16:41:17 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #wpwg
16:41:17 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2015/11/12-wpwg-irc
16:41:19 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
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16:41:21 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be
16:41:21 <Zakim> I don't understand 'this will be', trackbot
16:41:22 <trackbot> Meeting: Web Payments Working Group Teleconference
16:41:22 <trackbot> Date: 12 November 2015
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16:53:39 <manu> manu has changed the topic to: https://github.com/w3c/webpayments/wiki/Agenda---12th-November-2015-at-17:00-UTC
16:53:54 <manu> rrsagent, pointer?
16:53:54 <RRSAgent> See http://www.w3.org/2015/11/12-wpwg-irc#T16-53-54
16:54:03 <manu> rrsagent, draft minutes
16:54:03 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/11/12-wpwg-minutes.html manu
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16:57:04 <AdrianHB> Present+ AdrianHB
16:57:25 <manu> Present+ Manu
16:57:28 <manu> Present+ DaveLongley
16:57:31 <manu> Present+ DaveLehn
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16:59:54 <Rouslan> Present+ Rouslan_Solomakhin
16:59:56 <zkoch> Present+ zkoch
17:00:17 <manu> Telecon dial-in: +1-617-324-0000 US Toll Number
17:00:18 <AdrianHB> WebEx: https://mit.webex.com/mit/j.php?MTID=m7fdd2026b815736c50eb6592744f3e6e
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17:01:06 <RRSAgent> I'm logging. I don't understand 's|WebEx: https://mit.webex.com/mit/j.php?MTID=m7fdd2026b815736c50eb6592744f3e6e||', Ian.  Try /msg RRSAgent help
17:01:24 <Ian> rrsagent, make minutes
17:01:24 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/11/12-wpwg-minutes.html Ian
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17:01:49 <Ryladog> Present+ Katie Haritos-Shea
17:01:57 <Ian> present+ Ian
17:02:01 <Ian> present+ Manu
17:02:07 <Ian> present+ Rouslan
17:02:09 <Ian> present+ Katie
17:02:11 <shepazu> present+ Doug
17:02:11 <Ian> present+ Shane
17:02:15 <Ian> present+ Matt_Saxon
17:02:17 <dezell> present+ DavidE
17:02:21 <Ian> present+ jean-yves
17:02:36 <Ian> present+ David_Illsley
17:02:47 <ShaneM> Present+ ShaneM
17:04:19 <Ian> scribe: Ian
17:04:40 <Ian> Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-payments-wg/2015Nov/0014.html
17:04:49 <Ian> Agenda: https://github.com/w3c/webpayments/wiki/Agenda---12th-November-2015-at-17:00-UTC
17:05:30 <Ian> Topic: Introductions
17:05:34 <Ian> Chair: AdrianHB
17:05:54 <Ian> Welcome new participants from: Deque Systems, HM Government, Inswave Systems, Qihoo 360
17:06:13 <Ian> ...will set aside time at the end of the call to introduce themselves, or people can send to the mailing list as well
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17:06:16 <manu> q+ to add something to the Agenda - logistics around presenting "new material" - at operations/tech work?
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17:06:25 <Ian> topic: Technical Work
17:06:28 <AdrianHB> https://github.com/w3c/webpayments/wiki/RegistrationTypes
17:07:02 <AdrianHB> q?
17:07:11 <Ian> ack m
17:07:11 <Zakim> manu, you wanted to add something to the Agenda - logistics around presenting "new material" - at operations/tech work?
17:07:29 <Ian> Manu: People are missing work; need to figure out operations
17:07:44 <Ian> (IJ thinks that falls into Nick's action)
17:07:59 <Ian> Manu: I don't think what we proposed at the FTF was thought-out
17:08:15 <Ian> AdrianHB: Can you provide color as to what was done that slipped by the group.
17:08:40 <Ian> Manu: Where does discussion happen?
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17:09:28 <Ian> AdrianHB: People can put comments in the wiki about their edits, but I suggest that when someone has an action, they post a mail to the mailing list saying that they have.
17:09:39 <Ian> ...and also that people go to the github page for the group and set up notification settings
17:10:20 <AdrianHB> q?
17:10:21 <Ian> ...note that wiki is github-repo backed
17:10:22 <manu> q+ to forsee chaos.
17:10:24 <zkoch> For those that don’t know, the standard way of getting notifications is to “watch” the repo
17:10:34 <AdrianHB> q?
17:10:40 <Ian> MattS: +1 to that proposal...I didn't know this was there so want to review it.
17:10:53 <nicktr> present+ nicktr
17:12:07 <Ian> ack manu
17:12:07 <Zakim> manu, you wanted to forsee chaos.
17:12:14 <Ian> Manu: Typically W3C groups use the mailing list to sync up
17:12:26 <Ian> ...we are proposing multiple mechanisms to sync up (mail + wiki + tracker + github repo)
17:12:49 <fredM> fredM has joined #wpwg
17:13:10 <Ian> ...I think that it will be complex to keep people subscribed to multiple sources
17:13:21 <shepazu> q+
17:13:48 <Ian> q+
17:13:50 <Ian> ack she
17:13:55 <ShaneM> Q?
