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14:37:19 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
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14:37:21 <trackbot> Meeting: Low Vision Accessibility Task Force Teleconference
14:37:21 <trackbot> Date: 05 October 2017
14:37:25 <allanj> chair: Jim
14:37:59 <allanj> regrets: Glenda, Erich
14:38:35 <allanj> Agenda+ Understanding Graphics Contrast  https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/81151/Understanding2/results#xq1
14:42:41 <shawn> shawn has joined #lvtf
14:49:01 <allanj> Hour long meeting today! then AG call
14:56:24 <shawn> shawn has joined #lvtf
14:57:10 <scott> scott has joined #lvtf
14:59:22 <scott> hello hello?
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15:01:15 <JohnRochford> present+ JohnRochford
15:01:54 <alastairc> present+ alastairc
15:01:59 <allanj> present+
15:02:37 <alastairc> Something for discussion soon, perhaps not today: https://github.com/w3c/wcag21/issues/335#issuecomment-334468667
15:02:44 <allanj> regrets+ Laura
15:02:50 <alastairc> Regarding zoom content.
15:03:00 <scott> present+
15:03:15 <allanj> scribe: allanj
15:04:10 <allanj> topic: zoom
15:04:17 <allanj> Something for discussion soon, perhaps not today: https://github.com/w3c/wcag21/issues/335#issuecomment-334468667
15:05:03 <steverep_> steverep_ has joined #lvtf
15:05:09 <allanj>     For content with horizontal lines of text, content can be zoomed up to 400% from a starting width of 1280 CSS pixels without loss of content or functionality, and without requiring horizontal scrolling to read horizontal lines of text.
15:05:10 <allanj>     For content with vertical lines of text, content can be zoomed up to 300% from a starting height of 960 CSS pixels without loss of content or functionality, and without requiring vertical scrolling to read vertical lines of text.
15:05:12 <allanj>     Parts of the content that require two-dimensional layout for usage or meaning are excepted.
15:05:12 <steverep_> present+steverep
15:05:53 <JohnRochford> https://github.com/w3c/wcag21/issues/335#issuecomment-334468667
15:07:33 <allanj> ac: this text seems to cover all possible cases
15:09:02 <allanj> ... it is longer. covers the cases, prevents what we don't want, allows what we do want.
15:09:36 <alastairc> https://www.chenhuijing.com/zh-type/
15:09:37 <allanj> sr: the vertical part. browser reflow horizontally regardless of the text directions
15:10:05 <allanj> ac: horizontal reflow is new to browsers.
15:10:27 <allanj> ... there are small blocks that will fail depending on text direction.
15:10:50 <allanj> ... focusing on blocks of content rather than page level.
15:11:08 <allanj> ac: need to mull this a bit.
15:11:31 <allanj> jr: pixel definition absolute to viewport size?
15:12:03 <allanj> ac: pixels are relative to device by definition. should be consistent
15:12:33 <allanj> sr: will this be a testing issue... always have to start at 1280 pixels
15:13:13 <allanj> ac: desktop browsers only current ones that zoom with reflow. it eliminates pinch zoom.
15:13:30 <allanj> ... could add testing criteria
15:15:35 <allanj> No testing in Understanding document
15:16:46 <allanj> ac: join in on GitHub
15:18:20 <allanj> jim mine https://github.com/w3c/wcag21/issues/77 for content for Understanding
15:18:58 <scott> woot woot
15:19:58 <allanj> zakim, open item 1
15:19:58 <Zakim> agendum 1. "Understanding Graphics Contrast  https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/81151/Understanding2/results#xq1" taken up [from allanj]
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15:21:27 <allanj> essential vs important vs necessary wording
15:21:54 <allanj> please review: https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/essential_breakout/
15:22:00 <shawn> regrets: Shawn
15:22:23 <allanj> ac: perhaps remove second part of def.
15:22:51 <allanj> sr: first part is subjective. second part is essential and hard to meet
15:23:39 <allanj> ac: as site owner... if you took X away ... does it matter. as a definition
15:24:05 <allanj> ja: perhaps a rule or protocol
15:24:44 <allanj> sr: essential - effects many lvtf SC. 11 times in 2.1 SC.
15:25:07 <allanj> ... glossary def doesn't match what is meant in SC
15:25:33 <allanj> sr: lvtf uses it in Graphic Contrast and others.
15:26:00 <allanj> ... proposed use necessary or required for understanding. synonym replacement.
15:27:56 <allanj> ... UI contrast, Adapting Text, all use essential.
15:28:09 <allanj> ... what loss is acceptable?
15:29:06 <allanj> sr: hover - essential content in trigger - white space, part of background. added pure decoration
15:30:01 <allanj> ac: UI contrast. ... if you have a visual identifier, if you add essential then you need to define essential visual identifier.
15:30:24 <allanj> sr: produce examples on both sides of the word.
15:31:14 <allanj> jr: voted yes for suggested changes in essential breakout
15:37:34 <allanj> need Written techniques for
15:37:36 <allanj> -include labels and values with the graphic
15:37:37 <allanj> -contrasting differentiated pattern
15:37:39 <allanj> -include contrasting lines between adjoining colors.
15:37:40 <allanj> -include data within graphic (red piece of pie chart - white circle within red piece - 37% written in white circle)
15:39:01 <allanj> would be interesting to use the same graphic and apply different techniques to make contrast accessible
15:40:51 <allanj> sr: agree with Laura. Make the graphic visible by improving contast. not just applying text contrast to graphics.
15:41:46 <JohnRochford> I too agree with Laura.
15:43:07 <allanj> ac: will be adding more examples, strengthening first intent para.
15:45:12 <allanj> jim will post related materials for graphics.
15:45:49 <allanj> add to agenda - Hover Understanding review
15:47:19 <allanj> add to agenda reviewing comments
15:48:51 <allanj> and suggest to AG to close
15:49:25 <allanj>  with explanation
15:51:50 <allanj> Trackbot, end meeting
15:51:50 <trackbot> Zakim, list attendees
15:51:50 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been JohnRochford, alastairc, allanj, scott, steverep
15:51:58 <scott> scott has left #lvtf
15:51:58 <trackbot> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
15:51:58 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2017/10/05-lvtf-minutes.html trackbot
15:51:59 <trackbot> RRSAgent, bye
15:51:59 <RRSAgent> I see no action items
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15:52:53 <allanj> rrsagent, set logs public
15:53:13 <allanj> rrsagne, please leave
15:53:20 <allanj> rrsagent, please leave
15:53:20 <RRSAgent> I see no action items
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15:54:54 <allanj> regrets+ Glenda, Erich
15:55:16 <allanj> rrsagent, make minutes
15:55:16 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2017/10/05-lvtf-minutes.html allanj
15:55:33 <allanj> rrsagent, please leave