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15:31:34 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2017/10/19-epub3cg-irc
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15:52:48 <wolfgang> is anyone already connected to webex?
15:53:06 <dauwhe> No. Getting various errors still. I've emailed Ivan.
15:53:23 <wolfgang> thx, Dave!
15:56:16 <dauwhe> still no luck
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15:57:04 <toshiakikoike> present+
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15:58:37 <dauwhe> yeah, that link is definitely not working
15:59:56 <dauwhe> Sorry everyone. Romain, do you have a link or # for DAISY's?
16:01:15 <dauwhe> rachel and I are on the DAISY line
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16:01:51 <Avneesh> DAISY line is in US
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16:03:08 <tzviya> present+
16:03:12 <rachel> present+
16:03:15 <wolfgang> present+ wolfgang
16:03:16 <Avneesh> present+
16:03:26 <dauwhe> present+ dauwhe
16:03:47 <rdeltour> present_
16:03:53 <rdeltour> present+
16:03:55 <garth> garth has joined #epub3cg
16:04:05 <rdeltour> present+ LéoPaul
16:04:27 <garth> Are other folks able to dial in… is “319 436 071” really the meeting ID?
16:04:48 <dauwhe> Garth: we're using the DAISY number
16:04:50 <Terence> I tried, but it said the meeting had been cancelled or ended.
16:04:58 <duga> duga has joined #epub3cg
16:05:06 <garth> Tx!  That’s what I got too.
16:05:17 <garth> And for Brady: dial in +1 712/432-7300 Pin: 25693#
16:05:22 <garth> Present+ Garth
16:05:56 <duga> present+
16:06:14 <LauraBrady> Just dialled in successfully.
16:07:27 <Bill_Kasdorf> Bill_Kasdorf has joined #epub3cg
16:07:37 <tzviya> scribenick: tzviya
16:07:42 <Bill_Kasdorf> present+
16:08:05 <tzviya> topic: Update from A11y TF
16:08:28 <rachel> Avneesh are you able to join the line?
16:09:28 <tzviya> dauwhe: Avneesh sent an email summarizing. BillM is working with W3M on ISO standardization
16:10:02 <dauwhe> q?
16:10:07 <tzviya> ...If things progress, we will work with CG to ISO standardize EPUB A11y 1.0
16:10:29 <tzviya> topic: ACE Accessibility Checker
16:10:31 <dauwhe> https://inclusivepublishing.org/news-and-events/news/announcing-ace-beta-release/
16:10:37 <tzviya> dauwhe: Beta testing has begun
16:10:41 <Mira> Mira has joined #epub3cg
16:11:00 <tzviya> ...You can download and install the tool to participate in beta testing
16:11:33 <tzviya> ...I got it working and it's pretty cool. It generates a JSON file identifying accessibility problems.
16:11:57 <tzviya> ...I encourage all of you to test it
16:12:12 <tzviya> rachel: I have been pressuring vendors to test it as well
16:12:16 <rdeltour> q+
16:12:23 <dauwhe> ack rd
16:13:12 <tzviya> rdeltour: ACE is a tool to check conformance to EPUB Accessibility 1.0 tools. It's for power users. The tool has 2 facets.
16:13:16 <marisa_demeglio> marisa_demeglio has joined #epub3cg
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16:13:45 <tzviya> ...It does automated checks and data extractions. Automated checks are conservative to avoid false positives.
16:13:58 <tzviya> ...data extraction is intended for later inspection of content.
16:14:28 <tzviya> ...When using the tool, it's important to remember that it does only part of the job. Most things cannot be autoamted.
16:14:36 <Avneesh_> Avneesh_ has joined #epub3cg
16:14:46 <tzviya> ...There is also an HTTP install for larger workflows.
16:15:11 <Avneesh> Sorry my screen reader crashed and I had to restart
16:15:22 <rdeltour> Ace's dev site: https://daisy.github.io/ace
16:15:22 <tzviya> ...For those not interested in the technical, there is also inclusivepublishing.org
16:15:40 <rdeltour> For higher-level news: https://inclusivepublishing.org
16:16:05 <rdeltour> and the issue tracker on GitHub: https://github.com/daisy/ace/issues
16:16:10 <tzviya> dauwhe: any questions for avneesh or romain?
