IRC log of dwbp on 2015-11-13
Timestamps are in UTC.
- 14:01:43 [RRSAgent]
- RRSAgent has joined #dwbp
- 14:01:43 [RRSAgent]
- logging to http://www.w3.org/2015/11/13-dwbp-irc
- 14:01:45 [trackbot]
- RRSAgent, make logs 351
- 14:01:45 [yaso]
- Topic for #dwbp is: Agenda: https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/wiki/Meetings:Telecon20151113
- 14:01:47 [trackbot]
- Zakim, this will be DWBP
- 14:01:47 [Zakim]
- I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, trackbot
- 14:01:48 [trackbot]
- Meeting: Data on the Web Best Practices Working Group Teleconference
- 14:01:48 [trackbot]
- Date: 13 November 2015
- 14:01:55 [hadleybeeman]
- PhilA, webex doesn't seem to have the time zones right
- 14:01:58 [phila]
- zakim, code?
- 14:01:58 [Zakim]
- I have been told this is https://mit.webex.com/mit/j.php?MTID=m0642b1c7ce49018a07ffec17ea136ae6 or +1-617-324-0000 US Toll Number, Access code: 645 096 989 PW: xGbzp445 Host Key
- 14:02:01 [Zakim]
- ... 538630
- 14:02:10 [hadleybeeman]
- We had this problem with the TAG call too (PhilA)
- 14:02:13 [phila]
- phila has changed the topic to: Please look at the wiki for the NEW DIAL IN DETAILS
- 14:02:21 [phila]
- phila has changed the topic to: Please look at the wiki for the NEW DIAL IN DETAILS
- 14:02:37 [phila]
- It's not that, hadleybeeman, it's that our meeeting booking was cacnelled
- 14:02:42 [phila]
- we have had trolls
- 14:02:44 [hadleybeeman]
- Ouch!
- 14:02:47 [hadleybeeman]
- Okay. :(
- 14:04:39 [ericstephan]
- ericstephan has joined #dwbp
- 14:04:53 [ericstephan]
- present+ ericstephan
- 14:05:00 [Eric_Kauz]
- Eric_Kauz has joined #DWBP
- 14:05:44 [phila]
- phila has joined #dwbp
- 14:06:01 [newtonca_]
- newtonca_ has joined #dwbp
- 14:06:07 [phila]
- zakim, code?
- 14:06:07 [Zakim]
- I have been told this is https://mit.webex.com/mit/j.php?MTID=m0642b1c7ce49018a07ffec17ea136ae6 or +1-617-324-0000 US Toll Number, Access code: 645 096 989 PW: xGbzp445 Host Key
- 14:06:10 [Zakim]
- ... 538630
- 14:06:16 [yaso]
- present+ yaso
- 14:06:24 [newtonca_]
- present+ newtoncalegari
- 14:06:28 [Eric_Kauz]
- present+ Eric_Kauz
- 14:06:33 [riccardoAlbertoni]
- present+ riccardoAlbertoni
- 14:06:36 [phila]
- zakim, save this conference description
- 14:06:36 [Zakim]
- this conference description has been saved, phila
- 14:06:45 [phila]
- zakim, code?
- 14:06:45 [Zakim]
- I have been told this is https://mit.webex.com/mit/j.php?MTID=m0642b1c7ce49018a07ffec17ea136ae6 or +1-617-324-0000 US Toll Number, Access code: 645 096 989 PW: xGbzp445 Host Key
- 14:06:48 [Zakim]
- ... 538630
- 14:06:54 [newton]
- present+ newton
- 14:07:38 [hadleybeeman]
- present+ hadley
- 14:07:39 [hadleybeeman]
- zakim, who is here?
- 14:07:39 [Zakim]
- Present: ericstephan, yaso, newtoncalegari, Eric_Kauz, riccardoAlbertoni, hadley
- 14:07:42 [Zakim]
- On IRC I see newton, phila, Eric_Kauz, ericstephan, RRSAgent, Zakim, riccardoAlbertoni, newtoncalegari, yaso, PWinstanley, Ig_Bittencourt, hadleybeeman, rhiaro, trackbot
- 14:07:42 [phila]
- present+ phila
- 14:07:54 [phila]
- IF YOU ARE NOT ON WEBEX YET, PLEASE NOTE NEW DETAILS
- 14:08:03 [phila]
- IT'S NOT THE SAME AS LAST WEEK
- 14:08:04 [PWinstanley_]
- PWinstanley_ has joined #dwbp
- 14:08:25 [yaso]
- scribe?
