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15:44:40 <ivan> rrsagent, set log public
15:44:40 <ivan> Meeting: Publishing Business Group Telco
15:44:40 <ivan> Chair: Luc
15:44:40 <ivan> Date: 2018-03-13
15:44:40 <ivan> Regrets+
15:44:40 <ivan> Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-publishing-sc/2018Mar/0010.html
15:44:40 <ivan> ivan has changed the topic to: Meeting Agenda 2018-03-13: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-publishing-sc/2018Mar/0010.html
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15:59:53 <laudrain> present+
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16:01:08 <Bill_Kasdorf> present+
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16:01:46 <wolfgang> present+ wolfgang
16:01:51 <ivan> present+
16:01:55 <Brian> present+
16:02:12 <jkamata> present+ Junko Kamata
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16:03:22 <garth> present+ Garth
16:03:23 <rkwright> present + rkwright
16:03:50 <garth> Scribe expectations set appropriately low.
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16:04:02 <ivan> scribenick: garth
16:04:10 <dauwhe> Zakim, set scribe_expectation to low
16:04:11 <Zakim> I don't understand 'set scribe_expectation to low', dauwhe
16:04:14 <ivan> present+ rkwright
16:04:14 <George> present+ George
16:05:21 <garth> Luc: first item for EPUB 3.2 resolution
16:05:24 <Julian_Calderazi> Julian_Calderazi has joined #pbg
16:05:25 <ivan> Topic: Principles for EPUB 3.2 proposal
16:05:36 <garth> … Version 3.2; lots of work to do.
16:06:10 <ivan> present+ Dan_Fauxsmith
16:06:14 <garth> … Agree with princples?  Or have comments?
16:06:24 <Julian_Calderazi> link: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1r2RbLipc5VY3vUp_iuPak3oaNxI5BF9gJ5s-98qsmEY/edit?ts=5a578c4c#heading=h.izdc9lnn3tf
16:06:28 <dauwhe> http://w3c.github.io/publ-epub-revision/epub32/spec/epub-spec.html
16:06:38 <garth> … otherwise we’ll move to ask CG to proceed with work on EPUB 3.2 (with all due haste).
16:06:39 <ivan> present+ Julian_Calderazi
16:06:44 <ivan> zakim, who is here?
16:06:44 <Zakim> Present: laudrain, tzviya, Bill_Kasdorf, liisamk, BillM, dauwhe, wolfgang, ivan, Brian, Junko, Kamata, jyoshii, Garth, rkwright, George, Dan_Fauxsmith, Julian_Calderazi
16:06:48 <Zakim> On IRC I see Julian_Calderazi, George, rkwright, garth, Brian, jkamata, Bill_Kasdorf, liisamk, laudrain, Avneesh, Makoto, BillM, RRSAgent, Zakim, wolfgang, ivan, jyoshii, Rachel,
16:06:48 <Zakim> ... tzviya, dauwhe, bigbluehat
16:06:50 <garth> … Good concensus so far
16:06:53 <laudrain> q?
16:06:59 <garth> … No Objections, it seems!
16:07:04 <garth> q+
16:07:34 <garth> … Concensus on call; 72 hour notice to go out.
16:07:48 <ivan> resolved: CG can go ahead, provided there is an objection within 72 hours
16:07:52 <laudrain> ack garth
16:08:10 <wolfgang> s/an/no/
16:08:13 <Makoto> Who is going to lead the taskforce for this work in the CG?
16:08:18 <Bill_Kasdorf> s/there is an objection/there is no objection
16:08:58 <garth> Garth: can we get Matt to help with draft?
16:09:07 <garth> … how Matt is allocated?
16:09:07 <Avneesh> q+
16:09:39 <garth> George: Matt is 100% with Daisy.
16:09:57 <garth> Garth: Garth will reach out to Matt, for time availability.
16:09:59 <laudrain> q?
16:10:13 <laudrain> ack Avneesh
16:10:24 <garth> Geroge: Matt would likely want to work on this but A11Y?
16:10:41 <laudrain> s/Geroge/George/
16:10:46 <wolfgang> s/Geroge:/George:/
16:10:59 <dauwhe> q+
16:11:08 <laudrain> ack dave
16:11:31 <garth> Dave: did first pass as draft, that’s what we’ll work from.  Need issues to move forward.
16:11:49 <George> q+
16:11:54 <ivan> ack dauwhe
16:12:04 <garth> … most development should move through gitbub
16:12:14 <laudrain> ack George
16:12:16 <Makoto> I was disconnected for a while.
16:12:19 <garth> … Maybe kick-off meeting makes sense.
16:12:30 <ivan> +1 to George
16:12:44 <ivan> present+ makoto
16:12:48 <garth> Geroge: we MUST say SHOULD :-)
16:13:11 <wolfgang> s/Geroge/George/
16:13:13 <Makoto> Yes, I will!
