IRC log of ag on 2017-06-06

Timestamps are in UTC.

14:48:29 [RRSAgent]
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logging to
14:48:31 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, make logs public
14:48:34 [trackbot]
Zakim, this will be WAI_WCAG
14:48:34 [Zakim]
ok, trackbot
14:48:34 [trackbot]
Meeting: Accessibility Guidelines Working Group Teleconference
14:48:34 [trackbot]
Date: 06 June 2017
14:48:35 [AWK]
Zakim, agenda?
14:48:35 [Zakim]
I see 1 item remaining on the agenda:
14:48:35 [Zakim]
2. Help: [from AWK]
14:48:45 [AWK]
zakim, clear agenda
14:48:45 [Zakim]
agenda cleared
14:49:01 [AWK]
agenda+ Request to publish new WCAG 2.0 edited recommendation
14:49:13 [AWK]
agenda+ Approval process for Understanding documents
14:49:25 [AWK]
agenda+ AGWG summer schedule
14:49:38 [AWK]
agenda+ Character Key Shortcuts - Issue 69
14:49:57 [AWK]
agenda+ Orientation:
14:50:08 [AWK]
agenda+ Help:
14:52:12 [Wayne]
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14:52:36 [Wayne]
14:53:24 [Jan]
present+ JanMcSorley
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14:58:46 [MichaelC]
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15:01:25 [davidmacdonald]
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15:01:28 [Glenda]
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15:01:36 [davidmacdonald]
Present+ davidmacdonald
15:01:54 [jeanne]
present+ jeanne
15:02:01 [Alex_]
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15:02:37 [Jan]
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15:02:52 [ChrisLoiselle]
15:02:59 [Alex_]
i assume the dial in isn't working for all
15:03:06 [laura]
present+ Laura
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15:03:15 [jasonjgw]
15:03:18 [KimDirks]
15:03:23 [JF]
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15:03:31 [Jan]
Trying to connect by phone, but webex says the meeting number is invalid.
15:03:57 [Glenda]
scribe Glenda
15:04:16 [KimDirks]
*I'm having trouble too - it says the meeting isn't started.
15:04:25 [AWK]
15:04:28 [AWK]
Chair: AWK
15:04:39 [Ryladog]
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15:04:45 [Rachael]
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15:04:45 [alastairc]
Ah - the agenda was for thrusday, where is the link for tuesday?
15:05:06 [Ryladog]
Present+ Katie_Haritos-Shea
15:05:07 [gowerm]
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15:05:11 [gowerm]
present+ MikeGower
15:05:23 [Ryladog]
WebEx is for Thursday call
15:05:26 [Glenda]
present+ Glenda
15:05:28 [interaccess]
15:05:28 [JF]
present+ JF
15:05:32 [Lisa_]
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15:05:34 [Ryladog]
15:05:36 [Joshue108]
15:05:37 [AWK]
Zakim, agenda?
15:05:37 [Zakim]
I see 6 items remaining on the agenda:
15:05:38 [Zakim]
1. Request to publish new WCAG 2.0 edited recommendation [from AWK]
15:05:38 [Zakim]
2. Approval process for Understanding documents [from AWK]
15:05:38 [Zakim]
3. AGWG summer schedule [from AWK]
15:05:38 [Zakim]
4. Character Key Shortcuts - Issue 69 [from AWK]
15:05:41 [Zakim]
5. Orientation: [from AWK]
15:05:41 [Zakim]
6. Help: [from AWK]
15:05:43 [Glenda]
15:05:44 [marcjohlic]
present+ marcjohlic
15:05:45 [AWK]
ZAkim, take up item 3
15:05:48 [Makoto]
present+ Makoto
15:05:49 [Zakim]
agendum 3. "AGWG summer schedule" taken up [from AWK]
15:06:02 [Glenda]
open item 3
15:06:25 [MelanieP]
present+ Melanie_Philipp
15:06:45 [Glenda]
AWK: please respond to summer schedule questions so we can plan for our summer meeting schedule
15:06:47 [Lisa_]
Not managing to join. Is the meeting now?
15:07:10 [Joshue108]
15:07:21 [davidmacdonald]
Present+ davidmacdonald
15:08:03 [Rachael]
present+ Rachael
15:08:20 [Joshue108]
present+ Joshue108
15:08:23 [Glenda]
davidmacdonald: question about TPAC meeting dates for AG. so we can make travel arrangements.
