. Ok for SVG 1.1, but not for 2.0. 14:12:13 <LJWatson> RS: What do we want authors to do with <title> and <desc>? 14:12:26 <fesch> Authors should always provide a ‘title’ child element to the outermost svg element within a stand-alone SVG document. 14:12:33 <richardschwerdtfeger> Authors should always provide a ‘title’ child element to the outermost svg element within a stand-alone SVG document. The ‘title’ child element to an ‘svg’ element serves the purposes of identifying the content of the given SVG document fragment. 14:12:57 <LJWatson> LW: Why is it too strong for 2.0? 14:12:59 <AmeliaBR> q+ 14:13:18 <LJWatson> RS: It translates to a visual tooltip, and that isn't desireable in every situation. 14:14:02 <LJWatson> RS: Think we need to provide guidance, but requiring <title> is not needed. 14:14:34 <LJWatson> ABR: That's not what the spec text is saying. 14:14:51 <LJWatson> ABR: This is document title, not SVG title. 14:15:26 <LJWatson> RS: If a label were provided could the UA create a tooltip? 14:15:49 <LJWatson> ABR: Don't know. Doc title doesn't show up as a tooltip though. 14:16:00 <AmeliaBR> q- 14:16:18 <fesch> q+ 14:16:44 <LJWatson> FE: Worry that diff between doc and other title is too subtle. 14:16:45 <fesch> ack me 14:17:06 <LJWatson> RS: With harmonised DOM, it's just a container that may/may not have semantic value. 14:17:42 <LJWatson> RS: For <title>, with exclusion of SVG container, what should we be doing? 14:18:28 <LJWatson> ABR: Author expectation is that it'll be used as tooltip. We should say it should be available (some way) to all users. 14:19:20 <LJWatson> ABR: UA may display <title> as tooltip, but acknowledge that alternative presentations are also possible. 14:19:28 <LJWatson> rrsagent, make minutes 14:19:28 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-minutes.html LJWatson 14:20:15 <LJWatson> RS: If you don't have text that's visible/obvious, some alternative text should be made available to all users. 14:20:30 <LJWatson> RS: Could take a pass at drafting something for this. 14:20:34 <AmeliaBR> s/UA may display/Current text is: UA may display/ 14:21:03 <LJWatson> JW: It's an <svg>, which means it should be rendered by the UA in some way. 14:21:16 <LJWatson> JW: If not there should be some way to access it. 14:21:33 <richardschwerdtfeger> http://www.w3.org/TR/html5/dom.html#the-title-attribute 14:21:53 <richardschwerdtfeger> The title attribute represents advisory information for the element, such as would be appropriate for a tooltip. On a link, this could be the title or a description of the target resource; on an image, it could be the image credit or a description of the image; on a paragraph, it could be a footnote or commentary on the text; on a citation, it could be further information about the source; on interactive content, it could be a label for, or 14:21:53 <richardschwerdtfeger> instructions for, use of the element; and so forth. The value is text. 14:22:42 <LJWatson> JW: Giving SVG container it's own title would not be good. Don't want it to have it's own identity necessarily. 14:23:36 <LJWatson> RS: Should we try to harmonise with the ^^ text? 14:24:06 <LJWatson> RS: Want me to take a pass at rewriting that text? 14:24:10 <LJWatson> +1 14:24:22 <fesch> +1 14:24:57 <LJWatson> JW: Yes, but would like to see point about if there is no label in content then importance of <title> increases. 14:25:58 <LJWatson> FE: Talking about stand-alone SVG doc, need to highlight that. 14:26:38 <LJWatson> ABR: Question - if you have top level title in SVG in HTML doc, I think all browsers ignore it except for a11y purposes. 14:29:00 <LJWatson> JW: Don't think tooltip is correct rendering for <title. on doc. 14:29:51 <LJWatson> ABR: Doc level/stand-alone titles should be made available. Titles that are children of graphics content should be made available, possibly as tooltip or through alternate rendering. 