IRC log of i18n on 2016-06-23
Timestamps are in UTC.
- 14:33:19 [RRSAgent]
- RRSAgent has joined #i18n
- 14:33:19 [RRSAgent]
- logging to http://www.w3.org/2016/06/23-i18n-irc
- 14:33:24 [Zakim]
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- 14:33:30 [aphillip]
- trackbot, prepare teleconference
- 14:33:32 [trackbot]
- RRSAgent, make logs world
- 14:33:34 [trackbot]
- Zakim, this will be 4186
- 14:33:35 [trackbot]
- Meeting: Internationalization Working Group Teleconference
- 14:33:35 [trackbot]
- Date: 23 June 2016
- 14:33:35 [Zakim]
- ok, trackbot
- 14:34:02 [aphillip]
- Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-core/2016Jun/0029.html
- 14:34:07 [aphillip]
- Chair: Addison Phillips
- 14:34:11 [aphillip]
- Scribe: Addison Phillips
- 14:34:14 [aphillip]
- ScribeNick: aphillip
- 14:34:19 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/06/23-i18n-minutes.html aphillip
- 14:34:30 [aphillip]
- Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-core/2016Jun/0030.html
- 14:34:36 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/06/23-i18n-minutes.html aphillip
- 14:34:51 [aphillip]
- agenda+ Agenda
- 14:34:55 [aphillip]
- agenda+ Action Items
- 14:35:00 [aphillip]
- agenda+ Info Share
- 14:35:09 [aphillip]
- agenda+ RADAR and Active Work Review
- 14:35:16 [aphillip]
- agenda+ Specdev
- 14:35:24 [aphillip]
- agenda+ HTML 5.1 comments
- 14:35:27 [aphillip]
- agenda+ Charmod
- 14:35:42 [aphillip]
- agenda+ Move custom counter styles to Note
- 14:50:31 [Steve_Atkin]
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- 14:56:59 [aphillip]
- Present+ Steve
- 14:57:02 [aphillip]
- Present+ Addison
- 15:02:05 [JcK]
- JcK has joined #i18n
- 15:03:15 [aphillip]
- Present+ JcK
- 15:03:19 [aphillip]
- Present+ Richard
- 15:03:32 [aphillip]
- agenda?
- 15:03:42 [aphillip]
- zakim, take up agendum 1
- 15:03:42 [Zakim]
- agendum 1. "Agenda" taken up [from aphillip]
- 15:04:02 [aphillip]
- agenda+ Encoding spec
- 15:04:19 [aphillip]
- zakim, take up agendum 2
- 15:04:19 [Zakim]
- agendum 2. "Action Items" taken up [from aphillip]
- 15:04:31 [aphillip]
- https://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/open
- 15:05:36 [aphillip]
- close action-399
- 15:05:36 [trackbot]
- Closed action-399.
- 15:06:12 [aphillip]
- action-404?
- 15:06:12 [trackbot]
- action-404 -- Dennis Tan Tanaka to Check on zwj and friends in idna so that we can document in charmod-norm -- due 2015-02-19 -- OPEN
- 15:06:12 [trackbot]
- http://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/404
- 15:06:58 [aphillip]
- we decided that idna and friends are out of scope for charmod
- 15:07:01 [aphillip]
- close action-404
- 15:07:01 [trackbot]
- Closed action-404.
- 15:07:30 [aphillip]
- zakim, take up agendum 3
- 15:07:30 [Zakim]
- agendum 3. "Info Share" taken up [from aphillip]
- 15:07:41 [aphillip]
- reminder: sign up for TPAC!
- 15:08:41 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/06/23-i18n-minutes.html aphillip
- 15:08:52 [aphillip]
- richard: published the specdev
- 15:09:04 [aphillip]
- ... and something else in TR using echidna
- 15:09:10 [aphillip]
- ... counter styles
- 15:09:13 [aphillip]
- ... was really easy
- 15:09:30 [aphillip]
- addison: saw your email will try with charmod
- 15:09:36 [aphillip]
- richard: unicode 9 released on tuesday
- 15:09:51 [aphillip]
- ... and uniview is updates
- 15:09:55 [aphillip]
- s/updates/updated/
- 15:11:16 [aphillip]
- agenda?