16:13:14 <ivan> zakim, who is here?
16:13:14 <Zakim> Present: laudrain, tzviya, Bill_Kasdorf, liisamk, BillM, dauwhe, wolfgang, ivan, Brian, Junko, Kamata, jyoshii, Garth, rkwright, George, Dan_Fauxsmith, Julian_Calderazi, makoto
16:13:17 <Brian_> Brian_ has joined #pbg
16:13:18 <Zakim> On IRC I see Julian_Calderazi, George, rkwright, garth, Brian, jkamata, Bill_Kasdorf, liisamk, laudrain, Avneesh, Makoto, BillM, RRSAgent, Zakim, wolfgang, ivan, jyoshii, Rachel,
16:13:18 <Zakim> ... tzviya, dauwhe, bigbluehat
16:13:20 <garth> … (beware of W3C/ISO vocab differences)
16:13:48 <ivan> Topic: new person on the call
16:13:55 <garth> Luc: Welcome Dan Fxxx?
16:14:11 <wolfgang> s/Fxxx/Fauxsmith/
16:14:26 <Julian_Calderazi> Welcome Dan! Good to have you here.
16:14:42 <ivan> scribejs, set Dan Dan Fauxsmith
16:15:11 <ivan> Topic: DPUB Summit
16:15:27 <garth> Luc: Can anybody explain where we are with DPUB Summit
16:15:29 <ivan> present+ laurent
16:15:32 <BillM> q+
16:15:45 <garth> … in Berlin the 17th of May
16:15:57 <garth> … Book your rooms!
16:16:04 <BillM> https://www.edrlab.org/dpub-summit-2018/
16:16:11 <garth> … 1:00p on 16th to 5:30p on the 17th
16:16:18 <garth> … Program on web site
16:16:35 <Makoto> I will be there.
16:16:49 <ivan> +1 Makoto!
16:16:56 <laudrain> +1
16:17:06 <garth> … Daisy devices moving to EPUB 3 to be demoed.
16:17:12 <laudrain> ack BillM
16:17:24 <garth> BillM: W3C is co-sponsoring event
16:17:26 <Dan> Dan has joined #PBG
16:17:37 <Makoto> q+
16:17:38 <Brian_> Conflicts with a BISG metadata summit in NY; unable to attend
16:18:05 <garth> … Good general agenda and W3C-ish Publishing topics too
16:18:29 <garth> … Mix of (light) technical topcis and business too
16:18:30 <ivan> See also https://www.w3.org/blog/2018/03/digital-publishing-summit-in-berlin-16th-and-17th-of-may/
16:18:52 <garth> q?
16:18:57 <Julian_Calderazi> Makoto, u muted?
16:19:28 <garth> ack Makoto
16:20:27 <Makoto> Windows 10 tries to block me.
16:20:37 <garth> Summit follows AC meeitng Monday/Tuesday; Readium meeting 16th AM
16:20:55 <ivan> Topic: epubcheck funding
16:21:04 <garth> Liisa: epubhceck funding
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16:21:20 <laurentlemeur> present+
16:21:21 <wolfgang> s/meeitng/meeting/
16:21:24 <garth> … Need to raise $90-$100K to get epubcheck to where it needs to be
16:21:46 <wolfgang> s/epubhceck/epubcheck/
16:21:46 <garth> … Maybe get 20-30 compaires to put in $3K+
16:21:49 <garth> q+
16:21:54 <Makoto> I wanted to point out that there will be WHATWG people in the AC meeting.  It would be a good chance for us to understand how we should contact WHATWG about HTML.
16:22:00 <garth> … do we need tiers of funding
16:22:07 <laudrain> ack Garth
16:22:14 <garth> Garth: no, for an amount that small.
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16:22:33 <Brian_> q+
16:22:35 <rkwright> Ric agrees with Garth
16:22:42 <garth> Luc: How will this be announced?
16:23:02 <garth> Liisa: Ric could work with a list of prospects.
16:23:09 <tzviya> q+
16:23:16 <garth> … Should it just be a litter from this group
16:23:20 <Julian_Calderazi> Whatever might be needed as regards to design, count with me.
16:23:29 <wolfgang> s/litter/letter/
16:23:30 <rkwright> I believe Liisa means Rick, as in Rick Johnson
16:23:35 <laudrain> ack Brian_
16:23:39 <garth> … How did we land on getting payment and storing payment
16:24:16 <garth> Brian: Tiers might be good… for a lead tier (maybe $25K)
16:24:19 <Bill_Kasdorf> +1 to Brian
16:24:32 <garth> q+
16:24:44 <laudrain> ack tzviya
16:24:55 <garth> Tzviya: brian makes a good point
16:25:11 <garth> … where do the checks go?
