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14:58:36 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2017/08/31-i18n-irc
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14:58:49 <addison> trackbot, prepare teleconference
14:58:52 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
14:58:55 <trackbot> Meeting: Internationalization Working Group Teleconference
14:58:55 <trackbot> Date: 31 August 2017
14:59:07 <addison> Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-core/2017Aug/0019.html
14:59:15 <addison> agenda+ Agenda
14:59:19 <addison> agenda+ Action Items
14:59:26 <addison> agenda+ Info Share
14:59:34 <addison> agenda+ RADAR and Active Work Review
14:59:51 <addison> agenda+ WhatWG issue 2945 (hinting at translation for outgoing links)
15:00:01 <addison> agenda+ String metadata
15:00:15 <addison> agenda+ Developments related to the gap-analysis matrix
15:00:27 <addison> Regrets: Steven
15:00:33 <addison> Chair: Addison Phillips
15:00:36 <addison> ScribeNick: addison
15:00:45 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2017/08/31-i18n-minutes.html addison
15:01:51 <barryleiba> barryleiba has joined #i18n
15:01:58 <barryleiba> present+ Barry_Leiba
15:02:02 <addison> present+ Addison
15:02:09 <addison> zakim, who is here?
15:02:09 <Zakim> Present: Barry_Leiba, Addison
15:02:11 <Zakim> On IRC I see barryleiba, Zakim, RRSAgent, addison, andrewc, xfq, r12a, koji, bigbluehat, Bert, trackbot, fantasai
15:02:33 <addison> present+ r12a
15:02:44 <xfq> [Fù qiáo]
15:02:54 <xfq> present+ Fuqiao
15:03:05 <r12a> present+
15:04:46 <addison> present+ David
15:04:48 <David> David has joined #I18n
15:04:50 <andrewc> present+
15:05:02 <David> Zakim, present+
15:05:06 <barryleiba> Addison
15:05:09 <addison> zakim, take up agendum 1
15:05:09 <Zakim> agendum 1. "Agenda" taken up [from addison]
15:05:15 <addison> agenda?
15:05:33 <addison> zakim, take up agendum 2
15:05:33 <Zakim> agendum 2. "Action Items" taken up [from addison]
15:05:47 <addison> present+ Bert
15:05:55 <addison> https://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/open
15:05:55 <r12a> zakim, who's here?
15:05:55 <Zakim> Present: Barry_Leiba, Addison, r12a, Fuqiao, David, andrewc, Bert
15:05:57 <Zakim> On IRC I see David, barryleiba, Zakim, RRSAgent, addison, andrewc, xfq, r12a, koji, bigbluehat, Bert, trackbot, fantasai
15:06:21 <addison> action-618?
15:06:21 <trackbot> action-618 -- Richard Ishida to Create a short document about making direction default recommendation to be 'auto' and send to www-international@ for review -- due 2017-08-25 -- OPEN
15:06:21 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/618
15:06:55 <addison> action-645?
15:06:55 <trackbot> action-645 -- Addison Phillips to Remind working group to read whatwg html issue 2945 for discussion next telecon -- due 2017-08-31 -- OPEN
15:06:55 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/645
15:07:03 <addison> close action-645
15:07:03 <trackbot> Closed action-645.
15:07:13 <addison> action-646?
15:07:13 <trackbot> action-646 -- Richard Ishida to Publish strings-and-bidi article -- due 2017-08-31 -- OPEN
15:07:13 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/646
15:07:16 <addison> close action-646
15:07:16 <trackbot> Closed action-646.
15:07:24 <addison> zakim, take up agendum 3
15:07:24 <Zakim> agendum 3. "Info Share" taken up [from addison]
15:07:37 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2017/08/31-i18n-minutes.html addison
15:07:40 <r12a> agenda?
15:09:09 <David__> David__ has joined #I18n
15:09:25 <addison> zakim, take up agendum 4
15:09:25 <Zakim> agendum 4. "RADAR and Active Work Review" taken up [from addison]
15:09:40 <addison> https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/projects/1
15:10:37 <addison> richard: worked on css align, very complex
15:10:48 <addison> ... like a large math equation :-)
15:10:54 <addison> ... maybe not much to worry about
15:11:10 <addison> ... couple things, it's about aligning blocks inside another block
15:11:16 <addison> ... can do horizontally or vertically
15:11:40 <addison> ... call the vertical alignment in horizontally laid text
15:11:57 <andrewc_> andrewc_ has joined #i18n
15:12:12 <addison> ... have properties like "align self" and "align content"
15:12:35 <addison> ... or "jusitfy self" or "justify content"
15:12:46 <addison> ... word 'justify' already confusing??
15:13:15 <addison> ... and the section on baseline alignment is difficult to understand when differnet script baselines in use
15:13:31 <addison> ... editors aware of the problem obviously, but not obvious to me how the baseline is chosen
15:13:41 <addison> ... thinking of raising question
15:14:47 <addison> http://w3c.github.io/i18n-activity/reviews/
15:15:50 <Klensin> Klensin has joined #i18n
15:16:59 <addison> schedule review of issues for next week
15:17:11 <addison> http://w3c.github.io/i18n-activity/projects/
15:17:39 <Klensin> present+ JcK
15:17:55 <addison> action: richard: send list of review items for next week (pendings and close? items)
15:17:56 <trackbot> Created ACTION-647 - Send list of review items for next week (pendings and close? items) [on Richard Ishida - due 2017-09-07].
