06:07:06 RRSAgent has joined #dxwg 06:07:06 logging to https://www.w3.org/2018/05/08-dxwg-irc 06:07:15 rrsagent, make logs public 06:07:41 chair: KCoyle & PWinstanley 06:07:51 present+ 06:08:07 rrsagent, create minutes v2 06:08:07 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/05/08-dxwg-minutes.html PWinstanley 06:09:02 scribe:LarsG 06:10:48 riccardoAlbertoni has joined #dxwg 06:11:46 LarsG has joined #dxwg 06:11:53 kcoyle has joined #dxwg 06:12:36 Jaroslav_Pullmann has joined #dxwg 06:13:00 DaveBrowning has joined #dxwg 06:14:35 present+ 06:15:11 present+ 06:15:13 present+ 06:15:19 present+ 06:15:22 scribe LarsG 06:15:24 present+ 06:15:28 AndreaPerego has joined #dxwg 06:15:28 scribenick LarsG 06:15:32 present+ 06:15:36 SimonCox has joined #dxwg 06:15:36 present+ AndreaPerego 06:15:43 danbri has joined #dxwg 06:15:47 topic: Gather 06:16:02 kcoyle thanks Riccardo for organising the meeting 06:16:04 present+ 06:16:13 present+ 06:16:28 ... short round of introductions 06:16:57 agenda: https://www.w3.org/2017/dxwg/wiki/F2f3 06:17:08 RRSAgent, make logs world 06:17:17 ... first day introduction to ideas around profiles 06:17:18 RRSAgent, draft minutes v2 06:17:18 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/05/08-dxwg-minutes.html AndreaPerego 06:17:25 ... then we go on to discuss those ideas 06:17:38 ... we want to do this quickly due to time constraints 06:17:50 ... [checking people online] 06:17:57 agenda: https://www.w3.org/2017/dxwg/wiki/F2f3 06:17:59 RRSAgent, draft minutes v2 06:17:59 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/05/08-dxwg-minutes.html AndreaPerego 06:18:01 s/people/who is 06:18:28 ... we need to set well-defined goals 06:18:29 meeting: DXWG F2F3 - Day 1 06:18:31 RRSAgent, draft minutes v2 06:18:31 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/05/08-dxwg-minutes.html AndreaPerego 06:18:44 ... We have the charge of doing three different deliverables, so we 06:18:50 mr_wibble has joined #dxwg 06:18:58 ... need to formulate what we want with profiles so that we can deliver 06:19:06 ... need to be clear what a profile is 06:19:35 mr_wibble, who are you? 06:19:50 Tom Baker 06:19:53 It's Tom 06:20:04 The meeting is host by Italian National Council of Research - Institute of applied mathematics and information technologies 06:20:04 can't you hear us? 06:20:06 This is the default I was given - will try 06:20:27 zakim, mr_wibble is TomBaker 06:20:27 sorry, AndreaPerego, I do not recognize a party named 'mr_wibble' 06:20:46 type: /nick TomBaker 06:20:48 zakim, I am really TomBaker 06:20:48 I don't understand 'I am really TomBaker', mr_wibble 06:21:02 zakim, mr_wibble is really TomBaker 06:21:02 sorry, mr_wibble, I do not recognize a party named 'mr_wibble' 06:21:08 q+ maybe stoping your video would help 06:21:22 q? 06:21:31 ... There is a definition of profile https://w3c.github.io/dxwg/profiles/#Introduction 06:21:56 ... topic is complex 06:22:08 tom, just visit irc.w3.org in a new tab abd come in with a new nickname, then close this one 06:22:45 SimonCox: Break it down to separate concerns 06:23:02 ... should have a name and has as set of dependencies 06:23:04 tom_baker has joined #dxwg 06:23:35 AndreaPerego: Is this profile in general or application profile in particular? 06:23:45 q? 06:24:01 q? 06:25:45 I'm not hearing anything now 06:25:57 but I see the screen 06:25:57 q? 06:26:09 q? 06:26:17 q? 06:26:19 q+ to ask about how we should handle the Q for people in the room 06:26:34 q? 06:26:40 kcoyle: [rewriting profile definition] 06:26:55 q+ 06:27:28 ack SimonCox 06:27:28 SimonCox, you wanted to ask about how we should handle the Q for people in the room 06:27:34 s/scribenick LarsG/scribenick: LarsG/ 06:27:49 RRSAgent, draft minutes v2 06:27:49 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/05/08-dxwg-minutes.html AndreaPerego 06:28:27 s/kcoyle thanks Riccardo for organising the meeting/kcoyle: thanks Riccardo for organising the meeting/ 06:28:35 RRSAgent, draft minutes v2 06:28:35 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/05/08-dxwg-minutes.html AndreaPerego 06:28:36 SimonCox: asks about using the queue since there are many people in