16:16:21 <dauwhe> q?
16:16:25 <tzviya> topic: EPUB for Ed
16:16:53 <tzviya> rachel: I spent some time digging into existing EPUB for Ed
16:17:02 <Tobias> present+ Tobias
16:17:18 <tzviya> ...Especially as we discuss best practices, I think that a significant portion of the spec is just best practices
16:17:41 <tzviya> ...I am trying to come up with a recommendation for how we can break down this profile
16:18:02 <tzviya> ...Perhaps this will be best practices that differ by genre
16:18:21 <tzviya> ...There may be elements that should be merged with 3.1 spec
16:18:33 <dauwhe> q?
16:18:37 <dauwhe> q+
16:18:37 <tzviya> ... Some elements should be best practices or samples.
16:19:47 <tzviya> dauwhe: It seems that one of the only obvious things that would fit into the 3.1 spec is some of the metadata
16:20:13 <tzviya> ...some of it might be a11y metadata, and some of it might be what type of ed material it is
16:20:21 <tzviya> rachel: that is section 8
16:20:24 <tzviya> dau
16:20:40 <dauwhe> https://w3c.github.io/publ-cg/education/epub-education.html
16:20:44 <rachel> https://w3c.github.io/publ-cg/education/epub-education.html#navigation
16:21:03 <tzviya> rachel: I was also looking at section 7 about navigation and wondering if that might go into 3.1 as well
16:21:28 <tzviya> rachel: what's the best way to raise this?
16:21:32 <rachel> Section 8 Metadata: https://w3c.github.io/publ-cg/education/epub-education.html#publication-metadata
16:21:36 <tzviya> dauwhe: github issue
16:21:42 <tzviya> q+
16:22:27 <tzviya> dauwhe: some of the navigation section is more best practices related (it is suggested, not MUST/SHOULD)
16:22:40 <rachel> ack da
16:22:46 <dauwhe> ack tz
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16:25:39 <tzviya> tzviya: the navigation section includes some SSV terms "toc-brief". We need to know if there are other terms that need to go into an ARIA vocabulary
16:25:42 <Bill_Kasdorf> why is the sky blue?
16:25:55 <tzviya> rachel: where should we record that?
16:26:14 <tzviya> tzviya: let's start recording that in the CG and bring it to the WG after tpac
16:26:30 <tzviya> dauwhe: does anyone know status of LTI stuff?
16:26:38 <tzviya> tzviya: ask RickJ
16:26:56 <tzviya> topic: best practices
16:27:09 <tzviya> dauwhe: One can get into a lot of trouble
16:27:26 <tzviya> ...what can be done and by whom to help with best practices?
16:28:01 <tzviya> rachel: I was looking at epub for ed spec. As i reach out to people for help, I've discovered that solutions are market-specific.
16:28:21 <dauwhe> q?
16:28:28 <tzviya> ...I have been thinking that best practices might be an alternative to profiles
16:28:41 <tzviya> ...This would involve working with BISG
16:28:48 <rachel> roles for BISG
16:28:51 <rachel> https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/6A7PnYNt/
16:28:59 <garth> Socializing over drinks is always fine.
16:29:23 <Bill_Kasdorf> q+
16:29:36 <dauwhe> ack B
16:30:00 <tzviya> Bill_Kasdorf: This is on agenda for tomorrow's BISG Content Structure Committee meeting tomorrow
16:30:31 <tzviya> Evan: how generic is this best practices discussion? Is it tied to what readers will/won't support or more generic?
16:30:54 <tzviya> rachel: I am hesitant to get into system support, especially considering how fickle they can be
16:31:14 <dauwhe> q+
16:31:30 <tzviya> ...I think it would be useful to say this is a best practice, but bear in mind that it won't work on X platform
16:31:33 <Bill_Kasdorf> q+
16:32:07 <tzviya> Evan: This topic has come up in other groups, such as JatsML - is this a potential subset of EPUB?
