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15:27:47 <ivan> Meeting: Publishing Business Group
15:27:59 <ivan> Chair: Rick
15:28:49 <ivan> Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-publishingbg/2017May/0059.html
15:30:02 <ivan> Regrets: Mike_Baker, Nick_Ruffilo, Greg_Davis, Rachel_Comerford, Paul_Belfanti
15:40:47 <ivan> Regrets+ Luc
15:50:20 <Wolfgang> hi everybody!
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15:56:45 <dauwhe> present+ dauwhe
15:56:55 <RickJ> present+ RIckJ
15:57:08 <Wolfgang> present + Wolfgang
15:57:21 <Avneesh> present+ Avneesh
15:57:43 <Wolfgang> good afternoon, Dave!
15:57:49 <mateus> present+
15:58:26 <ivan> present+
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16:00:17 <George> Hello folks
16:00:29 <Wolfgang> hi George!
16:01:05 <George> present+ George
16:01:16 <dauwhe> scribenick: dauwhe
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16:01:34 <dauwhe> RickJ: we'll get started in a minute
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16:01:39 <tzviya> present+
16:01:50 <rkwright> present+
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16:03:05 <dauwhe> https://drafts.csswg.org/css-egg/#speech
16:03:12 <dauwhe> RickJ: let's get started
16:03:39 <dauwhe> Topic: Charter
16:03:53 <dauwhe> ivan: I should never be optimistic :)
16:04:14 <dauwhe> ... the consultation with the AC is over
16:04:20 <dauwhe> ... we have 52 votes in
16:04:40 <dauwhe> ... all 52 votes said they want this work to be done
16:04:46 <dauwhe> ... no objection to doing this work at all
16:05:18 <dauwhe> ... it is 52; there were 35 who said they were interested in participating
16:05:31 <dauwhe> ... 26 intend to develop projects or use the technology
16:05:53 <dauwhe> ... the difficulty is that we have an IPR patent policy, which means lawyers look at these charters
16:06:34 <dauwhe> ... so we have three objections saying we want this work to happen, but we want changes to the charter
16:06:45 <dauwhe> ... I have to be vague, because not all comments are public
16:06:54 <DanielBennett> DanielBennett has joined #pbg
16:06:55 <DanielBennett> present+ DanielBennett
16:06:58 <dauwhe> ... so the team is working on another version of the charter, to make it more palatable to lawyers
16:07:09 <dauwhe> ... I saw the latest draft 10 minutes ago
16:07:16 <jensklingelhoefer> jensklingelhoefer has joined #pbg
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16:07:20 <liisamk> present+ liisamk, jensklingelhoefer
16:07:22 <dauwhe> ... there is nothing in those changes that really change what we want to do
16:07:37 <dauwhe> ... it's all reformulating, making it more concise, making deliverables clearer
16:07:47 <dauwhe> ... I hope this version will go out to those who formally objected
16:07:55 <dauwhe> ... and see if this will work for them
16:08:10 <dauwhe> ... I am cautiously nearly almost sort of optimistic
16:08:28 <dauwhe> ... then we have to contact all 53 voters to see if they are ok with the new draft
16:08:39 <dauwhe> ... they will get five business days to review
16:08:45 <RickJ> q+
16:08:46 <George> Check if you are muted, because we are getting background noise.
16:08:47 <dauwhe> ... if that works, then we are done
16:09:27 <dauwhe> RickJ: we had talked two weeks ago about reaching out to those interested about the F2F meeting
16:09:56 <dauwhe> ivan: what the team came up with is that the June F2F is a joint meeting of the BG and the IG
16:10:06 <dauwhe> ... this means anyone who is in the BG can come to this meeting
16:10:14 <dauwhe> ... the BG has to decide if this is OK
16:10:22 <dauwhe> ... then we can announce it that way
16:10:24 <liam> liam has joined #pbg
16:10:24 <liam> present+
16:10:44 <dauwhe> ... if, by then, the WG is operational, then the WG will ... find an administrative way of saying it's a WG meeting
16:10:55 <dauwhe> ... the only reason we have to be careful is the same IPR issues
16:10:59 <garth> RVSP to F-to-F and draft agenda: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1J0VlZbMFj-33tfhZe0EK543NWFlx6dyDHauqkPwMeEI/edit#heading=h.6sesbeqec1qm
16:11:14 <leslie> leslie has joined #pbg
16:11:14 <leslie> present+
16:11:19 <garth> Better: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1J0VlZbMFj-33tfhZe0EK543NWFlx6dyDHauqkPwMeEI/edit
16:11:37 <dauwhe> ... we have to play by the rules
16:11:42 <dauwhe> ... there's no problem announcing it
16:11:51 <dauwhe> ... I know that Wendy plans to reach out to you
16:11:59 <George> q+
16:12:07 <dauwhe> ... you could tell Wendy if it's OK for this to be a BG/IG meeting
16:12:41 <dauwhe> RickJ: people who show up create standards, so is it appropriate to call for objections to having the f2f be a BG/IG meeting?