- 15:11:24 [aphillip]
- zakim, take up agendum 4
- 15:11:24 [Zakim]
- agendum 4. "RADAR and Active Work Review" taken up [from aphillip]
- 15:11:36 [aphillip]
- http://w3c.github.io/i18n-activity/radar/
- 15:13:16 [aphillip]
- http://w3c.github.io/i18n-activity/projects/
- 15:15:04 [aphillip]
- action: addison: ping martin about unicode in xml
- 15:15:04 [trackbot]
- Created ACTION-534 - Ping martin about unicode in xml [on Addison Phillips - due 2016-06-30].
- 15:15:26 [aphillip]
- richard: no comments on time and dates essential comments
- 15:15:29 [aphillip]
- ... due yesterday
- 15:15:33 [aphillip]
- ... so publish it?
- 15:15:36 [aphillip]
- yep
- 15:15:44 [aphillip]
- agenda?
- 15:16:23 [JcK]
- FWIW, I forwarded the "time thing" announcement to a couple of IETF folks concerned about the issues, one of whom apparently re-forwarded to the mail calendaring list. So there should be no shortage of people with an opportunity to review
- 15:16:23 [najib]
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- 15:16:46 [aphillip]
- zakim, take up agendum 6
- 15:16:46 [Zakim]
- agendum 6. "HTML 5.1 comments" taken up [from aphillip]
- 15:16:48 [aphillip]
- http://w3c.github.io/i18n-activity/reviews/
- 15:17:55 [aphillip]
- https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/issues/159
- 15:18:04 [aphillip]
- richard: need to step back a bit more
- 15:19:01 [r12a]
- http://w3c.github.io/i18n-activity/reviews/
- 15:20:35 [aphillip]
- https://github.com/w3c/html/issues/341
- 15:20:46 [aphillip]
- want to leave in, could be useful in some languages
- 15:21:04 [aphillip]
- use the incubator was suggested
- 15:22:53 [aphillip]
- addison: recollection was that this was kept in for past compat, that list-style-type was meant to replace it
- 15:23:32 [aphillip]
- ... we'd want this taken away but for compat?
- 15:24:14 [aphillip]
- richard: if could auto-detect label, that'd be a cool feature
- 15:25:17 [aphillip]
- ... write note before we close it saying we don't agree?
- 15:25:20 [r12a]
- https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/issues/33
- 15:25:40 [aphillip]
- action: addison: add note to issue 33 saying we don't agree before closing
- 15:25:40 [trackbot]
- Created ACTION-535 - Add note to issue 33 saying we don't agree before closing [on Addison Phillips - due 2016-06-30].
- 15:25:44 [aphillip]
- https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/issues/128
- 15:26:04 [aphillip]
- close 127
- 15:26:23 [aphillip]
- 127 is not a typo
- 15:28:51 [aphillip]
- close 128. theyy added type=submit to the ones that are default translatable
- 15:29:03 [aphillip]
- https://github.com/w3c/html/pull/503
- 15:29:21 [aphillip]
- https://github.com/w3c/html/issues/343
- 15:30:17 [r12a]
- https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/issues/133
- 15:32:39 [aphillip]
- add a question about whether to be addressed or not
- 15:32:47 [aphillip]
- and 5.1 or 5.2?
- 15:32:56 [aphillip]
- agenda?
