15:59:47 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #epub3cg
15:59:47 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2017/05/04-epub3cg-irc
15:59:53 <ivan> rrsagent, set log public
16:00:00 <tzviya> tzviya has joined #epub3cg
16:00:10 <ivan> Meeting: EPUB 3 CG Telco
16:00:17 <ivan> Chair: Dave Cramer
16:00:20 <laudrain> laudrain has joined #epub3cg
16:00:33 <laudrain> Present+ Luc
16:00:38 <ivan> Date: 2017-05-04
16:00:46 <mattg> present+ mattg
16:00:55 <ivan> present+
16:01:28 <George> present+ George
16:01:34 <tzviya> present+
16:02:03 <dauwhe> Zakim, who is here?
16:02:03 <Zakim> Present: Luc, mattg, ivan, George, tzviya
16:02:06 <Zakim> On IRC I see laudrain, tzviya, RRSAgent, Zakim, Mira, George, Avneesh, mattg, Schindler, LauraBrady, dauwhe, ivan, liam
16:02:15 <Dan_Sanicola> Dan_Sanicola has joined #epub3cg
16:02:18 <lmccormack> lmccormack has joined #epub3cg
16:02:34 <MURATA> MURATA has joined #epub3cg
16:02:34 <Avneesh> present+ Avneesh
16:03:18 <laudrain> try #6 to mute on phone?
16:03:21 <timlockridge> timlockridge has joined #epub3cg
16:05:13 <garth> garth has joined #epub3cg
16:05:18 <Naomi> Naomi has joined #epub3cg
16:05:20 <garth> present+ Garth
16:05:28 <dauwhe> scribenick: George
16:05:29 <George> GK: George minuting
16:05:35 <jcalderazi> jcalderazi has joined #epub3cg
16:05:47 <Rachel> Rachel has joined #epub3cg
16:05:55 <jcalderazi> Hi all.
16:05:55 <George> TS: Let's check people know how to get on.
16:06:18 <George> DC: links in orriginal on using IRC.
16:06:42 <George> DCWelcome to the EPUB 3 Community group
16:06:51 <ismith> ismith has joined #epub3cg
16:07:02 <George> Missionis a quite long statement.
16:07:14 <George> DC: IDPF and W3C have joined.
16:07:36 <George> DC There are three groups  Publishing Business Group,
16:07:53 <George> This EPUB 3 CG and we hope there will be a working group.
16:08:13 <George> DC: This group will work on maintaing 3.1 and the associated specifications.
16:08:25 <George> DC We are carrying on the work of EPUB
16:08:53 <George> DC: Let's introduce ourselves and our goals and we will talk about how we are going to work, email github.
16:09:13 <George> DC: There many areas where work needs to be done. Perhaps task forces.
16:09:19 <George> Questions:
16:10:01 <George> DC: Dave works for Hatchett and worked in the industry for 5 years.
16:10:29 <George> DC: Rachael Comorford with Micmillian. Working in ebooks for a year.
16:10:47 <George> RC: cannot get into IRC
16:10:55 <ivan> zakim, who is here?
16:10:55 <Zakim> Present: Luc, mattg, ivan, George, tzviya, Avneesh, Garth
16:10:57 <Zakim> On IRC I see ismith, Rachel, jcalderazi, Naomi, garth, timlockridge, MURATA, lmccormack, Dan_Sanicola, laudrain, tzviya, RRSAgent, Zakim, Mira, George, Avneesh, mattg, Schindler,
16:10:57 <Zakim> ... LauraBrady, dauwhe, ivan, liam
16:11:05 <Jean_K> Jean_K has joined #epub3cg
16:11:20 <George> Luc from Paris also with Hactheet interested in EPUB for interability and accessibility.
16:11:32 <Schindler> q+
16:11:57 <George> Tzviya is chair of DPUB IG and has been working in EPUB. With Wiley.
16:12:40 <George> Garth from Google Play books co-chair the DPUB IG and we expect it to turn to a WG.
16:12:53 <George> GC: in ebooks since 99.
16:13:06 <Rachel_C> Rachel_C has joined #epub3cg
16:13:22 <George> Bill K Apex and BISG and active in EPUB 3 and on IDPF Board. Lots of other Publishing work.
