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15:34:26 <ivan> rrsagent, set log public
15:34:26 <ivan> Meeting: Publishing Working Group Telco
15:34:26 <ivan> Chair: garth
15:34:26 <ivan> Date: 2017-10-16
15:34:26 <ivan> Regrets+ marisademeglio
15:34:26 <ivan> Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-publ-wg/2017Oct/0016.html
15:34:26 <ivan> ivan has changed the topic to: Meeting Agenda 2017-20-16: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-publ-wg/2017Oct/0016.html
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15:54:56 <ivan> present+
15:55:21 <dauwhe> present+ dauwhe
15:56:03 <ivan> present+ George
15:56:03 <wolfgang> present+ wolfgang
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15:58:27 <Avneesh> present+
15:58:45 <mattg> present+
15:59:02 <tzviya> present+
15:59:11 <timCole> present+ Tim_Cole
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15:59:54 <George> present+ George
16:00:04 <JunGamo> present+ JunGamo
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16:01:09 <cmaden2> present+ Chris_Maden
16:01:35 <LSullam> present+ Lillian Sullam
16:01:40 <baldurbjarnason> present+ baldurbjarnason
16:01:47 <josh> josh has joined #pwg
16:01:47 <rkwright> present+
16:01:48 <rachel> present+
16:01:50 <dauwhe> Zakim, who isn't here?
16:01:50 <Zakim> I don't understand your question, dauwhe.
16:01:58 <josh> present+
16:02:00 <ivan> regrets+ deborah
16:02:02 <laurentlemeur> laurentlemeur has joined #pwg
16:02:04 <laudrain> Present+ Luc
16:02:09 <ivan> regrets+ pkra
16:02:11 <rdeltour> present+
16:02:14 <mateus> mateus has joined #pwg
16:02:21 <mateus> present+
16:02:21 <laurentlemeur> present+ Laurent
16:03:02 <dauwhe> scribenick: dauwhe
16:03:16 <ivan> regrets+ leonard
16:03:17 <Bill_Kasdorf> Bill_Kasdorf has joined #pwg
16:04:06 <dauwhe> tzviya: let's get started
16:04:13 <dauwhe> [ping pong chime]
16:04:30 <tzviya> https://www.w3.org/publishing/groups/publ-wg/Meetings/Minutes/2017/2017-10-02-minutes.html
16:04:33 <ivan> Topic: last minutes
16:04:39 <ivan> present+ rachel
16:04:40 <dauwhe> tzviya: any comments on the minutes?
16:04:45 <Vlad> present+
16:04:45 <ivan> RESOLVED: minutes approved
16:04:45 <dauwhe> tzviya: minutes approved
16:04:47 <jeffp> present+
16:04:54 <Bill_Kasdorf> present+
16:04:54 <dauwhe> tzviya: any new members this week?
16:04:58 <ivan> Topic: new members
16:05:28 <dauwhe> ???: this is Marty from Atypon, which is part of Wiley
16:06:01 <ivan> Topic: spring f2f dates
16:06:14 <dauwhe> tzviya: we have a form for possible dates for the spring F2F
16:06:15 <tzviya> s/???/Marty
16:06:19 <tzviya> https://www.w3.org/publishing/groups/publ-wg/Meetings/Minutes/2017/2017-10-02-minutes.html
16:06:29 <ReinaldoFerraz> ReinaldoFerraz has joined #pwg
16:06:34 <tzviya> https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSc0YlroocKuvfP0bd5pNRFUChY7QJ2gYGOkE7zx-tSSpkBxkg/viewform?c=0&w=1&usp=mail_form_link
16:06:53 <dauwhe> DarthVader: (unintelligible)
16:06:56 <BenSchroeter> BenSchroeter has joined #pwg
16:07:01 <dauwhe> tzviya: please fill out the form
16:07:05 <BenSchroeter> present+
16:07:53 <dauwhe> garth: there's no time like the present, so if you haven't filled out the form please do so now!