- 14:08:47 [laufer]
- laufer has joined #dwbp
- 14:08:52 [yaso]
- Hi Laufer
- 14:09:00 [PWinstanley_]
- present+ PWinstanley
- 14:09:07 [laufer]
- hi Yaso
- 14:09:18 [laufer]
- present+ laufer
- 14:09:22 [yaso]
- scribe: hadleybeeman
- 14:09:30 [BernadetteLoscio]
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- 14:09:36 [yaso]
- http://www.w3.org/2013/meeting/dwbp/2015-11-06
- 14:09:39 [hadleybeeman]
- chair: yaso
- 14:09:54 [hadleybeeman]
- PROPOSED: approve last week's minutes?
- 14:09:58 [yaso]
- +1
- 14:10:01 [hadleybeeman]
- +1
- 14:10:02 [riccardoAlbertoni]
- +0 ( i was not present)
- 14:10:03 [ericstephan]
- +1
- 14:10:10 [BernadetteLoscio]
- +1
- 14:10:29 [phila]
- PROPSOED: Accept lasty week's minutes http://www.w3.org/2015/11/06-dwbp-minutes
- 14:10:33 [laufer]
- +1
- 14:10:36 [phila]
- s/lasty/last/
- 14:10:37 [yaso]
- +1
- 14:11:03 [riccardoAlbertoni]
- +0 ( i was not present)
- 14:11:13 [phila]
- RESOLUTION: Accept last week's minutes http://www.w3.org/2015/11/06-dwbp-minutes
- 14:11:17 [jerdeb]
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- 14:11:17 [yaso]
- s/PROPSOED/PROPOSED
- 14:11:19 [newton]
- +1
- 14:11:27 [BernadetteLoscio]
- +1
- 14:11:36 [yaso]
- agenda: https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/wiki/Meetings:Telecon20151113
- 14:11:44 [jerdeb]
- present+ jerdeb
- 14:11:55 [hadleybeeman]
- Topic: Updates from BP document
- 14:12:06 [hadleybeeman]
- yaso: Bernadette or Newton?
- 14:12:11 [BernadetteLoscio]
- present +BernadetteLoscio
- 14:12:12 [newton]
- Berna
- 14:12:28 [BernadetteLoscio]
- present+ BernadetteLoscio
- 14:12:35 [phila]
- RRSAgent, draft minutes
- 14:12:35 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/11/13-dwbp-minutes.html phila
- 14:12:39 [hadleybeeman]
- BernadetteLoscio: We are still working on the updates of the document
- 14:12:47 [hadleybeeman]
- ...We are working on the examples. And reviewing some Bps.
- 14:13:08 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I was reviewing the BP on data vocabularies, and opened some issues and are discussing them with Antoine
- 14:13:19 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I hope we can get consensus and some examples for the end of next week.
- 14:13:51 [hadleybeeman]
- ...For the Data Access section: Newton and I were discussing examples for this
- 14:13:55 [newton]
- The ISSUE-213
- 14:13:55 [PWinstanley_]
- hadleybeeman: is it your typing that's coming over the lines? can you mute pls
- 14:14:00 [hadleybeeman]
- ...And also the BP about use of REST for APIs. Newton just opened an issue about it
- 14:14:28 [phila]
- RRSAgent, make logs public
- 14:14:32 [phila]
- RRSAgent, draft minutes
- 14:14:32 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/11/13-dwbp-minutes.html phila
- 14:14:36 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I also sent a message about the use of a specific vocab (the DTFS) to use in examples on transport data.
- 14:14:48 [phila]
- s/DTFS/GTFS/
- 14:14:54 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I got some answers, and am considering using this. Does the group agree?
- 14:15:06 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Or are there other suggestions? Mark sent some.
- 14:15:13 [hadleybeeman]
- ...GTFS is easy to work with.
- 14:15:22 [phila]
- +1 to using GTFS in examples
- 14:15:22 [hadleybeeman]
- ...This is just an example, not to say you SHOULD use this vocabulary
- 14:15:34 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Phil, have you talked with Christophe re the Data Preservation section?