16:13:41 <George> Bernhard Heinser Swiss Access for all
16:14:05 <George> BH;with SBS for the Blind they work in web and ebooks.
16:14:10 <dauwhe> ack Schindler
16:14:17 <Jean_K> q+
16:14:40 <George> Wolfgange in Germany would love to see EPUB 4 with dictionaries and encyclopedia.
16:14:42 <dauwhe> ack Jean_K
16:15:01 <George> Jean with ebook archiects and interested in epub for education
16:15:17 <George> Jean with ebooks sincs 1996.
16:15:21 <Avneesh> q+
16:15:37 <Jean_K> Correction: Jean with McGraw-Hill Education as a Content Architect
16:15:54 <Jean_K> Still interested in EDUPUB AKA EPUB for Education.
16:16:12 <Rachel> Got it - needed to refresh. Sorry George!
16:16:28 <dauwhe> scribenick: Rachel
16:16:32 <George> Lloyd R engineer at NLS a division of LLOC
16:17:05 <George> Interested in epubb and braile rendition, worked at LOC for 40 years and 24  in digital
16:18:02 <Rachel> Avneesh DAISY consortium - Accessibility initiatives
16:18:51 <Rachel> Tobias Publishing service provide  - xml and epub software engineer, volunteer epubcheck maintainers
16:19:29 <Rachel> Mira - content architect at Cengage Learning
16:20:08 <Tobias> Tobias has joined #epub3cg
16:20:14 <Bill_Kasdorf> Bill_Kasdorf has joined #epub3cg
16:20:28 <Bill_Kasdorf> present+ Bill_Kasdorf
16:20:29 <Rachel> George Kerscher - DAISY and Benetech
16:21:19 <Rachel> Matt - hero
16:21:23 <tzviya> :)
16:21:52 <Rachel> Ian Smith - codemantra - interoperability, accessibility
16:22:04 <Tobias> Tobias has left #epub3cg
16:22:21 <Rachel> Laura Brady - ebook developer, BradyType
16:22:24 <Tobias> Tobias has joined #epub3cg
16:22:41 <Rachel> Laura Brady - awesome conference runner (ebookcraft)
16:23:12 <Rachel> Julian - ebook developer - accessibility and reading experience
16:23:34 <Rachel> Naomi - Penguin Random House - ebook process development
16:24:31 <Rachel> Ivan Herman - W3C
16:25:43 <Rachel> Tim Lockridge - miami university - epub production at Miami University press and educator
16:26:46 <TEYTAG> TEYTAG has joined #epub3cg
16:27:55 <Rachel> Makota - W3C - international epub 3.0, active in ISO - accessibility, epub maintenance, internationalization
16:28:26 <tzviya> s/Makota/Makoto
16:29:19 <Rachel> IDPF working group had weekly phone calls for epubs - doing a lot of the work on the phone can be difficult for a number of reasons including scheduling, geographic location
16:29:36 <Rachel> we are hoping that work can primarily take place on github
16:29:51 <tzviya> q+
16:29:52 <Avneesh> +
16:29:53 <Schindler> q+
16:30:03 <dauwhe> ack Avneesh
16:30:37 <Rachel> Avneesh - there are may domains for communications, each task force could decide btwn regular phone calls and github
16:30:44 <dauwhe> ack Tzviya
16:30:57 <Rachel> Tzviya - agreed
16:31:24 <dauwhe> ack Sch
16:31:29 <Rachel> Tzviya - a monthly meeting or something along those lines
16:32:07 <TEYTAG> Hi everyone
16:32:30 <Rachel> Wolfgang - once per month and update regularly in github (agreed)
16:32:43 <evanpowens> evanpowens has joined #epub3cg
16:32:48 <dauwhe> q?
16:33:16 <Rachel> Matt - are we planning to use the community group mailing list in the same manner as before?
16:33:57 <ivan> If you are new to github, that document may be useful: https://github.com/iherman/misc-notes/blob/master/docs/BasicGitHubContributionIntro.md
16:34:02 <Rachel> Dave - in CSS we've moved to github as central focus
16:34:12 <garth> q?
