discussed unexposing a couple of features (e.g., subresource timing) 15:47:56 s/@@8/Yoav_Weiss 15:48:05 ...the conclusion was @@. 15:48:05 RRSAgent, make minutes v2 15:48:05 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/10/24-tpac-minutes.html Bert 15:48:11 ...but we plan to reconvene shortly. 15:48:32 koalie: Thanks everyone! Next up - a reception from 6:30-9pm in the lunch space. 15:48:39 ...thanks also to the scribes. 15:48:41 s/... .../.../ 15:48:42 ADJOURNED. 15:48:49 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/10/24-tpac-minutes.html Ian 15:48:52 Ian has left #tpac 15:49:31 s/ -- / - /g 15:50:57 s/Kick of /Kick off / 15:51:51 s/som learned/some learned 15:52:21 s/reslts/results 15:52:39 s/participnts/participants 15:53:05 s/Decentralize ID/Decentralized ID/ 15:53:20 s/Propisng/Proposing 15:53:52 s/figuredout/figured out 15:54:21 s/diagram/diagrams 15:54:47 s/Read tou/Read the 15:55:10 s/contemnts/contents/ 15:55:25 s/evacative/evocative 15:56:12 s/There ay be/There may be 15:56:29 s/NExt step s/Next steps 15:57:25 s/: Implemented voice/Implemented voice 15:57:43 s/million uses/million users 15:58:01 s/is to I will/is that I will 15:58:17 s/alternatived/alternatives 15:59:05 s/potability/portability 16:00:20 s/caching/caching. Can probably make some other use cases./ 16:00:38 s/... Can probably make some other use cases.// 16:00:52 RRSAgent, make minutes v2 16:00:52 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/10/24-tpac-minutes.html Bert 16:01:34 s/We did a talked/We talked 16:02:34 RRSAgent, make minutes v2 16:02:34 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/10/24-tpac-minutes.html Bert 16:09:06 mweksler has joined #tpac 16:17:18 naomi has joined #tpac 16:21:36 naomi has joined #tpac 16:28:33 naomi has joined #tpac 16:29:15 atai has joined #tpac 16:29:16 naomi has joined #tpac 16:33:40 naomi has joined #tpac 16:52:49 naomi has joined #tpac 17:24:44 naomi has joined #tpac 19:11:43 mweksler has joined #tpac 19:37:07 horiuchi has joined #tpac 19:57:18 Ralph has joined #tpac 20:00:15 RalphS has joined #tpac 20:32:48 caribou has left #tpac 20:36:35 vagner has joined #tpac 20:44:39 mweksler has joined #tpac 21:29:06 Zakim has left #tpac 21:29:30 rrsagent, bye 21:29:30 I see no action items