15:08:50 [kirkwood_]
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15:09:12 [JF]
15:09:58 [Glenda]
MCooper: we should see a schedule forming soon, since May 31 was the end or the survey for suggested topics
15:10:16 [JF]
ack me
15:10:50 [Glenda]
Zakim, close item 3
15:10:51 [Zakim]
agendum 3, AGWG summer schedule, closed
15:10:51 [Zakim]
I see 5 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
15:10:53 [Glenda]
open item 1
15:10:55 [Zakim]
1. Request to publish new WCAG 2.0 edited recommendation [from AWK]
15:11:44 [Joshue108]
zakim, agenda?
15:11:44 [Zakim]
I see 5 items remaining on the agenda:
15:11:45 [Zakim]
1. Request to publish new WCAG 2.0 edited recommendation [from AWK]
15:11:45 [Zakim]
2. Approval process for Understanding documents [from AWK]
15:11:45 [Zakim]
4. Character Key Shortcuts - Issue 69 [from AWK]
15:11:45 [Zakim]
5. Orientation: [from AWK]
15:11:48 [Zakim]
6. Help: [from AWK]
15:12:29 [alastairc]
present+ alastairc
15:12:42 [MichaelC]
15:12:52 [kirkwood]
present+ kirkwood
15:13:01 [AWK]
ack mi
15:13:12 [Glenda]
AWK: discussing Stephen Repsher’s comment on color. AWK disagrees and says this was processed.
15:13:54 [Glenda]
MCooper: Is this just editorial? Personally wonder if we should leave this color change out.
15:14:26 [Glenda]
AWK: the intent of the working group is that this is editorial.
15:14:37 [Glenda]
MCooper: I’m 85% convinced
15:15:23 [Joshue108]
15:15:55 [Glenda]
AWK: Bruce has comments about typos. Also comment on color item #11 feels normative to him.
15:15:59 [Joshue108]
15:16:10 [Glenda]
AWK: Bruce’s last comment is changing fix we all agreed on.
15:16:37 [Alex_]
+1 to Josh
15:17:02 [Glenda]
Joshue108: is it worth it to make this change to 2.0, or just roll it into 2.1 (to prevent pushback and confusion related to 2.0).
15:17:16 [Joshue108]
ack me
15:17:33 [jasonjgw]
15:17:40 [Glenda]
Katie: I think we need to leave this for another time. Worried it will confuse people. Important that we end up doing it, but not if it confuses everyone.
15:19:30 [Glenda]
Makoto: I should have expressed my question before consensus. So it has been very clear to me that 1.4.1 covers "Color" and 1.3.3 covers other than "Color". If we'll add "color" to 1.3.3, what would be the difference between revised 1.3.3 and 1.4.1
15:19:54 [jamesn]
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15:20:06 [jamesn]
rrsagent, make minutes
15:20:06 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate jamesn
15:21:34 [Glenda]
AWK: meaning of 1.3.3. and 1.4.1 is not changing. 1.3.3 is talking shape, size, visual orientation, including color. If you provide click on the red button. 1.4.1 use of color, is talking about not relying on color as the only means of conveying information, like if an error state is only conveyed in red.
15:22:29 [Pietro]
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15:22:33 [JakeAbma]
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15:22:41 [MichaelC]
q+ to say this erratum is taking us off course of the edited rec
15:22:44 [JakeAbma]
present+ JakeAbma
15:22:53 [Pietro]
Present+ Pietro
15:23:02 [MichaelC]
15:24:33 [Joshue108]
q+ to say I don't want to burn cycles defending a relatively minor descision when we have bigger fish to fry with 2.1
15:24:53 [Glenda]
AWK: Judy’s concerns about proper messaging and understanding.
15:25:08 [Joshue108]
+1 to Michael
15:25:18 [AWK]
ack jas
15:25:46 [MichaelC]
q+ to note every time we do an approval round people find more typos ;)
15:26:27 [Joshue108]
ack me
15:26:27 [Zakim]
Joshue, you wanted to say I don't want to burn cycles defending a relatively minor descision when we have bigger fish to fry with 2.1
15:26:28 [AWK]
ack josh
15:26:34 [Glenda]
Jason: change to 1.3.3 is just clarifying what was already there. not a normative change. interpretation is correct. But if people have concerns we could delay to 2.1. Rather do it for 2.0.