16:08:13 <duga> duga has joined #pwg
16:08:14 <dauwhe> ... we will probably discuss this on Wednesday, and have a final decision soon
16:08:15 <ivan> Topic: Lifecylcle of a WP
16:08:20 <duga> present+
16:08:22 <ivan> present+ garth
16:08:54 <dauwhe> mattg: the lifecycle is picking up from where we left off two weeks ago
16:09:03 <dauwhe> ... we don't want to proscribe a solution for the FPWD
16:09:10 <Garth> Garth has joined #pwg
16:09:15 <Garth> present+ Garth
16:09:15 <dauwhe> ... I'm just taking the issues that have surfaced all along
16:09:22 <Garth> (on the right channel this time)
16:09:26 <dauwhe> ... so I'm trying to lay out the general topics in an editor's note
16:09:36 <dauwhe> ... so we don't have a big gap in our spec
16:09:48 <dauwhe> ... the first part is basic principles... we're not trying to break or fork the web
16:09:59 <dauwhe> ... and that a web publication shouldn't have to be it's own app
16:10:02 <Garth> q?
16:10:12 <dauwhe> ... the second part is a breakdown of what used to be in this section
16:10:21 <dauwhe> ... the issues and problems around initializing the WP
16:10:22 <ivan> The version of Matt's contribution in the PR: https://s3.amazonaws.com/pr-preview/w3c/wpub/lifecycle.html
16:10:49 <dauwhe> GarthVader: it's in the IRC
16:11:05 <dauwhe> mattg: taking it offline, searching across documents, how do you traverse history...
16:11:16 <dauwhe> ... updating a manifest... these are issues we know we will face
16:11:23 <dauwhe> ... this is what's on our plate
16:11:51 <dauwhe> ... do we integrate this? Should we list more? How should we get feedback? Broad issues in GitHub haven't worked well in the past.
16:11:59 <Garth> q?
16:12:01 <dauwhe> ... we want a wide range of people to voice their opinions
16:12:14 <dauwhe> ... we should put something in SOTD about what we want feedback on
16:12:21 <Garth> q?
16:12:23 <dauwhe> ... fin
16:12:33 <ivan> q+
16:12:37 <dauwhe> Garth: any feedback right now for matt?
16:12:42 <tzviya> q+
16:12:46 <dauwhe> ... consensus to accept the PR?
16:12:50 <dauwhe> q?
16:12:53 <Garth> q?
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16:13:07 <dauwhe> ivan: first, I think the PR should be merged
16:13:18 <MarthP> s/MarthP/MartyP/
16:13:19 <dauwhe> ... as for getting more feedback, TPAC isn't far away, so we will discuss there
16:13:25 <Garth> ack ivan
16:13:44 <dauwhe> ... and then make a lot of noise when the FPWD is out, maybe right after TPAC
16:13:57 <dauwhe> tzviya: I'm in the ship-it category
16:14:12 <dauwhe> ... once we publish, we might want to contact specific people, and ask for feedback
16:14:16 <Garth> q?
16:14:17 <dauwhe> ... like the browserfolk
16:14:19 <Garth> ack tzviya
16:14:27 <dauwhe> Garth: that sounds good to me
16:14:34 <laudrain> +1
16:14:42 <dauwhe> ... Matt, Make It So (in Picard voice)
16:14:59 <dauwhe> Garth: Leonard is next?
16:15:04 <dauwhe> ivan: He had an emergency
16:15:14 <Hadrien> Hadrien has joined #pwg
16:15:20 <dauwhe> Garth: we can move this to next week
16:15:23 <Hadrien> present+
16:15:34 <Garth> https://docs.google.com/document/d/12J3Y3bb5fdPh1r2XH9YloINkNSxBJArocKY108sYCZ0/edit?usp=sharing
16:15:40 <dauwhe> ... next is timCole on selectors
16:15:55 <tzviya> https://w3c.github.io/publ-loc/
16:16:02 <Garth> https://w3c.github.io/publ-loc/
16:16:10 <ivan> Topic: Locators
16:16:24 <dauwhe> timCole: there's a PR associated with this discussion about internal locators
16:16:32 <dauwhe> ... how to identify a fragment or location in a wp
16:16:43 <dauwhe> ... we tried to put that in WPUB doc, but it was too long
16:16:49 <dauwhe> ... so we started a new document
16:16:50 <Garth> q?
