20:27:25 RRSAgent has joined #svg 20:27:25 logging to http://www.w3.org/2016/08/18-svg-irc 20:27:27 RRSAgent, make logs public 20:27:29 Zakim, this will be GA_SVGWG 20:27:29 ok, trackbot 20:27:30 Meeting: SVG Working Group Teleconference 20:27:30 Date: 18 August 2016 20:27:45 Chair: Nikos 20:28:18 Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2016Aug/0046.html 20:28:21 present+ nikos 20:28:37 Scribe: Nikos 20:28:39 scribenick: nikos 20:32:26 present+ Tav 20:34:14 stakagi has joined #svg 20:35:56 present+ AmeliaBR 20:36:50 present+ stakagi 20:37:34 Topic: Publishing SVG 2 CR 20:39:31 nikos: Deadline for review comments is next Monday (Australian time) and we haven't really had anything relevant to SVG 2 come up 20:39:49 ... There's been some discussion of related topics with a11y 20:39:59 ... and a18n mentioned the review in their minutes, but no comments yet 20:40:10 ... so will talk to Doug early next week about getting approval to publish 20:40:26 ... so I'll prepare everything with a publication date sometime in next week 20:40:57 ... and do animation as well 20:41:53 ... and for SVG Strokes, etc, I would like to update those on TR as well because the EDs have a note stating that SVG 2 is what implementors should currently be looking at, and there's been some confusion 20:42:04 AmeliaBR: We could name them like CSS and call them Level 3 specs 20:42:36 AmeliaBR: I was playing around trying to build them and see if I could fix the style problem with the TOC 20:42:44 ... if I can figure that out I'll push a change 20:44:07 For the issue regarding categories 20:44:07 https://github.com/w3c/svgwg/issues/229 20:44:21 nikos: I'll have a look at that today and try to make some sense of it 20:44:31 ... there's categories that aren't referenced at all and they should be deleted 20:44:58 Topic: Remove support for "rev" attribute on element 20:45:04 https://github.com/w3c/svgwg/issues/224 20:45:23 nikos: So Whatwg removed this from their spec, W3C put it back in 20:46:23 ... Couldn't find any discussion as to why W3C want it in, so I think everyone would be mostly happy if we remove it from ours 20:46:35 ... and let the HTML groups sort it out 20:46:39 ... can add later if need be 20:46:43 Tav: I'm fine with that 20:46:57 AmeliaBR: As I said in the issue, I'm ok either way, I was just looking at the W3C HTML spec first 20:47:05 RESOLUTION: Remove rev attribute from SVG 2 20:47:41 Topic: Define equivalent paths for degenerate shapes 20:47:54 nikos: This isn't for SVG 2 CR, but there's been some discussion over the last week 20:47:58 https://github.com/w3c/svgwg/issues/235 20:48:06 AmeliaBR: Right now for SVG we have some things that are logically inconsistent 20:48:21 ... because this isn't exposed to authors we don't strictly need to deal with it now 20:48:41 ... basically the problem is that we have behaviour on shapes that isn't consistent with the path element that has the equivalent path 20:48:50 ... when the shape is degenerate 20:49:24 ... think I like the result that Nikos and Paul came to as well, which is to define it in terms of some extra switch that turns off rendering even though the equivalent path is something that would be a valid path, but is a shape that currently doesn't render 20:49:46 ... agree with Nikos that it might be taking away useful functionality if the equivalent path returned were empty 20:51:09 Tav: I don't have a strong opinion on this 20:51:27 AmeliaBR: I think try to be as consistent as we can - the bounding box matches the equivalent path 20:51:59 ... if we keep equivalent path as it's defined, the bounding box can be computed based on the equivalent path using whatever functions or algorithms are used 20:52:13 ... the only place where it's inconsistent is that you don't actually draw the shape 20:52:26 ... so that's where we can add in a switch or special rule to deal with teh backwards compat 20:52:50 nikos: And there was the suggestion of exposing that switch to authors 20:52:57 ... so they can control whether degenerate shapes render 20:53:49 Tav: How much content would break if we change the default? 20:54:12 nikos: No idea, but maybe if people are using the behaviour to make the shape dissapear in their drawing that would be bad 20:54:21 ... probably mostly animated content would be affected 20:55:07 AmeliaBR: We can agree that the equivalent path will be the equivalent path and the inconsistency will be at the rendering level 20:55:35 ... And I can close that issue and create a new one about exposing the path data 20:57:23 RESOLUTION: For equivalent paths exposed to authors, the actual equivalent path must be returned, even if the basic shape would not render. 20:58:20 Topic: Should some SVG 2 list type syntax definitions include a trailing comma? 20:58:26 https://github.com/w3c/svgwg/issues/233 20:59:26 nikos: Now I think none of us have any idea why this change was originally made in SVG 2 - but SVG 1.1 grammars for lists didn't allow a trailing comma - SVG 2 did for a while, but I removed it 21:00:48 ... The question is do we want to normatively specify that browsers need to be lenient in dealing with trailing commas 21:01:02 ... or just leave it up to implementations and not spec it? 21:01:37 AmeliaBR: I did some testing - all UAs I tried didn't support trailing comma on presentation attributes but they did for text positioning attributes 21:01:38 http://jsbin.com/wiwocutefe/1/edit?html,output 21:03:24 nikos: Maybe we just add a note advising implementors that content may exist that includes a trailing comma and that content would have worked in the path 21:03:52 AmeliaBR: Maybe we could ask Chrome to change and see if they get reports of breakage 21:04:23 Tav: I think we keep it the way it was in SVG 1.1. Various UAs don't support it - we don't 21:04:40 nikos: Yeah if there's no interop then it's not a big risk to spec with no trailing comma 21:05:10 RESOLUTION: SVG 2 list type grammars will not explicitly include a trailing comma 21:06:39 RRSAgent, make minutes 21:06:39 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/08/18-svg-minutes.html nikos 22:11:21 trackbot, end telcon 22:11:21 Zakim, list attendees 22:11:21 As of this point the attendees have been Tav, nikos, stakagi, shepazu, AmeliaBR, shepazu_ 22:11:29 RRSAgent, please draft minutes 22:11:29 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/08/18-svg-minutes.html trackbot 22:11:30 RRSAgent, bye 22:11:30 I see no action items