14:10:24 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #wcag-act
14:10:24 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2016/09/28-wcag-act-irc
14:10:26 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
14:10:28 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be
14:10:28 <Zakim> I don't understand 'this will be', trackbot
14:10:29 <trackbot> Meeting: Accessibility Conformance Testing Teleconference
14:10:29 <trackbot> Date: 28 September 2016
14:10:54 <Wilco> agenda+ Failure techniques proposal
14:11:06 <shadi> agenda?
14:11:23 <shadi> zakim, clear agenda
14:11:23 <Zakim> agenda cleared
14:11:42 <agarrison> agarrison has joined #wcag-act
14:11:55 <Wilco> agenda+ Failure techniques proposal
14:12:01 <Wilco> agenda+ Requirement documents
14:12:10 <Wilco> agenda+ ISO test frameworks
14:12:17 <Wilco> agenda+ ACT Framework Requirements
14:13:16 <agarrison> what is the password for joining webex?
14:13:31 <Ryladog> act
14:13:39 <cpandhi> cpandhi has joined #wcag-act
14:13:40 <shadi> s/act/
14:15:04 <shadi> present: Wilco, Katie, MaryJo, Charu
14:15:15 <Wilco> zakim take up next
14:15:22 <Wilco> zakim, take up next
14:15:22 <Zakim> I see a speaker queue remaining and respectfully decline to close this agendum, Wilco
14:15:39 <shadi> queue=
14:15:56 <Wilco> zakim, take up next
14:15:56 <Zakim> I see a speaker queue remaining and respectfully decline to close this agendum, Wilco
14:16:01 <shadi> q?
14:16:11 <shadi> ack shadi
14:16:18 <shadi> zakim, take up next
14:16:18 <Zakim> agendum 1. "Failure techniques proposal" taken up [from Wilco]
14:16:29 <shadi> present+ Alistair
14:17:33 <shadi> Wilco: had good discussion at TPAC last week
14:17:53 <shadi> ...discussion came up of relationship of ACT to Failures in WCAG
14:18:04 <shadi> ...exchange with Katie on the mailing list
14:18:23 <shadi> ...think could replace Failures with ACT rules
14:18:25 <Wilco> q?
14:18:27 <shadi> q+
14:18:44 <shadi> ack me
14:20:10 <cpandhi> +1
14:20:22 <shadi> Shadi: don't think we should discuss keeping or replacing Failures
14:20:38 <shadi> ...it is part of the WCAG 2.0 model and up to the WG to decide
14:20:54 <shadi> ...but agree that we should align our ACT rules to the Failures
14:21:04 <agarrison> q+
14:21:57 <Ryladog> Ryladog has joined #wcag-act
14:23:33 <shadi> ...so that the "testing procedure" part of the Failures could be replaced by ACT rules
14:23:34 <Wilco> ack ag
14:23:43 <shadi> Wilco: would there be a 1:1 mapping?
14:24:12 <shadi> Shadi: not sure if always 1:1 but we should try to translate documented Failures into ACt rules
14:24:32 <shadi> Alistair: sent email on Monday about this
14:24:35 <jemma> jemma has joined #wcag-act
14:24:56 <shadi> ...suggested replacing "test procedures" too
14:25:20 <agarrison> q-
14:26:04 <shadi> Wilco: looks like agreement
14:26:16 <shadi> ...so align ACT rules with WCAG Failures?
14:26:32 <shadi> Alistair: align with the "testing procedures"
14:26:40 <shadi> present+ Jemma
14:27:06 <shadi> ...including relevant context information
14:27:12 <shadi> ...like the assumptions
14:29:13 <cpandhi> q+
14:29:31 <shadi> Shadi: agree with aligning ACT rules with "testing procedures" of Failures, so that these could be replaced by WCAG WG if they wanted to
14:29:38 <Ryladog> q+
14:29:40 <shadi> ack cp
14:29:44 <Wilco> ack cp
14:29:47 <shadi> Charu: agree as well
14:29:59 <shadi> ...focus on designing the ACT rules
14:30:10 <shadi> ...and in that we align to Failures
14:30:21 <shadi> ...the plain english aspect will be very useful
14:30:51 <shadi> ...current testing procedures are sometimes very vague and can be replaced with something more accurate
14:30:54 <shadi> ack ry
14:31:08 <shadi> Katie: not sure where the idea of replacing came from?