16:16:58 <dauwhe> ... so Ivan wants to introduce the context
16:17:08 <dauwhe> ivan: for those who didn't read this or its predecessor
16:17:16 <dauwhe> ... this is the selector model from the web anno WG
16:17:33 <dauwhe> ... we should be able to point to an area in a resource that might not have an ID
16:17:42 <dauwhe> ... bookmarking or annotation is the obvious example
16:17:48 <dauwhe> ... that goal is the same as for epub cfi
16:17:56 <dauwhe> ... but the group took a different approach
16:18:06 <dauwhe> ... because a single solution wouldn't work
16:18:25 <dauwhe> ... so the group developed a JSON object that included various ways of IDing a point
16:18:37 <dauwhe> ... could be ID, could be text match, could be character index, could be range
16:19:06 <dauwhe> ... the idea was that IDing these things as JSON, an annotator can handle that
16:19:15 <dauwhe> ... we were looking at it for WP
16:19:23 <dauwhe> ... we think it could solve the use cases
16:19:37 <dauwhe> ... 2 issues: we had to expand the web anno model
16:19:51 <timCole> https://github.com/w3c/publ-loc/issues
16:20:00 <dauwhe> ... if we have a WP we might need a range spanning multiple docs
16:20:07 <dauwhe> ... the other issue is more general
16:20:15 <dauwhe> ... EPUB CFI was a fragment identifier
16:20:26 <dauwhe> ... web anno is a json structure and not a fragment identeifier
16:20:39 <dauwhe> ... there's a way to encode the JSON into a fragment identifier
16:20:47 <dauwhe> ... the Q is, do we really need that?
16:21:02 <dauwhe> ... those fragment identifiers are even harder to read than CFI
16:21:26 <dauwhe> ... and we also have to go through an IANA registration... there are lots of admin hoops
16:21:41 <dauwhe> ... for the use cases for WP, do we really need fragment identifiers
16:21:55 <mattg> s/identeifier/identifier/
16:21:58 <dauwhe> ... or can we use the JSON structure, knowing that annotation systems already have adopted these
16:22:14 <dauwhe> ... there are also some issues around details
16:22:22 <Garth> q?
16:22:39 <dauwhe> timCole: I want to go thru a couple of use cases in CFI
16:22:45 <rdeltour> q+
16:22:59 <ivan> Guests+ Marty_Picco
16:23:16 <dauwhe> rdeltour: to clarify, one of the reqs for CFI was that they could be sorted
16:23:28 <Garth> ack rdeltour
16:23:29 <dauwhe> ... you could tell if one was after the other, you could sort in doc order
16:23:31 <Garth> q?
16:23:40 <dauwhe> ... that isn't possible with this proposal
16:23:47 <dauwhe> ... but I don't think it's important for our needs
16:23:52 <Garth> q?
16:23:59 <dauwhe> ivan: I agree with both--it cant be done, and it's not terribly important
16:24:07 <dauwhe> timCole: the Q is how fixed is the reading order?
16:24:13 <ivan> s/cant/can't/
16:24:17 <dauwhe> tzviya: why does it always come back to that? :)
16:24:32 <dauwhe> Garth: we do have dependency on the reading order for ranges crossing docs
16:24:41 <rachel> q+
16:24:46 <dauwhe> timCole: we suggest you just list the resources and their segments
16:24:57 <ivan> guest+ rachel
16:24:58 <Garth> q?
16:25:01 <dauwhe> ... it assumes that there's some reason they are grouped
16:25:05 <Garth> ack rachel
16:25:23 <dauwhe> rachel: the issue across docs carries into the higher ed market, this is a problem we have with CFI
16:25:33 <dauwhe> ... we can't make CFIs that cross HTML files
16:25:53 <dauwhe> Garth: I remember that ranges were done with two pointers, which implies knowing the reading order
16:26:16 <dauwhe> timCole: in the original webanno model, there was a range indicator for within a single file
16:26:39 <dauwhe> ... we're looking now at multi-resource selector where you get identification thru any of the other selectors
16:26:55 <dauwhe> ... I don't know how well this would work, because we haven't tried
16:27:20 <dauwhe> Garth: so if you're starting in doc 3 and ending in doc ten, you'd have to reference (4..9)
16:27:26 <dauwhe> timCole: yep
16:27:27 <Garth> q?
16:27:33 <dauwhe> ... that's new
16:27:52 <tzviya> q+ comment about index ranges and fragids
16:27:57 <dauwhe> timCole: don't know if it will be good enough for Rachel's use case. We should talk at TPAC
16:28:07 <tzviya> q+ to comment about indexes and fragids
16:28:10 <dauwhe> Garth: this is potentially problematic with multiple reading orders
16:28:18 <Garth> q?
