IRC log of wcag-act on 2016-09-28

Timestamps are in UTC.

14:10:24 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #wcag-act
14:10:24 [RRSAgent]
logging to http://www.w3.org/2016/09/28-wcag-act-irc
14:10:26 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, make logs public
14:10:28 [trackbot]
Zakim, this will be
14:10:28 [Zakim]
I don't understand 'this will be', trackbot
14:10:29 [trackbot]
Meeting: Accessibility Conformance Testing Teleconference
14:10:29 [trackbot]
Date: 28 September 2016
14:10:54 [Wilco]
agenda+ Failure techniques proposal
14:11:06 [shadi]
agenda?
14:11:23 [shadi]
zakim, clear agenda
14:11:23 [Zakim]
agenda cleared
14:11:42 [agarrison]
agarrison has joined #wcag-act
14:11:55 [Wilco]
agenda+ Failure techniques proposal
14:12:01 [Wilco]
agenda+ Requirement documents
14:12:10 [Wilco]
agenda+ ISO test frameworks
14:12:17 [Wilco]
agenda+ ACT Framework Requirements
14:13:16 [agarrison]
what is the password for joining webex?
14:13:31 [Ryladog]
act
14:13:39 [cpandhi]
cpandhi has joined #wcag-act
14:13:40 [shadi]
s/act/
14:15:04 [shadi]
present: Wilco, Katie, MaryJo, Charu
14:15:15 [Wilco]
zakim take up next
14:15:22 [Wilco]
zakim, take up next
14:15:22 [Zakim]
I see a speaker queue remaining and respectfully decline to close this agendum, Wilco
14:15:39 [shadi]
queue=
14:15:56 [Wilco]
zakim, take up next
14:15:56 [Zakim]
I see a speaker queue remaining and respectfully decline to close this agendum, Wilco
14:16:01 [shadi]
q?
14:16:11 [shadi]
ack shadi
14:16:18 [shadi]
zakim, take up next
14:16:18 [Zakim]
agendum 1. "Failure techniques proposal" taken up [from Wilco]
14:16:29 [shadi]
present+ Alistair
14:17:33 [shadi]
Wilco: had good discussion at TPAC last week
14:17:53 [shadi]
...discussion came up of relationship of ACT to Failures in WCAG
14:18:04 [shadi]
...exchange with Katie on the mailing list
14:18:23 [shadi]
...think could replace Failures with ACT rules
14:18:25 [Wilco]
q?
14:18:27 [shadi]
q+
14:18:44 [shadi]
ack me
14:20:10 [cpandhi]
+1
14:20:22 [shadi]
Shadi: don't think we should discuss keeping or replacing Failures
14:20:38 [shadi]
...it is part of the WCAG 2.0 model and up to the WG to decide
14:20:54 [shadi]
...but agree that we should align our ACT rules to the Failures
14:21:04 [agarrison]
q+
14:21:57 [Ryladog]
Ryladog has joined #wcag-act
14:23:33 [shadi]
...so that the "testing procedure" part of the Failures could be replaced by ACT rules
14:23:34 [Wilco]
ack ag
14:23:43 [shadi]
Wilco: would there be a 1:1 mapping?
14:24:12 [shadi]
Shadi: not sure if always 1:1 but we should try to translate documented Failures into ACt rules
14:24:32 [shadi]
Alistair: sent email on Monday about this
14:24:35 [jemma]
jemma has joined #wcag-act
14:24:56 [shadi]
...suggested replacing "test procedures" too
14:25:20 [agarrison]
q-
14:26:04 [shadi]
Wilco: looks like agreement
14:26:16 [shadi]
...so align ACT rules with WCAG Failures?
14:26:32 [shadi]
Alistair: align with the "testing procedures"
14:26:40 [shadi]
present+ Jemma
14:27:06 [shadi]
...including relevant context information
14:27:12 [shadi]
...like the assumptions
14:29:13 [cpandhi]
q+
14:29:31 [shadi]
Shadi: agree with aligning ACT rules with "testing procedures" of Failures, so that these could be replaced by WCAG WG if they wanted to
14:29:38 [Ryladog]
q+
14:29:40 [shadi]
ack cp
14:29:44 [Wilco]
ack cp
14:29:47 [shadi]
Charu: agree as well
14:29:59 [shadi]
...focus on designing the ACT rules
14:30:10 [shadi]
...and in that we align to Failures
14:30:21 [shadi]
...the plain english aspect will be very useful
14:30:51 [shadi]
...current testing procedures are sometimes very vague and can be replaced with something more accurate
14:30:54 [shadi]
ack ry
14:31:08 [shadi]
Katie: not sure where the idea of replacing came from?
