IRC log of lvtf on 2016-05-19
Timestamps are in UTC.
- 14:05:32 [RRSAgent]
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- logging to http://www.w3.org/2016/05/19-lvtf-irc
- 14:05:34 [trackbot]
- RRSAgent, make logs public
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- Zakim, this will be
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- I don't understand 'this will be', trackbot
- 14:05:37 [trackbot]
- Meeting: Low Vision Accessibility Task Force Teleconference
- 14:05:37 [trackbot]
- Date: 19 May 2016
- 14:05:49 [allanj]
- Chair: Jim
- 14:29:43 [jeanne]
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- rrsagent, make minutes
- 14:37:50 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/05/19-lvtf-minutes.html allanj
- 14:38:11 [allanj]
- rrsagent, set logs public
- 14:39:05 [allanj]
- Agenda+ Gap Analysis
- 14:39:07 [allanj]
- http://w3c.github.io/low-vision-a11y-tf/WC-UA-alignment.html
- 14:41:14 [allanj]
- Regrets: Jeanne, Andrew
- 14:54:48 [Wayne]
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- regrets+JohnR
- 15:03:39 [ScottM]
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- 15:04:34 [allanj]
- scribe: wayne
- 15:05:17 [allanj]
- Resolution: 3.3.1 Text Size - GAP WCAG - 1.4.4 & 1.4.8 limits size to 200%, NOGAP UAAG met by 1.4.1 & 1.4.2
- 15:05:19 [allanj]
- Resolution: 3.3.2 Font - GAP WCAG no SC, NOGAP UAAG met by 1.4.1 & 1.4.2
- 15:05:20 [allanj]
- Resolution: 3.3.3 Style - GAP WCAG no SC, NOGAP UAAG met by 1.4.1 & 1.4.2
- 15:05:22 [allanj]
- Resolution: 3.3.4 Capitalization - GAP WCAG no SC, NOGAP UAAG met by 1.4.6
- 15:05:40 [laura]
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- 15:05:57 [Wayne]
- AJ: I wrote all the proposed gaps found when the full group was not present.
- 15:06:11 [Wayne]
- present+ wayne
- 15:06:44 [allanj]
- present+Jim
- 15:08:23 [Wayne]
- zakim, take up item 1
- 15:08:23 [Zakim]
- agendum 1. "Gap Analysis" taken up [from allanj]
- 15:08:34 [allanj]
- Topic: 3.4.6 spacing between elements
- 15:08:35 [laura]
- present+ Laura
- 15:09:32 [Wayne]
- See this in the GAP chart
- 15:09:44 [AWK]
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- 15:10:02 [allanj]
- https://w3c.github.io/low-vision-a11y-tf/WC-UA-alignment.html
- 15:11:13 [allanj]
- Resolution: 3.4.6 Spacing - GAP WCAG 1.4.8 only covers <p>, NOGAP UAAG met by 1.4.2 and 1.4.3
- 15:13:52 [Wayne]
- RESOLUTION: 3.4.6 Spacing - GAP WCAG 1.4.8 only covers <p>, NOGAP UAAG met by 1.4.2 and 1.4.3
- 15:17:40 [allanj]
- Topic: 3.5.1 element customization
- 15:18:47 [Wayne]
- RESOLUTION: No SC in WCAG, UAAG covers in 14.2 and 1.4.6
- 15:21:37 [Wayne]
- RESOLUTION: No SC in WCAG, UAAG covers in 14.2 and 1.4.6
- 15:21:48 [Wayne]
- RESOLUTION: No SC in WCAG, UAAG covers in 14.2
- 15:21:57 [allanj]
- Topic: 3.6.1 Maintain Point of Regard
- 15:23:49 [laura]
- Example: Point of Regard and Proximity of Controls: http://www.d.umn.edu/~lcarlson/wcagwg/point_of_regard/
- 15:23:57 [Wayne]
- RESOLUTION: GAP in WCAG, Covered in 1.8.6 and 1.8.9
- 15:24:42 [allanj]
- UAAG 1.8.6 and 1.8.9
- 15:27:17 [allanj]
- sm: problem in mobile, changing in orientation
- 15:27:47 [allanj]
- wd: focus in form is easy, tab, shift tab to regain focus
- 15:28:38 [allanj]
- ... if big text area, very disorienting
- 15:28:52 [allanj]
- topic: 3.6.2 proximity of related information
- 15:36:10 [Wayne]
- RESOLUTION: GAP in WCAG, UAAG GAP with partial 1.10.1
- 15:36:50 [allanj]
- last 3 bullets in use case not covered
- 15:37:08 [allanj]
- topic: 3.7.1 seeing all interface elements
- 15:37:47 [shawn]
- fyi, there is a pending edit on this wording -- on my To Do list
- 15:38:01 [allanj]
- User Need - All Elements: Users can see all interface elements that are intended for users to see, including when users have changed display settings such as text size.