14:30:17 <LJWatson> rrsagent, make minutes 14:30:17 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-minutes.html LJWatson 14:30:47 <AmeliaBR> Demo of top-level title vs tooltips in inline SVG: http://fiddle.jshell.net/z3jfprta/ 14:31:09 <richardschwerdtfeger> Action: Rich Author new text for the <title> element in SVG 14:31:09 <trackbot> Created ACTION-1582 - Author new text for the <title> element in svg [on Richard Schwerdtfeger - due 2015-02-20]. 14:31:26 <LJWatson> zakim, next item 14:31:26 <Zakim> agendum 2. "Issues 24 and 25" taken up [from LJWatson] 14:31:40 <LJWatson> zakim, close this 14:31:40 <Zakim> I don't understand 'close this', LJWatson 14:31:48 <LJWatson> zakim, close item 2 14:31:48 <Zakim> agendum 2, Issues 24 and 25, closed 14:31:49 <Zakim> I see 1 item remaining on the agenda: 14:31:49 <Zakim> 3. TF user scope [from LJWatson] 14:31:50 <fesch> zakim, next item 14:31:50 <Zakim> agendum 3. "TF user scope" taken up [from LJWatson] 14:32:08 <LJWatson> FE: We have a wiki page. 14:32:12 <AmeliaBR> https://www.w3.org/wiki/SVG_Accessibility 14:32:53 <LJWatson> FE: Could start to walk through on the call? 14:33:38 <LJWatson> JW: Understanding it by way of disability is useful for ensuring we capture everything, but it isn't a good way to think about SVG and how we design in accessibility. 14:36:07 <LJWatson> LW: We should gather requirements based on disability, then look for solutions/appropriate guidance. 14:36:16 <LJWatson> FE: Can we gather it all in the wiki? 14:36:29 <LJWatson> LW: Don't think we should do both at once. Should start with requirements/use cases. 14:37:34 <LJWatson> JW: We're not always aware of the capabilities of some technologies. 14:38:01 <LJWatson> JW: Do think there will be possibilities that haven't been explored. Haptic or sonification solutions for example. 14:38:19 <LJWatson> rrsagent, make minutes 14:38:19 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-minutes.html LJWatson 14:39:03 <LJWatson> FE: If we used a media queries type of thought we could plan for technologies we don't yet have. 14:39:17 <LJWatson> FE: Flags for different things. 14:39:39 <LJWatson> JW: Yes, and ARIA could be useful in the sense it'll point out what the important features are. 14:40:08 <LJWatson> FE: We should focus on requirements and use cases, then look at accomodations? 14:40:09 <LJWatson> +1 14:40:28 <LJWatson> ABR: Makes sense. 14:40:52 <LJWatson> ABR: Then looking for solutions with common benefits. 14:41:55 <LJWatson> FE: Looking at blind uers... 14:42:14 <LJWatson> s/uers/users/ 14:43:03 <LJWatson> JW: Screen readers can be used with braille display, input could be keyboard or touch. 14:43:31 <LJWatson> JW: Research into haptics on touch devices. Tactile display research is ongoing too. 14:44:15 <LJWatson> JW: Question is how do you support each of these? 14:44:21 <LJWatson> FE: What are the requirements? 14:46:38 <LJWatson> LW: Think we need to keep the requirements simple. A person who is blind and unable to see SVG content needs to be able to access and understand the content in a way that is meaningful with their chosen AT. 14:46:53 <LJWatson> FE: Doesn't it matter what the SVG is? 14:47:13 <LJWatson> FE: Technical drawing, map, blueprint etc. 14:47:45 <LJWatson> JW: It guides the solution. We don't have a measure of it yet, but there is the issue of complexity. 14:49:38 <LJWatson> FE: Removing noise from data is important. 14:51:12 <LJWatson> LW: This is where use cases will help. For example a blind student studying economics needs to access a datamap of historical financial information. 14:51:26 <LJWatson> FE: We will need 20+ uses cases for every disability. 14:51:46 <LJWatson> LW: Wouldn't think so - need to find use cases that typify key issues, not document every one. 14:52:25 <LJWatson> JW: Good idea to think about large numbers of use cases, but in the doc just include those that illustrate different requirements. 14:52:27 <LJWatson> LW: Right. 14:53:54 <LJWatson> FE: Do we have requirements for Deaf users? 