- 14:15:56 [yaso]
- +1 to GTFS at examples
- 14:15:58 [hadleybeeman]
- phila: Re GTFS: as an example, that's fine. (The G used to stand for "Google"; now it's "General".) Almost everyone uses it.
- 14:16:06 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Stations, bus stops, timetables, etc.
- 14:16:21 [hadleybeeman]
- ...As long as it's just in the examples and we aren't saying "you must use this"; that's fine.
- 14:16:34 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I did contact Christophe, who responded with a pull request with examples.
- 14:16:44 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I haven't yet asked him to look at the running example.
- 14:17:00 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I haven't seen what he's written yet (in that PR), but if the example doesn't fit that, I'll see if I can edit it.
- 14:17:09 [hadleybeeman]
- BernadetteLoscio: Okay, I'll look at his PR.
- 14:17:17 [hadleybeeman]
- ...and I'll reply on email.
- 14:17:19 [hadleybeeman]
- q?
- 14:17:21 [newton]
- q+
- 14:17:47 [hadleybeeman]
- BernadetteLoscio: So we are working on the doc, reviewing the BPs. There is still stuff to do. This week I'll send emails asking for feedback about specific stuff.
- 14:17:53 [hadleybeeman]
- ... From the whole group.
- 14:17:57 [phila]
- q+ to ask about next publication date
- 14:18:11 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Soon we need to prepare the doc to publish the next draft, so it's good to get feedback now.
- 14:18:13 [hadleybeeman]
- q?
- 14:18:32 [yaso]
- ack newton
- 14:18:35 [hadleybeeman]
- ack newton
- 14:18:52 [newton]
- Title: Use Content Negotiation when providing the same resource with different formats
- 14:18:54 [hadleybeeman]
- newton: Re Conneg: I wrote a draft on this and have discussed with Bernadette
- 14:19:06 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I've changed the title
- 14:19:13 [yaso]
- link, newton
- 14:19:14 [yaso]
- ?
- 14:19:21 [hadleybeeman]
- ...With this title, this BP could be basian or not
- 14:19:38 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I don't have a link yet, but I will put the text on my GitHub and send to the group
- 14:19:40 [PWinstanley]
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- 14:19:48 [hadleybeeman]
- ...It's better to discuss it later, with more content.
- 14:19:50 [PWinstanley]
- present+ PWinstanley
- 14:19:55 [newton]
- ISSUE-213
- 14:19:55 [trackbot]
- ISSUE-213 -- Changes on BP about REST APIs -- raised
- 14:19:55 [trackbot]
- http://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/track/issues/213
- 14:20:00 [hadleybeeman]
- yaso: And the BP for REST APIs?
- 14:20:40 [hadleybeeman]
- BernadetteLoscio: As Newton said on the issue, it's more because the idea of us saying you should use REST APIs as an approach to implementation — instead of saying this on the title of the BP
- 14:20:51 [Makx]
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- 14:20:54 [hadleybeeman]
- ...So the title could be more generic, like "use APIs", and then on the approach implementation section
- 14:21:02 [hadleybeeman]
- ...you could say that one option would be to use RESTful APIs
- 14:21:16 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I don't think it's in the scope of the group to say how to implement a RESTful API
- 14:21:18 [phila]
- Not sure I agree with that but I'll need to look at it more carefully, i.e. I have an idea we should be firmer in recommending REST
- 14:21:31 [hadleybeeman]
- ...If you're going to use an API, you should use a RESTful API, but say this is an example.
- 14:21:36 [hadleybeeman]
- +1 to phil from me
- 14:21:46 [hadleybeeman]
- yaso: I agree with Phil. Maybe we should talk more?
- 14:21:54 [hadleybeeman]
- BernadetteLoscio: We just started the discussion.
- 14:22:14 [hadleybeeman]
- yaso: I agree that we don't need to mention the REST word. But I don't know if we don't have to mention the methods related to hypermedia and stuffy
- 14:22:23 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Maybe we should carry on the discussion on email?
- 14:22:34 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Newton or Bernadette, could you send this around?
- 14:22:39 [hadleybeeman]
- BernadetteLoscio: It's on the issue (213)
- 14:22:49 [BernadetteLoscio]
- thanks Hadley!
