18:04:42 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #aria-apg
18:04:42 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2015/01/26-aria-apg-irc
18:04:44 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs member
18:04:46 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be WAI_PF
18:04:46 <Zakim> ok, trackbot, I see WAI_PFWG(ARIA)1:00PM already started
18:04:47 <trackbot> Meeting: Protocols and Formats Working Group Teleconference
18:04:47 <trackbot> Date: 26 January 2015
18:04:54 <Zakim> + +1.217.244.aaaa
18:05:09 <Zakim> + +1.919.607.aabb
18:07:03 <mattking> agenda+ spinbutton
18:07:05 <mattking> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/aria-practices/#spinbutton
18:07:06 <mattking> agenda+ slider
18:07:08 <mattking> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/aria-practices/#slider
18:07:09 <mattking> agenda+ tooltip
18:07:11 <mattking> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/aria-practices/#tooltip
18:07:32 <jnurthen> jnurthen has joined #aria-apg
18:07:39 <jnurthen> agenda?
18:08:44 <jnurthen> zakim, remove item 2
18:08:44 <Zakim> agendum 2, Popup menu design pattern, dropped
18:08:51 <jnurthen> zakim, remove item 3
18:08:51 <Zakim> agendum 3, Spin button design pattern, dropped
18:08:55 <jnurthen> zakim, remove item 4
18:08:55 <Zakim> agendum 4, Slider design pattern, dropped
18:08:58 <jnurthen> agenda?
18:09:57 <jnurthen> zakim, who is on the call?
18:09:57 <Zakim> On the phone I see James_Nurthen, Matt_King, Jon_Gunderson, +1.217.244.aaaa, +1.919.607.aabb
18:09:59 <mattking> scribe: matt King
18:10:15 <jnurthen> zakim, aaaa is Jemma
18:10:15 <Zakim> +Jemma; got it
18:10:32 <jnurthen> zakim, aabb is Birkir
18:10:32 <Zakim> +Birkir; got it
18:10:40 <jnurthen> zakim, who is on the call?
18:10:40 <Zakim> On the phone I see James_Nurthen, Matt_King, Jon_Gunderson, Jemma, Birkir
18:11:22 <mattking> agenda ?
18:11:54 <mattking> zakim, next item
18:11:54 <Zakim> agendum 5. "spinbutton" taken up [from mattking]
18:12:00 <mattking> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/aria-practices/#spinbutton
18:14:54 <Zakim> +Bryan_Garaventa
18:15:00 <mattking> birkir: can not get the examples to work
18:15:27 <mattking> MK: there is some keyboard description in the description field; should it be a bug?
18:15:38 <mattking> JN: OK with how it is written
18:16:15 <mattking> JG: didn't include support for typing in a value in the OAA example.
18:16:38 <mattking> JN: does the jQuery UI example work? seems to work for me.
18:16:54 <jnurthen> http://jqueryui.com/spinner/
18:16:58 <bgaraventa1979> bgaraventa1979 has joined #aria-apg
18:17:03 <mattking> Birkir: I was just talking about the dojo example and OAA example
18:17:20 <bgaraventa1979> zakim, I am Bryan_Garaventa
18:17:20 <Zakim> ok, bgaraventa1979, I now associate you with Bryan_Garaventa
18:18:17 <jongund> http://jqueryui.com/spinner/
18:18:56 <mattking> JG: Just tested jQuery example with NVDA; it works.
18:19:00 <jongund> The JQuery spinner seems to work
18:19:43 <mattking> JN: superfluous note about left/right arrows
18:22:57 <jnurthen> logged https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=27897
18:23:57 <mattking> zakim, next item
18:23:57 <Zakim> agendum 6. "slider" taken up [from mattking]
18:25:03 <mattking> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/aria-practices/#slider
18:25:36 <Zakim> +annabbott
18:26:02 <annabbott> annabbott has joined #aria-apg
18:26:49 <mattking> MK: What does it mean when it says you move the button to change the value of the slider?
18:27:12 <mattking> JG: are the buttons for the end values?
18:27:21 <mattking> JG: should such buttons be ignored?
18:28:09 <mattking> JN: we should use the word thumb instead of button
18:30:23 <Birkir> Does the thumb gets a thumbs up or thumbs down?
18:31:14 <mattking> JN: let's introduce the concept of thumb with some kind of description
18:31:26 <mattking> JN: we should use the terminology that others use.
18:32:00 <mattking> JN: html5 type of range corresponds to slider
18:32:17 <mattking> JN: Let's look at html5 spec description.