16:25:17 <laudrain> ack garth
16:25:52 <garth> Garth: +1 to Brian’s single bigger tier
16:26:07 <garth> Liisa: need to settle how we’re going to deal with cash
16:26:23 <laudrain> q?
16:26:29 <garth> … Nominate BillM for handling that
16:26:54 <laudrain> +1
16:27:06 <garth> Bill: wil take that on and explore option
16:27:30 <wolfgang> s/wil/will/
16:28:42 <garth> Tzviya: if Readium, need to make sure it looks good, relative to W3C takign over for IDPF
16:28:52 <ivan> s/takign/taking/
16:28:52 <laurentlemeur> q+
16:29:03 <laudrain> ack laurentlemeur
16:29:14 <ivan> q+
16:29:22 <laudrain> ack ivan
16:29:27 <garth> Laurent: is there a history of W3C do this sort of stuff: fundraising and paying for development
16:29:35 <garth> Ivan: not really
16:29:43 <tzviya> https://www.w3.org/International/sponsorship/
16:30:11 <garth> … general pushback against potential competition with member orgs
16:30:32 <garth> … some fundraising for general programs (e.g., mobile web initiative)
16:30:35 <tzviya> who funds https://validator.w3.org/?
16:30:35 <laudrain> q+
16:30:54 <ivan> ack laudrain
16:30:56 <garth> Luc: Readium and EDRlab may make sense.
16:31:19 <garth> Laurent: yes, well could be
16:31:19 <Julian_Calderazi> q+
16:31:34 <laudrain> ack Julian_Calderazi
16:31:34 <garth> Luc: though annoucements need to be clear
16:31:54 <garth> Julian: how long do we fundraise?
16:32:00 <wolfgang> s/annoucements/announcements/
16:32:14 <garth> Liissa: until to get to $100K (semi smiley)
16:32:18 <garth> s/ss/s/
16:32:33 <garth> q?
16:33:27 <garth> Tzviya: initial release in a month-ish, then start on EPUB 3.2
16:33:49 <rkwright> q+
16:33:49 <garth> … then there is also general maintenance
16:34:00 <laudrain> q?
16:34:09 <garth> Liisa: which is why were looking to have an annual budget
16:34:10 <laudrain> ack rkwright
16:34:36 <garth> Ric: Folks may be taking HappyPills(tm) with said estimates
16:35:18 <garth> … it’s involved, and muct be scoped and algile-ish
16:35:37 <wolfgang> s/muct/must/
16:35:52 <garth> Luc: EPUB 3.2 is making it somewhat easier, due to compatibility with EPUB 3.0.1
16:36:04 <garth> Ric: suffers for historicly too many cooks in the kitchen
16:36:23 <laudrain> q?
16:36:23 <garth> s/for historicly/historically from/
16:36:26 <tzviya> q+
16:36:34 <laudrain> ack tzviya
16:37:05 <garth> Tzviya: Six months was allotted for general cleanup of code and test suite
16:37:29 <garth> Ric: happy to help refine
16:37:37 <garth> Luc: IDPF web site
16:37:48 <ivan> Topic: IDPF Web site's fate
16:38:04 <garth> … discussion about what to move where; A11Y resources move to Daisy?
16:38:50 <garth> George: problem with maintaining info in two different places; A11Y guidelines on IDPF site; ACE knowledge base
16:39:04 <garth> … should redirect to new ACE location
16:39:37 <laudrain> q?
16:39:46 <garth> … new ACE knowledge is newer and should no be with overlapping copyright (swith older IDPF stuff)
16:39:48 <ivan> q+
16:39:58 <Bill_Kasdorf> q+
16:40:08 <Makoto> +q
16:40:13 <laudrain> ack ivan
16:40:22 <garth> Ivan: beyond A11Y…
16:40:29 <Bill_Kasdorf> q-
16:40:33 <garth> … what do we do with the IDPF Web site?
16:40:57 <garth> … some pages should be deprecated there
16:41:28 <rkwright> q+
16:41:33 <garth> … Keep some IDPF pages alive for W3C publishing?
16:41:57 <Bill_Kasdorf> q+
16:42:10 <Makoto> Yes
16:42:16 <Makoto> I would like to point out that
16:42:25 <Makoto> EPUB 3.1 depends on some
16:42:32 <Makoto> registries at the IDPF site.
16:42:58 <Makoto> URLs are hardcoded in the specs.
16:43:21 <liisamk> q+
16:43:27 <garth> ack Makoto
16:43:31 <laudrain> ack Makoto
16:43:35 <BillM> q+
16:43:37 <laudrain> ack rkwright
16:43:39 <garth> ask rkwright
16:43:43 <garth> ack rkwright
16:44:25 <garth> Ric: have been working on some Readium site work, with some light cloning from IDPF
16:44:28 <dauwhe> we've ported some IDPF documents to the CG github: https://w3c.github.io/publ-cg/
16:44:29 <laudrain> ack Bill_Kasdorf
16:45:09 <garth> BillK: Some aux specs (e.g., indexes) could well move to be CG notes
16:45:20 <garth> … if still valid
16:45:38 <laudrain> ack liisamk
16:45:56 <garth> Liisa: Should 3.2 not point to anythinfg on IDFP site?