- 15:38:02 [shawn]
- but that shouldn't hold up this gpa analysis
- 15:38:15 [shawn]
- s/gpa analysis/gap analysis
- 15:38:32 [allanj]
- wd: perhaps include busy background image with text on top
- 15:38:52 [Wayne]
- RESOLUTATION:
- 15:40:33 [Wayne]
- RESOLUTION: GAP in WCAG, UAAG 2.71 covers UA items only, not content elements
- 15:42:29 [allanj]
- awk: partial coverage WCAG 1.4.4 upto 200%
- 15:43:17 [allanj]
- ... also 1.4.8
- 15:43:59 [Wayne]
- RESOLUTION: WCAG partial 1.44 and 1.48, UAAG 2.71 covers UA items only, not content elements
- 15:44:19 [allanj]
- topic: 3.7.2 Printing Customized text
- 15:45:24 [Wayne]
- RESOLUTION: GAP in WCAG, Covered in UAAG 1.4.4
- 15:46:21 [allanj]
- topic: 3.7.3 Using User Setting
- 15:46:58 [allanj]
- deferred until the user need is completed
- 15:47:04 [ScottM]
- ...
- 15:51:36 [Wayne]
- AJ: There is a WCAG gap. 1.4.8 listed gives an upper limit (WCAG)
- 15:52:51 [Wayne]
- ... It looks like we are don't
- 15:53:03 [Wayne]
- s/don't/done./
- 15:54:00 [allanj]
- sm: windows has settings that effect the browser (or some of them)
- 15:54:01 [shawn]
- q+
- 15:54:43 [shawn]
- 3.7.3. User Need - User Settings: Content picks up all relevant user settings, such as ...
- 15:54:44 [allanj]
- ... this could be a huge problem, change browser settings based on OS settings
- 15:55:25 [Wayne]
- Scott: This could be very difficult; only Windows does this;
- 15:55:38 [allanj]
- awk: what are the things that are needed. OS settings, browser settings, content authors might set.
- 15:56:15 [Wayne]
- AWK: We are talking of user need. We can take on what is possible.
- 15:56:49 [ScottM]
- Authors must account for custom: Fonts, CSS, Colors, Removal of background or all images, text size
- 15:56:55 [Wayne]
- AWK: We are talking about the user need.
- 15:58:18 [Wayne]
- Shawn: This does not list. If the user sets values in the OS or Browser then the content respects this.
- 15:58:42 [shawn]
- ack s
- 15:58:59 [allanj]
- wd: this is in 508, but not in wcag stuff
- 15:59:13 [ScottM]
- Content must be interpretable with any custom settings
- 16:00:26 [allanj]
- sm: browsers don't always support OS settings
- 16:01:00 [shawn]
- action: Shawn 3.7.3 for "picks up" -> "respects" ?
- 16:01:00 [trackbot]
- Created ACTION-56 - 3.7.3 for "picks up" -> "respects" ? [on Shawn Henry - due 2016-05-26].
- 16:01:13 [Wayne]
- ScottM: Browsers don't respect OS settings, all kinds of things don't pass through; there are ways for pages to override; sites have there CSS.
- 16:02:01 [Wayne]
- Shawn: Content and User Agents respect the user's operating system settings.
- 16:02:08 [shawn]
- user agents user OS settings; content uses UA and OS settings
- 16:02:39 [shawn]
- s/user agents user OS settings/user agents use OS settings
- 16:02:55 [Wayne]
- AJ: If i had all these settings I coule pop up my settings.
- 16:03:36 [shawn]
- s/Content and User Agents respect the user's operating system settings./user agents respect OS settings; content respects UA and OS settings
- 16:04:13 [allanj]
- wd: user profile in OS, transfer to UA
- 16:05:31 [Wayne]
- ScottM: In office removes color dependencies; in browsers using JS one could ask the rendered; you can write the page more generic; the user must be able to make custom settings; render the page so it is intelligible with thes preferences in place.