16:13:01 <dauwhe> ... does anyone have any objections to formally make the F2F a joint BG-IG meeting?
16:13:02 <garth> q?
16:13:07 <garth> ack Rick
16:13:08 <garth> q+
16:13:20 <dauwhe> George: if this becomes a WG meeting
16:13:33 <dauwhe> ... do WG members have to sign the IPR agreement in order to participate?
16:13:46 <dauwhe> ... or is it automatic when you participate?
16:14:09 <dauwhe> ivan: the joining process--when the AC rep nominates someone to a group, it takes place then
16:14:12 <garth> q?
16:14:16 <garth> ack George
16:14:48 <dauwhe> garth: we want to make clear this is not a general BG meeting; I expect this to be much like a WG meeting
16:14:55 <dauwhe> ... focused on PWP/WP/EPUB4
16:15:24 <dauwhe> RickJ: my expectation is that we would use the facilities available now to announce the meeting
16:15:37 <dauwhe> ... then update agenda to describe that it is, in fact, a WG meeting
16:15:45 <dauwhe> garth: I pasted a link to the suggested agenda
16:15:54 <Bill_Kasdorf> q+
16:15:55 <dauwhe> ... that gives the flavor of what will happen
16:16:04 <garth> ack garth
16:16:04 <RickJ> ack gar
16:16:28 <dauwhe> Bill_Kasdorf: is there an issue if someone that is in the BG that's not in the WG, travels to NYC, and is there a problem?
16:16:31 <dauwhe> ivan: no
16:16:47 <dauwhe> ivan: formally speaking, we can think of it as a BG/IG meeting. Let's not overthink this.
16:16:56 <dauwhe> Bill_Kasdorf: that's what I was hoping you would say
16:17:15 <garth> q?
16:17:16 <dauwhe> ivan: looking at the agenda, we should be careful to avoid issues that lead to IPR problems
16:17:18 <garth> ack Bill_Kasdorf
16:17:46 <dauwhe> RickJ: any objections? Any concerns about making this a joint meeting?
16:17:49 <dauwhe> (silence)
16:18:11 <liisamk> joint meeting +1
16:18:12 <dauwhe> George: just want to make sure it's a joint meeting between IG and BG that is working for plans for when the WG officially kicks off
16:18:20 <dauwhe> ivan: that's a wonderful formulation
16:18:43 <garth> q?
16:18:52 <dauwhe> Resolved: the June F2F is a joint meeting between the IG and the BG
16:19:00 <dauwhe> RickJ: I'll tell Wendy
16:19:31 <dauwhe> Topic: update for EPUB Test
16:19:39 <dauwhe> RickJ: it looks like Brian isn't here
16:19:48 <dauwhe> Bill_Kasdorf: I don't have anything; we should wait for Brian
16:19:59 <dauwhe> RickJ: we'll postpone this item.
16:20:10 <dauwhe> RickJ: I'll swap the next 2 items
16:20:22 <dauwhe> Topic: EPUB for education
16:20:29 <dauwhe> ... CG will work on part of this
16:20:42 <dauwhe> ... I have committments from lots of publishers to work on this
16:20:46 <ivan> zakim, who is here?