the room 06:29:06 https://docs.google.com/document/d/15OfNXU9AJ-cZysc7uYP-Gks5dDa8n2B5IN6rWa3kRpo/edit?usp=sharing 06:29:14 ack PWinstanley 06:29:19 Makx has joined #dxwg 06:29:25 ... and discussion tends to be livelier and the use of the queue slows 06:29:30 ... things down 06:29:43 kcoyle: agrees, we'll have the open discussion later 06:30:09 PWinstanley: suggests using a GoogleDoc instead 06:31:12 kcoyle: can we accept this definition as in the GoogleDoc 06:31:21 ... and move on 06:31:55 present+ Makx 06:32:13 s/scribe LarsG/scribe: LarsG/ 06:32:15 RRSAgent, draft minutes v2 06:32:15 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/05/08-dxwg-minutes.html AndreaPerego 06:32:53 q? 06:33:15 [work on the profile def in the GoogleDoc] 06:35:41 Makx's presentation: http://makxdekkers.com/DXWG/DCAT-AP.pdf 06:36:06 kcoyle: Highlights that there are quite a lot of issues on the agenda 06:36:07 http://makxdekkers.com/DXWG/DCAT-AP.pdf 06:36:25 ... that we need to address before the end of the meeting 06:36:40 SimonCox: Profile definition: 06:37:01 ... 1 what it is, 2 what it does, 3 it has a name 06:37:49 Jaroslav_Pullmann: This is all about constraints but doesn't address 06:38:03 ... how a new vocabulary is constructed by the use of profiles 06:38:20 ... This we need to discuss. It's about the re-use of other 06:38:34 ... vocabularies (subsets etc.). 06:38:57 PWinstanley: is the identifier necessarily a URI? 06:39:06 kcoyle: LarsG says it is 06:39:19 Topic: Presentation DCAT-AP by Makx 06:40:01 rrsagent, create minutes v2 06:40:01 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/05/08-dxwg-minutes.html PWinstanley 06:40:51 Makx: DCAT-AP was developed for European data portals 06:41:32 ... [text is essentially in the slides] 06:45:39 q+ to ask if dcat-ap defines anything at syntax level, either choices of rdf format (rdfxml, ntriples, n3, turtle, jsonld, rdfa, microdata), or subsets of those (eg via xml or json schema). 06:45:46 ... #5 the process used was very similar to the W3C process 06:48:46 ... #7 kinds of questions, "what is the difference between publisher and contact point" 06:49:23 q? 06:49:34 ... #7 maintenance of profiles is an important part of the development 06:49:40 @danbri - no 06:49:46 present+ 06:49:55 q- 06:51:46 ... #9 some additions added from experience, some more forward-looking 06:54:56 ... #10 much of the discussion in the group was about the 06:55:15 ... mandatory vs recommended use of licensing information 06:56:06 q+ to ask Makx if the proposed definition accommodates DCAT-AP? 06:56:27 ... #11 one guideline is about how to extend the DCAT-AP profile 06:56:46 ... e. g. which controlled vocabularies to use 06:56:56 q+ to also ask if this proposed formalization makes sense https://github.com/w3c/dxwg/tree/gh-pages/profiledesc/examples#dcat 06:57:36 ... there is an analysis report to see how the national profiles 06:57:44 ... differ from DCAT-AP 07:00:07 ... #12 some of the properties that were thought to be crucial weren't much used 07:00:42 ... whereas other optional ones found many implementers 07:00:57 ... obviously some properties were confusing 07:04:05 Does GeoDCAT-AP have dependencies on any named base specifications in addition to DCAT? 07:05:08 danbri_ has joined #dxwg 07:05:50 danbri2 has joined #dxwg 07:06:37 kcoyle: Thanks Makx, this shows the complexity of a real working 07:06:51 q? 07:06:57 ... profile. Suggests to do the discussion in the GoogleDoc 07:07:47 https://github.com/w3c/dxwg/tree/gh-pages/profiledesc/examples#dcat-ap 07:08:01 SimonCox: has DCAT-AP WG been looking at formalisations, e g the one 07:08:10 ... SimonCox posts? 07:08:38 Makx: What we have done is to try to describe the profile using SHACL 07:09:12 SimonCox: The is DCAT-AP currently documented? 