14:25:02 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #rd
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14:25:04 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
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14:25:06 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be 7394
14:25:06 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see WAI_RDWG()9:30AM scheduled to start in 5 minutes
14:25:07 <trackbot> Meeting: Research and Development Working Group Teleconference
14:25:07 <trackbot> Date: 18 February 2015
14:25:34 <Vivienne> Regrets: Peter Thiessen, Yehya Mohamad
14:26:00 <shadi> zakim, call shadi-617
14:26:00 <Zakim> ok, shadi; the call is being made
14:26:15 <shadi> zakim, this is rdwg
14:26:15 <Zakim> ok, shadi; that matches WAI_RDWG()9:30AM
14:26:20 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
14:26:31 <Vivienne> zakim, IPcaller is me
14:26:31 <Zakim> +Vivienne; got it
14:26:32 <shadi> zakim, who is on the phone?
14:26:33 <Zakim> On the phone I see ??P19, Shadi, Vivienne
14:26:37 <mhakkinen> mhakkinen has joined #rd
14:27:05 <Vivienne> zakim, mute me
14:27:05 <Zakim> Vivienne should now be muted
14:27:06 <klaus> zakim, ??19 is me
14:27:06 <Zakim> sorry, klaus, I do not recognize a party named '??19'
14:27:24 <klaus> zakim, ??P19 is me
14:27:24 <Zakim> +klaus; got it
14:28:48 <Zakim> +Markku
14:28:54 <Vivienne> zakim, unmute me
14:28:54 <Zakim> Vivienne should no longer be muted
14:35:07 <shadi> https://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/wiki/Research_Catalogue
14:36:12 <klaus> https://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/wiki/Catalogue_Topics
14:37:28 <Vivienne> we also have this one: https://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/wiki/Research_Topics
14:40:57 <Vivienne> are we looking at the research topics or the symposia
14:41:09 <Vivienne> SA: we don't yet have a definition
14:41:13 <Vivienne> zakim, mute me
14:41:14 <Zakim> Vivienne should now be muted
14:41:20 <Vivienne> I will scribe for now
14:41:26 <Vivienne> scribe: vivienne
14:41:39 <Vivienne> SA:symposium topics would start as catalogue topics
14:41:54 <Vivienne> SA: catalogue - broader and more general
14:42:13 <Vivienne> SA: symposium topic - more focussed more specifically
14:42:34 <Vivienne> Sa: need to come up with definitions and get agreement from the group
14:42:44 <Vivienne> wiki page could define the terms
14:43:12 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/process
14:43:59 <Vivienne> great, there is yet another term "cataloge of research topics" - combines both symposium and catalogue
14:44:47 <Vivienne> MH: like the short, medium, long-term topics
14:45:36 <Vivienne> KM: issue - struggling in bringing down ideas to the level they could be considered for symposia
14:46:16 <Vivienne> KM: the catalogue of topics should be more structured so where people can work on them toward a seminar
14:47:44 <Vivienne> MH: rather than re-group topics - get people into groups to work on topics to get them ready for symposia
14:48:04 <Vivienne> SA: would remove the catalogue type of idea and make the topics just headed for symposia
14:48:16 <Vivienne> KM: catalogue is not going anywhere
14:48:27 <Vivienne> SA: is the problem the idea or the implementation
14:48:53 <Vivienne> SA: is the wiki a repository of research topics that are relevant to accessibility.  Will researchers look to is to see how they can contribute
14:49:18 <Vivienne> KM: we aren't able to assign people to the topics yet
14:49:42 <Vivienne> KM: might be an approach to build up groups which focus on certain topics and they can invite colleagues to contribute
14:50:06 <Vivienne> MH: next step is to put the current topics identified to a poll to see who wants to step up and work on topics
14:50:51 <Vivienne> KM: first step would be that they would brush up the catalogue topic and then spread the information - calling for people, projects, activities related to this topic.  If no one feels responsible for a topic, it won't happen
14:51:28 <Vivienne> MH: if we do put out the poll with the current topic list and get responses to say 10/x people.  Do we take the non-responsive topics and put them in a shelved topics list?
14:51:56 <Vivienne> MH: we're having a hard time pulling people into the meetings.  How do we expand it?  Do we share the poll more widely?
14:52:58 <Vivienne> SA: can look at working with the larger community, may be some mechanics involved.  We are focusing more on the mechanics than what we want to achieve?  What are we expecting the people who put their names on the topics?  symposia or working on the catalogue topic?
14:53:27 <Vivienne> MH: 2 steps - some critical mass to work on each topic and then some mechanism to see if any of the topics can graduate from catalogue to a symposium
14:53:57 <Vivienne> SA: Klaus wonders if there is enough incentive for someone to write up a catalogue topic if it isn't going to get to a symposium?
14:54:53 <Vivienne> KM: there is a chance that there might be a research symposium later - perhaps we could make it more interesting - make activities with a possibility to publish at the WWW conference.  REsearchers are interested in publishing.
14:55:20 <Vivienne> MH: agree with Klaus' view
14:55:48 <Vivienne> KM: perhaps consider publishing the catalogue with the items in a compendium - a publication
14:56:02 <Vivienne> SA: research topics published as a publication?
14:56:26 <Vivienne> KM: would be interesting for them.  Could become something like an open-access online journal
14:57:09 <Vivienne> SA: is in the charter - research catalogue would be a bigger benefit to community than the symposia.  Catalogue would a bigger service - research challenges for accessibility
14:57:31 <Vivienne> SA: like the idea of online publication - mention people who are contributing
14:57:36 <Vivienne> q?