16:28:34 <timCole> https://github.com/w3c/publ-loc/issues
16:28:41 <dauwhe> timCole: if you go to the link, and look at the issues
16:28:49 <Karen> Karen has joined #pwg
16:28:50 <dauwhe> ... the frag ID question Ivan already mentioned
16:29:03 <dauwhe> ... in the web anno model, we're always talking about a chunk of content
16:29:09 <dauwhe> ... everything is a segment of a file
16:29:28 <dauwhe> ... in CFI, there's location and there is side bias
16:29:57 <dauwhe> ... do you need to specify a position between char 6 and 7, but bias to the start of 7 rather than the end of 6?
16:29:58 <Garth> q?
16:30:02 <dauwhe> ... is that a real use case?
16:30:07 <dauwhe> Garth: I don't remember
16:30:16 <dauwhe> tzviya: maybe SVG?
16:30:27 <dauwhe> timCole: page breaks?
16:30:42 <dauwhe> mattg: if the char boundary is a page boundary, you need to know where to stay
16:30:54 <dauwhe> timCole: we havent figured out the side bias yet
16:31:08 <dauwhe> tzviya: could you work around that with anno selectors
16:31:20 <dauwhe> ivan: it's a matter of really understanding the use case
16:31:27 <dauwhe> timCole: might require an additional property
16:31:30 <ivan> q+
16:31:37 <dauwhe> ... my hope is that the anno model will fit
16:31:59 <dauwhe> Garth: I do recall pagination as being one of the reasons
16:32:07 <dauwhe> tzviya: I had 2 comments
16:32:16 <dauwhe> ... one was about range, indexing is a use case
16:32:38 <Garth> q?
16:32:42 <Garth> ack tzviya
16:32:42 <Zakim> tzviya, you wanted to comment about indexes and fragids
16:32:42 <dauwhe> ... people need page numbers, but even that has ranges, and may cross documents
16:33:01 <dauwhe> ... the other comment is on fragment identifiers, would this be odd without a new media type?
16:33:08 <dauwhe> ivan: odd is not a good term
16:33:15 <dauwhe> ... formally speaking, it's not possible
16:33:19 <Garth> ack ivan
16:33:23 <dauwhe> ... frag IDs are defined for A media type
16:33:34 <timCole> q+
16:33:39 <dauwhe> ... if we want to have frag IDs, then we have lots of administrative problems
16:33:49 <dauwhe> ... and I don't want to go through that again :)
16:34:16 <dauwhe> ... the range story... the way it works in one doc, is defining the start and the end of the range, using other selectors
16:34:26 <dauwhe> ... its a continuous set
16:34:42 <dauwhe> ... you may start in paragraph 1 and end in para 21, and it's the whole range
16:34:58 <dauwhe> ... can you define those ranges over doc boundaries? We still have to discuss that
16:35:22 <dauwhe> ... I want to emphasize that we've tried so far to be as close to the web anno model as possible
16:35:31 <dauwhe> ... we shouldn't redefine anything
16:35:36 <dauwhe> ... we might have to add stuff
16:35:52 <dauwhe> ... there is already a REC and implementations
16:36:17 <ivan> present+ bigbluehat
16:36:21 <Garth> q?
16:36:23 <dauwhe> ... and we don't want to break existing implementations
16:36:23 <Garth> ack timCole
16:36:29 <dauwhe> timCole: regarding fragment id
16:36:36 <dauwhe> ... there is precedent in media fragments
16:36:46 <dauwhe> ... which works for multiple mime types
16:37:04 <dauwhe> ... CFI is tied to the manifest of an EPUB
16:37:45 <dauwhe> ... you can be trying to talk about a segment of a resource that's inside another resource
16:37:58 <dauwhe> ... like a segment of an image that is in an HTML page
16:38:07 <dauwhe> ... but there is a scope, the embedding html page
16:38:23 <dauwhe> ... so with web pubs we have an html file that's part of a WP
16:38:27 <dauwhe> ... so again we have a scope
16:38:35 <dauwhe> ... so we might need this idea
16:38:41 <dauwhe> ... the last idea is kindof related
16:38:52 <dauwhe> ... if I have a resource that appears in multiple places in a publication
16:39:14 <dauwhe> ... do I need to specifiy which instance I'm talking about? the same image in ch5 vs ch9?
16:39:26 <duga> duga has joined #pwg
16:39:27 <dauwhe> Garth: we didn't have that problem in CFI because we didn't allow it to happen
16:39:45 <dauwhe> ... CFI postdated that requirement
16:39:58 <dauwhe> ... the other Q
16:40:04 <dauwhe> ... the proposal now works for WP
16:40:09 <dauwhe> ... would this work for PWP?