07:09:15 https://joinup.ec.europa.eu/release/dcat-ap-v11 07:09:31 Makx: Refers to the documentation site 07:10:09 ... there are several formats (doc, rdfs, shacl, JSON-LD Context) 07:10:29 q+ 07:10:31 ... SHACL is very incomplete (only checks mandatory fields, should be extended) 07:10:46 ... to include other parts of the specification 07:11:10 SimonCox: Very cool! 07:11:23 Topic: Proposal - (Nick & Rob) 07:11:35 q? 07:11:37 RRSAgent, draft minutes v2 07:11:37 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/05/08-dxwg-minutes.html AndreaPerego 07:11:38 ack SimonCox 07:11:38 SimonCox, you wanted to ask Makx if the proposed definition accommodates DCAT-AP? and to also ask if this proposed formalization makes sense 07:11:40 ... https://github.com/w3c/dxwg/tree/gh-pages/profiledesc/examples#dcat 07:12:39 roba: All DCAT-AP experience has been captured in the requirements 07:13:04 ... when you look at how things are connected (implementation resources, 07:13:20 ... dependencies) it becomes complicated, this is what 07:13:31 ... the profile description vocabulary is about 07:14:15 ... and it captures those relationships fairly well (looking at the 07:14:21 ... discussion). 07:14:30 1. formal vocabulary https://w3c.github.io/dxwg/profiledesc/profiledesc.html 07:14:50 2. example for DCAT-AP https://github.com/w3c/dxwg/tree/gh-pages/profiledesc/examples#dcat-ap 07:15:53 SimonCox: shows the profile desc page and some examples of how 07:16:11 ... the vocabulary can be used to describe DCAT-AP and 07:16:17 ... some Australian work 07:17:03 ... The profile vocabulary has got tighter semantics than the 07:17:48 ... description of DCAT-AP that was partially done re-using DCAT itself. 07:18:00 ... It should be noted that the profile vocabulary is not only about 07:18:17 ... RDF profiles but is more general 07:18:44 ... The primary test case is DCAT 07:19:08 roba: Will test the vocabulary on some OGC work, too 07:19:33 ... Picked out a few examples from Makx's page regarding 07:19:54 ... hierarchies and versioning (hasn't looked closely at that yet, though) 07:20:09 q+ 07:20:26 kcoyle: Maintenance schedule and agency should be part of the vocabulary 07:20:58 q+ 07:21:01 roba: The vocabulary won't reinvent wheels, so maintenance might use 07:21:05 ... another vocabulary 07:21:10 q? 07:21:14 ack roba 07:21:18 ack Makx 07:21:47 Makx: Maintenance might be more important for base specifications 07:22:06 ... than for profiles. Change in profiles/vocabularies can be very 07:22:11 recommendations for maintenance and governance aspects? seems like wider context than profiles... 07:22:13 ack SimonCox 07:22:16 ... hard for people to implement 07:22:29 SimonCox: There is a type of resource (profile/specification) that has 07:22:43 ... some additional constraints when we catalogue it 07:22:50 q? 07:23:14 ... That means that those who develop the profile formalisation need 07:23:24 ... to look at how that maps to the DCAT backbone 07:23:47 q+ 07:23:48 ... We need to look at how that relates to a DCAT catalogue, and that 07:23:51 (re cost of changes, sometimes creating new APs, or evolving existing ones, is a method for *avoiding* changes to the underlying rdf vocabs. 07:23:53 ) 07:24:04 ... publisher and maintenance schedule should be mandatory 07:24:28 danbri2: What is the syntactic level of interoperability? 07:25:10 ... There are groups that are concerned only with syntax (e. g. JSON-LD/JSON Schema) 07:25:27 ... and don't understand e. g. RDFa 07:25:35 RRSAgent, draft minutes v2 07:25:35 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/05/08-dxwg-minutes.html AndreaPerego 07:26:02 https://github.com/w3c/dxwg/issues/196 07:26:16 Topic: proposal by Lars 07:26:33 LarsG: context = profile negotiation work 07:26:38 scribenick: PWinstanley 07:26:45 ... first- definition of a profile 07:26:55 second, what must be in the document 07:27:01 RRSAgent, draft minutes v2 07:27:01 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/05/08-dxwg-minutes.html AndreaPerego 07:27:30 LarsG: profile should be identified by a URI, then have a human-readable title 07:27:55 ... textual description, and perhaps a formal model 07:28:05 ... Inspiration taken from ODRL work 07:28:37 ... in Library work profile doesn't depend on media type, it is considered in a very abstract way 07:29:21 ... We are making progress - but as danbri2 mentioned, communities differ in their interests and we need to find common ground 07:29:22 q+ 07:29:53 kcoyle: Do you 'see' the profile Rob and Nick create as fitting with your approach. How do we get these together? 