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17:56:27 <clapierre> scribe: clapierre
17:56:31 <clapierre> chair: clapierre
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17:56:36 <clapierre> title: Accessibility DPUB Task Force Weekly Meeting
17:57:47 <tzviya> present+
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17:58:01 <clapierre> present+ Charles LaPierre
17:58:09 <clapierre> present+ George Kerscher
17:58:17 <clapierre> present+ Avneesh
17:59:24 <rdeltour> present+ Romain_Deltour
18:00:35 <clapierre> http://w3c.github.io/dpub-accessibility/
18:01:16 <tzviya> present+ Matt_Garrish
18:01:35 <tzviya> present+ Mia_Lipner
18:01:48 <clapierre> regrets+ Deborah
18:02:23 <clapierre> regrets+ Peter K
18:02:46 <clapierre> Tzviya: Peter added to our note on Math and some other edits.
18:04:38 <clapierre> Topic: 1. Addition of metaData (Braille/ Audio renditions) (Romain)
18:07:14 <clapierre> Romain: how this came up.  talking about a11y note, with the IDPF meeting list.  some books are optimized for audiences audio books which don't comply to WCAG for universal a11y.  but these books need to be a11y.  in epub we have metadata to identify these books.  DPUB a11y is not about universal a11y.  not sure where this belongs, future work, or tailoring wcag
18:08:09 <clapierre> Tzviya: initially: review WCAG, and identify gaps.  we would have to frame it that way that there is a gap.  discoverability is an area which WCAG doesn't address.
18:08:24 <clapierre> Avneesh: would be good to register this with the W3C Note.
18:08:43 <clapierre> …, written down discovery here would be great to have
18:09:05 <clapierre> Romain: criteria for discoverability. is there other things missing in note?
18:09:33 <clapierre> George: materials that are optimized for a specific group and not universally design.
18:10:03 <clapierre> Romain: sensitive topic: we need to filter out WCAG and focus on one type of group. that is a big can of worms.
18:10:31 <clapierre> Avneesh: talking about 1 group of needs is a problem, but discoverability is really the focus here.
18:11:24 <clapierre> Tzviya: when I mentioned the metadata with Deborah, since it is so easy to falsify it.  But its not a reason to not have it.
18:12:07 <clapierre> Tzviya: laying ground work for future.  we outline these very broad issues.  wether content is accessible or all encompassing, is all we need to say.
18:12:29 <clapierre> Romain: Not sure what you said.
18:13:10 <clapierre> Tzviya: I think DPUB Note needs to do add a section (Discoverability) current w3C documentation that there is a way to say that content is accessible or how to find it.
18:14:21 <clapierre> Romain: if there is no way to profile WCAG there there is no way to a11y of specialized publications it won't reach A. so there is nothing you can do.  so claiming that a specific publication is a11y is an issue.  workaround: need a way to have custom profile but that is not universal.
18:15:19 <clapierre> Matt: there are forms of digital publications for specific groups and this is a know issue for these publications.  Outline there are guidelines needed.  without specifying how to solve this.
18:15:56 <clapierre> Tzviya: we want to soften the tone.   metadata issue and specialized version. maybe 2 issues.
18:16:16 <clapierre> …, so 2 new sections for metadata and optimized versions.
18:16:26 <clapierre> Romain: I can try both if you need volenteers.
18:17:00 <clapierre> Topic: 2. How to work with the ePub A11Y TF which will be referencing our Note (Avneesh)
18:17:18 <clapierre> Avneesh: what is the original plan for this Note beyond this state (1-2 years)
18:18:32 <clapierre> Tzviya: when we started working on this in 2015 this was to get our feet wet and working with other groups WAI.  we didn't think it would take this long.  at least 6 months ago and just to do a gap analysis and then publish it and work with other groups in WAI.
18:18:49 <clapierre> George: do we think we are complete in our gap analysis.
18:18:59 <clapierre> Avneesh: we are adding 2 and there may be more.
18:19:34 <clapierre> Tzviya: there is soposto be examples there.  WCAG, UAG/ATAG and if they are relevant to publishing.
18:20:03 <tzviya> s/soposto/supposed to
18:20:23 <clapierre> Avneesh: two kinds of audiences.  this note is for W3C and informative (what are missing pieces) and on epub side is publishers and concrete side.
18:21:05 <clapierre> George: this affirms that WCAG do apply to DPUB
18:21:58 <clapierre> …, this note says that it does apply and the epub a11y points to the note that WCAG is relevant and then go onto other things that we describe in our document.   this is where this doc is important.
18:23:24 <clapierre> Avneesh: when this document W3C process says that these things are missing from WCAG for DPUB help WCAG areas to work on future / extensions.  can help us harmonize WCAG to epub3 accessiblity.
18:24:24 <clapierre> George: do we say that things are missing from WCAG.
18:24:35 <clapierre> Tzviya: yes but we will tone it down a little.
18:24:57 <clapierre> …, expressing this is a gap analysis and not saying XYZ.
