14:36:11 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #coga
14:36:11 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2015/10/19-coga-irc
14:36:54 <Lisa_Seeman> agenda: this
14:36:56 <Lisa_Seeman> agenda+  review actions, and timelines reminder about next weeks call
14:36:57 <Lisa_Seeman> agenda+  Proposal for aria, importance or occurrence? and lisa's new thread
14:36:59 <Lisa_Seeman> agenda+ Proposal for wcag
14:37:00 <Lisa_Seeman> agenda+  Issue papers - GA
14:37:02 <Lisa_Seeman> agenda+  Techniques -  GA
14:37:03 <Lisa_Seeman> agenda+  Next ftf ideas (TPAC and Katie suggestion)
14:37:05 <Lisa_Seeman> agenda+  Other issue papers such as mobile
14:37:06 <Lisa_Seeman>  agenda+ be done
14:38:02 <Lisa_Seeman> regrets: John Rochford
14:59:28 <janina> janina has joined #coga
15:51:45 <Chaohai_Ding> Chaohai_Ding has joined #coga
15:58:43 <ayelet_seeman> ayelet_seeman has joined #coga
16:00:31 <Mike_Pluke> Mike_Pluke has joined #coga
16:05:35 <Lisa_Seeman> scribe: ayelet_seeman
16:06:19 <ayelet_seeman> Present+ Mike Pluke, Lisa Seeman, Ayelet Seeman, Chaohai Ding
16:06:39 <Lisa_Seeman> nexyt item
16:06:42 <Lisa_Seeman> next item
16:07:35 <Lisa_Seeman> https://rawgit.com/w3c/coga/master/issue-papers/links-buttons.html
16:09:36 <ayelet_seeman> LS: We won't have a call next week, as I (Lisa) will be traveling and we will have a joint call the next morning
16:10:45 <janina> present+ Janina
16:13:06 <Lisa_Seeman> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-cognitive-a11y-tf/2015Oct/0047.html
16:13:12 <Tony> Tony has joined #coga
16:13:52 <Tony> q?
16:15:07 <ayelet_seeman> LS: what we actually want aria-importance
16:15:18 <Tony> q+
16:15:56 <ayelet_seeman> MP: doesn't like calling it personalisation, but rather a simplification for the average user
16:16:46 <ayelet_seeman> LS: It is a personalisation because you enable people to control how many features they want
16:17:29 <ayelet_seeman> MP: yes, the personalisation is built on top of the simplifacation
16:18:29 <Lisa_Seeman> aria-importance= "critical" this content is essential for the key function of the page (Example: The send button for an email draft) OR if it is sometimes critical to a user being able to use the site, such as "save my work" or "emergency instructions" OR if it is used by over 90% of users most times they use the content, If you were making an interface as simple as posible, this is what you...
16:18:31 <Lisa_Seeman> ...would keep
16:18:32 <ayelet_seeman> LS: should we keep it as personalisation, and change the description to "the simplest possible interface"?
16:21:26 <ayelet_seeman> AS: what with aria-simplification?
16:21:55 <ayelet_seeman> MP: best
16:23:41 <ayelet_seeman> AS: how would we name the different levels?
16:23:43 <Tony> Q+
16:24:00 <ayelet_seeman> LS: Simplest, high, med, low
16:24:11 <Lisa_Seeman> ?
16:24:16 <Lisa_Seeman> q?
16:26:50 <ayelet_seeman> TD: talked to a web developers about this, and there was a discussion over advertisements, as well as the revenue generators versus the highest traffic
16:27:42 <ayelet_seeman> LS: that's why frequency has to be included. If they are conforming to the spec, it will be the traffic
16:28:11 <ayelet_seeman> ... Suggests adding this as an open issue
16:29:03 <ayelet_seeman> Present+ Tony Doran
16:30:04 <ayelet_seeman> LS: we could change it to 90% of this user group
16:31:14 <Lisa_Seeman> q?
16:31:21 <Lisa_Seeman> ack t
16:31:44 <ayelet_seeman> LS: would you like me to write up something adding context?
16:31:59 <Lisa_Seeman> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-cognitive-a11y-tf/2015Oct/0045.html
16:33:40 <Lisa_Seeman> <div>
16:33:41 <Lisa_Seeman> <span rel="alternative"  aria-type="easylang numberfree vocab500"  class="hidden">most people prefer simple text<span>
16:33:43 <Lisa_Seeman> In studies it was found that only 30% of users prefer long convoluted text with obtuse words and lots of numbers, with 56% claiming there preferred the simplified text , with the remainder unsure or stated it depends on the context </div>
16:36:07 <ayelet_seeman> LS: this is the replacement for the easylang tag
16:36:07 <Lisa_Seeman> <div easylang="most people prefer simple text" >
16:36:09 <Lisa_Seeman> In studies it was found that only 30% of users prefer long convoluted text with obtuse words and lots of numbers, with 56% claiming there preferred the simplified text , with the remainder unsure or stated it depends on the context </div>
16:37:37 <ayelet_seeman> the problem is that we had a long list of different tags for different users.