- 14:22:53 [hadleybeeman]
- newton: We could recommend some links on it
- 14:23:03 [Caroline]
- Caroline has joined #DWBP
- 14:23:05 [hadleybeeman]
- ...But I'm not sure we should get more specific
- 14:23:05 [yaso]
- q?
- 14:23:06 [hadleybeeman]
- q?
- 14:23:10 [hadleybeeman]
- ack phil
- 14:23:10 [Zakim]
- phila, you wanted to ask about next publication date
- 14:23:12 [yaso]
- ack phila
- 14:23:27 [hadleybeeman]
- phila: Newton, BernadetteLoscio, when do you think we can have a new publication? (ideally before Christmas)
- 14:23:30 [hadleybeeman]
- BernadetteLoscio: Yes
- 14:23:35 [BartvanLeeuwen]
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- 14:23:36 [hadleybeeman]
- phila: End of this month?
- 14:23:38 [hadleybeeman]
- BernadetteLoscio: Yes
- 14:23:45 [hadleybeeman]
- Phila: put the open issues in the document, like this one.
- 14:23:54 [hadleybeeman]
- BernadetteLoscio: We are working on it.
- 14:24:16 [hadleybeeman]
- phila: I'm trying to encourage you to publish something even though there is more work to do. We need another snapshot out to get feedback.
- 14:24:27 [hadleybeeman]
- ...We are headed toward Candidate Rec stage in 2 months time.
- 14:24:28 [yaso]
- Data Usage Vocabulary
- 14:24:29 [hadleybeeman]
- BernadetteLoscio: Okay
- 14:24:36 [hadleybeeman]
- topic: updates on data usage vocabulary
- 14:24:41 [BartvanLeeuwen]
- present+ BartvanLeeuwen
- 14:25:02 [ericstephan]
- https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/wiki/images/c/ce/Duv-citations-research.pdf
- 14:25:02 [hadleybeeman]
- ericstephan: I put this link on the agenda Update on Dataset Usage https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/wiki/images/c/ce/Duv-citations-research.pdf
- 14:25:12 [Caroline]
- Present+ Caroline
- 14:25:13 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Sorry, it's a slow download
- 14:25:46 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I'll wait just a couple minutes while it's downloading (for all of you) — and talk about the Data usage part of the vocabulary
- 14:25:56 [hadleybeeman]
- ...BernadetteLoscio and I have resolved this AM we need the working group's input
- 14:26:11 [yaso]
- q?
- 14:26:11 [hadleybeeman]
- ...To do that, we have to put issues into the document so you can see where we're struggling.
- 14:26:15 [hadleybeeman]
- ...And give us your ideas.
- 14:26:37 [hadleybeeman]
- ...There is another part where external folks are working in the climate community (NASA and universities) have a tool called Tool Match, which seems up our alley
- 14:26:52 [hadleybeeman]
- ...While it's focused on geospatial, it may give us some ideas on how to direct our efforts on the DUV
- 14:26:54 [yaso]
- q?
- 14:27:29 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Next part is the presentation. Last 2 weeks, I appreciate everyone bearing with me on Data citations.
- 14:27:38 [hadleybeeman]
- ...It's a challenging problem, how to get the citations model right.
- 14:28:00 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I was grappling with the issue that there are a lot of different solutions, challenges, ontologies, vocabularies...
- 14:28:08 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Most people think about the Info model. [slide 1]
- 14:28:21 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I'm highlighting the MLA, APA and Chicago Manual styles, the three main ones.
- 14:28:43 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I've been using the Purdue Online Writing Lab as a resource (logo on slide), because I didn't just want to study about mental models for any type of citation—
- 14:28:51 [hadleybeeman]
- ...We care about citations for data on the Web.
- 14:28:54 [hadleybeeman]
- ...[Slide 2]
- 14:29:08 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Re constructing knowledge models... [Minecraft slide]
- 14:29:24 [hadleybeeman]
- ...You have lots of tools with different emphases. I've been looking for the best solution for us.
- 14:29:29 [hadleybeeman]
- ...[Slide 3]
- 14:29:44 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Is there some level of synchronisation possible, to go from the information model to the knowledge model?