- 15:33:32 [aphillip]
- richard: closing all annotation model comments since no objections
- 15:33:39 [aphillip]
- zakim, take up agendum 8
- 15:33:39 [Zakim]
- agendum 8. "Move custom counter styles to Note" taken up [from aphillip]
- 15:33:57 [aphillip]
- css working group has been discussing plans for next charter period
- 15:34:08 [aphillip]
- ... and supposed to be 3 year charter
- 15:34:13 [aphillip]
- ... number of docs to rec in that time
- 15:34:18 [aphillip]
- ... one is counter styles
- 15:34:25 [aphillip]
- ... they expect it in rec in 2018
- 15:34:37 [aphillip]
- ... thinking our draft is a WG Note
- 15:34:49 [aphillip]
- (predefined counter styles)
- 15:34:57 [aphillip]
- richard: it's currently a WD
- 15:36:17 [aphillip]
- call for a vote on publishing "custom built counter styles" as a WG Note
- 15:36:28 [aphillip]
- ... short name of predefined-counter-styles
- 15:36:31 [r12a]
- http://w3c.github.io/predefined-counter-styles/
- 15:36:37 [aphillip]
- +1
- 15:36:38 [r12a]
- +1
- 15:37:09 [najib]
- +1
- 15:37:15 [Steve_Atkin]
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- 15:37:15 [JcK]
- +1
- 15:37:19 [Steve_Atkin]
- +1
- 15:37:25 [aphillip]
- so resolved
- 15:37:35 [aphillip]
- action: richard: publish predefined-counter-styles as a WG Note
- 15:37:36 [trackbot]
- Created ACTION-536 - Publish predefined-counter-styles as a wg note [on Richard Ishida - due 2016-06-30].
- 15:37:52 [aphillip]
- zakim, take up agendum 9
- 15:37:52 [Zakim]
- agendum 9. "Encoding spec" taken up [from aphillip]
- 15:37:59 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/06/23-i18n-minutes.html aphillip
- 15:38:02 [aphillip]
- Present+ Najib
- 15:38:18 [aphillip]
- richard: need to take a decision to publish a new version of the Encoding CR
- 15:38:26 [aphillip]
- ... there have been substantive changes since October
- 15:38:48 [r12a]
- https://github.com/whatwg/encoding/issues
- 15:38:52 [aphillip]
- richard: re-worked the double byte tests
- 15:39:04 [aphillip]
- .. submitted pull requests to WPT
- 15:39:18 [aphillip]
- ... link is to whatwg list for encoding
- 15:39:25 [aphillip]
- ... created 7 issues there
- 15:39:35 [aphillip]
- ... hoping they will get some impl discussion
- 15:39:41 [aphillip]
- richard: three possibilities
- 15:39:49 [aphillip]
- ... one is to fix browser
- 15:39:54 [aphillip]
- ... change spec to match browser
- 15:40:05 [aphillip]
- ... or problem with the test
- 15:40:11 [aphillip]
- ... hopefully not the last
- 15:42:00 [r12a]
- https://www.w3.org/International/tests/repo/results/encoding-dbl-byte.en
- 15:42:11 [r12a]
- https://www.w3.org/International/tests/repo/results/encoding-dbl-byte.en#gb18030
- 15:45:56 [aphillip]
- action: addison: file bugs against failing browsers, referring back to the encoding issue list, and update the encoding issues
- 15:45:56 [trackbot]
- Created ACTION-537 - File bugs against failing browsers, referring back to the encoding issue list, and update the encoding issues [on Addison Phillips - due 2016-06-30].
- 15:46:27 [aphillip]
- richard: the encodings I reworked was multibyte
- 15:46:38 [aphillip]
- ... haven't revisited single byte tests, generally better shape
- 15:46:47 [aphillip]
- ... passing tests with two impls is a CR requirement
- 15:46:55 [aphillip]
- ... weird thing here is 750K subtests
- 15:47:19 [aphillip]
- ... when you see a "partial", that means like 0.00001% of tests might have failed
- 15:47:30 [aphillip]
- ... usally not more than 1%
- 15:47:42 [aphillip]
- ... is a failure rate of < 1% mean it doesn't count
- 15:48:07 [aphillip]
- addison: very many tests where we don't have two
- 15:48:10 [aphillip]
- ?
- 15:48:14 [aphillip]
- richard: majority
- 15:52:28 [r12a]
- https://www.w3.org/International/tests/repo/results/encoding-sb-dec
- 15:52:46 [aphillip]
- steven: gb18030 concerns me the nost
- 15:52:51 [aphillip]
- s/nost/most/
- 15:54:44 [aphillip]
- richard: test here is conformance to encoding spec
- 15:54:56 [aphillip]
- ... might not be same as where gb18030 is defined
- 15:55:15 [aphillip]
- ... may be due to new version of 18030? maybe 18030:2005??