16:37:45 <Lisa_Seeman> Q?
16:37:57 <Tony> Simple is good :)(
16:41:24 <ayelet_seeman> LS: it sounds like we don't know what we want, whicjh is a problem as we'll be eaten alive in the call in a week
16:43:37 <ayelet_seeman> LS: from the developers point of view the second option is simpler
16:49:50 <ayelet_seeman> TD: what we do is say we need to provide alternative text so that everyone could understand it. but the content providers see it as that the content needs to be understandable by everyone
16:50:11 <ayelet_seeman> LS: some people like the full information
16:50:46 <ayelet_seeman> ... or content with numbers, non literal, etc.
16:51:32 <ayelet_seeman> (in answer to why would someone want the non simplified version)
16:52:07 <ayelet_seeman> MP: the issue is that there need to be different alternatives
16:54:00 <ayelet_seeman> LS: back to the question, which way of doing it is bette, do we want to make the developers insert a span in to the div, or do we prefer to enable them to provide only one alternative
16:56:13 <ayelet_seeman> TD: the content provider should see if the numbers are needed and if they are include
16:56:21 <slim> slim has joined #coga
16:56:40 <ayelet_seeman> LS: do we want to enable both?
16:59:44 <ayelet_seeman> TD: It enables an easy way of doing it, and lets people who know what they're doing do it in a better more robust way
17:00:21 <Lisa_Seeman> <button type="button"  >undo
17:00:23 <Lisa_Seeman> <div aria-more="morehelp" aria-hidden="true"> pressing the undo button will erase all your work on this page. Use this button with care. If you press it by mistake, press control and y at the same time and your answers will come back. </div>
17:00:24 <Lisa_Seeman> <a href="functiongethelp()" aria-more
17:00:26 <Lisa_Seeman> ="humanhelp" aria-hidden="true">I want a person to help me</a>
17:00:27 <Lisa_Seeman> </button>
17:00:29 <Lisa_Seeman> or
17:00:30 <Lisa_Seeman> <button type="button"  >undo
17:00:32 <Lisa_Seeman> <a href="functiongethelp()" aria-more
17:00:33 <Lisa_Seeman> ="humanhelp" aria-hidden="true">I want a person to help me</a>
17:00:34 <ayelet_seeman> LS: unless anyone objects, we will ask for both
17:00:35 <Lisa_Seeman> </button>
17:00:36 <Lisa_Seeman> or (option 4 - can be with option 1,2 and 3)
17:00:38 <Lisa_Seeman> <button type="button"  >undo
17:00:39 <Lisa_Seeman> <link aria-more="morehelp" aria-hidden="true" href="myhelpfile.html#undo/> </button>
17:00:41 <Lisa_Seeman> replacing the following:
17:00:42 <Lisa_Seeman> <button type="button" aria-moreinfo="uri2 uri3" >undo</button>
17:00:44 <Lisa_Seeman> URI 2 may read:
17:00:45 <Lisa_Seeman> <div id="uri2" aria-extrahelp="morehelp" aria-hidden="true"> pressing the undo button will erase all your work on this page. Use this button with care. If you press it by mistake, press control and y at the same time and your answers will come back. </div>
17:00:47 <Lisa_Seeman> <a href="functiongethelp()" aria-extrahelp="humanhelp" aria-hidden="true">I want a person to help me</a>
17:01:42 <Tony> I need to drop off - sorry
17:04:01 <Lisa_Seeman> whjat is neater?
17:04:15 <Lisa_Seeman> chaals are you there?
17:04:58 <ayelet_seeman> LS: we could put them both in the proposal, and let them decide
17:05:23 <Lisa_Seeman> ayelet?
17:05:39 <Lisa_Seeman> rrsagent, make logs public
17:07:13 <Lisa_Seeman> rrsagent, create minutes
17:07:13 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/10/19-coga-minutes.html Lisa_Seeman
17:07:36 <Lisa_Seeman> zakim, please part
17:07:36 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees have been Rich_Schwerdtfeger, Mike, Pluke, Lisa, Seeman, Ayelet, Chaohai, Ding, Janina, Tony, Doran
17:07:36 <Zakim> Zakim has left #coga
17:07:46 <Lisa_Seeman> rrsagent, please part
17:07:46 <RRSAgent> I see no action items