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15:18:51 <addison> richard: growing momentum to idea that mongolian handled differently than currently in unicode
15:18:55 <addison> ... ad hoc committee
15:19:02 <addison> ... not sure why not on mongolian list
15:19:06 <addison> ... will suggest that
15:19:20 <addison> ... key proposal is "graphetic" approach
15:19:36 <addison> ... if type sound a/aa/oo they all look the same
15:19:40 <addison> ... confusing when typing
15:20:01 <addison> ... useful to computers in distinguishing words
15:20:23 <addison> ... all sorts of complex rules, such as gender of word
15:20:38 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2017/08/31-i18n-minutes.html addison
15:21:00 <addison> ... you have one character for every shape (not quite that simple)
15:21:03 <addison> ... type what you see
15:23:00 <addison> agenda?
15:23:20 <addison> action: richard: ask mongolian ad hoc group to use our list
15:23:21 <trackbot> Created ACTION-648 - Ask mongolian ad hoc group to use our list [on Richard Ishida - due 2017-09-07].
15:24:07 <addison> zakim, take up agendum 7
15:24:07 <Zakim> agendum 7. "Developments related to the gap-analysis matrix" taken up [from addison]
15:24:16 <r12a> http://w3c.github.io/i18n-discuss/notes/language-matrix
15:24:29 <addison> richard: last week talked about above link (language matrix)
15:24:44 <addison> ... graphical idea of where pain points are for world's languages
15:24:53 <addison> ... have to be careful about what languages chosen
15:25:14 <addison> ... list is a bunch in alpha order by script tag
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15:25:39 <r12a> http://w3c.github.io/typography/gap-analysis/ethi
15:25:40 <addison> ... bit more flesh on bone for ethiopic/amharic
15:26:08 <addison> ... only javanese last week
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15:26:21 <addison> ... ethiopic more developed, used ELReq
15:26:30 <addison> ... more complete
15:26:38 <addison> ... taking another step
15:26:50 <addison> ... hebrew layout req and arabic layout req folks
15:26:57 <addison> ... approach from this angle?
15:27:05 <addison> ... send email to shervin
15:27:10 <r12a> http://w3c.github.io/typography/gap-analysis/arab-ar-fa
15:27:13 <addison> ... click on arabic link
15:27:45 <addison> ... probably add more pages for urdu, uighur. this covers ar/fa
15:28:04 <addison> richard: should help arabic layout folks zoom in on things that need requirements
15:29:28 <addison> ... idea is to use gap analysis to prompt to write requirements
15:29:46 <addison> ... write down what does/doesn't work
15:29:51 <addison> ... write tests to demonstrate
15:30:01 <addison> ... and write reqs for things that don't work so know what to do
15:30:21 <addison> richard: wanted to mention, since fuqiao is here
15:30:27 <addison> ... try to reactivate chinese work
15:30:35 <addison> ... maybe additional thing to consider there
15:30:48 <addison> ... ask chinese experts "what's still missing"
15:33:35 <addison> david: what does level represent?
15:33:45 <addison> richard: level represents overall
15:34:06 <addison> ... color says whether the language works or not on the web
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15:34:42 <addison> richard: numbers are very kludgey
15:34:56 <addison> ... added points for dark green, etc. and divided
15:35:29 <addison> ... hokey, but gives some idea
15:35:39 <addison> jck: two suggestions
15:35:56 <addison> ... comment at bottom welcoming analysis of other languages
15:36:14 <addison> richard: meant to do that and forgot
15:36:38 <addison> jck: under 'latn' you have "serbo-croatian"
15:37:04 <addison> ... and no longer politically correct
15:37:54 <addison> agenda?
15:38:06 <addison> zakim, take up agendum 5
15:38:06 <Zakim> agendum 5. "WhatWG issue 2945 (hinting at translation for outgoing links)" taken up [from addison]
15:38:20 <addison> https://github.com/whatwg/html/issues/2945
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15:40:29 <addison> richard: the attribute as billed currently looks at the content and tries to decide what to do based on content
15:40:37 <addison> ... but should reflect preference of the user
15:40:42 <addison> ... that's significant
15:41:03 <addison> ... that makes a "loud clang"
15:41:18 <addison> ... if you're reading hindi with the page translated into english
15:41:41 <addison> ... and the link says "translate to hindi"
15:41:58 <addison> s/into english//
15:42:17 <addison> ... second page in english would hint english
15:44:21 <addison> addison: don't see how page authors would use this
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15:53:43 <addison> (much unminuted discussion)
15:53:51 <addison> David: another thing might be Referrer-Language
15:54:47 <addison> richard: worth thinking about, "there's been a change in language here"
15:55:27 <addison> andrewc: spec out how browsers handle
15:55:55 <addison> david: think we conclude that bad to embed it
15:56:11 <addison> richard: easier to change language preferences and see them
15:56:31 <addison> ... and maybe some what to signal language change
15:56:53 <xfq> +1 to david & richard
15:56:57 <addison> s/some what/some way/
15:58:07 <addison> action: addison: reply to whatwg 2945 translatehint issue with wg opinion
15:58:07 <trackbot> Created ACTION-649 - Reply to whatwg 2945 translatehint issue with wg opinion [on Addison Phillips - due 2017-09-07].
15:58:37 <addison> Topic: AOB?
15:59:20 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2017/08/31-i18n-minutes.html addison
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16:26:43 <addison> zakim, bye
16:26:43 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees have been Barry_Leiba, Addison, r12a, Fuqiao, David, andrewc, Bert, JcK
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16:44:48 <r12a> s/trackbot, prepare teleconference/previous minutes: https://www.w3.org/2017/08/24-i18n-minutes.html/
16:48:32 <r12a> rrsagent, draft minutes
16:48:32 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2017/08/31-i18n-minutes.html r12a
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