- 15:55:28 [aphillip]
- ... anne doesn't expect mappings to be identical to other people's
- 15:55:47 [aphillip]
- ... based on browser behaivor
- 15:55:51 [aphillip]
- ... or merging things
- 15:59:36 [aphillip]
- richard: more tests coming shortly through this process
- 15:59:49 [aphillip]
- ... replacement encoding and utf-16 encodings and maybe user-defined
- 15:59:58 [aphillip]
- steven: is there an impact on node.js
- 16:00:30 [aphillip]
- addison: js is a unicode beast
- 16:00:58 [aphillip]
- steven: need to think about more, want to think about it. could be subtle
- 16:01:55 [aphillip]
- resolve to publish a new CR?
- 16:02:01 [aphillip]
- richard: may need to pub another one later
- 16:02:26 [aphillip]
- ... problem is this is confusing
- 16:02:30 [aphillip]
- ... your TR isn't up to date
- 16:03:14 [aphillip]
- addison: can just track publish if whatwg's changes
- 16:05:09 [aphillip]
- ... mapping tables different from spec/algorithm
- 16:05:23 [aphillip]
- richard: no tests for API either
- 16:06:35 [aphillip]
- action: addison: work with richard and PLH to establish procedure for bringing changes to encoding forward
- 16:06:35 [trackbot]
- Created ACTION-538 - Work with richard and plh to establish procedure for bringing changes to encoding forward [on Addison Phillips - due 2016-06-30].
- 16:06:52 [aphillip]
- resolve: publish new encoding CR?
- 16:07:01 [aphillip]
- +1
- 16:07:03 [r12a]
- +1
- 16:07:03 [Steve_Atkin]
- +1
- 16:07:05 [najib]
- +1
- 16:08:45 [JcK]
- +1 (with procedural note)
- 16:09:07 [aphillip]
- addison: additional changes including exit of CR requires WG approval
- 16:09:36 [aphillip]
- s/resolve:/resolve: in principle /
- 16:09:43 [JcK]
- +1 with "in principle"
- 16:09:51 [r12a]
- agenda?
- 16:10:04 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/06/23-i18n-minutes.html aphillip
- 16:10:12 [aphillip]
- Topic: AOB?
- 16:11:04 [najib]
- najib has left #i18n
- 16:11:10 [aphillip]
- rrsagent, make minutes
- 16:11:10 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/06/23-i18n-minutes.html aphillip
- 16:12:04 [JcK]
- JcK has left #i18n
- 16:12:27 [aphillip]
- zakim, bye
- 16:12:27 [Zakim]
- Zakim has left #i18n
- 16:12:35 [aphillip]
- rrsagent, make minutes
- 16:12:35 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/06/23-i18n-minutes.html aphillip
- 16:12:39 [aphillip]
- rrsagent, bye
- 16:12:39 [RRSAgent]
- I see 5 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2016/06/23-i18n-actions.rdf :
- 16:12:39 [RRSAgent]
- ACTION: addison: ping martin about unicode in xml [1]
- 16:12:39 [RRSAgent]
- recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/06/23-i18n-irc#T15-15-04
- 16:12:39 [RRSAgent]
- ACTION: addison: add note to issue 33 saying we don't agree before closing [2]
- 16:12:39 [RRSAgent]
- recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/06/23-i18n-irc#T15-25-40
- 16:12:39 [RRSAgent]
- ACTION: richard: publish predefined-counter-styles as a WG Note [3]
- 16:12:39 [RRSAgent]
- recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/06/23-i18n-irc#T15-37-35
- 16:12:39 [RRSAgent]
- ACTION: addison: file bugs against failing browsers, referring back to the encoding issue list, and update the encoding issues [4]
- 16:12:39 [RRSAgent]
- recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/06/23-i18n-irc#T15-45-56
- 16:12:39 [RRSAgent]
- ACTION: addison: work with richard and PLH to establish procedure for bringing changes to encoding forward [5]
- 16:12:39 [RRSAgent]
- recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/06/23-i18n-irc#T16-06-35