14:54:06 <LJWatson> RS: There are audio/video tags in SVG. 14:54:34 <LJWatson> RS: Likely to be authoring guidacne not spec guidance. 14:55:01 <richardschwerdtfeger> s/guidacne/guidance/ 14:55:41 <LJWatson> LW: I can put together requirements and uses cases for blind users and circulate to list? 14:56:07 <LJWatson> ACTION: Léonie to put together use cases and requirements for blind users. 14:56:08 <trackbot> Created ACTION-1583 - Put together use cases and requirements for blind users. [on Léonie Watson - due 2015-02-20]. 14:57:22 <LJWatson> ACTION: Amelia to put together use cases and requirements for cognitive and mibility impaired users. 14:57:22 <trackbot> Error finding 'Amelia'. You can review and register nicknames at <https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/users>. 14:57:53 <LJWatson> rrsagent, make minutes 14:57:53 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-minutes.html LJWatson 14:58:17 <LJWatson> ACTION: Fred to put together use cases and requirements for Deaf and hard of hearing people. 14:58:17 <trackbot> Created ACTION-1584 - Put together use cases and requirements for deaf and hard of hearing people. [on Fred Esch - due 2015-02-20]. 14:58:42 <AmeliaBR> ACTION: AmeliaBR to put together use cases and requirements for cognitive and mibility impaired users. 14:58:42 <trackbot> Error finding 'AmeliaBR'. You can review and register nicknames at <https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/users>. 14:59:41 <LJWatson> ACTION: AmeliaBR to put together use cases and requirements for cognitive and mibility impaired users. 14:59:41 <trackbot> Error finding 'AmeliaBR'. You can review and register nicknames at <https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/users>. 15:01:15 <Zakim> -CharuP 15:02:26 <richardschwerdtfeger> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/products/17 15:05:44 <Zakim> -Amy 15:06:02 <Zakim> -Rich_Schwerdtfeger 15:06:40 <LJWatson> rrsagent, make minutes 15:06:40 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-minutes.html LJWatson 15:08:35 <LJWatson> Meeting: SVG A11y TF teleconf 15:08:41 <LJWatson> rrsagent, make minutes 15:08:41 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-minutes.html LJWatson 15:08:46 <Zakim> -LJWatson 15:08:51 <Zakim> -AmeliaBR 15:08:52 <Zakim> -Jason_White 15:08:54 <Zakim> -fesch 15:08:54 <Zakim> WAI_SVGTF()9:00AM has ended 15:08:54 <Zakim> Attendees were fesch, Jason_White, +1.512.238.aaaa, LJWatson, AmeliaBR, Rich_Schwerdtfeger, CharuP, Amy 15:09:04 <LJWatson> rrsagent, make minutes 15:09:04 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-minutes.html LJWatson 15:10:17 <LJWatson> Present: fesch, Jason_White, +1.512.238.aaaa, LJWatson, AmeliaBR, Rich_Schwerdtfeger, CharuP, Amy 15:10:29 <LJWatson> rrsagent, make minutes 15:10:29 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-minutes.html LJWatson 15:12:28 <LJWatson> zakim, please part 15:12:28 <Zakim> Zakim has left #svg-a11y 15:12:35 <LJWatson> rrsagent, please part 15:12:35 <RRSAgent> I see 6 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-actions.rdf : 15:12:35 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Rich Author new text for the <title> element in SVG [1] 15:12:35 <RRSAgent> recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-irc#T14-31-09 15:12:35 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Léonie to put together use cases and requirements for blind users. [2] 15:12:35 <RRSAgent> recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-irc#T14-56-07 15:12:35 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Amelia to put together use cases and requirements for cognitive and mibility impaired users. [3] 15:12:35 <RRSAgent> recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-irc#T14-57-22 15:12:35 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Fred to put together use cases and requirements for Deaf and hard of hearing people. [4] 15:12:35 <RRSAgent> recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-irc#T14-58-17 15:12:35 <RRSAgent> ACTION: AmeliaBR to put together use cases and requirements for cognitive and mibility impaired users. [5] 15:12:35 <RRSAgent> recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-irc#T14-58-42 15:12:35 <RRSAgent> ACTION: AmeliaBR to put together use cases and requirements for cognitive and mibility impaired users. [6] 15:12:35 <RRSAgent> recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-irc#T14-59-41