16:46:00 <Makoto> That's certainly possible.
16:46:24 <wolfgang> s/anythinfg/anything/
16:46:36 <wolfgang> s/IDFP/IDPF/
16:46:48 <garth> Garth: likely good direction for 3.2
16:47:02 <garth> Ivan: but old URLs never die
16:47:03 <laurentlemeur> who's paying today for the IDPF domain name?
16:47:21 <laudrain> ack BillM
16:47:25 <laudrain> q?
16:47:49 <garth> BillM: 3.2 referencing only W3C locations is a good plan
16:48:17 <garth> … IDPF.org should be considered more a static achive
16:48:35 <ivan> q+
16:48:39 <wolfgang> s/achive/archive/
16:48:56 <garth> … could move into some sort of static archive
16:49:15 <garth> q?
16:49:29 <Makoto> We had http://idpf.org/epub/vocab/structure/ (ssv)
16:49:42 <Makoto> But it is redirected to https://idpf.github.io/epub-vocabs/structure/
16:50:02 <laudrain> ack ivan
16:50:31 <garth> Ivan: Package namespace is IDPF URI
16:50:48 <Makoto> We cannot change them.
16:50:58 <BillM> q+
16:51:07 <laudrain> ack BillM
16:51:30 <rkwright> q+
16:51:39 <liisamk> q+
16:51:44 <garth> BillM: epubzone isn’t continuing, W3C will be used instead.
16:51:50 <ivan> q+
16:52:05 <garth> … it was never normative, anyhow.
16:52:48 <Makoto> Redirection would work.
16:53:28 <laudrain> ack rkwright
16:53:28 <garth> Ric: 1) URLs: redirection can help not break specs.  2) epubzone, some has migrated to Readium
16:53:46 <laudrain> ack liisamk
16:54:04 <laudrain> ack ivan
16:54:13 <garth> Liisa: Noticed that forums on epubzone are still acrive and might be in need of monitoring
16:54:29 <wolfgang> s/acrive/active/
16:54:58 <garth> Ivan: Should use W3C blog for publishing stuff
16:55:01 <garth> q?
16:55:26 <ivan> Topic: External coordiantion TF
16:55:29 <garth> Luc: Task forces
16:55:49 <ivan> s/coordiantion/coordination/
16:55:51 <wolfgang> s/coordiantion/coordination/
16:56:36 <garth> BillK: email to Publishing BG late this week or early next (External Coordination task force) to call for participation
16:56:49 <garth> … stay tuned for email
16:56:53 <ivan> Topic: A11y TF
16:57:08 <garth> Luc: A11Y TF call tomorrow
16:57:12 <Makoto> A11Y: BillM, did you speak with the W3C management about starting an EPUB accessibility project in ISO/IEC?  Japan has created a draft for the required new work item proposal and is waiting.
16:57:37 <garth> Avneesh: A11Y awaiting resolution/direction
16:57:42 <Makoto> I think that I need "OK".
16:57:44 <Makoto> That's all.
16:57:55 <Makoto> Why no progress?
16:58:18 <BillM> q+
16:58:40 <garth> Luc: ISO — 3.0.1 now, start on 3.2 thereafter
16:58:47 <Makoto> Why no "OK" from the w3c m about an Iso/IEC project for EPUB A11Y?
16:59:06 <laudrain> ack BillM
16:59:17 <Makoto> No.
16:59:21 <Makoto> Independent.
16:59:44 <garth> BillM: 3.2 needs to be set.  This should should recommend that “OK”.
16:59:48 <Avneesh> q+
17:00:27 <garth> … does it make sense to EPUB A11Y at ISO independantly of EPUB 3.2
17:00:48 <Makoto> I agree with Garth.
17:00:57 <Makoto> should be separated.
17:00:57 <laudrain> ack Avneesh
17:00:57 <dauwhe> scribenick: dauwhe
17:01:23 <dauwhe> Avneesh: the proposal of separating epub a11y from EPUB 3.1 was due to the independence of accessibility
17:01:39 <dauwhe> ... now the situation has changed, and we need to rethink
17:01:44 <BillM> +1 to Avneesh
17:02:13 <Makoto> Yes!
17:02:15 <Makoto> Bye
17:02:18 <dauwhe> laudrain: we need a call about ISO and a11y
17:02:20 <dauwhe> ... thanks all
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17:02:52 <ivan> rrsagent, draft minutes
17:02:52 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2018/03/13-pbg-minutes.html ivan