15:27:02 [Glenda]
Joshue: I’m not against us doing this. Don’t want to burning cycles on something minor.
15:27:26 [Mike_Elledge]
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15:27:39 [Mike_Elledge]
Present+ Mike Elledge
15:27:50 [bruce_bailey]
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15:27:54 [Glenda]
MichaelC: typos, we should fix them. A year ago, we said last call. And we have more. We need to draw a line. This is the errata we have collected up to date x.
15:27:58 [MichaelC]
ack me
15:27:58 [Zakim]
MichaelC, you wanted to note every time we do an approval round people find more typos ;)
15:28:22 [Glenda]
Katie: I think we should, I just don’t think we should do it now.
15:28:34 [Glenda]
AWK: if we don’t do it now, I don’t think we ever will.
15:28:36 [JF]
+1 to Katie
15:29:22 [Ryladog]
15:29:23 [alastairc]
I don't feel strongly, I'd lean toward rolling into 2.1 if it can't be done quickly now.
15:29:42 [Glenda]
MichaelC: lean toward wanting to do errata now. It will be less helpful after 2.1 is published.
15:29:47 [jasonjgw]
15:29:50 [Joshue108]
Access code: 642 418 206
15:29:50 [AWK]
ack r
15:30:05 [Glenda]
Katie: people will continue to comply with WCAG 2.0 for 10 years
15:30:16 [JF]
15:30:16 [MichaelC]
15:30:26 [AWK]
ack jf
15:30:35 [MichaelC]
q+ to say we need a ¨trigger¨ for when to take it up again if we defer
15:31:04 [AWK]
ack jason
15:31:09 [Glenda]
JF: agree with Katie. WCAG 2.1 does not invalidate WCAG 2.0. Regulator perspective, a lot of people will still use WCAG 2.0.
15:31:42 [Joshue108]
15:31:49 [Glenda]
JasonWhite: problem with new errata, but we should at least clear the list of known errata.
15:32:08 [MichaelC]
ack me
15:32:08 [Zakim]
MichaelC, you wanted to say we need a ¨trigger¨ for when to take it up again if we defer
15:32:10 [AWK]
ack m
15:32:25 [Lisa_]
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15:32:37 [Joshue108]
ack me
15:32:46 [AWK]
ack jo
15:32:47 [Glenda]
MichaelC: we don’t have consensus. but we are having problems getting this through, why would we try again.
15:32:48 [Lisa_]
I can not join the web ex
15:33:44 [Glenda]
Joshue: +1 to what MichaelC is saying. So difficult to get errata published. If not now, then when. This is an opportunity to tidy up things that we know are wrong.
15:34:26 [Glenda]
+1 to what Joshue just said. Publish errata.
15:34:27 [Lisa_]
Jan is on the call she is the SC manager. Start without me
15:34:54 [Lisa_]
Maybe I have the wrong meeting number
15:35:11 [Joshue108]
15:35:27 [Glenda]
AWK: errata are published, this is a proposal to update the WCAG 2.0 edited version.
15:35:48 [bruce_bailey]
15:36:12 [AWK]
ack bruce
15:36:40 [Glenda]
RESOLUTION: We do not have consensus to publish new WCAG 2.0 edited recommendation
15:36:52 [Glenda]
Next item
15:36:56 [gowerm]
@awk I also have what I would call errata about style inconsistencies in SCs
15:38:21 [Glenda]
AWK: Survey shows consensus. “The first change is to move the Understanding document out of "TR" space. This will result in the Working Group being able to publish corrections to the Understanding document immediately with a CFC rather than publishing updates only every six months.”
15:38:22 [MichaelC]
q+ to address JS comments
15:38:37 [Glenda]
AWK: “The second change is to clarify with the Working Group that we will do a CFC to clarify that the Understanding documents are approved prior to major releases (CR, REC) but that additions and changes to the content of the Understanding document will be made in an iterative process as the group works on success criteria.
15:38:57 [davidmacdonald]
15:39:16 [AWK]
ack mi
15:39:16 [Zakim]
MichaelC, you wanted to address JS comments
15:40:10 [Glenda]
MichaelC: publishing to TR constrains our publishing. And it has a new dataed version. Non TR means that search engines are more likely to find latest content.
15:40:11 [AWK]
ack dav
15:40:47 [JF]
15:41:06 [Glenda]
davidmacdonald: understanding documents have a lot of authority, worried about frequent updates impacting that authority.