14:00:39 RRSAgent has joined #svg-a11y 14:00:39 logging to http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-irc 14:00:49 Amy has joined #svg-a11y 14:00:51 + +1.512.238.aaaa 14:00:52 +[IPcaller] 14:01:00 zakim, [IPcaller] is me 14:01:00 +LJWatson; got it 14:01:10 + +1.941.266.aabb 14:02:22 AmeliaBR has joined #svg-a11y 14:02:32 agenda+ title and describedby 14:02:40 zakim, agenda? 14:02:41 I see 7 items remaining on the agenda: 14:02:41 1. What do we plan to do for blind users? [from LJWatson] 14:02:42 2. What do we plan to do for color blind users? [from fesch] 14:02:43 3. What do we plan to do for non AT using low vision users? [from fesch] 14:02:43 4. What do we plan to do to support uses with cognitive issues? [from fesch] 14:02:43 5. What do we plan to do for mobility impaired users? [from fesch] 14:02:43 6. What do we plan to do for deaf users? [from fesch] 14:02:44 7. title and describedby [from LJWatson] 14:02:46 +??P17 14:02:52 zakim, clear agenda 14:02:52 agenda cleared 14:03:02 agenda+ title and describedby 14:03:10 zakim, ??P17 is me 14:03:10 +AmeliaBR; got it 14:03:23 agenda+ Issues 24 and 25 14:03:42 agenda+ TF user scope 14:04:12 zakim, this is 2742 14:04:12 LJWatson, this was already WAI_SVGTF()9:00AM 14:04:13 ok, LJWatson; that matches WAI_SVGTF()9:00AM 14:04:22 rrsagent, set logs world-visible 14:05:05 Chair: Fred Esch 14:05:28 scribenick LJWatson 14:05:41 rrsagent, make minutes 14:05:41 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-minutes.html LJWatson 14:06:30 Title: SVG A11y TF telecon 14:07:04 rrsagent, make minutes 14:07:04 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-minutes.html LJWatson 14:07:12 zakim, who is on the phone 14:07:12 I don't understand 'who is on the phone', LJWatson 14:07:19 zakim, who is on the phone? 14:07:19 On the phone I see fesch, Jason_White, LJWatson, +1.512.238.aaaa, +1.941.266.aabb, AmeliaBR 14:07:44 richardschwerdtfeger has joined #svg-a11y 14:08:36 +Rich_Schwerdtfeger 14:08:45 zakim, +1.512.238.aa is CharuP 14:08:45 +CharuP; got it 14:09:36 zakim, +1.941.266.aabb is Amy 14:09:36 +Amy; got it 14:09:50 zakim, take up item 1 14:09:50 agendum 1. "title and describedby" taken up [from LJWatson] 14:10:05 Rich has some an issue having to do with title and describedby in the SVG 2 spec and accessibility 14:10:06 http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/track/actions/3728 14:10:08 https://svgwg.org/svg2-draft/struct.html#DescElement 14:10:09 look at issues 24 and 25 14:10:19 The title attribute represents advisory information for the element, such as would be appropriate for a tooltip. 14:10:20 HTML5 link: http://www.w3.org/TR/html5/dom.html#the-title-attribute 14:10:36 shepazu_ has joined #svg-a11y 14:10:53 descriptive element 14:10:55 An element which provides supplementary descriptive information about its parent. Specifically, the following elements are descriptive elements: ‘desc’, ‘metadata’ and ‘title’. 14:10:56 ‘desc’ 14:10:58 Categories: 14:11:02 RS: Spec text (2nd link) is too strong. Says authors should use . Ok for SVG 1.1, but not for 2.0. 14:12:13 <LJWatson> RS: What do we want authors to do with <title> and <desc>? 14:12:26 <fesch> Authors should always provide a ‘title’ child element to the outermost svg element within a stand-alone SVG document. 14:12:33 <richardschwerdtfeger> Authors should always provide a ‘title’ child element to the outermost svg element within a stand-alone SVG document. The ‘title’ child element to an ‘svg’ element serves the purposes of identifying the content of the given SVG document fragment. 