16:20:46 <Zakim> Present: dauwhe, RIckJ, Avneesh, mateus, ivan, George, tzviya, rkwright, Bill_Kasdorf, mattg
16:20:49 <Zakim> On IRC I see leslie, liam, liisamk, jensklingelhoefer, DanielBennett, garth, cmussi, mattg, Bill_Kasdorf, rkwright, BillMcCoy, MAKOTO_, George, tzviya, RickJ, Avneesh, mateus,
16:20:49 <Zakim> ... jkamata, Julian_Calderazi, Zakim, RRSAgent, Wolfgang, dauwhe, ivan, Karen, bigbluehat
16:21:06 <dauwhe> ... my expectation is that within the next few weeks we can move formalize both the CG side and the IMS side
16:21:20 <dauwhe> ... we at VitalSource will be proposing some specifics around the outcomes side
16:21:30 <dauwhe> ... and we will volunteer to work with EPUBCHeck to support that
16:21:39 <dauwhe> ... not sure what else we can do with EPUBCheck
16:21:50 <dauwhe> ... we didn't have time to talk through the epub part last week
16:22:02 <dauwhe> Topic: EPUBCHECK
16:22:08 <dauwhe> RickJ: we need resources
16:22:15 <RickJ> q?
16:22:15 <dauwhe> ... BillK and Liisa were champions for this
16:22:28 <tzviya> https://github.com/IDPF/epubcheck/wiki/WorkPlan
16:22:36 <ivan> present+ garth, jkamata, julian_calderazi, makoto
16:22:38 <dauwhe> ... does anyone has something to discuss around epubcheck, and how to keep it relevant and current
16:22:53 <dauwhe> Bill_Kasdorf: Tzviya posted a link to the epubcheck work plan
16:23:01 <liisamk> q+
16:23:14 <garth> present+ Garth
16:23:17 <dauwhe> liisamk: the big thing I want to figure out is
16:23:30 <ivan> present+ billMcCoy, bernhard_heinser
16:23:30 <dauwhe> ... when and how do we get people to shift away from older versions of epubcheck
16:23:34 <tzviya> q+
16:23:38 <ivan> zakim, who is here?
16:23:38 <Zakim> Present: dauwhe, RIckJ, Avneesh, mateus, ivan, George, tzviya, rkwright, Bill_Kasdorf, mattg, garth, cristina, danel_bennett, jens_klingeljoefer, jkamata, julian_calderazi, liisa,
16:23:40 <david_stroup> david_stroup has joined #pbg
16:23:41 <david_stroup> present+
16:23:43 <Zakim> ... makoto, Wolfgang_Schindler, billMcCoy, bernhard_heinser
16:23:43 <Zakim> On IRC I see leslie, liam, liisamk, jensklingelhoefer, DanielBennett, garth, cmussi, mattg, Bill_Kasdorf, rkwright, BillMcCoy, MAKOTO_, George, tzviya, RickJ, Avneesh, mateus,
16:23:43 <Zakim> ... jkamata, Julian_Calderazi, Zakim, RRSAgent, Wolfgang, dauwhe, ivan, Karen, bigbluehat
16:23:45 <dauwhe> ... from a publishers perspective, the errors are different depending what version people are using
16:23:52 <dauwhe> ... how do we deprecate older epubchecks?
16:24:01 <dauwhe> q+
16:24:07 <garth> ack lii
16:24:10 <ivan> ack liisamk
16:24:23 <rkwright> q+
16:24:29 <dauwhe> tzviya: I'm not sure we can deprecate older versions
16:24:54 <dauwhe> ... when epubcheck 4 was released, the old version is not really available for download
16:25:02 <dauwhe> ... epubcheck can download older versions of EPUB
16:25:32 <dauwhe> liisamk: I'm worried about retailers integrating older versions of epubcheck into their ingestion systems
16:25:33 <garth> q+
16:25:48 <dauwhe> tzviya: there's a lot of misunderstanding aobut epubcheck releases
16:25:50 <dauwhe> q-
16:26:02 <tzviya> q-
16:26:02 <garth> q?
16:26:10 <RickJ> ack rkw
16:26:11 <dauwhe> rkwright: i don't know how you get people to move on from an old version
16:26:20 <dauwhe> .. since they've already integrated it into their system
16:26:39 <RickJ> ack gar
16:26:41 <dauwhe> ... Apple is using an old version which only checks 3.0, and so some people will want to us e that one
16:26:50 <dauwhe> garth: we're guilty of running a 3.x version
16:27:02 <dauwhe> ... it takes more than a month to integrate a new version into our system
16:27:18 <dauwhe> ... this time we're going to push some changes back to epubcheck, to make integrations easier
16:27:37 <dauwhe> ... it's hard to take a new version, whitelist new components, etc.