17:14:10 <Ian> shepazu: We are getting used to github as the place for doing specs.
17:14:21 <Ian> ...it's becoming more common and also we are getting a lot of issues that way
17:14:31 <Ian> ...the way we've dealt with it is to have the issue reflected on the mailing list
17:14:37 <AdrianHB> q?
17:14:38 <Ian> ...I'll make sure that's done over the next few days
17:14:55 <manu> +1 to getting everything reflected to the mailing lists.
17:14:59 <Ian> ...I'd be reluctant to set up a policy or a non-automatic convention for how we are reflecting these things
17:15:18 <AdrianHB> q+ to propose a notifications list
17:15:25 <Ian> (No notification list)
17:15:29 <Ian> (Please just use our list)
17:15:58 <manu> Ian: Nick still has an action to see how we should operate - send suggestions to the mailing list.
17:16:08 <manu> Ian: Let's do technical work on this call.
17:16:14 <manu> Ian: Clearly, this is pressing.
17:16:17 <AdrianHB> q?
17:16:20 <AdrianHB> ack ian
17:16:22 <manu> ack Ian
17:16:23 <AdrianHB> ack ian
17:16:30 <Ian> AdrianHB: I wanted to suggest that we have a notification list...Ian shot me down
17:16:41 <nicktr> is in a very noisy environment - but this is useful feedback
17:16:51 <Ian> ...the reason I suggested that is that I think we are seeking a balance between spam on the list and filtering out things we need to look at.
17:17:07 <Ian> ...AdrianB pointed out that if we are notifying everything from github, this needs to be a separate list.
17:17:13 <Ian> ...I leave this as a suggestion for Nick's consideraiton
17:17:19 <shepazu> q+
17:17:24 <manu> q+ to get back to registration.
17:17:33 <dezell> ack AdrianHB
17:17:33 <Zakim> AdrianHB, you wanted to propose a notifications list
17:17:33 <Ian> ack Ad
17:17:49 <AdrianHB> q?
17:17:54 <AdrianHB> ack shepazu
17:18:16 <zkoch> Put me in the bucket of “forgot to watch repo so missed adrian’s update”. Oops…
17:18:17 <Ian> shepazu: We can simply have github issues reflected on mailing list (not all github events)
17:18:33 <Ian> ...I think we should just go ahead and get issues reflected to the mailing list.
17:18:42 <Ian> ...if we find that this is unworkable, we can revisit the decision
17:18:55 <Ian> AdrianHB: +1
17:19:11 <Ian> queue==
17:19:20 <Ian> AdrianHB: Back to Adrian's registration notes
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17:19:40 <Ian> Manu: I think we are doing a bit too much handwaving for the registration mechanism. We need to determine whether something is in scope for our work.
17:20:05 <Ian> ...I would argue that registration becomes problematic if you register all your payment instruments with one brand of browser and you can't take them with you to another browser.
17:20:17 <AdrianHB> q?
17:20:19 <dlongley> q+
17:20:40 <zkoch> q+
17:20:42 <Ian> Manu: If the API call is successful, where is the data stored? Or how does data get moved from one browser to another?
17:21:10 <Ian> AdrianHB: I'm hearing there is more conversation needed beyond enumerating registration types. Is this a correct first step?
17:21:14 <Ian> Manu: Yes, but we need to add to the wiki.
17:21:38 <Ian> Manu: A concern section would be helpful - is the group going to look at portability of registration data
17:21:44 <AdrianHB> ack dlongley
17:22:17 <Ian> dlongley: We need to separate interests (1) what does the UA need? (2) How do we make it available to the UA?
17:22:34 <zkoch> q-
17:22:36 <Ian> ...if we break it down that way, that will facilitate our discussion
17:22:38 <zkoch> +1 to what dlongley said
17:22:54 <Ian> AdrianHB: My suggestion is that we have some good input. How to capture in the wiki?
17:23:14 <manu> +1 to capturing it in the wiki and expanding on it, and moving on to next agenda item.
17:23:34 <Ian> AdrianHB: Wiki page; open for people to make changes
17:23:49 <Ian> Topic: Flows
17:24:10 <Ian> AdrianHB: MattS has agreed to write up legacy flows and lead discussion. How goes it?
17:24:30 <Ian> MattS: Regarding Action-3
17:24:30 <Ian> https://www.w3.org/Payments/WG/track/actions/3
17:24:37 <Ian> ...I have done 2 of 3...also existing paypal flows
17:24:49 <Ian> MattS: I've also received some comments I'll need to respond to
17:24:53 <Ian> Regarding Action-4
17:25:02 <Ian> https://www.w3.org/Payments/WG/track/actions/4
17:25:07 <AdrianHB> https://github.com/w3c/webpayments/wiki/Flows
17:25:30 <Ian> MattS: I've not yet been able to engage with other people who expressed interest in flows during TPAC.