14:12:57 <LJWatson> LW: Why is it too strong for 2.0? 14:12:59 <AmeliaBR> q+ 14:13:18 <LJWatson> RS: It translates to a visual tooltip, and that isn't desireable in every situation. 14:14:02 <LJWatson> RS: Think we need to provide guidance, but requiring <title> is not needed. 14:14:34 <LJWatson> ABR: That's not what the spec text is saying. 14:14:51 <LJWatson> ABR: This is document title, not SVG title. 14:15:26 <LJWatson> RS: If a label were provided could the UA create a tooltip? 14:15:49 <LJWatson> ABR: Don't know. Doc title doesn't show up as a tooltip though. 14:16:00 <AmeliaBR> q- 14:16:18 <fesch> q+ 14:16:44 <LJWatson> FE: Worry that diff between doc and other title is too subtle. 14:16:45 <fesch> ack me 14:17:06 <LJWatson> RS: With harmonised DOM, it's just a container that may/may not have semantic value. 14:17:42 <LJWatson> RS: For <title>, with exclusion of SVG container, what should we be doing? 14:18:28 <LJWatson> ABR: Author expectation is that it'll be used as tooltip. We should say it should be available (some way) to all users. 14:19:20 <LJWatson> ABR: UA may display <title> as tooltip, but acknowledge that alternative presentations are also possible. 14:19:28 <LJWatson> rrsagent, make minutes 14:19:28 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-minutes.html LJWatson 14:20:15 <LJWatson> RS: If you don't have text that's visible/obvious, some alternative text should be made available to all users. 14:20:30 <LJWatson> RS: Could take a pass at drafting something for this. 14:20:34 <AmeliaBR> s/UA may display/Current text is: UA may display/ 14:21:03 <LJWatson> JW: It's an <svg>, which means it should be rendered by the UA in some way. 14:21:16 <LJWatson> JW: If not there should be some way to access it. 14:21:33 <richardschwerdtfeger> http://www.w3.org/TR/html5/dom.html#the-title-attribute 14:21:53 <richardschwerdtfeger> The title attribute represents advisory information for the element, such as would be appropriate for a tooltip. On a link, this could be the title or a description of the target resource; on an image, it could be the image credit or a description of the image; on a paragraph, it could be a footnote or commentary on the text; on a citation, it could be further information about the source; on interactive content, it could be a label for, or 14:21:53 <richardschwerdtfeger> instructions for, use of the element; and so forth. The value is text. 14:22:42 <LJWatson> JW: Giving SVG container it's own title would not be good. Don't want it to have it's own identity necessarily. 14:23:36 <LJWatson> RS: Should we try to harmonise with the ^^ text? 14:24:06 <LJWatson> RS: Want me to take a pass at rewriting that text? 14:24:10 <LJWatson> +1 14:24:22 <fesch> +1 14:24:57 <LJWatson> JW: Yes, but would like to see point about if there is no label in content then importance of <title> increases. 14:25:58 <LJWatson> FE: Talking about stand-alone SVG doc, need to highlight that. 14:26:38 <LJWatson> ABR: Question - if you have top level title in SVG in HTML doc, I think all browsers ignore it except for a11y purposes. 14:29:00 <LJWatson> JW: Don't think tooltip is correct rendering for <title. on doc. 14:29:51 <LJWatson> ABR: Doc level/stand-alone titles should be made available. Titles that are children of graphics content should be made available, possibly as tooltip or through alternate rendering. 14:30:17 <LJWatson> rrsagent, make minutes 14:30:17 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-minutes.html LJWatson 14:30:47 <AmeliaBR> Demo of top-level title vs tooltips in inline SVG: http://fiddle.jshell.net/z3jfprta/ 14:31:09 <richardschwerdtfeger> Action: Rich Author new text for the <title> element in SVG 14:31:09 <trackbot> Created ACTION-1582 - Author new text for the <title> element in svg [on Richard Schwerdtfeger - due 2015-02-20]. 