18:33:29 <jnurthen> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/drafts/html/master/forms.html#range-state-(type=range)
18:36:37 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
18:37:15 <mattking> JN: looking at other descriptions from other sites so we can get terminology used by others
18:37:55 <mattking> AA: what about using the term value control?
18:38:05 <mattking> AA: for the thumb?
18:38:29 <LJWatson> LJWatson has joined #aria-apg
18:38:43 <LJWatson> zakim, [IPcaller] is me
18:38:43 <Zakim> +LJWatson; got it
18:48:12 <jnurthen> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=27899
18:49:41 <mattking> MK: can slider bbe either horizontal or vertical
18:49:49 <mattking> JN: yes, they can be either
18:49:58 <mattking> JN: they support aria-orientation
18:50:14 <mattking> JN: default should be horizontal
18:50:48 <mattking> MK: does home always go to min? or, could it go to max?
18:51:04 <mattking> bryan: home would go to left in horizontal
18:51:33 <mattking> MK: is it the case max is always on the right?
18:52:09 <mattking> MK: I think we should cange wording to say that home goes to beginning and end goes to end
18:52:39 <mattking> AA: pacielo says that home goes to first and end to last
18:53:53 <mattking> JN: go with the first and last slider
18:53:58 <Zakim> -Birkir
18:55:34 <mattking> TOPIC: Slider (Multi-Thumb) (widget)
18:55:34 <jnurthen> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=27900
18:57:06 <mattking> action bryan to raise Mozilla bug for firefox not reporting slider as role for html5 range
18:57:06 <trackbot> Created ACTION-1570 - Raise mozilla bug for firefox not reporting slider as role for html5 range [on Bryan Garaventa - due 2015-02-02].
18:57:53 <mattking> slider multi-thumb pattern:
18:57:54 <mattking> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/aria-practices/#slidertwothumb
19:01:23 <mattking> the description is A multi-thumb slider is a slider with multiple user inputs designed to change the maximum and minimum range for an object it controls. 
19:01:32 <mattking> mk: I don't think this description is clear
19:08:31 <mattking> this note:
19:08:33 <mattking> If the current value of a slider crosses over one of the other sliders, the tab order remains the same. Example. If a high range slider is moved so that its current value is below the current value of a low range slider, the thumb will visually appear to be before the low range slider. This should not change the tab order of the slider. note end
19:08:48 <mattking> does not agree with the text in the kb interaction that requires constraints.
19:09:08 <mattking> JN: I do not agree with the note; may be for ease of implementation rather than ideal behavior.
19:09:18 <mattking> mk: agree with James.
19:09:36 <mattking> AA: this is different because tab keeps you inside the widget.
19:10:02 <mattking> jn: there are many implementations that work way.
19:13:52 <mattking> jn: reword the note to be less prescriptive and point out the issues.
19:14:33 <mattking> mk: consider changing the text for kb interaction to remove constraint language
19:14:46 <mattking> jn: add words to make it less prescrriptive
19:14:59 <mattking> jn: add the words typically contrained
19:15:25 <mattking> s/contrained/constrained/
19:17:37 <jnurthen> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=27901
19:18:55 <Jemma> Jemma has joined #aria-apg
19:20:34 <mattking> jn: aria-controls is specified; not sure it is useful
19:20:52 <mattking> mk: we should strike that
19:21:48 <mattking> mk: aria-controls is for controlling"another" widget on the page; not for something inside the same widget.
19:22:24 <mattking> jn: we can remove the note about aria-live as well
19:22:46 <mattking> zakim, next item
19:22:46 <Zakim> agendum 7. "tooltip" taken up [from mattking]
19:23:34 <mattking> rrsagent, make minutes
19:23:34 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/01/26-aria-apg-minutes.html mattking
19:24:21 <mattking> we will continue with tooltip next time.
19:24:33 <Zakim> -LJWatson
19:24:34 <Zakim> -Jon_Gunderson
19:24:35 <Zakim> -James_Nurthen
19:24:36 <Zakim> -annabbott
19:24:38 <Zakim> -Jemma
19:24:39 <Zakim> -Matt_King
19:24:44 <mattking> rrsagent, make minutes
19:24:44 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/01/26-aria-apg-minutes.html mattking
19:24:56 <mattking> zakim, bye
19:24:56 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees were James_Nurthen, Matt_King, Jon_Gunderson, +1.217.244.aaaa, +1.919.607.aabb, Jemma, Birkir, Bryan_Garaventa, annabbott, LJWatson
19:24:56 <Zakim> Zakim has left #aria-apg
19:25:46 <mattking> make log public
19:26:00 <mattking> rrsagent, make log public