- 14:30:03 [hadleybeeman]
- ...You've got a consumer who cites, on the Web, a dataset from a journal article.
- 14:30:20 [hadleybeeman]
- ...We have to have a link to that, or we'll only be building knowledge models and not reaching out to the greater community
- 14:30:40 [hadleybeeman]
- ...We've got a publisher who creates a metadata citation for data on the Web, or
- 14:30:42 [yaso]
- q?
- 14:30:53 [hadleybeeman]
- ...citing a technical document associated with the data.
- 14:30:56 [hadleybeeman]
- ...[next slide]
- 14:31:12 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Re digital libraries... I've found there is a core electronic document data model.
- 14:31:20 [hadleybeeman]
- ...There are different styles that extend that model
- 14:31:31 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Around that, you have the vocabularies. SPAR ontologies, Dublin Core, etc.
- 14:31:50 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Beyond the vocabularies, you have the Force11 community, and the other non-semweb vocabs
- 14:32:00 [hadleybeeman]
- ...You have StructureID. Bib-JSON
- 14:32:21 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Because we're looking at open data on the Web and not just semantic data, that's useful.
- 14:32:42 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I know we're focusing on URIs as identifiers, but there are legacy datasets that use other identifiers.
- 14:32:50 [hadleybeeman]
- ...If they have those, we have to bring those along too.
- 14:33:10 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Outside that, whatever we put together for a data model, we include principles from Force11 and BPs...
- 14:33:21 [hadleybeeman]
- ...And then there is Interrelated content, which is what you do with the citation
- 14:33:26 [hadleybeeman]
- ...And there are ontologies for that.
- 14:33:42 [hadleybeeman]
- ...It helped me separate in my mind everything out there, and the correlation between the info and the knowledge models.
- 14:33:46 [hadleybeeman]
- ...[Next slide]
- 14:33:56 [hadleybeeman]
- ...From the digital librarians...
- 14:34:00 [hadleybeeman]
- ...This is the core citation model
- 14:34:11 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Only thing we added: the Citation creator
- 14:34:31 [hadleybeeman]
- ...There were a few that jumped out at me. Sometimes the publisher, creator and distributor might be broken out
- 14:34:34 [hadleybeeman]
- ...[next slide]
- 14:35:08 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Based on the previous slide with the basic elements, we have right now in the model DUV-CitationAct, we recommend it includes the properties that support the attributes here.
- 14:35:16 [hadleybeeman]
- ...This is up for discussion... did we pick the best properties?
- 14:35:46 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Also, if something is published on the Web, sometimes you have authors who are a foaf:agent, sometimes foaf:organisation, sometimes foaf:project
- 14:35:57 [yaso]
- q?
- 14:36:07 [hadleybeeman]
- ...The role of the distributor, whoever makes the data accessible on the web... we're talking about the relationship between that and the dataset.
- 14:36:17 [hadleybeeman]
- ...We're proposing we go with the basic citation model.
- 14:36:36 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Then: we're aligned with the digital librarian community. Got feedback from Purdue.
- 14:36:47 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Through this, I've learned which communities we need to get to validate this.
- 14:36:56 [yaso]
- q?
- 14:37:05 [hadleybeeman]
- yaso: Thank you for the update. Comments?
- 14:37:11 [hadleybeeman]
- phila: I do, but I know we don't have much time
- 14:37:28 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Grateful to Eric for that huge amount of work. I need to sit down and send questions on email.
- 14:37:32 [yaso]
- http://www.w3.org/TR/vocab-dqv/
- 14:37:33 [hadleybeeman]
- topic: Data Quality Vocabulary
- 14:37:53 [hadleybeeman]
- riccardoAlbertoni: First a little discussion on the update in the document.
- 14:38:08 [hadleybeeman]
- ...This week, Antoine changed the data document, updating it according to the decision we made in the last call.
- 14:38:28 [phila]
- -> http://w3c.github.io/dwbp/vocab-dqg.html DQV
- 14:38:39 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I think that the most important thing is that we now have an example to show how to associate all the high-quality certifications for a dataset.
- 14:38:42 [riccardoAlbertoni]
- http://w3c.github.io/dwbp/vocab-dqg.html#express-that-a-dataset-received-an-odi-certificate
- 14:38:54 [hadleybeeman]
- ...This is an example. http://w3c.github.io/dwbp/vocab-dqg.html#express-that-a-dataset-received-an-odi-certificate
- 14:39:23 [hadleybeeman]
- ... Beside small changes on the document, we have 2 discussions pending.