14:31:27 [shadi]
Wilco: came from me, but agree with discussion outcome
14:31:55 [shadi]
...about aligning with "testing procedures"
14:32:24 [shadi]
Katie: agree with focusing on designing the ACT rules to align with "testing procedures"
14:32:54 [shadi]
...not good to call for replacing right now until we see what we get
14:33:08 [shadi]
Alistair: would be good to take that approach for the Techniques as well
14:33:20 [shadi]
Wilco: agree with that
14:34:03 [shadi]
...will try to put together a small proposal as part of the requirements for the repository
14:34:42 [shadi]
+1 to document this as part of the requirements
14:35:27 [Wilco]
action: Wilco, document decision on failure techniques in requirement for repository
14:35:27 [trackbot]
Error finding 'Wilco,'. You can review and register nicknames at <http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/task-forces/conformance-testing/track/users>.
14:35:50 [Wilco]
action: Wilco to document decision on failure techniques in requirement for repository
14:35:51 [trackbot]
Created ACTION-2 - Document decision on failure techniques in requirement for repository [on Wilco Fiers - due 2016-10-05].
14:36:40 [Wilco]
zakim, take up next
14:36:40 [Zakim]
agendum 3. "ISO test frameworks" taken up [from Wilco]
14:37:07 [shadi]
Wilco: Alistair did research
14:37:18 [shadi]
Alistair: all in the email I sent to the list
14:37:36 [shadi]
...framework we are creating is probably similar to existing ones
14:37:52 [shadi]
...stuff available for software testing
14:38:00 [shadi]
q+ to talk about existing W3C efforts too
14:38:16 [shadi]
...work probably closest to the acceptance testing
14:38:31 [shadi]
...there is information about how to write such tests
14:38:43 [shadi]
...helps the discussion we had at the f2f last week
14:39:11 [shadi]
...but also additional information, like "positive" or "negative" phrasing
14:39:36 [shadi]
...probably our tests are "negative" - like want to identify images without descriptions
14:40:21 [Wilco]
shadi: Thanks, very helpful work. At TPAC I also looked at other testing effort at w3c.
14:40:34 [Wilco]
... there was browser testing and tools, who work on webdriver
14:40:51 [Wilco]
... also the web platform WG, they have a test effort called Web Platform Testing
14:41:22 [Wilco]
... we should look at that, build on that. Those are more focused on browser testing. It may only be partially useable, but terminology should be reused and build on
14:41:23 [shadi]
https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/task-forces/conformance-testing/wiki/Testing_Resources
14:41:51 [Wilco]
... in this page are some resources. People can add to this, to have an overview of what exists
14:42:08 [shadi]
ack me
14:42:08 [Zakim]
shadi, you wanted to talk about existing W3C efforts too
14:42:42 [shadi]
Wilco: want to extract relevant parts from these resources
14:43:02 [shadi]
Alistair: not only about what we want to take up but also about what we want to avoid
14:43:54 [shadi]
Wilco: would be good to have the key take-aways
14:44:35 [shadi]
...volunteers?
14:44:58 [shadi]
Alistair: how? maybe for me to do first-cut and send to the list for review?
14:45:05 [shadi]
Charu: I can review
14:46:23 [agarrison]
Action: Alistair to pull out relevant sections of standards docs.
14:46:23 [trackbot]
Created ACTION-3 - Pull out relevant sections of standards docs. [on Alistair Garrison - due 2016-10-05].
14:46:50 [Wilco]
zakim, take up next
14:46:50 [Zakim]
agendum 4. "ACT Framework Requirements" taken up [from Wilco]
14:47:17 [shadi]
agenda?
14:47:22 [cpandhi]
action: Charu to review forst cut from Alistair
14:47:22 [trackbot]
Created ACTION-4 - Review forst cut from alistair [on Charu Pandhi - due 2016-10-05].
