16:04:14 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #dnt
16:04:14 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2017/05/22-dnt-irc
16:04:16 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
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16:04:18 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be TRACK
16:04:18 <Zakim> ok, trackbot
16:04:19 <trackbot> Meeting: Tracking Protection Working Group Teleconference
16:04:19 <trackbot> Date: 22 May 2017
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16:04:55 <Bert> present+
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16:06:08 <dsinger> present+ dsinger
16:06:25 <wileys> Here
16:08:08 <schunter> https://github.com/w3c/dnt/issues/21
16:08:39 <wileys> More important than the proposal is a review of the motivation of the additional TPE elments and their intended use by implementors - across all parties included expected handling by UAs
16:08:49 <wileys> there
16:08:56 <wileys> their
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16:10:03 <dsinger> q+
16:10:14 <mikeoneill> present+
16:13:00 <schunter> A site that registers an exception MUST publish...
16:13:39 <rvaneijk> nice change indeed
16:14:28 <mikeoneill> i will change that after this meeting
16:16:04 <wileys> Well stated David!
16:16:31 <mikeoneill> The TSR is meant to be dynamic, i.e. could be dependant on DNT 0 or 1
16:17:42 <wileys> Machine readable = Tracking Protection LIst
16:18:07 <schunter> q?
16:18:09 <wileys> Starts as optional until the EU Data Protection Board attempts to mandate it in some fashion
16:18:13 <dsinger> q-
16:18:16 <schunter> q+ aleecia
16:18:17 <mikeoneill> q+
16:18:26 <schunter> ack alee
16:18:39 <wileys> Not trying to state it is P3P
16:19:02 <wileys> +q
16:19:47 <wileys> Happy to answer those questions
16:20:22 <wileys> To be fair this conversation is a bit out of scope of DNT
16:20:46 <dsinger> https://github.com/w3c/dnt/issues/22
16:20:52 <schunter> Our goal is to simplify EU compliance. More transparency may be a useful part of it.
16:22:26 <wileys> DNT is not the end-all-be-all solution to EU compliance
16:22:47 <schunter> Sure. This is why we only discuss one field  ;-)
16:23:12 <wileys> So at some point we need to focus on the goal of the DNT signal itself and not be pulled into rabbit holes for Tracking Protection Lists (otherParty)
16:24:36 <schunter> ack ale
16:25:07 <schunter> Concern by shane: Mis-use of otherParties as whitelist for blocking
16:25:33 <dsinger> q+ to ask (a) which way the otherParties array can be wrong (by omission, by inclusion); (b) what statement/promise is being made about these otherParties (to distinguish them from (i) parties in any exception call and (ii) parties visited but not mentioned.)
16:25:48 <rvaneijk> I do NOT see the otherParties property as a quid-pro-quo approach, i.e. blocking when DNT:1 is ignored.
16:26:03 <rvaneijk> This WG's charter was extended with a specific focus on the viability of TPE to address the requirements for managing cookie and tracking consent that satisfies the requirements of EU privacy legislation.
16:26:09 <rvaneijk> The otheParties text proposed is - I believe - an important buidling block for consent. It allows publishers but also, e.g., embedded resources to make representations in a machine readable format.
16:26:15 <rvaneijk> I proposed an optional field. Yahoo! does not have to use the otherParties property, just as there is no obligation to use the sameParty property.
16:26:49 <mikeoneill> ptherParties is site-specific (it relates to the site). Tracking Protection Lists were web-wide as implemented by MS and FF (I beleive)
16:27:04 <rvaneijk> The list Shane is talkig about fits nicely in the sameParty/otherParty array.
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16:27:24 <rvaneijk> ... in a (sub)domain format
16:28:30 <schunter> ack mi
16:28:37 <wileys> q-
16:29:34 <schunter> ack d
16:29:34 <Zakim> dsinger, you wanted to ask (a) which way the otherParties array can be wrong (by omission, by inclusion); (b) what statement/promise is being made about these otherParties (to
16:29:37 <Zakim> ... distinguish them from (i) parties in any exception call and (ii) parties visited but not mentioned.)
16:30:28 <wileys> And more importantly - what happens if the list is “wrong”?  Does the DNT signal change in someway?  Again, the otherParty list appears to have no utility with respect to the DNT signal.
16:30:43 <schunter> q?
16:30:43 <dsinger> q?
16:31:39 <wileys> What if my Site Specific exception list includes a domain not in the otherParty list?  Or the other way around?  How is the DNT signal impacted?
16:32:17 <dsinger> so, if present, the otherParties array MUST include all otherParties that might appear (recursively, by inclusion) on the site.
16:33:16 <fwagner> Q+
16:35:05 <dsinger> can we see a precise proposed text, please (before a formal CfO)?
16:35:20 <schunter> next week: final text proposals
16:35:31 <schunter> in 2 weeks: objecttions (substantiated)
16:35:32 <wileys> So conflict with the Site Specific exception list, no direct bearing on the DNT signal, and looks/feels/smells very much like a TPL
16:35:41 <schunter> afterwards: chairs discuss and determine consensus
16:36:29 <wileys> We support human readable lists
16:39:16 <wileys> When does the charter run out?
16:41:29 <rvaneijk> wileys, the charter runs until end of the year.
16:44:16 <Bert> RRSAgent, make minutes v2
16:44:16 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2017/05/22-dnt-minutes.html Bert
16:45:16 <wileys> wileys has left #dnt
17:33:03 <Bert> present+ Alan Toner, Matthias Schunter, Frank Wagner, Rob van Eijk, Brendan Riordan-Butterworth, Vincent Toubiana, Shane Wiley, Aleecia McDonald
17:33:06 <Bert> RRSAgent, make minutes v2
17:33:06 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2017/05/22-dnt-minutes.html Bert
17:34:03 <Bert> scribenick: nobody
17:34:04 <Bert> RRSAgent, make minutes v2
17:34:04 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2017/05/22-dnt-minutes.html Bert
17:35:44 <Bert> chair: Matthias Schunter
17:35:45 <Bert> RRSAgent, make minutes v2
17:35:45 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2017/05/22-dnt-minutes.html Bert
18:00:35 <at> at has joined #dnt
18:06:25 <Bert> RRSAgent, bye
18:06:25 <RRSAgent> I see no action items