- 14:39:30 [hadleybeeman]
- ...We are waiting for people behind the scenes.
- 14:39:40 [hadleybeeman]
- ...1) How to encode SLA in a quality policy?
- 14:39:55 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Yesterday, Nandana sent examples to the editors. We are considering them and hope to add them to the doc soon.
- 14:40:23 [hadleybeeman]
- ...2) Re metrics dimensions categories, is this a concrete class or abstract class?
- 14:40:39 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I want to apologise. @@@ contacted us editors last week, and we haven't had time yet to answer.
- 14:41:01 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I'd like to move on to concrete discussion about issues now, unless there are questions?
- 14:41:05 [yaso]
- q?
- 14:41:29 [phila]
- s/@@@/Jeremy/
- 14:41:32 [hadleybeeman]
- [no questions]
- 14:41:35 [riccardoAlbertoni]
- issue-202
- 14:41:35 [trackbot]
- issue-202 -- Relation between dqv, iso 19115/19157 and geodcat-ap -- open
- 14:41:35 [trackbot]
- http://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/track/issues/202
- 14:41:39 [hadleybeeman]
- riccardoAlbertoni: Let's start with issue 202
- 14:41:56 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Which was generated by Andrea Perrego.
- 14:42:19 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Issue: relationship between the vocab, an ISO standard, the INSPIRE directive and a profile of DCAT
- 14:42:35 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Perrego suggested some possible requirements to consider.
- 14:42:56 [hadleybeeman]
- ...In the DQV, we are already saying that a dataset conforms to a standard, we have a specific property in the class for doing that.
- 14:43:24 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Andrea is asking if we would like to consider also to express that a dataset is not conformant to a standard. Or that it hasn't yet been evaluated against a standard.
- 14:43:32 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Yesterday I emailed about this
- 14:43:44 [phila]
- q+
- 14:43:55 [hadleybeeman]
- ...My position: we should consider to add the support in DQV to express that a dataset is not conformant to a standard.
- 14:44:08 [hadleybeeman]
- ...But I'm not sure if it makes sense to say that it has not yet been evaluated against a standard.
- 14:44:14 [hadleybeeman]
- ...So, any comments?
- 14:44:18 [yaso]
- q?
- 14:44:22 [hadleybeeman]
- ack phila
- 14:44:23 [yaso]
- ack phila
- 14:44:52 [hadleybeeman]
- phila: The thing about DCAT-AP and GeoDCAT-AP is that they are in increasing use, the European Data Portal is being launched next week which demands DCAT-AP
- 14:45:01 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I get hung up on "what is the subject of the triples."
- 14:45:26 [hadleybeeman]
- ...If I have a dataset of bus stops, the dataset doesn't conform to GeoDCAT-AP, but the metadata about the data may conform.
- 14:45:38 [peter]
- peter has joined #dwbp
- 14:45:45 [peter]
- present+ peter
- 14:45:52 [hadleybeeman]
- ...You'll need a property that says, "This dataset has metadata that is conformant to this standard [like GeoDCAT-AP]
- 14:45:55 [hadleybeeman]
- ..."
- 14:45:56 [phila]
- <dataset> ex:hasMetadataConformantTo <DCAT-AP>
- 14:46:11 [hadleybeeman]
- riccardoAlbertoni: That is a good suggestion
- 14:46:30 [hadleybeeman]
- ...It's hard to say if this is in the scope for DQV. It could be.
- 14:47:08 [hadleybeeman]
- ...We are trying to model the quality of datasets. The fact that the dataset is compliant to DCAT-AP, which is basically a vocabulary... so it is not a standard?
- 14:47:20 [hadleybeeman]
- phila: The European Commission wouldn't agree that it isn't a standard.
- 14:47:30 [hadleybeeman]
- riccardoAlbertoni: I guess there are plenty of standards.
- 14:47:40 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I wonder if this kind of statement should be captured by our vocabulary or not.
- 14:47:44 [laufer]
- q+
- 14:47:54 [hadleybeeman]
- phila: I think it tells you something about the process, how the data was created.