14:57:41 <Vivienne> zakim, ack me
14:57:41 <Zakim> unmuting Vivienne
14:57:43 <Zakim> I see no one on the speaker queue
14:57:50 <Vivienne> q+
14:58:14 <Vivienne> MH: try to find a way to link the catalogue - would be a real win
14:58:31 <Vivienne> Sa: Mark, how would a research topic be referenced?
14:59:22 <Vivienne> MH: looking at specific standards development - UA vendors etc need to understand where the opportunities are to apply the research opportunities are.  When they are working on a new recommendation, they can look up the challenges etc.
14:59:37 <Vivienne> MH: could be a value to W3C
15:00:36 <Vivienne> https://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/wiki/Accreditation
15:02:39 <Vivienne> have done a re-write of the accreditation one - hope it meets the ideas we have just discussed
15:02:42 <Vivienne> zakim, mute me
15:02:42 <Zakim> Vivienne should now be muted
15:03:02 <Vivienne> SA: symposium is backward looking, whereas the catalogue topic is more forward-looking
15:04:10 <Vivienne> Sa: explore using the wiki as a playground to create topics, review etc.  Once they are finished, look at a more formal way to publish it - perhaps a working group note that is continually updated
15:04:50 <mhakkinen> +q
15:04:53 <Vivienne> SA: maybe associate the people with each topic they have contributed to - added incentive - be recognised as someone with research expertise in the field an can be contacted
15:05:10 <shadi> q- viv
15:05:20 <shadi> ack m
15:05:32 <Vivienne> MH: is there any precedence of these kind of working group notes? Can a single note get too unwieldy and should be there multiple notes for each topic?
15:05:59 <Vivienne> SA: technique documents are multi-page notes, and there are other examples.  Have an entry note - overview listing topics and links to other topics
15:06:47 <Vivienne> SA: precedent? closest is the requirements analysis, WAI did accessibility notes for HTML - looking at what needs to happen
15:07:12 <Vivienne> SA: RDWG is unique and may break new ground
15:07:15 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/WAI/References/HTML4-access
15:07:27 <Vivienne> MH: more research-focused notes?
15:08:05 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/WAI/intro/people-use-web/
15:08:14 <Vivienne> SA: could also be a WAI-style? as the how people use the web
15:08:59 <Vivienne> SA: some people find this easier to use - easier to navigate
15:10:03 <Vivienne> SA: is moving away from wiki to something with a more formal standing, and perhaps have more credibility
15:10:59 <Vivienne> MH: there is a page about using WAI materials
15:11:47 <Vivienne> MH: look at what is the next step. Take the list of topics and design a poll and allow us to gauge people's interest and getting them to commit to working on a topic
15:12:13 <Vivienne> SA: is there a need to re-discuss with the group or remind them what we think catalogue topics are and are not, and what we want to achieve with the surveys
15:12:33 <Vivienne> SA: might get more ideas and input and allow them to get an overview of what we want to achieve with the survey
15:13:04 <Vivienne> MH: we do the survey which is a shared concensus on the research topics, starting with the current FAQ about the catalogue?
15:13:35 <Vivienne> SA: could be as short as a sentence/question - research topics are intended to be part of a catalogue
15:13:46 <Vivienne> Sa: could have the question about the current definition
15:14:01 <Vivienne> MH: is there an update on the charter approval?
15:14:04 <Vivienne> SA: no, not yet
15:14:22 <Vivienne> MH: anything in the charter that is different in the definition?
15:14:26 <Vivienne> Sa: don't think so
15:16:37 <Vivienne> SA: don't want to restrict ourselves to what we can do with the current group
15:17:13 <Vivienne> MH: do we need to re-visit meeting times?
15:17:42 <Vivienne> SA: can look at it - either check in with people and ask them about missing meetings reasons.  If it is meeting time - can try to re-schedule
15:19:02 <Vivienne> SA: we are also transitioning the group, new co-chairs talk about how we'd like the group to work.  Try to pull them in and help them see what it can be as opposed to administrative meetings.  They have perhaps lost the overall mission of the group
15:19:40 <Vivienne> MH: spending the time in administrative work is not a good use of their time
15:20:50 <Vivienne> Sa: have held discussion sessions - after a draft write-up, look for caps in research challenges etc
15:20:54 <Vivienne> ack me
15:22:28 <Vivienne> MH: need to liven u the discussions alternating between practical review of outstanding and a discussion that is purely focussed as a research discussion
15:24:14 <Vivienne> SA: can do the survey when MH & VC put together questions
15:24:29 <Vivienne> MH: use tomorrow's coordination time to finalise next survey
15:24:54 <Vivienne> Vivienne's skype name: vivienne_conway
15:25:24 <Vivienne> MH: shall we create the survey and edit it? if you give us the link, we can try to do it
15:25:33 <mhakkinen> my skype is mhakkinen
15:25:46 <shadi> www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/47076/RDWG-170215
15:27:45 <Vivienne> Sa: need to get access to survey tool
15:28:19 <Vivienne> Sa: discuss goals of group and how we are going to achieve them
15:28:55 <klaus> bye - have to leave now!
15:28:55 <Vivienne> SA: to advise about survey access
15:29:05 <Zakim> -klaus
15:29:38 <Vivienne> tomorrow 9:15 us
15:32:07 <Zakim> -Markku
15:32:09 <Zakim> -Shadi
15:32:22 <Zakim> -Vivienne
15:32:24 <Zakim> WAI_RDWG()9:30AM has ended
15:32:24 <Zakim> Attendees were Shadi, Vivienne, klaus, Markku