18:25:07 <clapierre> Matt: reads like tracker issues which is his concern.
18:25:27 <clapierre> Topic: Status of last weeks tasks (Michael Cooper’s recommendations) (Deborah / Tzviya) & (Conversion of Google Doc WCAG Techniques to Wiki)(Charles)
18:26:41 <clapierre> Tzviya: we said time is limited and I haven't touched this.  I may not be able to get to this depending on what happens.
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18:27:21 <clapierre> …, we are all stretched right now.  Jean is available but is not part of this group.  we can unofficially take her help.
18:27:46 <clapierre> …, Matt you offered or may be able to help with some word smitthing.
18:28:18 <clapierre> …, Michael's recommendations is to tone down the note.
18:29:16 <clapierre> Matt: I think explaining these issues and how you are expressing the issue.  I can go through and try to clean up some of these things.  I will do one and see if its what you want/expect then can do the rest.
18:29:34 <clapierre> Tzviya: I can do this with you 15 min after this call if you want.
18:29:47 <clapierre> Matt: I can fork the repo and do a quick clean up and send it to you.
18:31:00 <clapierre> Charles: the conversion from Google docs to wiki is done but could need more work missing usecases etc.
18:31:25 <clapierre> Topic: If time start to go over Alastair Campbell comments or at least task someone to do this work
18:31:48 <clapierre> Tzviya: I think lets get to a cleaner doc first.
18:32:13 <clapierre> …, we talked about removing DropCap.  ARIA changed how footnotes are handled so I can clean that up.
18:33:23 <clapierre> Charles: we should remove DropCap from this Note since it is handled already by W3C so I say lets remove it…. objections?
18:33:39 <clapierre> All: None.
18:34:41 <clapierre> Tzviya: we need update the references.  I will fix the ones I know about and will email the list for others.
18:34:48 <clapierre> Charles: I will remove the DropCap section.
18:36:41 <clapierre> Tzviya: looking at Alastair the most important is updating the abstract.
18:37:23 <clapierre> George: we should email them thanking them for their comments and we are acting on them
18:37:33 <clapierre> …, headings issue as well.
18:37:43 <clapierre> Tzviya: he had some really valuable points.
18:39:01 <clapierre> George: will Matt take on the abstract?
18:39:55 <clapierre> Tzviya: I think Deborah will be able to work on the abstract.  There are some detailed comments and maybe we should go through them. in the remaining 20 minutes.
18:41:09 <tzviya> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-digipub/2016Feb/0000.html
18:42:02 <clapierre> Avneesh: conveys that most of W3C note be phrased as a WCAG extension in the future.
18:42:27 <clapierre> George: this was started way before the wcag extension.
18:43:10 <clapierre> Tzviya: 2.1 Navigating Among Multiple Documents
18:43:42 <clapierre> …, why back button doesn't solve all our problems
18:44:26 <clapierre> …, Use-case 2 appears to be a miss-linking issue, on the web such an issue would affect everyone, I don’t understand why it would affect a non-sighted reader only?
18:45:34 <clapierre> …, point was: there is no way to test a11y of a package I can't check if the Nav doc links are correct.  but there is no tool to test this… can not access  a particular script.
18:46:11 <clapierre> George: its a boundary for these kind of documents.  you want to restrict your links to one package.
18:46:34 <clapierre> …, is the word publication the issue?
18:47:09 <clapierre> Tzviya: its just a matter of link checking.  criteria Bypass Blocks (2.4.1), Multiple Ways (2.4.5) and Location (2.4.8) could all have new dPub techniques added within the current SC.
18:47:29 <clapierre> …, its about the packaging is the issue.
18:49:33 <clapierre> George: Boundry (constraint) on identifying the links that those bounded documents and those which are outside.  You can create a toc and point to the various parts of the publication.  There is a wrapper around this documents that are core to the core to TOC which makes up the publication.
18:49:49 <clapierre> Tzviya: identifier or locator.
18:50:56 <clapierre> Tzviya: we need find a way to have these two meetings back to back.
18:51:02 <clapierre> George: key get this note done.
18:51:50 <clapierre> … how many hours do you think would take you and Jean to get this done?
18:52:05 <clapierre> Tzviya: don't know lets let Matt take a first crack at this .
18:52:13 <clapierre> George: let me see what I can do.
18:53:22 <clapierre> Charles: Matt will take first crack of this.  Thanks Matt, I know you were volunteered for this, we do really appreciate this!
18:53:55 <clapierre> rrsagent, draft minutes
18:53:55 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/03/11-DPUB-minutes.html clapierre
19:01:42 <clapierre> Topic: Addition of MathML to our Note (Peter)
19:03:07 <clapierre> Charles: Peter who couldn't make this meeting has already completed most if not all of this new section.  Thank you for doing this work for us Peter you are awesome!
19:03:15 <clapierre> rrsagent, draft minutes
19:03:15 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/03/11-DPUB-minutes.html clapierre
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