16:27:45 <dauwhe> ... if we focus on making that easier, it could help
16:27:50 <garth> q?
16:28:03 <BillMcCoy> q+
16:28:06 <dauwhe> RickJ: do we know where epubcheck lives within w3c?
16:28:11 <George> q+
16:28:21 <dauwhe> BillMcCoy: the BG can create task forces
16:28:23 <ivan> regrets+ Ryan_Pugatch
16:28:25 <dauwhe> ... or it could be the CG
16:28:30 <dauwhe> ... the code is on github
16:28:39 <dauwhe> ... for "live" I think you mean who does what
16:28:55 <dauwhe> ... some of the people doing the work might not be in the BG/CG/IG/WG
16:29:02 <dauwhe> ... readium foundation has offered some help
16:29:18 <dauwhe> ... we want to consider it as part of the poublishing@w3c umbrella
16:29:28 <dauwhe> ... or we could have another CG, but that might be too many groups
16:29:31 <ivan> s/poublishing/publishing/
16:29:36 <RickJ> ack billmc
16:29:40 <RickJ> ack geo
16:29:42 <ivan> present+ george
16:29:45 <dauwhe> George: this relates to DAISY's planning for a11y checker
16:30:08 <dauwhe> ... if someone gets a product out in the market that integrates these things
16:30:18 <dauwhe> ... then if these components change there could be a problem
16:30:54 <dauwhe> ... we need to figure out a way to figuring out what versions are being used, and then enable people to move to the next version
16:31:35 <dauwhe> RickJ: I think they'll be something like epubcheck for whatever comes out of the WG
16:31:42 <dauwhe> ... that will need to be part of the conversation
16:31:52 <tzviya> q+
16:32:04 <dauwhe> ... Bill, I need to turn back to you here. We need someone to take responsibility to drive this forward.
16:32:17 <dauwhe> ... whether it's alignment with DAISY, with the CG, where's the best fit?
16:33:02 <dauwhe> BillMcCoy: from my POV, if the EPUB3 CG, was about to do 3.11, one of the plank for the plan for 3.11 would be tests and EPUBCheck
16:33:18 <dauwhe> ... but we're behind the 8 ball, as we didn't do 3.1 in epubcheck before the merger
16:33:33 <dauwhe> ... the unfinished business is that epubcheck is behind
16:33:39 <dauwhe> ... that would be a good action item for me
16:34:07 <dauwhe> ... but there's also a larger issue of epubcheck integration with the larger ecosystem
16:34:28 <garth> … epubchuck is hard, it’s real programming
16:34:49 <garth> … often a problem for standards WG’s
16:34:57 <Bill_Kasdorf> q+
16:35:28 <garth> … unclear how we make that work with the volenteer nature of WG participation (and sometimes semi-technical)
16:35:33 <ivan> ack tzviya
16:35:37 <dauwhe> dauwhe: epubcheck is production code, which is not a natural deliverable of a WG
16:35:53 <dauwhe> tzviya: when I talk to Romain, he says it's hard to work on 'cause it's spaghetti code
16:36:01 <mattg> q+
16:36:09 <dauwhe> ... if you look at that writeup, he's proposing an overhaul of the whole system
16:36:27 <dauwhe> ... it's java-based, and even many of us who code don't know java
16:36:36 <dauwhe> ... it's not just a wish-list, it's a matter of real time
16:36:42 <Avneesh> q+
16:36:48 <dauwhe> and the people working on it need to be paid
16:36:52 <ivan> ack Bill_Kasdorf
16:36:55 <RickJ> ack Bill_K
16:37:05 <dauwhe> Bill_Kasdorf: another thing we're lacking is a clear identity of who's the owner
16:37:09 <dauwhe> ... the point person
16:37:17 <dauwhe> ... I am not that person
16:37:41 <dauwhe> ... because it was a collaborative effort between three organizations, it was never clear who was in charge
16:38:03 <dauwhe> ... we need someone with public visibility to be the point person
16:38:10 <garth> q?
16:38:13 <dauwhe> RickJ: I'm going to jump the queue
16:38:14 <ivan> q?
16:38:27 <dauwhe> ... Tzviya, you're writing in IRC, are you looking to be that person?