- 14:48:12 [hadleybeeman]
- ...It tells you the organisation that created this data has taken the trouble to create metadata according to this standard.
- 14:48:14 [hadleybeeman]
- q+
- 14:48:18 [peter]
- there is an RDA - related metadata to metadata link issue: http://www.rda-jsc.org/sites/all/files/6JSC-ALA-45-CCC-response.pdf
- 14:48:36 [hadleybeeman]
- ...It lets you trust the data further.
- 14:48:57 [hadleybeeman]
- riccardoAlbertoni: I get that. I wonder if the property you were suggesting could be a sub-property of dc:conformsTo?
- 14:49:02 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Shall we open an issue?
- 14:49:08 [hadleybeeman]
- phila: Was hoping to help you close an issue
- 14:49:26 [hadleybeeman]
- riccardoAlbertoni: This is a good suggestion, but I think it's not helping to close the issue.
- 14:49:34 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I'm happy you pointed this out.
- 14:49:37 [phila]
- ack l
- 14:49:38 [hadleybeeman]
- ack lauf
- 14:49:39 [yaso]
- q?
- 14:49:52 [yaso]
- ack hadleybeeman
- 14:49:57 [yaso]
- ops
- 14:50:00 [yaso]
- ack laufer
- 14:50:11 [hadleybeeman]
- laufer: About the issue of seeing or not if the datasets conforms to a standard:
- 14:50:23 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I want to ask, what is the model we are assuming for quality? A closed world, or an open world?
- 14:50:37 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I think we have to assert that the quality of a dataset is in a closed world.
- 14:50:43 [hadleybeeman]
- riccardoAlbertoni: I tend to agree
- 14:50:49 [jerdeb]
- it should be closed world
- 14:50:59 [hadleybeeman]
- ...In most cases, they are working with a closed world assumption. Depends on the community.
- 14:51:15 [hadleybeeman]
- laufer: I think it's difficult to assert all the things that a dataset is not.
- 14:51:25 [hadleybeeman]
- hadleybeeman: That's profound
- 14:51:41 [hadleybeeman]
- riccardoAlbertoni: You are saying there is difficulties in expressing this statement, but you would find it useful to express it?
- 14:52:07 [hadleybeeman]
- laufer: I don't know. I think we have to define what are the assertions about quality that our vocabulary will enable.
- 14:52:20 [hadleybeeman]
- ...So, one can assert that a dataset is conforment to a standard.
- 14:52:35 [hadleybeeman]
- ...But it seems a strange thing to assert to what the dataset is not conferment.
- 14:52:59 [hadleybeeman]
- ...If you don't assert that it IS conformant, then we can conclude that it isn't conforment.
- 14:53:07 [yaso]
- q+
- 14:53:25 [yaso]
- q-
- 14:53:27 [hadleybeeman]
- riccardoAlbertoni: The point is that Andrea is point out that these kinds of needs are required in some domains, like geographical domain.
- 14:53:28 [hadleybeeman]
- q+
- 14:53:37 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Where there is a huge amount of open data.
- 14:54:09 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I think we should take into consideration the possibility that saying that one dataset is not conformant to a standard. But I don't think "not evaluated yet" is useful
- 14:54:33 [hadleybeeman]
- ...And may make the management of metadata more difficult
- 14:54:49 [hadleybeeman]
- laufer: If you don't have any assertion about a standard, we can conclude...nothing?
- 14:54:53 [hadleybeeman]
- riccardoAlbertoni: Yes, nothing.
- 14:55:12 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Because some people will work in an open-world assumption. Others in the closed-world assumption. We can't presume.
- 14:55:29 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I'm not sure; this is an open discussion
- 14:55:33 [yaso]
- ack hadleybeeman
- 14:55:50 [phila]
- hadleybeeman: I wanted to scroll back to talking about the metadata being conformant to a standard
- 14:56:07 [phila]
- ... If I'm combining datasets, that's what I want to know. That then makes it easy to know what I can do with it
- 14:56:15 [yaso]
- +1 to hadleybeeman
- 14:56:21 [phila]
- ... So +1 for that being a user need
- 14:56:40 [hadleybeeman]
- riccardoAlbertoni: Okay, I appreciate that. I think we really need to open an issue here.