07:30:21 LarsG: The neg group thinks the profile identifier is critical to the 'negotiation' bit 07:30:41 ... then are there profile hierarchies, what dependencies are there? 07:31:08 ... XML or OWL imports are there, why shouldn't this work for profiles 07:31:45 ... the schema location vs the schema identification are very different, but in the XML situation this can be implemented in the engine 07:32:10 q+ 07:32:15 ... the tighter linking simplifies the situation 07:32:26 ack roba 07:33:15 roba: the profile descr vocab covers those requirements. The profile desc is agnostic about format 07:34:04 ... the use of mediatype to describe the constraints is made canonical, so you can create a profile of the profile vocab to describe profiles 07:34:31 ... there was a deliberate mistake in the vocab to include cardinalities - they should be taken out. 07:35:49 ... the description can cover hierarchy, but I don't think it will achieve a lot. 07:35:52 q? 07:36:00 ack Jaroslav_Pullmann 07:37:01 Too much echo 07:37:12 https://github.com/w3c/dxwg/issues/72 07:37:14 Jaroslav_Pullmann: there is a proposal for a description but we are losing the notion of 'function'. how does a profile behave - does it constrain or widen or re-define a psecification? 07:37:32 ... there are examples of functions/purposes of profiles in the link 07:37:57 ... when looking at the description bear in mind function 07:38:10 ack AndreaPerego 07:38:48 AndreaPerego: URIs are used in catalogue services - if not exactly uris they use codes 07:39:20 .... the catalogue service knows about the codes and can handle metadata as required by the output schema. 07:39:28 profile of profile.ttl to define a canonical way to attach codes - eg. skos:notation ? 07:40:09 ... all the work on geoDCAT-AP etc was based around this - the URI is just an identifier, the catalogue knows what that identified entity is about 07:40:10 q+ 07:40:21 RRSAgent, draft minutes v2 07:40:21 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/05/08-dxwg-minutes.html DaveBrowning 07:40:34 ... there are many aspects, we need to address them one by one 07:40:50 kcoyle: yes we need to diagram these aspects 07:41:01 ack Jaroslav_Pullmann 07:41:47 Jaroslav_Pullmann: we need to be guided by the function . e.g. constraints are a function. this would give a concrete aspect of specifying the mandatory elements 07:42:30 ... Makx illustrated profile based obligations. These area fundamental requirements 07:42:30 implementation resources have a "role" - so a way to address these needs is provided 07:43:08 topic:Dublin Core approach 07:43:10 RRSAgent, draft minutes v2 07:43:10 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/05/08-dxwg-minutes.html AndreaPerego 07:43:22 kcoyle: I will illustrate the basic framework 07:43:46 DC defined a framework putting the profile into a context (pre-RDF) 07:44:01 did RDDL come up? i think 15ish years ago, when xml namespaces were controversial. 07:44:07 ie Resource_Directory_Description_Language 07:44:23 ... there was a profile mainly based on semantics; a vocab was developed to describe how the vocabulary of the profile is developed from the user point of view 07:44:29 ... it is hierarchical 07:45:00 http://dublincore.org/documents/profile-guidelines/ 07:45:12 ... we (Tom Baker and I) developed a setof guidelines ot help people develop their profiles. In DC a profile is a reuse of vocabulary terms (constrain, but not invent) 07:45:26 http://dublincore.org/documents/dc-dsp/ 07:45:37 ... the concept in DC was to define vocabs very loosely and then fine-tune the constraints in profile 07:46:06 http://dublincore.org/documents/singapore-framework/ 07:47:18 ... I've been working on developing a simple way for people to create vocabs using CSV on the web. Vocabs can be created on spreadsheets. We are focusing on the human end of this 07:48:38 ... Tell people what needs to be input. What is happening in this group is at a lower level, other people who don't have the technical ability need a wrapper to simplify their efforts. We hope to link this to ShEx and SHACL 07:49:31 danbri2: It feels similar to the DC situation - e.g. DC agonised over link to RDF - so they did shex and shacl work indirectly in case RDF 'died' 07:49:53 ... because DC is stepping out of RDF to keep things going 07:50:15 ... e.g. RIDDL in days of old 07:50:19 DC work fits in just fine as implementation resource - we are just promoting the metadata for such resources so we can have a canonical form to help us discover them and knwo how they should be used.. 07:50:48 SimonCox: yes, similar to what Makx described in his list of distributions 07:50:54 http://www.rddl.org/ 07:51:27 .... the point danbri2 made last night about content negotiation - we want the published of a resource to describe what is available 07:51:52 q+ 07:52:12 ... Landing pages give us the next step 07:52:27 ... can this be accommodated in a machine readable form? 07:53:00 https://github.com/kcoyle/RDF-AP/blob/master/schemaList.csv 07:53:06 danbri2: i don't know. conneg doesn't work for web crawlers - it causes a mass DNS as the sources get queried 07:53:21 s/RIDDL/GRDDL/ 07:53:32 s/GRDDL/RDDL/ 07:53:40 SimonCox: we have seen dcat:distribution and in roba and Nick's prof:resource is used 07:54:19 ... if you don't send content negotion a format it will send back the landing page 07:54:29 LarsG: do crawlers follow links? 07:54:41 danbri2: I'd have to get back to you on that 07:54:57 * yes hard to follow... 07:55:14 Jaroslav_Pullmann: we are a DCAT group but we're talking about defining profiles - we need focus 07:55:24 q+ to ask whether we were talking about RDDL or GRDDL 07:55:39 kcoyle: we nede to put these levels into the page to determine what our focus is going to be 07:55:45 q- 07:55:47 ack antoine 07:55:51 I was referring to RDDL, https://www.xml.com/pub/a/2001/02/28/rddl.html 07:56:03 q+ to ask if we're really (only) a DCAT group 07:56:59 https://docs.google.com/drawings/d/1dHkpwKwUwMgS1RqSCTPO3uOoRiY_qNk0z5bhXJlYi4Y/ 07:57:05 antoine: asking about these different levels....I added to the agenda a proposal to capture at least some levels (wiki page) 07:57:39 ... the diagram is to see if I've understood roba and SimonCox points and also to make my proposal 07:57:41 I think danbri2 meant that DCMI did ShEx- and SHACL-like work, circa 2007-2008, but did it with a level of indirection in the form of an RDF-like model 07:57:55 ... I think it is a rewording of what has been proposed earlier 07:58:49 roba: looks accurate. it is a matter of chosing the right words. those elements exist with a little qualification to the specifications of what these elements 'do' 07:59:15 antoine: I don't go into the detail, but I'll start by explaining that the start is the middle layer 07:59:16 Antoine's diagram looks very clear to me 08:01:21 q? 08:01:28 ack LarsG 08:01:28 LarsG, you wanted to ask if we're really (only) a DCAT group 08:01:59 LarsG: coming back to Jaroslav_Pullmann comment that we are a DCAT group - we are a DX group. DCAT is only one aspect 08:02:40 Jaroslav_Pullmann: when talking about profiles etc DCAT is a baseline - we don't have other stakeholders 08:02:50 q+ 08:03:13 LarsG: profile guidelines will be a 'recommendation' so we need >=2 implementations 08:03:27 ...profiles is on the IETF track 08:04:03 danbri2: do you want web browser people to be involved reading the work? 08:04:23 LarsG: I don't expect that immediately, but perhaps in a few years time 08:04:43 ... I don't think it is constrained to the semantic web community 08:04:59 kcoyle: where do you see the difference. semweb bleeds into other areas 08:05:18 danbri2: people think about other things than RDF 08:06:00 ... if something comes out of this group others might want to consider if it is going to interfere with e.g. web server operations 08:06:36 Jaroslav_Pullmann: in LarsG proposal the focus was negotiation, not on the working of a profile. 