16:38:40 <dauwhe> tzviya: I think we're confusing EPUB Test and EPUBCheck
16:38:53 <dauwhe> Bill_Kasdorf: you're right, I was thinking about Test
16:39:15 <dauwhe> tzviya: I'm offering to be the point person for EPUBcheck, but I can do none of the programming
16:39:27 <dauwhe> RickJ: I think that's a great benefit, and I appreciate you taking that on
16:39:33 <dauwhe> ... and helping figure out what needs to be done
16:39:39 <ivan> ack mattg
16:39:42 <dauwhe> mattg: back to the CG question
16:39:57 <dauwhe> ... one thing we failed in the past was listing all the changes between spec versions
16:40:05 <George> q+
16:40:07 <dauwhe> ... I think that's something we should do going forward
16:40:24 <dauwhe> ... it would be great to have a clear list of spec changes to work from
16:40:38 <dauwhe> ... the CG can help with that
16:40:49 <dauwhe> Avneesh: I want to clarify some things
16:41:00 <ivan> ack Avneesh
16:41:00 <dauwhe> ... EPUBCheck is not ready for open collaboration
16:41:11 <dauwhe> ... it has been maintained by a small group
16:41:28 <dauwhe> ... if you want it to be an open source process
16:41:44 <dauwhe> ... first the software needs to be prepared for that
16:41:53 <dauwhe> ... needs to be modular
16:42:05 <dauwhe> ... the second thing is the business of running the project
16:42:17 <dauwhe> ... the people who have worked on 3.1 are experts on formats/standards
16:42:30 <BillMcCoy> q+
16:42:37 <dauwhe> ... but most are not hard core coders, and are not involved in open source
16:42:42 <dauwhe> ... only readium is like that
16:42:49 <BillMcCoy> ack BillMcCoy
16:42:55 <dauwhe> ... maybe we need someone who's familiar with open=source development
16:43:09 <garth> q?
16:43:14 <garth> ack George
16:43:17 <dauwhe> George: I agree with Avneesh and delighted that Tzviya will be the point
16:43:44 <dauwhe> ... the 3.1 support, digging into spaghetti code, and getting an update that will help us right now, is good
16:43:57 <tzviya> q+
16:44:01 <dauwhe> ... but for future, companies need to assign programmers to this, and commit time
16:44:10 <dauwhe> ... the other approach is to put money into hiring someone
16:44:24 <dauwhe> ... but we need nose-down programmers where this is part of their job description
16:44:33 <dauwhe> ... it worked with Romain, but DAISY had to pull him off
16:44:39 <dauwhe> RickJ: clarifying Q
16:44:51 <dauwhe> ... there's only a small group of people who really understand the code?
16:45:01 <dauwhe> ... and those people are working on the a11y checker?
16:45:13 <dauwhe> ... and this a11y checker will have dependencies on EPUBCheck?
16:45:17 <dauwhe> ... is that accurate?
16:45:24 <dauwhe> George: we always thought epubcheck would run first
16:45:44 <dauwhe> RickJ: if the a11y checker is expecting 3.1, and is expecting epubcheck to run first, there's a problem here
16:46:05 <dauwhe> ... there seems to be a dependency on these people who are tied up
16:46:18 <rkwright> q+
16:46:22 <dauwhe> Avneesh: epub a11y spec is not tied to 3.1
16:46:33 <dauwhe> ... we have a dependency, but its not do or die
16:46:48 <dauwhe> ... for this year, Romain is fully tied up with a11y checker
16:47:02 <dauwhe> ... we can not have epubcheck depend on one person anyway
16:47:07 <ivan> ack tzviya
16:47:11 <dauwhe> tzviya: I think we're getting into too many details
16:47:28 <dauwhe> ... I think we need a task force, and want Romain and TObias to intend
16:47:54 <dauwhe> ... we need publishers to help, but we also need more information on what actual tasks are required
16:48:03 <Bill_Kasdorf> see why we needed Tzviya as point person? :-)
16:48:04 <dauwhe> ... this is not a typical open-source project; it's large
16:48:11 <dauwhe> Avneesh: Romain can help with consulting
16:48:24 <dauwhe> tzviya: I'll work with Dave and Rachel to get this going in the CG, and get a task force
16:48:29 <dauwhe> ... and break into modular tasks
16:48:32 <dauwhe> RickJ: thanks