14:31:27 <shadi> Wilco: came from me, but agree with discussion outcome
14:31:55 <shadi> ...about aligning with "testing procedures"
14:32:24 <shadi> Katie: agree with focusing on designing the ACT rules to align with "testing procedures"
14:32:54 <shadi> ...not good to call for replacing right now until we see what we get
14:33:08 <shadi> Alistair: would be good to take that approach for the Techniques as well
14:33:20 <shadi> Wilco: agree with that
14:34:03 <shadi> ...will try to put together a small proposal as part of the requirements for the repository
14:34:42 <shadi> +1 to document this as part of the requirements
14:35:27 <Wilco> action: Wilco, document decision on failure techniques in requirement for repository
14:35:27 <trackbot> Error finding 'Wilco,'. You can review and register nicknames at <http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/task-forces/conformance-testing/track/users>.
14:35:50 <Wilco> action: Wilco to document decision on failure techniques in requirement for repository
14:35:51 <trackbot> Created ACTION-2 - Document decision on failure techniques in requirement for repository [on Wilco Fiers - due 2016-10-05].
14:36:40 <Wilco> zakim, take up next
14:36:40 <Zakim> agendum 3. "ISO test frameworks" taken up [from Wilco]
14:37:07 <shadi> Wilco: Alistair did research
14:37:18 <shadi> Alistair: all in the email I sent to the list
14:37:36 <shadi> ...framework we are creating is probably similar to existing ones
14:37:52 <shadi> ...stuff available for software testing
14:38:00 <shadi> q+ to talk about existing W3C efforts too
14:38:16 <shadi> ...work probably closest to the acceptance testing
14:38:31 <shadi> ...there is information about how to write such tests
14:38:43 <shadi> ...helps the discussion we had at the f2f last week
14:39:11 <shadi> ...but also additional information, like "positive" or "negative" phrasing
14:39:36 <shadi> ...probably our tests are "negative" - like want to identify images without descriptions
14:40:21 <Wilco> shadi: Thanks, very helpful work. At TPAC I also looked at other testing effort at w3c.
14:40:34 <Wilco> ... there was browser testing and tools, who work on webdriver
14:40:51 <Wilco> ... also the web platform WG, they have a test effort called Web Platform Testing
14:41:22 <Wilco> ... we should look at that, build on that. Those are more focused on browser testing. It may only be partially useable, but terminology should be reused and build on
14:41:23 <shadi> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/task-forces/conformance-testing/wiki/Testing_Resources
14:41:51 <Wilco> ... in this page are some resources. People can add to this, to have an overview of what exists
14:42:08 <shadi> ack me
14:42:08 <Zakim> shadi, you wanted to talk about existing W3C efforts too
14:42:42 <shadi> Wilco: want to extract relevant parts from these resources
14:43:02 <shadi> Alistair: not only about what we want to take up but also about what we want to avoid
14:43:54 <shadi> Wilco: would be good to have the key take-aways
14:44:35 <shadi> ...volunteers?
14:44:58 <shadi> Alistair: how? maybe for me to do first-cut and send to the list for review?
14:45:05 <shadi> Charu: I can review
14:46:23 <agarrison> Action: Alistair to pull out relevant sections of standards docs.
14:46:23 <trackbot> Created ACTION-3 - Pull out relevant sections of standards docs. [on Alistair Garrison - due 2016-10-05].
14:46:50 <Wilco> zakim, take up next
14:46:50 <Zakim> agendum 4. "ACT Framework Requirements" taken up [from Wilco]
14:47:17 <shadi> agenda?
14:47:22 <cpandhi> action: Charu to review forst cut from Alistair
14:47:22 <trackbot> Created ACTION-4 - Review forst cut from alistair [on Charu Pandhi - due 2016-10-05].