14:31:26 <LJWatson> zakim, next item 14:31:26 <Zakim> agendum 2. "Issues 24 and 25" taken up [from LJWatson] 14:31:40 <LJWatson> zakim, close this 14:31:40 <Zakim> I don't understand 'close this', LJWatson 14:31:48 <LJWatson> zakim, close item 2 14:31:48 <Zakim> agendum 2, Issues 24 and 25, closed 14:31:49 <Zakim> I see 1 item remaining on the agenda: 14:31:49 <Zakim> 3. TF user scope [from LJWatson] 14:31:50 <fesch> zakim, next item 14:31:50 <Zakim> agendum 3. "TF user scope" taken up [from LJWatson] 14:32:08 <LJWatson> FE: We have a wiki page. 14:32:12 <AmeliaBR> https://www.w3.org/wiki/SVG_Accessibility 14:32:53 <LJWatson> FE: Could start to walk through on the call? 14:33:38 <LJWatson> JW: Understanding it by way of disability is useful for ensuring we capture everything, but it isn't a good way to think about SVG and how we design in accessibility. 14:36:07 <LJWatson> LW: We should gather requirements based on disability, then look for solutions/appropriate guidance. 14:36:16 <LJWatson> FE: Can we gather it all in the wiki? 14:36:29 <LJWatson> LW: Don't think we should do both at once. Should start with requirements/use cases. 14:37:34 <LJWatson> JW: We're not always aware of the capabilities of some technologies. 14:38:01 <LJWatson> JW: Do think there will be possibilities that haven't been explored. Haptic or sonification solutions for example. 14:38:19 <LJWatson> rrsagent, make minutes 14:38:19 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-minutes.html LJWatson 14:39:03 <LJWatson> FE: If we used a media queries type of thought we could plan for technologies we don't yet have. 14:39:17 <LJWatson> FE: Flags for different things. 14:39:39 <LJWatson> JW: Yes, and ARIA could be useful in the sense it'll point out what the important features are. 14:40:08 <LJWatson> FE: We should focus on requirements and use cases, then look at accomodations? 14:40:09 <LJWatson> +1 14:40:28 <LJWatson> ABR: Makes sense. 14:40:52 <LJWatson> ABR: Then looking for solutions with common benefits. 14:41:55 <LJWatson> FE: Looking at blind uers... 14:42:14 <LJWatson> s/uers/users/ 14:43:03 <LJWatson> JW: Screen readers can be used with braille display, input could be keyboard or touch. 14:43:31 <LJWatson> JW: Research into haptics on touch devices. Tactile display research is ongoing too. 14:44:15 <LJWatson> JW: Question is how do you support each of these? 14:44:21 <LJWatson> FE: What are the requirements? 14:46:38 <LJWatson> LW: Think we need to keep the requirements simple. A person who is blind and unable to see SVG content needs to be able to access and understand the content in a way that is meaningful with their chosen AT. 14:46:53 <LJWatson> FE: Doesn't it matter what the SVG is? 14:47:13 <LJWatson> FE: Technical drawing, map, blueprint etc. 14:47:45 <LJWatson> JW: It guides the solution. We don't have a measure of it yet, but there is the issue of complexity. 14:49:38 <LJWatson> FE: Removing noise from data is important. 14:51:12 <LJWatson> LW: This is where use cases will help. For example a blind student studying economics needs to access a datamap of historical financial information. 14:51:26 <LJWatson> FE: We will need 20+ uses cases for every disability. 14:51:46 <LJWatson> LW: Wouldn't think so - need to find use cases that typify key issues, not document every one. 14:52:25 <LJWatson> JW: Good idea to think about large numbers of use cases, but in the doc just include those that illustrate different requirements. 14:52:27 <LJWatson> LW: Right. 14:53:54 <LJWatson> FE: Do we have requirements for Deaf users? 14:54:06 <LJWatson> RS: There are audio/video tags in SVG. 14:54:34 <LJWatson> RS: Likely to be authoring guidacne not spec guidance. 14:55:01 <richardschwerdtfeger> s/guidacne/guidance/ 14:55:41 <LJWatson> LW: I can put together requirements and uses cases for blind users and circulate to list? 14:56:07 <LJWatson> ACTION: Léonie to put together use cases and requirements for blind users. 14:56:08 <trackbot> Created ACTION-1583 - Put together use cases and requirements for blind users. [on Léonie Watson - due 2015-02-20]. 