14:47:40 [Wilco]
topic: EIII requirements
14:48:31 [shadi]
https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/task-forces/conformance-testing/track/
14:49:27 [Wilco]
s/EIII/WCAG-EM
14:49:56 [shadi]
https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wcag-act/2016Sep/0022.html
14:50:30 [shadi]
http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/methodology-reqs/
14:51:43 [shadi]
Shadi: think structure of WCAG-EM requirements is useful
14:52:00 [shadi]
...but actual requirements may be too high-level than what we need
14:53:08 [agarrison]
q+
14:53:14 [shadi]
...important to have "terminology" and "audience" definitions
14:53:24 [Wilco]
ack ag
14:53:34 [shadi]
...and work from Alistair and Charu could add the details
14:53:40 [jemma]
I agree with Shadi that wcag-em could be useful framework for ACT.
14:53:52 [shadi]
Alistair: some definitions could be taken over, like web page states
14:53:57 [shadi]
q+
14:54:06 [shadi]
Wilco: agree with that
14:54:13 [agarrison]
q-
14:54:29 [Wilco]
ack sh
14:55:02 [shadi]
Shadi: agree with Alistair
14:55:12 [shadi]
...should build on existing terms where possible
14:55:55 [shadi]
...but wasn't necessarily focusing on the terms themselves but the structure of the requirements document
14:56:41 [shadi]
Wilco: anyone want to help out reviewing existing work at W3C?
14:56:43 [shadi]
...https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/task-forces/conformance-testing/wiki/Testing_Resources#W3C_Groups_on_Testing
14:57:31 [shadi]
Shadi: takes some searching and stuff
14:57:47 [shadi]
Jemma: can help with Open Ajax Alliance work
14:58:05 [shadi]
MaryJo: can look into DHS trusted tester
14:59:57 [shadi]
action: shadi to get GitHub setup for Requirements editing and viewing
14:59:57 [trackbot]
Created ACTION-5 - Get github setup for requirements editing and viewing [on Shadi Abou-Zahra - due 2016-10-05].
15:00:08 [Wilco]
action: wilco to investigate W3C testing activities for take-aways on the requirements
15:00:08 [trackbot]
Created ACTION-6 - Investigate w3c testing activities for take-aways on the requirements [on Wilco Fiers - due 2016-10-05].
15:01:16 [Wilco]
action: wilco to work with Jemma on OAA relation to ACT
15:01:16 [trackbot]
Created ACTION-7 - Work with jemma on oaa relation to act [on Wilco Fiers - due 2016-10-05].
15:01:41 [jemma]
Thanks everybody!
15:01:57 [shadi]
trackbot, end meeting
15:01:57 [trackbot]
Zakim, list attendees
15:01:57 [Zakim]
As of this point the attendees have been Wilco, Katie, MaryJo, Charu, Alistair, Jemma
15:02:05 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, please draft minutes
15:02:05 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/09/28-wcag-act-minutes.html trackbot
15:02:06 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, bye
15:02:06 [RRSAgent]
I see 7 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2016/09/28-wcag-act-actions.rdf :
15:02:06 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Wilco, document decision on failure techniques in requirement for repository [1]
15:02:06 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/09/28-wcag-act-irc#T14-35-27
15:02:06 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Wilco to document decision on failure techniques in requirement for repository [2]
15:02:06 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/09/28-wcag-act-irc#T14-35-50
15:02:06 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Alistair to pull out relevant sections of standards docs. [3]
15:02:06 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/09/28-wcag-act-irc#T14-46-23
15:02:06 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Charu to review forst cut from Alistair [4]
15:02:06 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/09/28-wcag-act-irc#T14-47-22
15:02:06 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: shadi to get GitHub setup for Requirements editing and viewing [5]
15:02:06 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/09/28-wcag-act-irc#T14-59-57
15:02:06 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: wilco to investigate W3C testing activities for take-aways on the requirements [6]
15:02:06 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/09/28-wcag-act-irc#T15-00-08
15:02:06 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: wilco to work with Jemma on OAA relation to ACT [7]
15:02:06 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/09/28-wcag-act-irc#T15-01-16