15:41:43 [Glenda]
katie: i think the updates to the understanding documents need to be agreed upon.
15:41:57 [bruce_bailey]
q+ to say I like having the dated versions
15:42:12 [Joshue108]
15:42:15 [Mike_Pluke]
present+ Mike_Pluke
15:42:56 [AWK]
ack JF
15:43:45 [Glenda]
AWK: for WCAG 2.1 we will not do a cfc for every while content is being built. But we will have cfc after these documents are more stable.
15:44:05 [bruce_bailey]
I am for the move out of TR space, and I always send folks links to the undated (most recent) version -- but this has been extra
15:44:07 [AWK]
ack bruce
15:44:07 [Zakim]
bruce_bailey, you wanted to say I like having the dated versions
15:44:15 [Glenda]
JF: fully support moving these non-normative docs into a place where we can update them more frequently.
15:44:38 [Lisa_]
Tried the new WebEx. Still can't join.
15:44:39 [jeanne]
q+ to say that it is important to keep a history, and I hope this new procedure will do that.
15:44:54 [Glenda]
Bruce: I like having dated versions, but I think it will be easier going forward without all the different dated versions.
15:45:01 [Lisa_]
Hell is copying meeting numbers to the phone
15:45:35 [Glenda]
Jeanne: hope new procedure will keep a history of changes
15:45:47 [Glenda]
AWK: yes, it will be in github and the decision log
15:46:27 [Lisa_]
Giving up. Sorry folks.
15:46:57 [Glenda]
MichaelC: we can do it in serveral ways: github commit history, and change logs, and dated snapshots at keypoints.
15:46:58 [Lisa_]
Tried for 45 minets
15:47:09 [gowerm]
Lisa, check your email
15:47:18 [gowerm]
Remailed dial in number
15:47:25 [Glenda]
AWK: I think it will be easier to look through a github commit list.
15:47:31 [Glenda]
+1 to AWK’s comment!
15:48:17 [Glenda]
DavidM - I will not object
15:48:46 [Glenda]
RESOLUTION: Accepted as proposed “Approval process for Understanding documents”
15:48:59 [Glenda]
next item
15:49:15 [AWK]
zakim, clear queue
15:49:15 [Zakim]
I don't understand 'clear queue', AWK
15:49:16 [JF]
15:49:18 [AWK]
ack j
15:49:19 [jeanne]
ack jea
15:49:19 [Zakim]
jeanne, you wanted to say that it is important to keep a history, and I hope this new procedure will do that.
15:49:23 [Glenda]
next item
15:50:27 [JF]
+1 to Jason
15:50:36 [Ryladog]
15:50:36 [JF]
15:50:44 [davidmacdonald]
15:50:59 [Glenda]
AWK: pretty good agreement. Comments from Jason echoed by James. Jason’s comment is about that speech tools should do more. Not willing to put burden on content providers.
15:51:12 [AWK]
ack ry
15:51:35 [gowerm]
15:51:38 [AWK]
ack jf
15:51:39 [Wayne]
15:51:44 [davidmacdonald]
15:51:49 [Glenda]
Katie: for years we included things that screen readers could have done, until screen readers filled in the gaps.
15:53:02 [Alex_]
15:53:03 [jasonjgw]
15:53:19 [Glenda]
JF: concerned and conflicted, not happy putting all of this requirement on the author. We can solve this with user agent and can accomplish this.
15:53:52 [Joshue108]
ack david
15:53:54 [Glenda]
Joshue: addressing particular user needs
15:55:18 [Ryladog]
+1 to David
15:55:30 [Glenda]
davidmacdonald: not to0 hard to do, reasonable to ask the developer
15:55:35 [Wayne]
15:56:50 [Joshue108]
Kims video
15:57:12 [AWK]
ack gowerm
15:57:37 [Glenda]
davidmacdonald: page is listening to the page for a keystroke, if you speak a word and it is typed for you, and it includes a letter for a key that has been hijacked, it will trigger that shortcut. JS developers say it is not unreasonable to have this SC
15:58:09 [Ryladog]
Can we include the video along with the SC in the Draft to help commentators understand the issue better?
15:58:40 [Joshue108]
We could
15:59:03 [AWK]
ack alex
15:59:04 [Glenda]
mikeg: author controlled situation, if the author created a single key shortcut, they should have responsibilty to make it easy to turn off that single key shortcut. not just a speech issue, this impacts and benefits users with mobility issues too.