- 16:06:14 [ScottM]
- +1
- 16:06:42 [allanj]
- wd: users need a mechanism to propose presentation setting and UA will respect these.
- 16:06:51 [allanj]
- ja: and transportable
- 16:09:03 [shawn]
- https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/low-vision-a11y-tf/track/actions/56
- 16:11:43 [ScottM]
- ?
- 16:12:15 [allanj]
- ja: UA GL2.6 has 5 SC related to settings
- 16:17:04 [allanj]
- discussion of multiple configurations, transportable setting
- 16:17:37 [allanj]
- sh: we want to focus on specific needs related to low vision
- 16:17:46 [ScottM]
- You could jump the fence with a pony!
- 16:19:19 [allanj]
- ... expanding needs to include advanced settings - transportable, multiple settings, etc...seems concocted
- 16:19:49 [allanj]
- wd: create profile, and transport it.
- 16:20:25 [allanj]
- sh: perhaps add to gap analysis - is this a need, or just a gap
- 16:20:51 [allanj]
- ... start a github issues about 2.6 - is it a need
- 16:22:22 [Wayne]
- Shawn: we can still do the gap analysis for our rough 3.7.3
- 16:23:09 [allanj]
- 3.7.3 user agents respect OS settings; content respects UA and OS settings
- 16:24:17 [allanj]
- 3.7.3 user agents uses OS settings; content uses UA and OS settings
- 16:24:29 [Wayne]
- RESOLUTION: 3.7.3 user agents uses OS settings; content uses UA and OS settings
- 16:24:51 [allanj]
- NOGAP UAAG GL 2.6 and 5.1.3
- 16:26:10 [Wayne]
- RESOLUTION: Absent in WCAG; NOGAP UAAG GL 2.6 and 5.1.3
- 16:26:59 [allanj]
- rrsagent, make minutes
- 16:26:59 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/05/19-lvtf-minutes.html allanj
- 16:27:03 [ScottM]
- Yep
- 16:27:12 [allanj]
- zakim, who is here?
- 16:27:12 [Zakim]
- Present: wayne, Jim, Laura
- 16:27:14 [Zakim]
- On IRC I see laura, ScottM, Wayne, jeanne, Zakim, RRSAgent, shawn, allanj, MichaelC, trackbot
- 16:27:29 [allanj]
- present+ shawn, awk
- 16:27:55 [laura]
- bye
- 16:28:00 [ScottM]
- Bye
- 16:28:38 [allanj]
- rrsagent, make minutes
- 16:28:38 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/05/19-lvtf-minutes.html allanj
- 16:28:45 [allanj]
- zakim, please part
- 16:28:45 [Zakim]
- leaving. As of this point the attendees have been wayne, Jim, Laura, shawn, awk
- 16:28:45 [Zakim]
- Zakim has left #lvtf
- 16:29:36 [allanj]
- rrsagent, make minutes
- 16:29:36 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/05/19-lvtf-minutes.html allanj
- 16:39:52 [allanj]
- regrets- andrew
- 16:39:58 [allanj]
- rrsagent, make minutes
- 16:39:58 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/05/19-lvtf-minutes.html allanj
- 17:09:05 [allanj]
- regrets -andrew
- 17:09:08 [allanj]
- rrsagent, make minutes
- 17:09:08 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/05/19-lvtf-minutes.html allanj
- 17:09:52 [allanj]
- agenda?
- 17:10:11 [Zakim]
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- 17:10:20 [allanj]
- zakim, clear agenda
- 17:10:20 [Zakim]
- agenda cleared
- 17:10:29 [allanj]
- zakim, please part
- 17:10:29 [Zakim]
- Zakim has left #lvtf
- 17:10:35 [allanj]
- rrsagent, please part
- 17:10:35 [RRSAgent]
- I see 1 open action item saved in http://www.w3.org/2016/05/19-lvtf-actions.rdf :
- 17:10:35 [RRSAgent]
- ACTION: Shawn 3.7.3 for "picks up" -> "respects" ? [1]
- 17:10:35 [RRSAgent]
- recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/05/19-lvtf-irc#T16-01-00