16:34:31 <Rachel> Thank you Ivan!
16:34:39 <George> q+
16:34:39 <TEYTAG> Thanks Ivan
16:35:31 <dauwhe> ack George
16:36:31 <dauwhe> +1000
16:36:45 <Rachel> George - agree on reducing the number of emails and using github, concerned about new resources to the publishing community (such as GitHub and IRC).  Can we find someone for mentoring and onboarding?
16:37:03 <ivan> q+
16:37:27 <dauwhe> ack Ivan
16:37:36 <Rachel> Dave - we should think about how can this group facilitate learning
16:38:22 <George> Ivan's guidance document is very good.
16:38:53 <Schindler> *ivan's introduction to github is indeed very helpful :)
16:39:18 <Rachel> Ivan - if this community feels more comfortable with something else then IRC, something else can be used
16:39:35 <dauwhe> q?
16:39:35 <Rachel> Dave - Those of us in other meetings have found it to be a useful tool
16:40:02 <Bill_Kasdorf> +1 to IRC, GitHub, and Ivan's GitHub intro
16:41:13 <Rachel> Task force 1 epub 3.1 maintainence - mostly editorial or markup issues
16:41:54 <Jean_K> q+
16:42:03 <Rachel> Dave - 3.1.x is possible based on the quantity of errata, beyond that scope will need to be raised in business group
16:42:17 <Rachel> What about maintenance of 2.0 and 3.0?
16:42:47 <George> EPUB 2.0.1 was the maintenance update prior to working on EPUB 3
16:43:11 <Rachel> Dave - to discuss: how do we handle prior versions of the epub; the steering committee and business group will need to discuss
16:43:12 <dauwhe> ack Jean
16:44:13 <Rachel> Jean - what is the maintence for the epub, epub 3, epub 3.x: what is the lifecycle?  Have we determined a sunset date for older versions? 3.0 is actively used.  Is 3.1?
16:44:17 <Bill_Kasdorf> q+
16:44:30 <dauwhe> ack Bill_
16:44:43 <laudrain> q+
16:44:52 <George> q+
16:44:52 <Rachel> Bill - this carries to epubcheck issues
16:45:18 <dauwhe> ack luc
16:45:24 <tzviya> ack la
16:45:24 <dauwhe> acl laudrain
16:45:26 <Rachel> Bill - at what point do we convert or version epubcheck for 3.1
16:46:56 <Rachel> luc - isn't epub2 replaced by epub3? why continue to maintain the older standard? We plan to convert epub2 files to epub3 version without changing content.  It would just be another technical expression of the same content
16:47:40 <Rachel> Dave - we should bring this to the business group and steering committee: what are we continuing to support (version-wise) and how?
16:47:40 <dauwhe> q?
16:47:42 <garth> q?
16:47:47 <dauwhe> ack George
16:48:32 <Jean_K> +1000 to everything George K just said.
16:48:38 <mattg> q+
16:48:59 <Rachel> George - it's important that the world see epub3 and the different versions as important and valuable.  We need to instill confidence in the publishing industry that epub3 and its successors for a long time. moving content into the future
16:49:05 <Rachel> Dave - Agreed
16:49:09 <Rachel> me too
16:49:17 <dauwhe> ack mattg
16:49:19 <TEYTAG> q+
16:49:23 <TEYTAG> Will we not be based on the EPUB 3.1 version?
16:50:04 <Rachel> Matt - if it was acknowledged as a problem, we generally load an errata page and then incorporate fully into future versions
16:50:11 <Bill_Kasdorf> q+
16:50:19 <dauwhe> ack TEYTAG
16:50:55 <Jean_K> q+
16:51:14 <Rachel> Dave - we're talkingabout lots of different things here, which includes how to support epub formats in wide use bac to epub2
16:51:24 <dauwhe> ack Bill_
16:51:49 <tzviya> q+
16:52:23 <Rachel> Bill - I am very support of continuing to migrate content but in terms of impact of versions we're talking about more than new epubs.  We are talking about reading system compatibility and a large scale back list that is still available
16:52:29 <dauwhe> ack Jean
16:53:44 <Rachel> Jean - do the marketing and communication activities live with the community group, business group, etc?  The communication that we have that is public facing is our most important.