16:40:30 <dauwhe> timCole: I haven't thought about it
16:40:40 <dauwhe> ... in WP, we think everything should have ULR
16:40:57 <ivan> q+
16:41:02 <dauwhe> ... if in PWP, the identifiers are only available via the manifest, then we might have an issue
16:41:08 <wolfgang> s /ULR/URL/
16:41:13 <dauwhe> ... we should use canonical identifiers
16:41:28 <dauwhe> ... maybe it's a must
16:41:33 <dauwhe> q?
16:41:34 <Garth> q?
16:41:47 <Garth> ack ivan
16:42:01 <dauwhe> ivan: there's a concept of embedded resource selector
16:42:09 <dauwhe> ... by default each resource has it's own URL
16:42:24 <dauwhe> ... in some cases you want to say that this URL has to be understood in the context of a WP
16:42:35 <dauwhe> ... so we have 2 diff ways of expressing that
16:42:49 <dauwhe> ... if you use that, if it is the package a package has a URN
16:42:57 <dauwhe> ... each constituent also has an identifier
16:43:09 <dauwhe> ... this mechanism should be usable to solve this issue
16:43:10 <Bill_Kasdorf> q+
16:43:18 <dauwhe> ... one more thing
16:43:36 <dauwhe> ... we would need to have an agreement that we merge the PR
16:43:44 <timCole> https://github.com/w3c/wpub/pull/75
16:43:45 <dauwhe> ... so that this is now integral part of the work
16:43:53 <dauwhe> ... even if it's in a different doc
16:44:20 <Garth> ack Bill_Kasdorf
16:44:22 <Garth> q?
16:44:24 <dauwhe> Bill_Kasdorf: we do have to keep a11y issues in mind
16:44:41 <dauwhe> ... if you have a fragment of an image, how do you manage the alt text so it's still accessible
16:44:59 <dauwhe> timCole: the fragment wouldn't include the description
16:45:05 <dauwhe> ivan: I want to see the use case
16:45:22 <dauwhe> ... this is to put annotations or create bookmarks, that's what it's all about
16:45:33 <dauwhe> ... I don't think there's an a11y scenario here
16:45:38 <dauwhe> Bill_Kasdorf: I think you're right
16:45:42 <duga> q+
16:45:47 <ivan> present+ gregorio
16:45:49 <dauwhe> ivan:  this did not come up in web anno for these reasons
16:45:55 <Garth> ack duga
16:46:15 <dauwhe> duga: it seems like the use here would be a picture, I draw a circle around someone's face, and say something
16:46:24 <dauwhe> ... you'd want alt text to explain what's circled
16:46:35 <dauwhe> ... if it's a photo of the class of 1987
16:46:35 <Garth> q?
16:46:45 <dauwhe> ivan: the alt text is in the document, part of the HTML
16:46:50 <bigbluehat> you'd need to annotate the alt text--not the photo
16:46:54 <bigbluehat> what ivan said
16:47:11 <bigbluehat> s/what ivan said//
16:47:12 <dauwhe> duga: the alt text describes the entirety of the picture, not the fragment
16:47:16 <tzviya> q+
16:47:24 <bigbluehat> q+
16:47:36 <dauwhe> ivan: you make an anno on the picture, and then you add the alt to the anno
16:47:47 <bigbluehat> q-
16:48:01 <dauwhe> tzviya: I don't want to go too far down this rabbit hole
16:48:07 <Garth> ack tzviya
16:48:12 <dauwhe> ... brady, you're talking about the a11y of annotations
16:48:18 <dauwhe> ... and we have two more items on the agenda
16:48:36 <dauwhe> Garth: Tim, were there other issues?
16:48:39 <dauwhe> timCole: no
16:48:58 <dauwhe> Garth: going back to Ivan's suggestion of merging this PR
16:49:08 <Garth> q?
16:49:11 <dauwhe> ... seems like a good plan to me
16:49:14 <tzviya> +1
16:49:19 <ivan> RESOLVED: merge PR #75
16:49:20 <dauwhe> Garth: let's do that
16:49:31 <dauwhe> timCole: I'm hoping to have this doc to discuss at TPAC
16:49:59 <ivan> Topic: Pagination issues
16:50:42 <Garth> https://github.com/w3c/wpub/pull/65
16:50:52 <tzviya> https://github.com/w3c/wpub/pull/85
16:51:31 <ivan> Proposed: close #65 and merge #85
16:51:41 <Garth> q?
16:51:52 <ivan> q+
16:52:08 <Garth> q?