16:48:48 <dauwhe> rkwright: I do have experience managing open source, and it's very very difficult
16:48:59 <dauwhe> ... it's harder than managing an internal team
16:49:13 <dauwhe> ... I do know java, and was one of the original authors of epubcheck
16:49:23 <dauwhe> ... so I could help the task force
16:49:34 <dauwhe> ... and even work on epubcheck itself, but would need to be paid
16:49:39 <dauwhe> RickJ: thanks everyone
16:49:52 <dauwhe> ... two additions to the agenda
16:50:00 <dauwhe> Topic: November Publishing Summit
16:50:19 <BillMcCoy> q+
16:50:28 <RickJ> ack rkwright
16:50:29 <dauwhe> Bill_Kasdorf: I did agree to co-chair the program committe for the publishing summit in November
16:50:40 <dauwhe> ... We need another co-chair
16:50:56 <dauwhe> ... one of my priorities is related to the other topic, making sure it's not just books
16:51:18 <dauwhe> ... I'd like to turn it over to you for a timeline, but there's a june 12 deadline for some things
16:51:37 <dauwhe> ... perhaps we could have a call this week before I go to SSP
16:52:07 <dauwhe> BillMcCoy: this 1.5 day event co located with tpac is the big opportunity for making sure publishing @ w3c is not about just specs
16:52:19 <tzviya> https://www.w3.org/2017/11/TPAC/Overview.html - note the warning about dreamforce
16:52:19 <dauwhe> ... but about building a community
16:52:34 <dauwhe> ... galvanizing the community, inspired by BiB, TOC, etc
16:52:44 <dauwhe> ... we will open registration for TPAC week on June 12
16:52:53 <dauwhe> ... so we need to be open for registration on June 12
16:53:09 <dauwhe> ... we won't have a detailed program then
16:53:25 <dauwhe> ... to Bill K's point, we need to validate and refine the theme
16:53:35 <dauwhe> ... and turn that into a program outline
16:53:47 <dauwhe> ... but we won't have specific sessions and speakers
16:53:58 <garth> q?
16:54:13 <dauwhe> ... so the work of the committee is a few calls etc before june 12, then some work in june/july to finalize program
16:54:40 <dauwhe> ... then there's logistics, etc, which I and w3c can do
16:55:25 <dauwhe> ... Bill_Kasdorf, do you want to supplement that?
16:55:37 <dauwhe> Bill_Kasdorf: is the program committee involved in recruiting sponsors?
16:55:55 <dauwhe> BillMcCoy: from my POV, the primary responsibility is the program, not finding sponsors
16:56:32 <dauwhe> Bill_Kasdorf: this is a short-term commitment to shaping the program, finalizing the program and title for June 12, then shaping the program by end of July
16:56:48 <dauwhe> BillMcCoy: correct. There's already a start on the wiki
16:57:30 <dauwhe> RickJ: Question: how should volunteers contact you?
16:57:37 <dauwhe> Bill_Kasdorf: email me and sign up on the wiki
16:58:00 <dauwhe> BillMcCoy: given your schedule, we should have a call thursday or friday
16:58:15 <dauwhe> Bill_Kasdorf: could you do a doodle poll to whoever's interested today?
16:58:51 <George> bye
16:59:00 <dauwhe> RickJ: we had one other agenda item, on reaching out to non-publishers, but I'll add that to the agenda for the next meeting
16:59:15 <dauwhe> ... this is our meeting; if there are things you want to discuss let me know.
16:59:28 <dauwhe> RickJ: thanks everyone! we're done.
17:00:53 <ivan> rrsagent, draft minutes
17:00:53 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2017/05/23-pbg-minutes.html ivan
17:01:08 <ivan> zakim, bye
17:01:08 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees have been dauwhe, RIckJ, Avneesh, mateus, ivan, George, tzviya, rkwright, Bill_Kasdorf, mattg, garth, cristina, danel_bennett,
17:01:08 <Zakim> Zakim has left #pbg
17:01:11 <Zakim> ... jens_klingeljoefer, jkamata, julian_calderazi, liisa, makoto, Wolfgang_Schindler, billMcCoy, bernhard_heinser
17:01:29 <ivan> rrsagent, bye
17:01:39 <ivan> rrsagent, set log public
17:01:49 <ivan> rrsagent, draft minutes
17:01:49 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2017/05/23-pbg-minutes.html ivan
17:01:55 <ivan> rrsagent, bye
17:01:55 <RRSAgent> I see no action items