16:54:18 <Rachel> Jean - I got an email asking if there was an IDPF event at BEA this year but we need a decision on who handles conferences/event
16:54:33 <Rachel> Dave - there will be a publishers meeting at TPAC in CA in Nov
16:54:41 <Bill_Kasdorf> clarification: not just backlist being available (which can be updated) but all the existing EPUBs that have been sold and are in the hands of users who expect them to continue to work
16:54:47 <dauwhe> ack Tzviya
16:55:12 <Rachel> Tzviya - questions about events and evangalism should go to Bill McCoy
16:55:22 <Jean_K> FYI - 5 minute warning.
16:55:55 <Bill_Kasdorf> +1 to what Tzviya is sayinig
16:56:05 <Rachel> Tzviya - I love the idea of sunsetting old specs, we can maintain a validation tool that checks against those specs but still not maintain the older version of the spec
16:56:09 <MURATA> What happens if there are two sensible interpretations of EPUB 2?
16:56:18 <Rachel> +1 what Tzviya is saying
16:56:53 <garth> q+
16:56:55 <Rachel> Evan - I've been on groups that improve documentation without changing the actual specification
16:57:14 <dauwhe> q?
16:58:04 <dauwhe> ack garth
16:58:24 <Tobias> q+
16:58:47 <Rachel> Garth - +1 Matt, Evan: errata on 2.x but changes should go to 3.x
16:58:56 <dauwhe> ack Tobias
17:00:05 <Rachel> Tobias - we're always trying to maintain epub2 in epubcheck but there are only 2 people maintaining this.  We need help from the community to do validation work for 3.1.
17:00:52 <Rachel> Dave - Task Force - Testing and validation (incuding epubcheck updating and maintenance)
17:01:41 <Rachel> Thank you everyone!
17:01:48 <Tobias> EpubCheck update: we're trying to put together a 4.1 version soon: https://github.com/IDPF/epubcheck/milestone/3 but it will not yet contain EPUB 3.1 support
17:01:49 <laudrain> laudrain has left #epub3cg
17:02:10 <Dan_Sanicola> Dan_Sanicola has left #epub3cg
17:02:26 <Schindler> Have a nice afternoon/evening!
17:02:30 <dauwhe> https://github.com/w3c/pub-cg/wiki
17:04:45 <TEYTAG> Thank you Dave for this link -> https://github.com/w3c/pub-cg/wiki
17:07:34 <Tobias> Tobias has left #epub3cg
17:09:29 <ivan> rrsagent, draft minutes
17:09:29 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2017/05/04-epub3cg-minutes.html ivan
17:10:33 <ivan> dauwhe: the minutes are generated, but I did not clean them up. Unfortunately, cleaning requires team access:-(
17:11:09 <ivan> (I am trying to come up with an alternative, but have not really done it yet; working on a way to generate minutes into github in markdown...)
17:11:29 <ivan> got to go now...
17:11:40 <dauwhe> thanks for your help, Ivan!!!
17:12:17 <TEYTAG> Thanks Ivan... You are great :)
17:12:39 <TEYTAG> http://www.w3.org/2017/05/04-epub3cg-minutes.html Perfect... Thanks
17:12:58 <Rachel> Thank you! I'm happy to clean them up if I can figure out how.
17:14:17 <liam> team access isn't required to clean up the file, it's public
17:14:51 <liam> but CVS access is needed to save the changes back to the W3C site. They could be put on github, or emailed to Ivan or to me to check in, for example
17:15:09 <liam> (or they might be just fine as they are)
17:15:45 <Rachel> given my typing skills, I would advocate for a little cleanup
17:20:00 <TEYTAG> Have a nice day. Bye
17:26:08 <lmccormack> lmccormack has joined #epub3cg
17:41:15 <dauwhe> I'll work on some cleanup on the HTML file, then we can figure out what to do with it
18:37:09 <teytag> teytag has joined #epub3cg
19:05:31 <Zakim> Zakim has left #epub3cg