16:52:21 <Garth> ack ivan
16:52:25 <dauwhe> ivan: I saw Florian's comments
16:52:34 <dauwhe> ... he was commenting on Dave's changes on his PR
16:52:50 <dauwhe> ... I would be in favor of merging things
16:53:10 <dauwhe> ... the comments of florian are valid and should be discussed
16:53:18 <dauwhe> ... but it's good to have a complete FPWD
16:53:32 <Garth> q?
16:53:40 <dauwhe> Garth: I would agree with Ivan's proposal
16:53:48 <dauwhe> ... any objections?
16:53:48 <ivan> RESOLVED: close #65 and merge #85
16:54:08 <ivan> Topic: TPAC Agenda
16:54:18 <dauwhe> Garth: there are references to a fleshed-out agenda
16:54:26 <dauwhe> ... now everyone can comment but not edit
16:54:47 <dauwhe> ... I encourage folks to review and comment
16:55:15 <ivan> zakim, who is here?
16:55:15 <Zakim> Present: ivan, dauwhe, George, wolfgang, Avneesh, mattg, tzviya, Tim_Cole, JunGamo, Chris_Maden, Lillian, Sullam, baldurbjarnason, rkwright, rachel, josh, Luc, rdeltour, mateus,
16:55:18 <Zakim> ... Laurent, Vlad, jeffp, Bill_Kasdorf, BenSchroeter, duga, garth, Hadrien, bigbluehat, gregorio
16:55:18 <Zakim> On IRC I see duga, Hadrien, Leslie, Garth, BenSchroeter, ReinaldoFerraz, Bill_Kasdorf, mateus, laurentlemeur, josh, LSullam, laudrain, rkwright, baldurbjarnason, JunGamo, jeffp,
16:55:18 <Zakim> ... Vlad, timCole, Avneesh, George, MarthP, RRSAgent, Zakim, wolfgang, cmaden2, mattg, rdeltour, rachel, tzviya, ivan, plinss, dbaron, github-bot, jyasskin, astearns, bigbluehat,
16:55:20 <Zakim> ... dauwhe, ShaneM, wseltzer
16:55:23 <dauwhe> tzviya: We have more requests at joint meetings
16:55:29 <ivan> present+ gregorio
16:55:32 <Garth> q?
16:55:42 <ivan> present+ hadrien
16:55:49 <dauwhe> Garth: anything else to bring up?
16:55:54 <dauwhe> (silence)
16:56:11 <Garth> https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSc0YlroocKuvfP0bd5pNRFUChY7QJ2gYGOkE7zx-tSSpkBxkg/viewform?c=0&w=1&usp=mail_form_link
16:56:11 <ivan> present+ jpyle
16:56:12 <dauwhe> Garth: everyone, take the last five minutes to fill out the form for the Spring F2F
16:56:21 <ivan> present+ leslie
16:56:36 <wolfgang> have a nice afternoon!
16:56:38 <dauwhe> Garth: that's all, folks!
16:56:57 <ivan> present+ reinaldo
16:57:02 <ivan> present+ billk
16:57:21 <ivan> present+ bdugas
16:57:35 <ivan> zakim, who is here?
16:57:35 <Zakim> Present: ivan, dauwhe, George, wolfgang, Avneesh, mattg, tzviya, Tim_Cole, JunGamo, Chris_Maden, Lillian, Sullam, baldurbjarnason, rkwright, rachel, josh, Luc, rdeltour, mateus,
16:57:38 <Zakim> ... Laurent, Vlad, jeffp, Bill_Kasdorf, BenSchroeter, duga, garth, Hadrien, bigbluehat, gregorio, jpyle, leslie, reinaldo, billk, bdugas
16:57:38 <Zakim> On IRC I see Leslie, Garth, ReinaldoFerraz, Bill_Kasdorf, laurentlemeur, JunGamo, jeffp, timCole, George, MarthP, RRSAgent, Zakim, wolfgang, cmaden2, mattg, rdeltour, rachel,
16:57:38 <Zakim> ... tzviya, ivan, plinss, dbaron, github-bot, jyasskin, astearns, bigbluehat, dauwhe, ShaneM, wseltzer
16:57:57 <cmaden2> cmaden2 has left #pwg
16:58:04 <ivan> rrsagent, draft minutes
16:58:04 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2017/10/16-pwg-minutes.html ivan
16:58:22 <ivan> rrsagent, draft minutes
16:58:22 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2017/10/16-pwg-minutes.html ivan