17:25:36 <Ian> ...some have not been able to join the WG yet.
17:25:48 <Ian> ....so no progress on Action 4 but I will chase up people tomorrow.
17:25:50 <AdrianHB> q?
17:26:23 <Ian> (Manu has some comments on how the flows are built)
17:26:44 <AdrianHB> q+
17:26:56 <ShaneM> Looking forward to it!
17:27:10 <Ian> Manu: Hope is to be able to pull flows into documentation
17:27:16 <Ian> ...using respec
17:27:56 <Ian> ...I think we've made good progress on integration in a way that works for people.
17:28:13 <Ian> ...there's a desire by at least one spec editor to try to work it flows into the document, with annotations
17:28:20 <AdrianHB> ack me
17:28:23 <manu> I've added "Concerns" to wiki page - https://github.com/w3c/webpayments/wiki/RegistrationTypes#concerns
17:28:25 <Ian> ...will use work Matt did at TPAC as basis.
17:28:44 <mountie> q+
17:29:16 <Ian> MattS: I have a question...Where should flows be mastered and where should comments be sent?
17:29:32 <manu> q+ to suggest flows are mastered in github repo for WPWG and questions are raised via issues (which will be mirrored to the mailing list)
17:29:53 <Ian> AdrianHB: I have a few quick points to make before I have to run
17:30:07 <Ian> AdrianHB: I will help document one of the flows (as listed in the wiki)
17:30:21 <Ian> ..Manu, can you add details to the flows page about how to generate SVG from source?
17:30:24 <manu> ACTION: Manu to add details to flows wiki page on generating SVG from PlantUML source.
17:30:25 <trackbot> Created ACTION-6 - Add details to flows wiki page on generating svg from plantuml source. [on Manu Sporny - due 2015-11-19].
17:31:04 <ShaneM> I will put the info into the flows wiki if Manu doesn't have time.
17:31:11 <Ian> AdrianHB: There is a question about how these flows map to the proposals. I propose we don't do that until we have confirmation from Zach and Manu that changes from TPAC discussion have been incorporated
17:31:39 <Ian> MattS: Ok, happy to hold off
17:31:45 <AdrianHB> ack mountie
17:31:46 <Ian> ack Mountie
17:31:57 <Ian> Mountie: Can we add flows (e.g., Samsung pay)?
17:32:10 <Ian> AdrianHB: Please do. Add your name and which flow(s) to the wiki.
17:32:32 <Ian> https://github.com/w3c/webpayments/wiki/Flows#flows-to-be-analysed-with-assignee
17:32:43 <Ian> MattS: Please also let me know you've signed up to do flow(s)
17:32:50 <Ian> q?
17:33:07 <Ian> Topic: Operations
17:33:14 <Ian> AdrianHB: Pressing, so I will follow up with Nick
17:33:19 <Ian> Topic: Next call(s)
17:33:21 <mountie> q+
17:33:49 <Ian> AdrianHB: Mountie is here...we want an Asia call but to date there is only Mountie and me. Until we get 5 people interested I think we will not have a call in a favorable time zone to Asia.
17:33:56 <ijmad> thinking there are some other flows not on that list that might be useful such as Direct Debits (UK/EU) through a provider like GoCardless or ACH (US) through providers
17:34:22 <manu> Ian: Is the WG call weekly?
17:35:06 <Ian> IJ: Note US thanksgiving 26 Nov.
17:35:19 <Ian> ACTION: AdrianHB to work with NickTR on potential agenda for 19 November and possibly set up a call
17:35:19 <trackbot> Error finding 'AdrianHB'. You can review and register nicknames at <http://www.w3.org/Payments/WG/track/users>.
17:35:38 <Ian> RESOLVED: No WG call on 26 November
17:35:53 <Ian> q?
17:36:00 <Ian> ack manu
17:36:00 <Zakim> manu, you wanted to suggest flows are mastered in github repo for WPWG and questions are raised via issues (which will be mirrored to the mailing list)
17:36:29 <Ian> Manu: I think flow masters are in github repo and issues on github issue tracker. And ensure those issues are mirrored to the mailing list.
17:36:39 <Ian> ...if we use that mechanism, that aligns with proposal from earlier on the call
17:37:17 <Ian> ....regarding this call, I think we need to talk about other things this group will need to do (e.g., messages spec)
17:37:26 <Ian> ...can we add an agenda item for that?
17:37:51 <Ian> AdrianHB: I think if there is stuff we need to discuss that's not on the agenda, let's put on the agenda before the call.
17:38:49 <AdrianHB> ack mountie
17:40:24 <Ian> AdrianHB: I suggest Manu's topic be on a next agenda, with context created either via wiki or issues
17:40:32 <Ian> ...that's also perhaps enough to schedule a 19 Nov call
17:40:50 <Ian> RESOLVED: Next call is 19 November.
17:40:52 <zkoch> +1
17:41:17 <Ian> rrsagent, make minutes
17:41:17 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/11/12-wpwg-minutes.html Ian
17:41:20 <Ian> rrsagent, set logs public
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