14:57:22 <LJWatson> ACTION: Amelia to put together use cases and requirements for cognitive and mibility impaired users. 14:57:22 <trackbot> Error finding 'Amelia'. You can review and register nicknames at <https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/users>. 14:57:53 <LJWatson> rrsagent, make minutes 14:57:53 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-minutes.html LJWatson 14:58:17 <LJWatson> ACTION: Fred to put together use cases and requirements for Deaf and hard of hearing people. 14:58:17 <trackbot> Created ACTION-1584 - Put together use cases and requirements for deaf and hard of hearing people. [on Fred Esch - due 2015-02-20]. 14:58:42 <AmeliaBR> ACTION: AmeliaBR to put together use cases and requirements for cognitive and mibility impaired users. 14:58:42 <trackbot> Error finding 'AmeliaBR'. You can review and register nicknames at <https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/users>. 14:59:41 <LJWatson> ACTION: AmeliaBR to put together use cases and requirements for cognitive and mibility impaired users. 14:59:41 <trackbot> Error finding 'AmeliaBR'. You can review and register nicknames at <https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/users>. 15:01:15 <Zakim> -CharuP 15:02:26 <richardschwerdtfeger> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/products/17 15:05:44 <Zakim> -Amy 15:06:02 <Zakim> -Rich_Schwerdtfeger 15:06:40 <LJWatson> rrsagent, make minutes 15:06:40 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-minutes.html LJWatson 15:08:35 <LJWatson> Meeting: SVG A11y TF teleconf 15:08:41 <LJWatson> rrsagent, make minutes 15:08:41 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-minutes.html LJWatson 15:08:46 <Zakim> -LJWatson 15:08:51 <Zakim> -AmeliaBR 15:08:52 <Zakim> -Jason_White 15:08:54 <Zakim> -fesch 15:08:54 <Zakim> WAI_SVGTF()9:00AM has ended 15:08:54 <Zakim> Attendees were fesch, Jason_White, +1.512.238.aaaa, LJWatson, AmeliaBR, Rich_Schwerdtfeger, CharuP, Amy 15:09:04 <LJWatson> rrsagent, make minutes 15:09:04 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-minutes.html LJWatson 15:10:17 <LJWatson> Present: fesch, Jason_White, +1.512.238.aaaa, LJWatson, AmeliaBR, Rich_Schwerdtfeger, CharuP, Amy 15:10:29 <LJWatson> rrsagent, make minutes 15:10:29 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-minutes.html LJWatson 15:12:28 <LJWatson> zakim, please part 15:12:28 <Zakim> Zakim has left #svg-a11y 15:12:35 <LJWatson> rrsagent, please part 15:12:35 <RRSAgent> I see 6 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-actions.rdf : 15:12:35 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Rich Author new text for the <title> element in SVG [1] 15:12:35 <RRSAgent> recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-irc#T14-31-09 15:12:35 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Léonie to put together use cases and requirements for blind users. [2] 15:12:35 <RRSAgent> recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-irc#T14-56-07 15:12:35 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Amelia to put together use cases and requirements for cognitive and mibility impaired users. [3] 15:12:35 <RRSAgent> recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-irc#T14-57-22 15:12:35 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Fred to put together use cases and requirements for Deaf and hard of hearing people. [4] 15:12:35 <RRSAgent> recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-irc#T14-58-17 15:12:35 <RRSAgent> ACTION: AmeliaBR to put together use cases and requirements for cognitive and mibility impaired users. [5] 15:12:35 <RRSAgent> recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-irc#T14-58-42 15:12:35 <RRSAgent> ACTION: AmeliaBR to put together use cases and requirements for cognitive and mibility impaired users. [6] 15:12:35 <RRSAgent> recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/02/13-svg-a11y-irc#T14-59-41