16:00:23 [Joshue108]
16:00:25 [Joshue108]
16:01:10 [Glenda]
alex: address accommodation deficiencies in AT, concerned that this creates risk for adoption (asking too much). Concede that disabling the single key shortcut is doable. 3rd point, are we writing an SC for only 1 speech to text AT. Seems onerous.
16:01:14 [Ryladog]
But we are helping the build the expectation
16:01:18 [Wayne]
16:01:24 [AWK]
ack jason
16:01:30 [jeanne]
q+ why doesn't the SC say not to create single key shortcuts unless there is a mechanism available to to turn it off or to remap it to a shortcut that uses at least one non-character key. I found it confusing to say one or more
16:01:51 [jeanne]
q+ to ask why doesn't the SC say not to create single key shortcuts unless there is a mechanism available to to turn it off or to remap it to a shortcut that uses at least one non-character key. I found it confusing to say one or more
16:02:52 [jeanne]
16:03:46 [Joshue108]
ack me
16:03:46 [Wayne]
16:03:47 [AWK]
ack josh
16:03:51 [Glenda]
JasonWhite: if WCAG 2.0 very careful in allowing in an SC that dealt with a screen reader gap. I’m open to the potential.
16:05:06 [Glenda]
Joshue: reminder, we are publishing for public review. Is this a SC that spans more than 1 speech AT?
16:05:10 [JF]
I think we also need to keep on top of what HTML 5.2 is doing with Accesskey (
16:05:39 [Glenda]
AWK: I was talking about people with hand tremors.
16:05:55 [Glenda]
Joshue: I think we should include for public review.
16:05:56 [Joshue108]
16:07:28 [gowerm]
16:07:35 [AWK]
ack gower
16:08:17 [Joshue108]
+1 to Mike Gower
16:08:24 [Ryladog]
+1 to Mike
16:08:27 [jeanne]
+1 to Mike
16:08:33 [Wayne]
+1 to Mike
16:08:36 [Glenda]
gowerm: really suprised about your comment, the Gmail situation is exactly what we are requiring with this SC. Author has to allow you a way to turn off a single shortcut key. This is not a single AT issue.
16:08:42 [Glenda]
+1 Mike
16:08:52 [Alex_]
16:08:58 [Joshue108]
16:08:59 [Jan]
Jan has joined #ag
16:08:59 [AWK]
ack alex
16:09:28 [Jan]
+1 to Katie's point to put it out there. This single-key keystroke issue can also affect people with cognitive disabilities
16:09:34 [AWK]
16:10:01 [Glenda]
Alex: add more than speech recognition as benefit.
16:10:26 [gowerm]
I agree taht the understanding document is very biased to speech, and it shouldn't be
16:10:36 [Glenda]
AWK: whole draft has understanding doc that includes benefits to keyboard only and speech users
16:10:45 [Joshue108]
ack me
16:10:58 [Jan]
16:11:58 [bruce_bailey]
present+ Bruce_Bailey
16:12:15 [Wayne]
16:12:20 [Glenda]
Joshue: this SC is broader. it helps keyboard and speech. And be cautious about throwing something out just because it helps 1 thing. that 1 think may be a very important barrier to remove.
16:12:26 [AWK]
ack jan
16:13:18 [AWK]
Jan: Need to add cognitive disabilities use case to Understanding document to clarify that benefit
16:13:37 [Joshue108]
+1 to Jan
16:13:41 [Glenda]
Jan: this also effects people with coga and low vision. We need to add more benefits to all the different types of disabilities. (also echos what Joshue just said). If this is being created by the author, they need to be responsible for not creating a barrier.
16:13:43 [gowerm]
+1 get it out there. I've volunteered to rewrite the understanding doc
16:13:47 [jeanne]
+1 to Jan
16:13:54 [Glenda]
+1 jan
16:13:55 [jasonjgw]
16:14:05 [AWK]
ack way
16:14:27 [AWK]
ack jason
16:15:19 [Glenda]
JasonWhite: I think this is giving me impresion that this is a solution looking for a problem. Ask rational to be reviewed. Objection stands.
16:15:39 [Glenda]
JF: stand down for now, let’s get it out there for wider review. that has value.
16:16:28 [Glenda]
Alex: I don’t really object to it, except the benefit needs to be rewritten. I can’t accept it if it says it is only to benefit a deficienciy in one AT.