16:32:10 <rachel> ack da
16:32:55 <tzviya> dauwhe: I'm remembering working on BISG FXL guide. We had a broad set of guidelines, followed by systems restrictions
16:32:57 <tzviya> q+
16:33:30 <tzviya> dauwhe: If we include systems, it greatly adds to the task. I am greatly interested in what the interoperable core of EPUB is
16:33:44 <tzviya> ...finding out what the core is would be of great interest
16:33:48 <dauwhe> ack dauwhe
16:33:50 <rachel> ack bi
16:34:06 <tzviya> Bill_Kasdorf: Sometimes best practices can be about dealing with the inconsistency
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16:34:27 <tzviya> ...How do we publish? I recommend a web-based living document, not a static document
16:34:40 <dauwhe> ack tz
16:34:47 <rachel> +1 to dynamic web publication
16:34:47 <clapierre> present+
16:34:54 <dauwhe> tzviya: If you look successful docs we've seen in the past
16:35:18 <dauwhe> ... the ones that have longevity don't address the fickleness of reading systmes
16:35:28 <dauwhe> ... like Matt's a11y guidelines
16:35:29 <dauwhe> https://idpf.github.io/a11y-guidelines/
16:35:46 <dauwhe> ... we'll forever be updating if we deal with interop
16:35:56 <dauwhe> ... maybe interop is a separate project
16:36:00 <dauwhe> +1
16:36:04 <rachel> +1 to interoperability as a unique spec
16:36:11 <wolfgang> +1
16:36:31 <tzviya> dauwhe: I was going to bring up Matt's a11y guide as a useful model
16:37:04 <Bill_Kasdorf> q+
16:37:11 <rachel> ack bi
16:37:11 <tzviya> ...I wonder if we could build from that as a model, given how intertwined a11y and best practices already are
16:37:12 <tzviya> +1
16:37:16 <dauwhe> ack bi
16:37:24 <tzviya> Bill_Kasdorf: I recommend doing this in a modular fashion
16:37:25 <rdeltour> q+
16:37:28 <tzviya> +1 to Bill_Kasdorf
16:37:36 <dauwhe> ack rdeltour
16:37:49 <rdeltour> http://kb.daisy.org/publishing/
16:38:00 <tzviya> rdeltour: Matt's guidelines have moved to accessibility knowledgebase
16:38:28 <tzviya> rdeltour: we welcome contributions
16:38:41 <tzviya> ...to the a11y knowledgebas
16:38:55 <dauwhe> https://github.com/daisy/kb
16:39:01 <tzviya> s/knowledgebas/knowledgebase
16:39:11 <dauwhe> q>
16:39:13 <dauwhe> q?
16:39:48 <tzviya> rdeltour: looking for reviewers and contributors, but this is not quite ready for publicizing
16:40:22 <tzviya> dauwhe: Everyone thinks best practices are a good idea. need volunteers
16:40:26 <tzviya> I will help
16:40:31 <LauraBrady> I am happy to contribute and help however I can.
16:40:42 <tzviya> rachel: I have volunteered
16:41:13 <LauraBrady> cool
16:41:37 <tzviya> dauwhe: next steps?
16:41:49 <tzviya> rachel: we can pull in best practices from epub for ed
16:41:59 <JohnCosta> I am happy to contribute also  - based on profile work in IEEE Actionable Data Book research (interactive epub for education)
16:42:10 <tzviya> ...we can pull in resources from ???
16:42:13 <JohnCosta> http://ieee-adb.org
16:42:26 <LauraBrady> Weird echo on the phone call. Makes it hard to hear everything.
16:42:34 <tzviya> rachel: other resources to recommend?
16:42:43 <dauwhe> q
16:42:47 <dauwhe> q?
16:43:01 <rachel> we can pull resources from IEEE, DAISY, Publisher specific (Macmillan), and of course the education profile
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16:43:37 <tzviya> dauwhe: AOB?
16:44:07 <tzviya> rrsagent, make logs public
16:44:20 <teytag> Hi there
16:44:41 <LauraBrady> Thank you, Dave.
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16:44:55 <wolfgang> Thanks, Dave!
16:45:12 <marisa_demeglio> ( present+ )
16:47:55 <teytag> Hi Dave. Will you send a notes about this meeting?
16:49:09 <dauwhe> teytag: yes, hope to have minutes up this afternoon
16:49:41 <teytag> Thanks for info
16:50:34 <Tobias> exit+
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17:12:17 <dauwhe> rrsagent, make logs private
17:16:26 <dauwhe> rrsagent, draft minutes
17:16:26 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2017/10/19-epub3cg-minutes.html dauwhe
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