14:47:40 <Wilco> topic: EIII requirements
14:48:31 <shadi> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/task-forces/conformance-testing/track/
14:49:27 <Wilco> s/EIII/WCAG-EM
14:49:56 <shadi> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wcag-act/2016Sep/0022.html
14:50:30 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/methodology-reqs/
14:51:43 <shadi> Shadi: think structure of WCAG-EM requirements is useful
14:52:00 <shadi> ...but actual requirements may be too high-level than what we need
14:53:08 <agarrison> q+
14:53:14 <shadi> ...important to have "terminology" and "audience" definitions
14:53:24 <Wilco> ack ag
14:53:34 <shadi> ...and work from Alistair and Charu could add the details
14:53:40 <jemma> I agree with Shadi that wcag-em could be useful framework for ACT.
14:53:52 <shadi> Alistair: some definitions could be taken over, like web page states
14:53:57 <shadi> q+
14:54:06 <shadi> Wilco: agree with that
14:54:13 <agarrison> q-
14:54:29 <Wilco> ack sh
14:55:02 <shadi> Shadi: agree with Alistair
14:55:12 <shadi> ...should build on existing terms where possible
14:55:55 <shadi> ...but wasn't necessarily focusing on the terms themselves but the structure of the requirements document
14:56:41 <shadi> Wilco: anyone want to help out reviewing existing work at W3C?
14:56:43 <shadi> ...https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/task-forces/conformance-testing/wiki/Testing_Resources#W3C_Groups_on_Testing
14:57:31 <shadi> Shadi: takes some searching and stuff
14:57:47 <shadi> Jemma: can help with Open Ajax Alliance work
14:58:05 <shadi> MaryJo: can look into DHS trusted tester
14:59:57 <shadi> action: shadi to get GitHub setup for Requirements editing and viewing
14:59:57 <trackbot> Created ACTION-5 - Get github setup for requirements editing and viewing [on Shadi Abou-Zahra - due 2016-10-05].
15:00:08 <Wilco> action: wilco to investigate W3C testing activities for take-aways on the requirements
15:00:08 <trackbot> Created ACTION-6 - Investigate w3c testing activities for take-aways on the requirements [on Wilco Fiers - due 2016-10-05].
15:01:16 <Wilco> action: wilco to work with Jemma on OAA relation to ACT
15:01:16 <trackbot> Created ACTION-7 - Work with jemma on oaa relation to act [on Wilco Fiers - due 2016-10-05].
15:01:41 <jemma> Thanks everybody!
15:01:57 <shadi> trackbot, end meeting
15:01:57 <trackbot> Zakim, list attendees
15:01:57 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been Wilco, Katie, MaryJo, Charu, Alistair, Jemma
15:02:05 <trackbot> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
15:02:05 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/09/28-wcag-act-minutes.html trackbot
15:02:06 <trackbot> RRSAgent, bye
15:02:06 <RRSAgent> I see 7 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2016/09/28-wcag-act-actions.rdf :
15:02:06 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Wilco, document decision on failure techniques in requirement for repository [1]
15:02:06 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/09/28-wcag-act-irc#T14-35-27
15:02:06 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Wilco to document decision on failure techniques in requirement for repository [2]
15:02:06 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/09/28-wcag-act-irc#T14-35-50
15:02:06 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Alistair to pull out relevant sections of standards docs. [3]
15:02:06 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/09/28-wcag-act-irc#T14-46-23
15:02:06 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Charu to review forst cut from Alistair [4]
15:02:06 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/09/28-wcag-act-irc#T14-47-22
15:02:06 <RRSAgent> ACTION: shadi to get GitHub setup for Requirements editing and viewing [5]
15:02:06 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/09/28-wcag-act-irc#T14-59-57
15:02:06 <RRSAgent> ACTION: wilco to investigate W3C testing activities for take-aways on the requirements [6]
15:02:06 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/09/28-wcag-act-irc#T15-00-08
15:02:06 <RRSAgent> ACTION: wilco to work with Jemma on OAA relation to ACT [7]
15:02:06 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/09/28-wcag-act-irc#T15-01-16