16:16:52 [Pietro_]
Pietro_ has joined #ag
16:17:31 [Glenda]
AWK: any objections other than JasonWhite
16:17:33 [alastairc]
I've been waiting for the SC to settle before writing the understanding for mine.
16:17:50 [jeanne]
+1 MikeG thanks
16:17:58 [Glenda]
MikeG: I’ll address the issue in benefits (understanding) to address Alex’ suggestion
16:18:18 [Ryladog]
Thanks to Mike for offering to update Understanding info fo this proposed SC
16:18:32 [Glenda]
JF: minor reservation about non-character key. Can we clarify that it is a modifier key.
16:18:56 [jeanne]
+1 JohnF, it's a modifier key, and that is what is most needed.
16:19:43 [davidmacdonald]
character c\key single printable Unicode code point, any keyboard character that is printable, i.e. letters of the alphabet including capitals, punctuation, numbers, and symbols. Note that the Space and Enter keys, which return empty spaces rather than characters, are not character keys.
16:19:43 [Joshue108]
+1 to seeing more examples of user groups etc where this SC would meet a real need.
16:21:40 [gowerm]
Yep, I'll ensure that's captured Josh
16:21:49 [Joshue108]
thanks Mike.
16:22:01 [Glenda]
RESOLUTION: Accepted as proposed, with need for futher clarifications in understanding doc
16:22:31 [Glenda]
AWK: not ignoring your objection, assume you will reply your object during the CFC process.
16:22:36 [Glenda]
JasonWhite: yes
16:22:56 [Ryladog]
16:22:59 [Glenda]
next item
16:24:08 [Joshue108]
16:24:16 [davidmacdonald]
16:25:00 [AWK]
16:25:39 [Glenda]
david: we talked offline, i’m okay with it going out. I stand down.
16:27:08 [Glenda]
AWK: jamesn said change in orientation has not been addressed. What did he mean?
16:28:17 [Glenda]
AWK: some applications are locked in one orientation. If you have your device locked to your wheelchair, you should not have to perm tilt your head to the side.
16:28:58 [AWK]
"The content is operable in the device orientation that is used to load the web page, except where orientation is essential for use of the content."
16:28:59 [davidmacdonald]
The content is operable in the device orientation that is used to load the web page, except where orientation is essential for use of the content.
16:29:10 [gowerm]
16:29:16 [AWK]
s/"The content is operable in the device orientation that is used to load the web page, except where orientation is essential for use of the content."/
16:29:21 [Wayne]
16:29:40 [AWK]
ack gow
16:29:42 [JF]
I'd tweeka "used to load the page" to "on initial page load"
16:30:05 [Wayne]
16:31:02 [Glenda]
MikeG: trying to understang rational. why suppress the ability to change orientation after page load?
16:31:41 [Glenda]
AWK: this would not force anyone to lock orientation on page load, ideally users can view content in the orientation they have their device (do not recommend suppressing after page load).
16:32:40 [jeanne]
+1 David's amendment
16:32:41 [JF]
by all
16:32:43 [Glenda]
RESOLUTION: leave this open
16:32:50 [laura]
16:33:38 [Glenda]
RSSAgent, make logs public
16:34:22 [AWK]
regrets+ lauriat, EA_Draffan, Detlev, Jim_Allan, KathyW
16:34:44 [Glenda]
trackbox, end meeting
16:34:59 [Glenda]
Zakim, please part
16:34:59 [Zakim]
leaving. As of this point the attendees have been AWK, Davidmacdonald, jasonjgw, MichaelC, KimDirks, Katie_Haritos-Shea, JF, Kathy, MikeGower, chriscm, shadi, Wayne, JanMcSorley,
16:34:59 [Zakim]
Zakim has left #ag
16:35:01 [JF]
* trackbot, with a T ;)
16:35:02 [Zakim]
... jeanne, ChrisLoiselle, Laura, Glenda, marcjohlic, Makoto, Melanie_Philipp, Rachael, Joshue108, alastairc, kirkwood, JakeAbma, Pietro, Elledge, Mike_Pluke, Bruce_Bailey
16:35:19 [Glenda]
trackbot, end meeting
16:35:19 [trackbot]
Zakim, list attendees
16:35:27 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, please draft minutes
16:35:27 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate trackbot
16:35:28 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, bye
16:35:28 [RRSAgent]
I see no action items