08:06:54 q+ 08:07:07 LarsG: we don't expect IETF to get down into the detail of what a profile is, just the identifier 08:07:11 ack roba 08:07:45 roba: the profile description is there but the negotiation aspect doesn't need to deal with the description, identifiers are enough 08:08:14 roba+ yes profile negotiation just tells where to find things 08:08:37 AndreaPerego: we should go to REC track, but we might not do that. If we see that we don't have implementations then we can just go to a note 08:09:05 topic: BREAK for coffee 08:09:18 RRSAgent, draft minutes v2 08:09:18 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/05/08-dxwg-minutes.html AndreaPerego 08:39:23 scribenick SimonCox 08:39:34 scribenick: SimonCox 08:42:51 Topic: Option appraisal for profiles 08:43:13 PWinstanley: three presentations have presented us with some options 08:43:43 ... Makx illustrated requirements on basis of various *DCAT-AP versions 08:44:05 ... RobA showed how this is a generalizable pattern, with DCAT as exemplar, but useful in wider setting 08:45:07 ... Lars claims we need to right kind of identifier, but raises issue of scope - is this just RDF, or does it make wider claims. If the latter, it will take more work to get issued as standard 08:45:48 ... now we need to understand what the priorities are 08:46:19 ... so we develop working draft 08:46:55 ... So, looking at definition: 1. 'profile addresses a particular function' 08:48:26 s/addresses/accomplish/ 08:48:31 s/scribenick SimonCox// 08:48:43 RRSAgent, draft minutes v2 08:48:43 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/05/08-dxwg-minutes.html AndreaPerego 08:49:07 kcoyle: developed profile for a reason 08:49:18 q+ to ask if it may be worth having examples of such "functions" 08:49:49 q+ to suggest that any application would be ok as example 08:49:51 Jaroslav_Pullmann: 'does not define new terms or concepts' - only composed of elements from dependencies 08:50:25 kcoyle: agrees, and this is how DC does it, but some requirements point to adding new elements 08:50:42 PWinstanley: how different to SQL or XSD? 08:51:06 q? 08:51:11 Jaroslav_Pullmann: asking what is special about 'profile' compared with 'vocabulary' 08:52:03 danbri: metadata wars ... DC=discover, XX=mutimedia, YY=teaching etc 08:52:24 s/mutimedia/multimedia/ 08:52:26 ... if you re-used too much, then you can't show new artefacts to funders :-( 08:52:59 ... Shape languages allow a new artefact that doesn't create new elements :-) 08:53:40 q? 08:53:46 ... JSON-LD supports aliasing - so JSON users have clean terms which map to existing terms from 16 different namespaces 08:54:23 kcoyle: DC profile is more than just a vocabulary. Useful for certain _applications_ = for humans and what they need to do with it 08:54:23 danbri has joined #dxwg 08:54:56 ... includes examples, guidance, supports web-forms 08:55:12 ... gets to function or reason-why 08:55:37 q? 08:55:37 ack AndreaPerego 08:55:38 AndreaPerego, you wanted to ask if it may be worth having examples of such "functions" 08:57:30 PWinstanley: what is 'function'? Mathematical? Facilitative? 08:58:07 AndreaPerego: work from examples of existing profiles. Comes from practice, artefacts that you can claim-conformance-to 08:58:58 q+ 08:59:13 ack antoine 08:59:13 antoine, you wanted to suggest that any application would be ok as example 09:00:10 Jaroslav_Pullmann: importance is _identity_ of profile 09:00:12 q+ 09:00:18 q+ 09:00:24 ack SimonCox 09:00:34 antoine: conflation of profile and application profile 09:00:51 q+ to talk about expectations on data received 09:02:06 ack kcoyle 09:02:56 q+ 09:03:14 SimonCox: functional requirement is having a named artefact to claim conformance to, or extend in another specification, and that this is right level of granularity 09:03:29 kcoyle: community function 09:03:53 q- 09:03:56 ... see AP's as linked to communities (applications?) 09:04:13 q? 09:04:46 ack AndreaPerego 09:05:02 ... introduces idea of "consensus" 09:05:51 q+ to talk about the DNB use cases 09:06:27 ack Jaroslav_Pullmann 09:06:36 AndreaPerego: AP came out of validation requirement. RDFS did not suppor that so other documents were used 09:06:55 karen would this capture what you said: "A profile can play a key role for a community to formalize expectations about the data that it cares about - and sharing these expectation with others." 09:06:58 s/suppor/support/ 09:07:53 ... 'minimal level of interoperability' - formal validation and compliance came later 09:09:35 ack LarsG 09:09:35 LarsG, you wanted to talk about the DNB use cases 09:09:36