- 14:56:57 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Phil's suggestion could be a good starting point.
- 14:57:10 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I could have an open action to me to include this new relation?
- 14:57:20 [phila]
- [..] Riccardo thinks
- 14:57:52 [trackbot]
- Sorry, phila, I don't understand 'Trackbot, please decide whether we should open an issue or an action'. Please refer to <http://www.w3.org/2005/06/tracker/irc> for help.
- 14:58:17 [phila]
- q+ for 10 secs at the end
- 14:58:37 [hadleybeeman]
- action: Riccardo to send an email to discuss the suggestion to add the assertion that a dataset's metadata conforms to a standard (like GeoJSON)
- 14:58:37 [trackbot]
- Created ACTION-219 - Send an email to discuss the suggestion to add the assertion that a dataset's metadata conforms to a standard (like geojson) [on Riccardo Albertoni - due 2015-11-20].
- 14:58:44 [riccardoAlbertoni]
- issue-188
- 14:58:44 [trackbot]
- issue-188 -- Section "Express the quality of a linkset" will be completed by examples coming from Riccardo's work on measuring the quality of linksets between SKOS concept schemes -- open
- 14:58:44 [trackbot]
- http://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/track/issues/188
- 14:59:14 [hadleybeeman]
- riccardoAlbertoni: We have already added an example in the doc pertaining to linkset quality.
- 14:59:19 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I want to close this issue
- 14:59:32 [hadleybeeman]
- ...As it is written, it is misleading and doesn't make sense. And doesn't require more discussion.
- 14:59:45 [yaso]
- q?
- 14:59:49 [phila]
- If it's dealt with it's dealt with IMHO
- 14:59:52 [hadleybeeman]
- ...I will add the missing part, as editorial note. Reminder that we have to add an example.
- 15:00:10 [hadleybeeman]
- yaso: Is everyone okay with closing this issue?
- 15:00:33 [hadleybeeman]
- yaso: I don't think we need a group decision to close this.
- 15:00:40 [hadleybeeman]
- riccardoAlbertoni: Yes. No group discussion is needed.
- 15:00:48 [hadleybeeman]
- yaso: Thank you, riccardoAlbertoni for this update.
- 15:00:48 [yaso]
- ack phila
- 15:00:48 [Zakim]
- phila, you wanted to discuss 10 secs at the end
- 15:00:49 [phila]
- -> http://fantasai.inkedblade.net/style/design/w3c-restyle/2016/sample What our final docs will look like (as of Jan 2016)
- 15:00:57 [hadleybeeman]
- topic: Any other business
- 15:00:57 [yaso]
- close issue-188
- 15:00:57 [trackbot]
- Closed issue-188.
- 15:01:10 [hadleybeeman]
- phila: You may have seen that we've been redesigning our document template.
- 15:01:18 [hadleybeeman]
- ...This is a link to the new template, which comes in to force in Jan.
- 15:01:27 [peter_]
- peter_ has joined #dwbp
- 15:01:29 [hadleybeeman]
- ...The final version of this group's docs will look like this.
- 15:01:34 [peter_]
- present+ peter
- 15:01:41 [hadleybeeman]
- ...Looking for comments on this new TR design?
- 15:02:11 [riccardoAlbertoni]
- thank for the suggestions!
- 15:02:28 [ericstephan]
- Okay bye everyone
- 15:02:31 [laufer]
- bye all, nice wknd...
- 15:02:31 [hadleybeeman]
- Yaso: [closes the meeting]
- 15:02:32 [phila]
- RRSAgent, dtraft minutes
- 15:02:32 [RRSAgent]
- I'm logging. I don't understand 'dtraft minutes', phila. Try /msg RRSAgent help
- 15:02:32 [Caroline]
- great design! :)
- 15:02:35 [Caroline]
- Bye! tks
- 15:02:36 [peter_]
- bye
- 15:02:38 [hadleybeeman]
- bye
- 15:02:39 [phila]
- RRSAgent, draft minutes
- 15:02:39 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/11/13-dwbp-minutes.html phila
- 15:02:40 [BernadetteLoscio]
- bye! thanks!!!
- 15:02:50 [yaso]
- Bye! Thanks all
- 15:03:02 [newton]
- bye!
- 15:38:45 [riccardoAlbertoni]
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